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| Understanding where Anti-Cloti comes from | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: 14 May 2014 - 05:31 (371 Views) | |
| Enigma | 21 May 2014 - 14:55 Post #11 |
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Elite Member
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I didn't mean to start anything, think of it as..."the more you know" which is what leads me to my conclusion. Aerith gave Cloud and Tifa her blessing. In my perspective, she saw some romance between them, supports it from beyond the grave. |
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| Dante | 21 May 2014 - 18:35 Post #12 |
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Dante's Lady
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No need to worry Engima. I am not offended. I get that you see Cloti as canon which is totally fine. I am not going to expect everyone to be Clerith. Even though I don't ship Cloti in the present, its obvious they are great friends. Engima, I only used that quote as Splash said to prove Aerith moved on from Zack to Cloud (since she calls Cloud her kobito, and Zack is nowhere near Case of Lifestream). Thanks Splash, its always nice to have Clotis like you and I am a girl. Personally I think its all good since I ship all three pairings: Zack/Aerith (CC) and Cloud/Tifa (CC and LO) and Cloud/Aerith (FF7 and AC/ACC). I think we can all agree Cloud/Yuffie is the best date though. I mean she has been the only girl to make out with Cloud. I am jealous.
Edited by Dante, 21 May 2014 - 18:40.
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| Enigma | 21 May 2014 - 19:27 Post #13 |
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Elite Member
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I don't really see it as canon. I mean, in my perspective I think that's what happened, but as far as the company is concerned, they haven't said either way. I consider myself a nuetral Cloti. I'm glad your not offended :) I never want to make people feel bad >< |
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| Splash | 22 May 2014 - 03:23 Post #14 |
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Elite Member
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Can't resist guys.
My essay was written for emotionally vested Clotis who feel personally victimized by Regina George when they read comments along this line of reasoning like the only reason people choose TifanCo for the date is because she has inflatable Caltene bar boobs. Or that her entire character existence is meant to make her bitchy selfish personality contrast with Aerith's angelic one. That is Anti Cloti. No one here qualifies that title. I'm proud that we aren't acting like Plastics. Love it guys/gals now that Dante has clarified her gender :) Hello and Goodnight. |
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| Godoka | 23 May 2014 - 22:17 Post #15 |
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Heavenly
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My opinion on this based on the title alone, is that the LTD is the spawn of the bad blood between fans. I'm not sure how or WHY it even started or why people had to get so invested (invested enough to INSULT others over their ship) but it happened and sadly it is still happening. tbh I'm perfectly okay with people believing it is up to interpretation. Because that way everyone is happy. They can believe which pairing is canon out the two for their own separate reasons without arguing. I think Cloti is pretty clearly canon but obvs there is a strong belief to the opposite. It doesn't just come out of thin air, there's a reason why people see things differently. I think people just assume that because one party feels differently they made it up and they must be 'crazy'. Nah, I think it's two different women, two different bonds, and two different opinions on what romantic feelings are that lead people to believe clerith or cloti is canon. endgame. etc. I think people are "Anti Cloti" or "Anti Clerith" because of the unfortunate experiences that happened in the fandom for them. I used to hate Clerith, heck I used to hate Aerith. But I realized it was because I disliked the way I was treated in the fandom, not because I actually hated the ship or the characters. I actually really adore Aerith and Clerith isn't something I can say I ship but I don't look at it and go "EW NOTP" uvu I think it is cute and I like their friendship |
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| Enigma | 23 May 2014 - 23:12 Post #16 |
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Elite Member
