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Experience rank in FE4; is killing me
Topic Started: Mar 24 2009, 01:33 AM (931 Views)
Successor of Raphael


Yeah, I just got to the end of first gen. I know that I made some poor choices leveling-wise before (since this is my first time actually attempting the ranked run - also, I'm not using any savestates here), so those will be obvious, but could someone perhaps help me here?

Here were my final levels (no Finn):

Ethlin 30
Diadora 30
Edain 30
Claude 30
Sigurd 30
Lex 30
Lachesis 30
Levin 28
Mideel 26
Bridget 26
Jamka 25
Holyn 25
Ira 25
Noish 24
Beowulf 24
Fury 23
Alec 23
Cuan 23
Azel 22
Tiltyu 22
Arden 15
Sylvia 11
Deu 9


.__.


Also, for your entertainment, here's how hard I failed in turn completion:

Prologue 16 turns
Chapter 1 30 turns
Chapter 2 40 turns
Chapter 3 36 turns
Chapter 4 39 turns
Chapter 5 30 turns


I was several turns below the average and I was automatically screwed for the level requirement. If I did my math right, there are a possible 1122 level ups in FE4, and from this alone, I'm already missing 129 of them. If this is incorrect, please let me know. Anyway, does someone have any tips to offer this sad player? D:
Edited by Successor of Raphael, Mar 24 2009, 01:34 AM.
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Mekkah


Yeah, you're fucked.
Anyone with a staff should be at 30 through Return/Warp/Reserve/Libro spamming. There's some ranked runs on the japanese game youtube, the links are somewhere on SF but that's down.

There's some tricks to getting Dew up further. One is to use the fact that he gains 10EXP from giving gold. Let him repeatedly obtain gold and give it away as often as possible, for example every time he did an arena battle, or by letting him visit a village. Another option is to let him give gold to people who have nearly capped gold, so he has gold leftover which he can give to others. I think it also works if he has a lover who does an arena battle, gives to him, which he then gives back to or to someone else, lover does another arena battle next turn, etc.

The other is to use his Bargain skill to buy useful rings to do better in battle or gain more EXP through Elite Ring, but that's obvious.
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Successor of Raphael


Yeah, I was in Reptor's face when I realized what level Fury was, and I wanted to stab myself in the face for it. Tiltyu and Fury especially.

I never really thought of abusing Deu's giving command. At all. If I could get him to a respectable level, he could even hold his own for a little bit in the arena, depending on the stage. The capped one is good as well. I'm so glad I asked because I would not have thought of this, ever.

I already restarted. I assume that second gen is easier to level everyone up in, but I haven't played that half in a while so I don't remember. The thing with Deu transfers just fine to Patty, too.

By the way... do/did you post at IGN? I've seen your name somewhere else before, but it makes me think of IGN. That's just random thought.
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Mekkah


I only know about those Dew uses because the guy from that video did it repeatedly. It's one of the reasons why you won't see me S-ranking this game - it's more about abuse than actual good gameplay.

I was active on IGN ages ago, but ever since my Firefox refuses to work for longer than a minute on the boards and since their login system screwed me over I don't really come there anymore. I was active on the Pokemon boards first, then moved to the Fire Emblem ones later, but both are boring. I'm also active on Serenes Forest, and somewhat on other FE boards, though they're mostly dead (FEP, FEF, GameFAQs).
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Successor of Raphael


Ah, that's right... _unknown_ right? brinzy_boi here, though I haven't posted on that site in forever.

Anyway, I got to chapter 2 and I've already shaved off a few turns and my levels are better overall, especially Azel and Deu, Azel having gotten past the swordfighter (he already had the Speed ring and he took the Skill ring by mistake, but what the hey), and Deu with that trick.

But you're right - this is heavily dependent on abuse. FE5 seems similar in the abusive aspect, but I dunno, at least there's no level requirement. Thanks for the help.
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Mekkah


Yeah, _unknown_1 is me.

