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Okay, so, I realized I have a small problem...
Topic Started: Jun 29 2008, 03:02 PM (1,318 Views)
Soja
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Gentle Water, Crashing Waves

Nevermind.

For the haze of your elitism, you overlook my point.

Exeunt Soja
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Mirar on Sep 8 2007
06:08 PM
nigga please
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How to Get Banned From FEFF
1. Break a rule enough that a moderator has to verbally warn you.
2. Break a rule enough that a moderator has to actually warn you.
3. Repeat steps 1 and 2.
4. Repeat steps 1 and 2 again, getting suspended for a few days.
5. Repeat steps 1 and 2 yet again, getting suspended for a week and Underdogged.
6. Repeat steps 1 and 2.
7. Do all this in the course of a month.
8. ????
9. PROFIT!!!

Congratulations! You've been banned from FEFF!
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Linoud
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Knight of Seven

Inui clearly doesn't play FPS, Soja. Your point was overlooked in the first place, though I do believe it covers all games.

Inui, you've missed the entire point completely. You never limit yourself in competetive play. This is to improve your skill without relying on a certain thing, Soja's example was to improve noscoping on H3. HJ's problem is that his limit has become a habit. GG.
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Linkssword


Why would you even limit yourself in the first place? You can become the best shielder ever in Brawl, but if you limit yourself to not using grabs you're gunna get raped when you face anyone halfway decent as they are going to just grab you when you shield, making it useless.

:\
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(*Jman*)
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Kakatte Koi!

Linoud
Jun 30 2008, 10:54 AM
This is to improve your skill without relying on a certain thing, Soja's example was to improve noscoping on H3. HJ's problem is that his limit has become a habit.

Except not grabbing is like sniping someone in the leg on purpose. Sure you can get good at sniping someone in the leg that way but that's a skill that will never help you in competitive play.
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Formerly Omni, Rosa, Terra, Serra, Captain Star Falco, Minamimoto
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Linoud
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Knight of Seven

Well, actually it would in H3. Two shots anywhere with a sniper = kill. But not using a scope usually makes you better up close with a sniper and not completely screwed over. Then you can get headshots and just kills with one shot followed by a beatdown. Sniper who doesn't know how to noscope properly = lol.

I know what your saying though, Brawl isn't really the game where you can limit yourself and achieve a positive outcome.

I don't grab usually, because I've always used Link and his grab sucks. If I'm sure I can land it though, I grab. :hmm:
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Reaver
Troll

Inui
Jun 29 2008, 05:34 PM
HJ
Jun 29 2008, 03:02 PM
When I played Melee with my friends, we (for some unknown reason) decided grabbing wasn't allowed, and eventually it almost felt like grabs didn't even exist.

Now it's carried over to Brawl. I don't use grabs at all, and I can't really shake it off. If I ever want to stand a chance against decent players, is this something I'll need to change? I'd really rather not. >_>

Are you serious?

That's the very definition of scrub. Limiting yourself based on some self-made rules that don't exist in the game.

This is where I would say "you mean like infinities" but I have the feeling that some rules that aren't in the game mean more than other rules that aren't in the game.
Neon,June 8 2005
07:34 PM
@Reaver: Me grammer is better than ur post count newbie.

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(*Jman*)
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Kakatte Koi!

Reaver
Jun 30 2008, 03:12 PM
This is where I would say "you mean like infinities" but I have the feeling that some rules that aren't in the game mean more than other rules that aren't in the game.

The Dedede standing infinite isn't THAT bad.

List of characters
 
Infinite only:
Luigi

Both CG and Infinite grab:
Mario
Samus
Bowser
DK

Note: When DDD dthrows Samus, Luigi, or Mario the infinite grab suffers from stale move-negation, in order to keep up the infinite you must reset your stale moves with grab jabs. This really only becomes an infinite at higher percents (50%+) or your opponent is capable of breaking your grab.

Note: When you are trying to "infinite" Bowser you are forced to take a little step forward in order for the grab to connect. Technically this isn't an infinite compared to the other characters but on certain levels you can easily get 75-150% easily, before you eventually run out of stage.


Samus, Luigi, and Mario can all mash out of the infinite if you're fast at mashing and Bowser can ledgecamp and CG Dedede back across the stage. It's only DK who really gets massively raped by it. On the other hand, the infinite on Ness and Lucas is just retarded. Grab at any percent and you're gone.
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Inui
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Power of Flower

No @ both Soja and Linoud. You're both wrong because *gasp* you are not competitive gamers.

What you explained as some kind of "point/honour code" or some shit is ridiculous in competitive play. It does not make you better to limit yourself.

Soja's point was that not using the scope makes you better at killing without it. Too bad it's actually not smart to just never use the scope in order to get better at not using it. Just use both methods in the situations each one is better at 100% of the time.
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Mike Hunt
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Inui
Jun 29 2008, 05:34 PM
HJ
Jun 29 2008, 03:02 PM
When I played Melee with my friends, we (for some unknown reason) decided grabbing wasn't allowed, and eventually it almost felt like grabs didn't even exist.

Now it's carried over to Brawl. I don't use grabs at all, and I can't really shake it off. If I ever want to stand a chance against decent players, is this something I'll need to change? I'd really rather not. >_>

Are you serious?

That's the very definition of scrub. Limiting yourself based on some self-made rules that don't exist in the game.

You do realize that no items, stage bans and so on would qualify as "self-made rules that don't exist in the game" as well, right? :hmm:
Formerly SwordsAreShiney

~ Webmaster of FEPlanet (a large FE site) and GTSPlus (a small Pokémon site), and creator of Fire Emblem Tactics Online. (to satisfy all your PvP FE needs), and webmaster of the future, new and improved FEFusion website.