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Aerith's scenes in the movie were one of my favorite before I even knew about the LTD. I shipped Cloti when I saw AC and I thought Aerith was "mother" that everyone was talking about. Then with the angelic and motherly feel Aerith gave to the movie I didn't think she was Cloud's lover. I don't know, I think anti-cloti stems from immaturity. I think people who really really were into Clerith when they played the game were pissed that she died and Tifa seemed to be "moving in on Cloud" now that Aerith "was out of the way" And because of how much Cloti was in the OG itself, and the fact that death prevents a relationship and effectively ends the "clerith marriage" people got angry and took it out on Tifa. When FF7 came out we were all younger and more immature, but some people still hold onto that immaturity. Like on tumblr with the SE confessions blog. Someone makes an honest opinion on how they feel about Aerith in a negative way, and in order to defend Aerith, Tifa gets bashed. There is much more hate on Tifa than there is on Aerith and most of the things attacking Tifa are based around Cloud. For example, being a bad mother to the two children but excusing the fact Cloud abandoned the kids. Being a stuck-up bitch who never gave Cloud a chance, dressing like a stripper/slut just to get attention, is a stalking, is trying to get between Cloud and Aerith. And then naming her "a typical whiny waifu" There are people that love both Tifa AND Aerith while being a hardcore Cloti, or being a hardcore Clerith. It's this thing of "I hate them because they're in the way of my ship" which in itself I think is very immature. |
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| Splash | 23 May 2014 - 23:16 Post #17 |
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Elite Member
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Err am I really naive or not veteran is this fandom yet (I'm not) but how serious does the 'bad blood' get? I so did not expect so many views of this essay and that it would be taken so seriously...I really like writing essays as a literature, philosophy, logic and history fan. Look people can rebutt my arguments all they want, in philosophy and science anything that can NOT be falsified is called propoganda not 'proof' :)! The inspiration of this title was based on my disgust and adamant disagreement with the content of some arguments but there is a line between attacking the argument and attacking the person. Gosh I didnt want this essay to go down that rabbit hole lol, and it was revised heavily so that no person felt confronted. My theory is that people want to be right ( Well duh yeah). I'm aware that some shippers who are veterans have liked their pairing for YEARS. They've invested in it, emotionally, time wise, financially (by buying the products and merchandise), made friends over it but that is a great investment. No one wants to be 'wrong' and realize that they all the effort was for the canonly wrong pairing. it's humiliating. I guess that's where the fear propelling the nastiness in LTD dispute comes from. It doesn't help that SE is evasive and ambiguous driving people even further into this cycle as the years go by and personal investment increases. It gets worse and the fear of being wrong and wasting it all increases. But I am veteran in investing in 'canonly' wrong belief. For over ten years I hated Snape, told everyone Snape was bad and evil, made Snaps act as the villain when doing role playing in schoolyards. So when the truth came out my jaw dropped and wow. A decade of hating Snape was hard to transition from. I feel like I owe his character a personal apology. Now if someone told me I was a horrible person who should try to die for hating him, then we've defs crossed the line from attacking argument to attacking the persron. |
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| Enigma | 23 May 2014 - 23:24 Post #18 |
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Elite Member
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The bad blood is really, really deep. A friend of mine who's a Clerith has been harrassed so much because she ships Clerith (she never posts anything anti-cloti only pro-clerith) that it got to the point that seeing Tifa or anything Cloti related, she got physically sick. I have posted pure Cloti stuff, like quotes from Cloud about how he cares about Tifa's opinion and only hers, his "i'll be there to remind you" sweet stuff, and before I knew it I would get anon mail telling me that Clerith was canon and Cloud was in love with Aerith, and all this "proof" that is suppose to debunk me. |
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| Splash | 23 May 2014 - 23:57 Post #19 |
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Elite Member
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Omigosh. That's really sinister. Borderline Diabolical. Um I get motion sickness when playing high graphic video games but we are on a different page. No there's something off about your friend's bullies. The problem with haters is their hate, not the thing they hate. I notice that people who are racist are usually racist in conjunction with one of sexist or homophobic. Obviously the problem can't be with all people off one race and the entire female/male populace right?! So the problem is them and their hate. Most likely the bullies of your friend are pathalogical haters, who dislike a lot of things, and happen to favour Cloti. It's disappointing that cyber bullies use this LTD as a swamp to abuse others. Couple that with the safety fortress of being online, being anonymous and knowing your target will probably never meet you IRL and watch it hit the celing.... :stare: Awww. I hope that doesn't hinder your happiness with cloud and tifa. The pros of getting that much rebuttal mail is that you get so much information right at your door without having to google it. And knowledge is power. More content for you :giggle: to work with. |