Also, if you want to get the maximum out of arenas, you can use savestates. Apparently you can cancel the fight mid-battle and switch to another weapon to toy with the RNG (like if you're about to miss, switch to a lance so the opponent attacks next and misses). You can also use the arena to get people hurt to give your healers something to do if they don't have Return/Warp.
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Inui
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Power of Flower

How come your god-tier super easy to max out characters (Ayra, Jamuka, Levin, Brigid, Holyn) aren't level 30? They can do this solely from the arena, lmao.
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Mekkah


Apparently they cannot, because I'm pretty sure that someone playing FE4 ranked would use the arena to the absolute max. I'd gamble the reason they're not maxed out is because they're all unmounted, with Sigurd using the Leg Ring, so they're always late to the action unless sent in a seperate direction.
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Inui
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Power of Flower

I have always maxed those guys out because they can't lose in the arena... I also know where reinforcements and shit come out, so I can position them to get EXP even if they get left behind when it comes to seizing castles. Chapter 4 is really good for them since everyone is slowed down, especially non-flying mounted units.
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Successor of Raphael


Charlotte Aulin
Mar 25 2009, 11:38 AM
How come your god-tier super easy to max out characters (Ayra, Jamuka, Levin, Brigid, Holyn) aren't level 30? They can do this solely from the arena, lmao.
Poor playing for the most part. Levin, there's no excuse. The others don't cap out from the arena - those are their levels with every arena fight won but I didn't whore out the Elite Ring or anything. I tried to level others a bit more but I didn't do a good job. Like I said, it was my first time through.

Ayra didn't get so many kills because I figured that she'd 30 out later on anyway. I focused more on Noish, Alec, and Azel in chapter 1. Chapter 2, same story, except now Azel and Holyn weren't keeping up and they had to settle for exp off by... uh, the sleep staff (can't remember their names, lol). Then I focused a lot on Cuan in chapter 3 (though apparently the wrong way that time) and Holyn, Jamuka, Ayra, and Levin were all looking for exp around the map, but it isn't that much to give, and plus since they have better offenses overall (at least to the point where it didn't take a lucky crit or Noish/Alec/Mideel/Ardan rabble to clear a few armors), they spent the first part trying to let the weaker guys get some exp and then killing other stuff so I could progress.

Later in chapter 3, the swordies had their fun at Ograhil. Chapter 4 was spent trying to get everyone some exp, but I put more focus on those who couldn't go off to the later part of the chapter because of the mountains. Those who could go took civilians and the rest of the chapter. Chapter 5... eh, I knew I was pretty much done for.

Most of it was poor playing, or at least my abuse was not as good as it should have been, but I didn't realize how badly I needed to abuse.

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I have always maxed those guys out because they can't lose in the arena... I also know where reinforcements and shit come out, so I can position them to get EXP even if they get left behind when it comes to seizing castles. Chapter 4 is really good for them since everyone is slowed down, especially non-flying mounted units.


I am pretty sure this time around, I've been playing better (as in I've actually started to really scrape gold together, get the cheapest stuff I can, and throw that Elite Ring around). I'm at the beginning of chapter 5, no arena, and here are my levels:

Diadora 30
Ethlin 30
Edain 30
Fury 30
Claude 30
Levin 30
Lex 28
Sigurd 27
Azel 27
Ira 25
Cuan 23 (I just can't seem to get it right with him)
Lachesis 23
Jamka 22
Holyn 22
Beowulf 22
Bridget 21
Noish 20
Alec 18
Arden 15
Tiltyu 12
Deu 11 (the best I could do, really)
Sylvia 10

A lot of these units can afford the Elite Ring, which will net me at least three levels for them, if not four or possibly five. Tiltyu suffered this time, so I'm not sure if she'll get any staff abuse in. Lachesis, Sigurd, Lex, and Azel will be fine, of course.

I don't know how you're 30ing Holyn. What levels do you normally have for Alec and Noish? Azel? Arden and Deu? Apparently I'm missing something because, while I did improve overall, I'm not getting these same results that you are.

Oh, and I also shaved off 9 turns overall, so yay.

Quote:
 
Yeah, _unknown_1 is me.

Also, if you want to get the maximum out of arenas, you can use savestates. Apparently you can cancel the fight mid-battle and switch to another weapon to toy with the RNG (like if you're about to miss, switch to a lance so the opponent attacks next and misses). You can also use the arena to get people hurt to give your healers something to do if they don't have Return/Warp.


Definitely been taking this up to the highest degree I could. The weapon switching thing is a godsend. It alone accounts for a lot of the arena success I've had with Noish and Alec.
Edited by Successor of Raphael, Mar 29 2009, 12:31 AM.
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Successor of Raphael


Sorry for the double post.

