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| How to not Suck at SSBM | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Sep 17 2006, 12:00 PM (704 Views) | |
| Crysta | Sep 19 2006, 05:08 PM Post #46 |
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wat
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I'd leave the cross-country / international flights for the people who have the desire, time, and money. If you wanna go to the beach house, though, you're talking about California. XDDD You generally try to stay away from the homerunners, or kill them before they get the chance to use them. I think people who aren't accostumed to items have difficulty being a hard target because they're too focused on comboing and shiz. You can see the homerun coming a mile away. Hearts shouldn't matter much in pro atmospheres, where you're getting hit every bloody second. The hammer may deal a lot of damage, but the characters are slowed and really, really can't jump. That's why I prefer things like the beam sword and shells. More controlled. The bunny ears are also fun, but I can understand why some people don't like them. XD |
~ Crysta, Zombie Queen![]() Trophy Case
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| Inui | Sep 19 2006, 05:28 PM Post #47 |
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Power of Flower
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Items don't add skill. Anyone that says "but adapting to them requires skill lol!" is completely wrong. It takes a hundred times more skill to have excellent technique and good mindgames than it does to do anything involving items. At high level play, it's all smarts, mindgames, and technique. Items would take away from that and add a chaotic element that doesn't suit tournaments. It's fine for casual play and I don't care then, but they need to be removed for tournaments. They take away from skill and add to luck. I think even without items there's too much luck involved. The first stage is random, Peach's turnips are random, Luigi's misfire, stages can gay you, etc. The creators made a party game. A lot of players removed the party aspects and turned it into something very close to a traditional fighter. Thankfully, super gay stages are banned. And most of them move a lot. Icicle Mountain, Big Blue, and Brinstar Depths are examples of banned moving stages. Pokefloats and Rainbow Cruise, however, are not banned, and thus allowed for counterpicking. Final Destination, Battlefield, Dreamland 64, Pokemon Stadium, Yoshi's Story, and Fountain of Dreams are the most fair stages in the game, and thus the 6 "Neutrals" that we competitive players play on the most. Those stages still give characters advantages in some situations, but Smash is a terribly unbalanced game. Rules are often changed because it's so hard to achieve any sort of balance. In most matches, it's random moves and items flying around, so Marth vs Peach at a stage like Yoshi's Story doesn't make a difference. When you take that match-up to the high level, the Marth will know how to make the Peach suffer with easy kills on the small stage, and the Marth will know how to use Marth as a Peach counter. Taking out the party aspects adds a lot of analysis to the game when it comes to stages and character match-ups. Most stages are banned because of one character: Fox. On stages such as Flatzone and Yoshi's Island, Fox can waveshine half the characters in the game off the side and also get very easy up smash and up air kills due to the low ceilings. At a stage like Peach's Castle, Fox can camp like a complete fag, drillshine infinite against the walls, and get easy vertical kills. These strategies are unbreakable. That means there is no "omg be creative and work around it!" bullshit. No. Not happening. You cannot fight back against a good Fox at a stage like Flatzone. Mew2King was able to beat me, Ryoko, and Magus in a 3 on 1 there! And the three of us are no joke when it comes to this game. That's how ridiculous that stage is for Fox, so it's banned. Btw, if anyone has any questions about why a certain stage is banned, why a certain stage is allowed, and how characters do on stages, I'll be happy to answer. I'm an untechnical player, so I rely a lot on characters and stages to win. I know a lot about stage and character counterpicking.
Then Linoud will have to suck it up and play local scrubs if he's not willing to travel to a tournament in England, France, or Sweden. That's where most European tournies are. You can still go to Smashboards and ask in the International board to find someone in your area that's not total garbage. The_Doug in England travels. Helios and Yuna in Sweden travel. Doraki in France travels. You can find people if you look for them, Linoud. |
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| Merk | Sep 19 2006, 05:32 PM Post #48 |
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ザワザワ
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Right. For casual gamers, the majority of the people who play SSB series, items add fun. =] |
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| Crysta | Sep 19 2006, 05:57 PM Post #49 |
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wat
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You're right. Items do not add skill anymore than that controller does. It does, however, qualify as another arena in which you can master to better improve your overall finesse -- like every other omgl33t skill you acquire through practice and experience. It is easy to learn and duplicate technique and mind games if they're predictable and used frequently enough. The predictability of items is limited at best, hence why you pros like to call them n00b, simply because if you can't master it in some three move combo. You don't need to remove it. You WANT it removed. If someone can use items with great efficiency, can couple it with all this great technique and mind games, then they are by all definitions teh great master. Survival of the fittest, bish.