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| Enigma | 24 May 2014 - 00:47 Post #20 |
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Elite Member
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The funny thing is, everything they sent me I knew already. Believe me, I am not just blinded by Cloti. I have read Clerith evidence, and I will admit when something is targetted at Clerith. It's not as if I have only read Cloti essays. I've seen the Clerith point of view, I've seen stuff in the OG, and in the entire compilation first hand. The way I came into the LTD was because I watched AC and that's what got me interested in 7. I entered the LTD thinking Clerith was the canon pairing but my friend who was Clerith said it's actually just interpretated, so she gave me all this Clerith evidence that seemed convincing. Then I came across actual quotes, the OG, CC, and interviews and virtually every material there is in FF7. The funny thing is, I already thought Clerith was endgame until I saw the evidence first hand for myself and it was to my conclusion that Cloti made the most logical sense in the end. It doesn't make sense that Cloud's romantic feelings for Tifa ended INSTANTLY when he met Aerith, and it doesn't make sense that he falls madly deeply in love with Aerith despite hardly knowing or even understanding who she is. Also his minimal reactions compared to Tifa's. When Aerith gets taken by Shinra, she gets smacked and Tifa flips out. If Cloud loves this girl, why didn't he react with more anger at seeing the love of his life abused like that? Tifa also seems more disgusted at the idea of what Hojo planned with Aerith and Red XIII. I just figure that if Cloud is madly deeply in love with Aerith, that seeing her being treated so horribly would piss him off, and cause him to speak up, ESPECIALLY if he's her bodyguard. I mean everyone in this forum, you have someone you love (even if it's not in a romantic sense) like, let's say a family member you are very close to, someone who you really have no idea what'd you do without them, if you saw someone slapping them, or referring to them as an object or demeaning them and trampling all over their civil rights, would you honestly just STAND there? I am NOT saying he doesn't care about Aerith...I'm just giving you guys a look into my thought process and my reasoning. I made a post on what I believe Aerith was to Cloud, but I know that Cloud has a different take on who she was as a person. I believe Cloud say Aerith not as she really was. He saw this innocent, weak, damsel in distress who was a "girl" instead of a woman. Now before ANYONE gets upset with me please let me state what I have observed of Cloud... He thinks she's innocent when they first meet when she's selling flowers. He makes a comment about the turks recruiting her for SOLDIER but after seeing how she can't keep up with him on the rooftops he makes a comment "I thought you were cut out to be in soldier" Then when she wants to show him the way to sector 7 he says "you've got to be kidding me. you want to put yourself in danger again?" She says she's use to it, and his reaction is "used to it?!" Then he makes a comment that he's not sure about getting help from a girl. He even tries to sneak out of her house because he doesn't want to put her in danger, even though he is capable of protecting her. He ends up just taking her with him because he doesn't want her to walk home alone, and he doesn't need to walk ALL the way back to her house and then back to the gates. He freaks out when she tries to walk into Don's mansion alone, and then checks to make sure she actually knows what sort of place it is, and won't let her go in alone. He doesn't want Aerith to be one of the three girls and objects to it more than he does to Tifa doing it. And Aerith even says "oh, so it's ok for Tifa to be in danger?" he then says that no he doesn't want Tifa in danger either, but he KNOWS Tifa is a very capable martial artist who can defend herself and fight alongside him, where he thinks Aerith can't defend herself. Cloud even comes to the conclusion that Aerith wanted to die and give her life to the planet...despite the dream HE HAD WHERE SHE SAID SHE'D COME BACK. And Tifa corrects him, saying that Aerith planned to come back and thought about the future more than anyone. The creator's even said that Aerith appears to be a weak young girl, but behind that is a strong will. I feel that Cloud had the wrong idea about Aerith, even when there was obvious evidence staring him in the face that she wasn't weak. Even Leon makes that mistake in KH by asking Aerith if she can handle staying behind alone if anything were to happen. This is ALL just my opinion, and I mean...if Cloud is soooo dense that he can't figured out that Aerith likes him when she's asking "What's mine and Cloud's compatibility?!" and when she asks him out on a date...I reaaaaally doubt he was able to figure out who Aerith truly was. |
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6:46 PM Jul 10