So I finished Chapter 5. Here are my levels this time around.

Diadora 30
Ethlin 30
Edain 30
Fury 30
Claude 30
Levin 30
Sigurd 30
Azel - 30
Lex 30
Lachesis 30
Ira 29
Bridget 28
Jamka 28
Holyn 28
Mideel 26
Beowulf 26
Noish 24
Cuan 23
Alec 21
Arden 21
Tiltyu 18
Deu 14
Sylvia 12

If the number of possible level ups in this game is really 1122, then so far, I have missed 92 of my 122 levels. So I can't miss more than 30.

I'm under the impression that second gen is easier than first gen when it comes to exp. Hopefully this is the case.

Here are my turns:

Prologue 15 turns
Chapter 1 35 turns
Chapter 2 35 turns
Chapter 3 36 turns
Chapter 4 39 turns
Chapter 5 35 turns

At first, I felt like I was going too slow, but I stumbled across these averages:

Prologue - ~15
Chapter 1 - ~35
Chapter 2 - ~40
Chapter 3 - ~38
Chapter 4 - ~40
Chapter 5 - ~26
Chapter 6 - ~33
Chapter 7 - ~42
Chapter 8 - ~28
Chapter 9 - ~28
Chapter 10 - ~26
Epilogue - ~30

This adds up to 381 turns, the turn limit being 399. I guess this game isn't bad at all when it comes to turn count. Of course, nobody is dead and I also didn't have to deal with any stupid deaths. Yeah, I used savestates for that, because otherwise I would not be attempting this. A savestate between a castle.

Finally, here are my pairings. I'm not gonna bother listing most of my equipment, but I did make some changes from the first time and I think it'll work out.

Edain x Jamuka
Lachesis x Azel
Ira x Lex
Fury x Claude
Brigid x Holyn
Tiltyu x Levin
Sylvia x... nobody

Edain x Jamuka was done because I had some good idea in my head at first, but then I realized I screwed myself on Pursuit (I think). Lachesis x Azel is for Nanna and Ira x Lex is obvious. Fury x Claude should help Fee resist more, and Sety, upon getting 28 magic, can silence the hell out of Ishtar. Brigid x Holyn is so Patty can have some offense, and it was last minute. Tiltyu x Levin is for very early Holsety. I didn't pair off Sylvia because I'm hoping that Sharlow's Elite will help me get him out of the way faster and that Laylea's Charisma can be a bit more useful than Prayer, and I may not miss Continue if she decides she wants the Sleep Sword after Patty levels.


And... that's that. Any major qualms? Did I fuck up somewhere? At least this time, there is a chance.
Edited by Successor of Raphael, Mar 29 2009, 08:00 AM.
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Mekkah


Aideen x Jamka is only going to affect Lester, since all you will be doing with Lana is obviously staff spamming whenever possible (I hope you let her and not Sety inherit the bulk of the good staves). I usually let Aideen pass down the Bargain Ring since Lana cannot use the arena, though you can also try to pair her up with someone. So yeah, just abuse the hell out of Lester. Hero Bow alone should be plenty, I guess.

Not a fan of Lachesis x Azel. The mag difference is overrated, and they do much better damage with melee than magic weapons pretty much always. Nonetheless, nothing too crippling, you still have Pursuit and Charisma, the best things about these two.

Ayra x Lex is a given. Ayra x Dew might have been recommended for ranked, as it allows the kids to buy Elite Ring at half price while allowing Lex to go with someone else, but this will of course do. Any overkill gold Lakche may have can be carted to Johan/Johalva if you pair them up, so they can buy rings and suck slightly less.

Fury x Claude is fine, just promote Fee ASAP (I'd recommend giving her the Thief Sword as she gets to those 5000G brigands first) and staffspam the hell out of everything.

Brigid x Holyn is standard. Lex is my personal favourite, but as I said, he does fine with Ayra, and this is another way to make Patty less of a headache.

Tiltyu x Levin is excellent if you manage to pull it off without losing turn tempo in gen 1, and it looks like you did it.

Sylvia with subs = good. Why take mediocre stat boosts on two units that will never be fighting over godsends such as Charisma and Elite.