In my opinion, the game deserves to be played the way it was meant to be played. You can play it however you like, I just won't be very envious when you brag about it, nor eager to play you.
o g I wonder why some are banned and others are not. Pokefloats and Rainbow Cruise are my LEAST favorite of those stages, but I don't care if people want to play on them and I'm not cocky enough to tell someone what's pro-worthy and what is not... mostly because I'm not a pro and I don't think I am, but even if I was... Seriously, what makes Pokefloats and Rainbow Cruise different from those?
I noticed you guys loved the flatest, least varied stages. :rolleyes:
Okay, that's like cutting out one paragraph of an entire report, and saying it's better than the rest of the work because you can analyze it more thoroughly. Well DUH. It's only part of the document. You'd be much better off if you analyzed the whole thing. The party aspect is focused more on fun, which is like the whole point of the game, but if you were REALLY that bored and interested you could get tactical with it as well. Just choosing counter characters isn't high on the priority list for MOST Smashers, and I don't think that's a bad thing. Nor do I think it makes you any smarter than the next guy. Just more bent on winning over having fun, which ultimately makes it no fun for anyone else who may not be in it for that reason.
I don't recall you being the cosmic power which can actually determine absolutes, but if you wanna think that, by all means do. It's not to my dismay. I don't think that highly of myself, but I don't think so highly of others who do. Of course, I'm not really gung-ho on finding a near-impossible way to break it just to prove you wrong, either. I just think you overvalue yourself and undervalue everyone else way too much for your own good. |
~ Crysta, Zombie Queen![]() Trophy Case
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| Inui | Sep 19 2006, 08:35 PM Post #50 |
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Power of Flower
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You're right, too. Items add a different kind of skill. However, when adding that different kind of skill, it drastically increases how much luck affects the match. That's actually something smart you said right there. Until after the first sentence. They're called "n00b" because they add a lot of luck to matches because the items randomly fall in random places and are random themselves. As I said, they're removed because they add a lot of luck to a match. When a game is played professionally, it's all about skills and smarts, not who gets the best item to fall in front of their face. SS4 Ricky, one of the best Link playes, won the Otakon Item Free-For-All 4 years in a row. He's a master of items and uses them with great skill and talent that even I admire. However, when the normal singles tournament started, he got 4th place. 1st Yuna, 2nd Inui, 3rd forgot his name, 4th SS4 Ricky. =/ This was out of 64 players.
I don't brag about playing it like a fighting game. I just play it like a fighting game, like the other 50,000 tournament players do. The game's not a party game in the tournament scene.
Brinstar Depths: Allows floaty characters such as Peach and Jigglypuff to camp in ways that other characters can't reach them no matter what they do. The stage also rotates entirely, and if you're in the wrong place when it does, you can easily die. Big Blue: Fast moving floor causes instant death for a fast faller or someone with a slow jump if they touch the road. There are also very gay methods of getting kills there by making your foe touch the road. Characters with speedy jumps have a huge advantage there and can camp very well. Icicle Mountain: This needs explanation? The stage randomly goes up and down and you can die if you're caught somewhere. The edges of the stages are small and you can get extremely gay horizontal kills. Fox is also as gay here as he is everywhere else with waveshining. Rainbow Cruise and Pokefloats: They require good jumping and good jumpers have advantages, but there's nothing incredibly gay there. They're allowed for counterpicking. There's no unbreakable strategy there. You use Roy...a character that sucks ass at all of these kinds of stages. And it's not about being "cocky enough" to say what's pro and what's not. I just know from all of my experience. Whether I come off as cocky or not is another issue, though I'll admit I'm cocky about Smash most of the time.