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Inui
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Power of Flower

SwordsAreShiney
Jun 30 2008, 03:57 PM
You do realize that no items, stage bans and so on would qualify as "self-made rules that don't exist in the game" as well, right? :hmm:

No, it doesn't.

We don't create situations that don't exist in the gameplay. We just change the settings within the game to turn a party game into a fighting game.
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Linoud
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Knight of Seven

Inui
Jun 30 2008, 09:51 PM
No @ both Soja and Linoud. You're both wrong because *gasp* you are not competitive gamers.

What you explained as some kind of "point/honour code" or some shit is ridiculous in competitive play. It does not make you better to limit yourself.

Soja's point was that not using the scope makes you better at killing without it. Too bad it's actually not smart to just never use the scope in order to get better at not using it. Just use both methods in the situations each one is better at 100% of the time.

*gasp* Your clearly not a competive gamer outside Smash! Perhaps if you stoped being an elitist and took the point for once you would understand.

Playing a few games with friends with an honor rule of noscoping = increases noscoping skill immensely so that when it is required in competive play you can do it without the trouble.

I'm likely to be attending a H3 WGL tournament in a few days though Lucas, so by all means, continue your arguement about not being competetive for the time being.

Your being such an obstinate cunt saying that limiting doesn't improve your skill, your even trying to say it's truth in a game you don't seem to even play IRL in, or much at all. GG.
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Mike Hunt
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Inui
Jun 30 2008, 04:59 PM
SwordsAreShiney
Jun 30 2008, 03:57 PM
You do realize that no items, stage bans and so on would qualify as "self-made rules that don't exist in the game" as well, right? :hmm:

No, it doesn't.

We don't create situations that don't exist in the gameplay. We just change the settings within the game to turn a party game into a fighting game.

Well, in Brawl you could map your controller so that there's no grabbing, no jumping or anything like that.

So no grabbing is technically a situation that exists in the game as well.
Formerly SwordsAreShiney

~ Webmaster of FEPlanet (a large FE site) and GTSPlus (a small Pokémon site), and creator of Fire Emblem Tactics Online. (to satisfy all your PvP FE needs), and webmaster of the future, new and improved FEFusion website.

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Inui
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Power of Flower

Linoud
Jun 30 2008, 04:01 PM
*gasp* Your clearly not a competive gamer outside Smash! Perhaps if you stoped being an elitist and took the point for once you would understand.

I play Guilty Gear competitively. You'd only be correct in saying I don't play shooters and RTS's competitively, because I'm active in fighting games.

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Playing a few games with friends with an honor rule of noscoping = increases noscoping skill immensely so that when it is required in competive play you can do it without the trouble.


No.

Use the sniper without the scope in situations where it's better to do so.

Use the sniper with the scope in the situations where it's better to do so.

Do not use the sniper without the scope in situations where using the scope is better because that is not going to benefit you at all in competitive play. In fact, it will do the opposite.

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I'm likely to be attending a H3 WGL tournament in a few days though Lucas, so by all means, continue your arguement about not being competetive for the time being.


Scrubby Europe tournaments mean almost nothing when compared to the extremely high level of stuff in America and Asia. Sorry, but it's the truth. No amount of bias in the world can change the fact that your entire continent's competition is far less than that of Asia and America when it comes to gaming.

Back in Melee, you had three whole players on your entire continent that could compare to America's top players, and they weren't even as good as our top ten. That's just an example from one game.

I'm not trying to be a dick and just say "Europe sucks!" for no reason. I'm just being honest. Your top players consistently lose to the top players of America and Asia in competitive gaming.

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Your being such an obstinate cunt saying that limiting doesn't improve your skill, your even trying to say it's truth in a game you don't seem to even play IRL in, or much at all. GG.


I don't need to play shooters competitively to realize how terrible yours and Soja's points are.

SwordsAreShiney
 
Well, in Brawl you could map your controller so that there's no grabbing, no jumping or anything like that.

So no grabbing is technically a situation that exists in the game as well.


Wow, dude. Do you really want to continue this debate after posting that?
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Mike Hunt
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Inui
Jun 30 2008, 05:11 PM
SwordsAreShiney
 
Well, in Brawl you could map your controller so that there's no grabbing, no jumping or anything like that.

So no grabbing is technically a situation that exists in the game as well.


Wow, dude. Do you really want to continue this debate after posting that?

Not really. I just wanted to point out that you go around branding people scrubs when the very definition can apply to the no-items/fancy stages mindset as well.
Formerly SwordsAreShiney

~ Webmaster of FEPlanet (a large FE site) and GTSPlus (a small Pokémon site), and creator of Fire Emblem Tactics Online. (to satisfy all your PvP FE needs), and webmaster of the future, new and improved FEFusion website.

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Linoud
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Knight of Seven

Lucas. Who said no-scoping was for long-range? I'm talking when it's impossible to use the scope when being fire upon or if in close quarters. It's actually impossible to use a scope if being fire on, so if you've practiced no-scoping, you can actually fight a shotgun/sword up close. GG.

Unless of course you want to explain how having a sniper match without using the scope for practice isn't going to increase players skill without the scope, I'd not continue. But the one thing you don't seem to be actually understanding is:

Practice. This isn't in competetive games. Improving no-scope skill is an excellent defense for a sniper. I agree with the point, use a scope if needed, and no-scope if needed, but really, you seem to think practising without a scope = scrub. I'm sure any of your "pros" have practiced snipers without scopes.

Another thing Lucas, I just said I was attending a tournament and I'd be technically a competetive gamer by your terms. I never said anything about Europe/America/Asias skill level in terms of games. Sorry, it's the truth. There it seemed like you really did want to bring up a point about tournament skill levels in different areas, just to be a dick. :hmm:
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