Eh, some other things. Remember you can heal and dance indoors. For example, in Ch9, you have a lot of idle time for all your people except the lucky few who take care of the advance on wherever Corple is imprisoned. So during that time you can do all sorts of creative things, such as getting a lot of people hurt in the arena, then healing it off with all your staff users for free exp, then dancing with Laylea to have them do it all over again. You can also have Patty use Give twice in this one turn.

Remember that people with Prayer have no reason ever to pass up an arena win. If they need to, get them beaten down to 1hp, while taking note of how much damage they take per attack. Then add so much health to them using castle/Life Ring/healers that they end up in a good Prayer after x attacks. For example, Fin has 40 hp, and something does 10 damage to him. Normally, he would only get 10% from Prayer after 3 attacks, so just let him "die", then heal him to 12hp, and enter the arena. The instant he gets hit he gains 110% avo. The Prayer Ring from Arion might be useful for this (though Prayer Ring + Elite Ring might be too expensive for most), and females can also use the Prayer Sword.

Same goes for people with Wrath to a lesser extent. Just repeatedly reset until that Forrest misses Tinny another time so she can return with Wrath. Use Magic Ring to widen her OHKO range.

Another abusable thing for the arena is Sleep Sword. Just try until the enemy is put to sleep. It works better with Ambush, but the only people you have with Ambush can't use it or don't need it. Well, except Hannibal, but he doesn't have a very hard time with arenas to begin with.

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Successor of Raphael


Mekkah
Mar 29 2009, 03:35 PM

Aideen x Jamka is only going to affect Lester, since all you will be doing with Lana is obviously staff spamming whenever possible (I hope you let her and not Sety inherit the bulk of the good staves). I usually let Aideen pass down the Bargain Ring since Lana cannot use the arena, though you can also try to pair her up with someone. So yeah, just abuse the hell out of Lester. Hero Bow alone should be plenty, I guess.


Lana has Bargain Ring + Warp/Libro/Relive/Silence/Restore/Sleep. I had this vision that it'd be a good idea to get the Sleep staff for her while I could get it, because then if I need the cash, that's 15000G right there, which goes a far way with the Bargain Ring. As for Lester, Imma just have to deal.

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Not a fan of Lachesis x Azel. The mag difference is overrated, and they do much better damage with melee than magic weapons pretty much always. Nonetheless, nothing too crippling, you still have Pursuit and Charisma, the best things about these two.


I suppose this is true, though I was banking more on Delmud weakening with the Thunder Sword than one-rounding everything. Nanna will rarely have to fight.

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Ayra x Lex is a given. Ayra x Dew might have been recommended for ranked, as it allows the kids to buy Elite Ring at half price while allowing Lex to go with someone else, but this will of course do. Any overkill gold Lakche may have can be carted to Johan/Johalva if you pair them up, so they can buy rings and suck slightly less.


Oooh, Ayra x Dew. I never thought of that one. Now that you put it that way, I almost want to restart and give it a try. If I fail this run, then I'll try a third and final time and I'll definitely keep this in mind.

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Fury x Claude is fine, just promote Fee ASAP (I'd recommend giving her the Thief Sword as she gets to those 5000G brigands first) and staffspam the hell out of everything.


Roger that. Though... I think Fee could have also benefitted from one-rounding everything that she needs to. Noish sounds very viable.

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Brigid x Holyn is standard. Lex is my personal favourite, but as I said, he does fine with Ayra, and this is another way to make Patty less of a headache.


See, it's funny because I totally forgot to get Midir to talk to her, and when I did realize it, they were on two separate parts of chapter 4, but Holyn had been beside her just because of how they were standing. So I went with it. Thankfully, they fell in love - I was on my way to Reptor when it happened.

Anyway, I took the Hero Sword from Ayra and gave it to Holyn at the end of first gen. I'm reading that Celice gets one from Patty, assuming it's the replacement sword, but I think this'll do Patty fine. Faval is Faval.

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Tiltyu x Levin is excellent if you manage to pull it off without losing turn tempo in gen 1, and it looks like you did it.

Sylvia with subs = good. Why take mediocre stat boosts on two units that will never be fighting over godsends such as Charisma and Elite.


Definitely.

Quote:
 
Eh, some other things. Remember you can heal and dance indoors. For example, in Ch9, you have a lot of idle time for all your people except the lucky few who take care of the advance on wherever Corple is imprisoned. So during that time you can do all sorts of creative things, such as getting a lot of people hurt in the arena, then healing it off with all your staff users for free exp, then dancing with Laylea to have them do it all over again. You can also have Patty use Give twice in this one turn.