I find that ironic considering those are the only stages Roy's good at, especially FD and FoD. Yes, we love those stages. There's nothing too gay about them, so they're perfect for random choices for the first match.
Not exactly. Removing items adds the character match-up stuff. Items remove a lot of skill and technique. It's a trade-off, not a reduction, in either case.
I have more fun when the game is more focused on skill and technique than luck. My brother is just a casual Smasher and even he still hates items and the banned stages. Most tournament Smashers prioritize counterpicking. Well, if the other person isn't as good at counterpicking, then yeah, it makes the smart counterpicker smarter at Smash. Who enters a tournament without wanting to win? Counterpicking stages and characters is a normal thing. I was gay enough to counterpick Peach against Lord Knight's Ice Climbers. That match is so gay for IC's, that Lord Knight didn't even play it; he just forfeit and let me win. And yah know what? He didn't blame me for fagging him out like that, since any tournament player would do the same thing in something as important as Winners Finals of the bracket. In the beginning of the set, I picked Sheik and LK counterpicked the IC's, who have the advantage vs Sheik. I barely won two matches, got owned in the third, then picked Peach and won the set. =/ Only total assholes counterpick in friendlies. When I fought you and Ivan, and I often picked characters that you'd both have the advantage against to make the fight more fair.
I'm not the only one saying those strategies are gay and unbreakable. MLG and the top Smash pros say so, too. Nah. If Lord Knight came and posted stuff, I'd value it. He's better than me by a small amount and just as knowledgeable. He makes sense and really knows what he's talking about. I don't value what non-tourny players say for the most part, I'll admit. They're generally not anywhere near as educated and they view the game in an entirely different light. However, I'm not arrogant enough to discard everything non-tourny players say. If that was the case, I wouldn't bother discussing this game on FEFF. You also did say some intelligent things about the game. |
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| Linoud | Sep 20 2006, 06:50 AM Post #51 |
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Knight of Seven
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Linoud only turned 15. ![]() Your saying a 15 year old can travel to america/france to attend a tournament? o_o; Scuse meh, but you need to be at least 16 to travel anywhere alone too. Least with Ryanair. <_< Then, if I have an opportunity to go, my parents jump in.
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| Inui | Sep 20 2006, 11:01 AM Post #52 |
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Power of Flower
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Then you're out of luck, dude. |
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| Linoud | Sep 20 2006, 11:05 AM Post #53 |
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Knight of Seven
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'xactly. Hence, I can't travel countries to go to a game tournament. Parents dont understand these things. XDI can travel Ireland sure, but I aint going near northern Ireland. ![]() I've got a saftey issue there. XD |
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| Inui | Sep 20 2006, 11:06 AM Post #54 |
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Power of Flower
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Safety issue? Anyways, I already told you to actually ask around on Smashboards to find anyone near you that doesn't suck. |
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| Linoud | Sep 20 2006, 01:09 PM Post #55 |
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Knight of Seven
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<_< You don't know about the North of Ireland too well do you? XD 'kay. I've tried. Kone on Smashboards told me there weren't any really. |
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| Inui | Sep 20 2006, 01:10 PM Post #56 |
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Power of Flower
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Sucks to be Irish when it comes to Smash.
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| Linoud | Sep 20 2006, 03:30 PM Post #57 |
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Knight of Seven
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Sucks to be in Ireland when it comes to smash. ![]() Damn Counter-strike LANs are always on, but no smash tournaments. XD |
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| Inui | Sep 20 2006, 03:38 PM Post #58 |
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Power of Flower
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Well, you'd have to travel... But you said you can't. Maybe you can contact The_Doug. I think he's the closest pro to you. |
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| odelay | Sep 20 2006, 05:12 PM Post #59 |
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que?
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nice link, but i already know pretty much all of them |
| Existence is futlie! | |
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| Inui | Sep 20 2006, 05:14 PM Post #60 |
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Power of Flower
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What's your Smashboards name, what's the last tournament you attended, and do you have any vids? |
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9:24 AM Jul 11
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Linoud only turned 15. 


9:24 AM Jul 11