Thanks for mentioning it. I have made note of it and will do so when the time arises.

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Remember that people with Prayer have no reason ever to pass up an arena win. If they need to, get them beaten down to 1hp, while taking note of how much damage they take per attack. Then add so much health to them using castle/Life Ring/healers that they end up in a good Prayer after x attacks. For example, Fin has 40 hp, and something does 10 damage to him. Normally, he would only get 10% from Prayer after 3 attacks, so just let him "die", then heal him to 12hp, and enter the arena. The instant he gets hit he gains 110% avo. The Prayer Ring from Arion might be useful for this (though Prayer Ring + Elite Ring might be too expensive for most), and females can also use the Prayer Sword.


See, stuff like this should've been a priority for me to look for. Deu's Bargain would be a godsend for me, but I neglected it. Prayer is such a good skill, too, but I neglected Finn. If I had put some more thought into it, I would have two children with Prayer (possibly Lachesis x Finn if not Beowulf) and two with Bargain. This would allow me to zone in on certain characters for the Elite/Prayer/Bargain rings, and a lot of them would be getting them for cheap. Plus they all, directly or indirectly, net me more wins in the arena. Considering what you've told me, I could've made this even better than I'm doing now.

Edain x Midir because all that's needed is Pursuit and Edain's belongings.
Ayra x Dew for next time, if there needs to be one, for what you told me earlier
Lachesis x Beo/Finn, depending on the results of Azel!Delmud
Sylvia x nobody, or Lex if he's free. Charisma or faster leveling... bohth are fine to me
Fury x Noish so Fee can have the power needed to kill Mountain Thieves
Brigid x Lex sounds like a very good idea to me. The sooner I can get Patty off of me, the better
Tiltyu x Levin is win.

I kinda wish I asked for advice before starting my runs. This would have already been put up.

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Same goes for people with Wrath to a lesser extent. Just repeatedly reset until that Forrest misses Tinny another time so she can return with Wrath. Use Magic Ring to widen her OHKO range.


Best way to level those mages.

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Another abusable thing for the arena is Sleep Sword. Just try until the enemy is put to sleep. It works better with Ambush, but the only people you have with Ambush can't use it or don't need it. Well, except Hannibal, but he doesn't have a very hard time with arenas to begin with.


Yet another reason to do Sylvia x Lex. There's even that elusive Arden, who seems to make a decent father actually... but alone he's just lolworthy.

Thanks for all of this - you're really making me think better about what I should be doing. I'm currently at the beginning of chapter 7. I hope I can beat it this time.
Edited by Successor of Raphael, Mar 29 2009, 10:39 PM.
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Inui
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Power of Flower

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I don't know how you're 30ing Holyn. What levels do you normally have for Alec and Noish? Azel? Arden and Deu? Apparently I'm missing something because, while I did improve overall, I'm not getting these same results that you are.


The arena makes it really easy to get him to level 30. He gets enough from the arena and chapter four. Chapter four is really good to give your non-mounted units EXP since the mounted units are really slowed down. If you're having trouble with him, give him a boss kill in chapter four.

Noish and Alec are mounted, so it's easy to level them up. However, I don't usually get them to level 30. 25+ is really easy, though, especially for Alec since he actually has Pursuit.

Azel sucks...but he can rape the arena when he gets wind magic and move around after he promotes. Getting him to 25+ is easy if you work on promoting him early so he gets that horse.

Arden and Dew fail hardcore, so leveling them is crazy hard. I really suck at it. I can get them to ~10 and I often give up or just fail, lol.
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Mekkah


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Chapter four is really good to give your non-mounted units EXP since the mounted units are really slowed down.


Not really. There's some forests, but before you reach them your mounts have like 3 turns to run way ahead over a road, and then they get to move after attacking. The rest of the way to the first castle is much of the same. Over the mountains to Silesia, I believe promoted mounts and foots have about the same movement, and from there it's a straight road to the first castle.

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If you're having trouble with him, give him a boss kill in chapter four.


Bosskills don't help, as promoted units or bosses don't really give more EXP than unpromoted or non-bosses. Only level matters, and the levels are hardly any higher than the normal enemies you face in that chapter.
Edited by Mekkah, Mar 31 2009, 10:34 AM.
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