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| Agustrian War Room | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Jun 23 2009, 03:23 PM (7,574 Views) | |
| Tiaro | Jul 16 2009, 12:18 PM Post #166 |
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BOOM! Headshot.
:3
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It's safe to say Manster won't act against us right now, so let's worry about others, shall we? |
Brawl code: 1118-0273-4847
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| Phoenix Wright | Jul 16 2009, 07:22 PM Post #167 |
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that moron that forgot this is s11
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...And why are you still dwelling on Yied? Did you attempt to get Isaac's help in Silesia after we're done helping them? Better yet, did you even READ where I said I'd be IN FAVOR of attacking Yied if we got Isaac support in Silesia for it later? I'm willing to bet you didn't, and that you didn't read the last post either, because your entire response is entirely irrelevant to what I'm saying. Oh, and since you seemed to have missed it while getting lost in "paranoid walls of text" that are actually well-backed points that you can't seem to effectively respond to, I called for taking Madino from Silesia. I'm not just throwing out "rampant paranoia and overanalyzed walls of text for every single suggestion" -- I'm bringing my own suggestions into this as well, suggestions that will further our goals more immediately. So, since you're probably still not listening, I'll reiterate again: Provided we get Isaac help in Silesia, I am in favor of attacking Yied. And instead of just sitting there and calling every country you want to fight retarded and discounting their intelligence, and then slandering me as a paranoid, passive nay-sayer, how about you actually show that Manster won't help their ally Miletos by giving them money? Or are you incapable of proving that point, too? And before you start calling me paranoid, belligerent, insulting, or whatever, I quote you:
You're the one that made this personal, attacking me (and please, do a better job than that when you're going to attack, your main line of attack was more crooked, twisted, and generally wrong than the Mexican government) when all I was doing was providing an alternate voice to refine your ideas and make the final result of our deliberations better for the good of all. |
Previously: Ron DeLite, Simon
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| Hakado | Jul 17 2009, 12:17 AM Post #168 |
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The Card Master
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Bullshit. This would only serve to make us look like bad allies. We should go straight for Yied, then we can make negotiations for Isaac and us to assault Silesia. These are NOT things that should be done simultaniously. AFTER we show Isaac we're usefull, we sill speak of these things. If you want to form a alliance that's actually worth shit, this is not the way to do it. But hey, sure, if you want, I'll go talk to DSie on msn and go like 'Hey wanna invade Silesia together? :NomNomNom:' and she'll be like 'Rofl okay' and things will be awesome, right?
All of what you've been saying, all of it, has been wrapped in your lovely analysing bullshit. If you can get that part out I may actually stop being annoyed by the walls of text you keep posting. What's the point in taking Madino? Immediatly furthering our goals? Unless you want to harm us, no. You dont just take one territory of an enemy nation. You have to GO TO WAR TO TAKE THEIR TERRITORIES. If we go to war, we need to be ready to take all of it. To do that we want alliances. To make alliances, like, say, the Isaac one youre fapping over, we're going to have to kill Yied first. Since I generally prefer not to have two nations killing our asses. I'm not going on some exchanging help bullshit with Isaac. If we want an alliance that's worth shit, we will not go that route.
WHICH IS BULLSHIT AND WE'RE NOT GOING THAT ROUTE Alliances can and likely will be formed after Yied. After. I want alliances that are actually worth shit, thank you. And yes, the ones we have so far are. Grandbell and Verdane are barrier nations, even with Grandbell being weak-ass faggots. Manster is, despite your paranoia making you afraid of what they might do with their discount (Which will amount to 'Yaye shiny weapons!' and pretty much nothing more.), will prove usefull since theyre the merchants, and if you were even thinking slightly IC (which you're not) you'd see why you want them to be allies rather then not.
Have you LOOKED at the bullshit Yied and Miletos have posted? Really? I'm RIGHT in saying theyre idiots. Yied had Ryoku fucking things up in the War Declaration thread he shouldnt even be replying to, not to mention the money-whoring they KNEW would create animosity towards them, and Miletos has Arden. Arden's the kind of guy who spends 600 gold simply because one city has a shinier name then the other. And I'm dead fucking serious about that one. Not a different country, no, simply because one's the 'capitol' which is a utterly meaningless title in this game. Oh, and they could've taken the capitol right after this battle, I believe. If I need to explain why Arden's an idiot you need to lurk moar.
They earned that money by smartly playing their discount advantage. And money isnt worth a whole lot in this Rpg to begin with, youknow. Not after the initial phase of buying 1-2 ranges and Steels were still in the middle of. This Rpg has a ton of money. All Manster's helping us doing is spending it more efficiently. And I sincerely doubt Miletos is the type of nation to even ask for money in the first place. They seem to have the proud warrior schtick going on, and that means while they may ask for units, which Manster will not comply with when it comes to fighting us, or nothing. Money? I seriously doubt they'll even considering asking for it. There is no proof. No proof either way. You have paranoia, I have precedent. Fuck paranoia to hell and back. Unlike your overanalysed paranoia when it comes to Miletos/Manster, I know the leader. Well. He will dodge any attempt at Miletos forcing miletary help out of then. Except, ofcourse, apart from ONE easily dodged statement in the alliance treaty (Militairy Aid. Vaguer then shitfuck, and with no statements or explanations or anything at all to back it up? It may as well not be in the treaty), your point also has no proof. Especially not since Manster's been a force of inaction, of neutrality, in all but signing alliances. Alliances they want since they get barrier nations from them.
Right. Alternate voice. Refining ideas. In part, you're right. Sadly, it's also still wrapped in your overanalysing bullshit. Stop being so goddamned serious about everything. And yes, that includes NOT overanalysing everything, and just having fun Now we've got two choices the way I see it, we can either drop this subject and try to coexist, or we can stop being in the same nation, because continuing along this vein wont end well. Ball's in your court, Simon. |
Previously known as: Serra, Hakato, Hakado, Dorgie Poo, Pearl Fey, Kallen and Sailor Moon ![]() HakaDSie>Kovutachi
Weird as fuck, isnt he? | |
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| Hollie | Jul 17 2009, 10:15 AM Post #169 |
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Resident Brit
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Um, just to point out, Simon, but Hakado knows Wirt better than anybody else here. If he says Wirt won't help Manster, then I'm inclined to believe him. I don't know Wirt well at all, but it doesn't strike me as something he'd do, either. I... apparently fail at peacekeeping, so I just have to say you're both going overboard now. Simon, Hakado does know what he's doing, and Hakado, Simon is only trying to help, even if he is being paranoid. |
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| Tiaro | Jul 17 2009, 10:29 AM Post #170 |
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BOOM! Headshot.
:3
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I know him well, too, and he wouldn't do that to us. If there was anyone I trusted with my life besides Hakado, it'd be Wirt. Manster won't betray us. We had our alliance agreed on before we even started the RPG. I'm pretty sure ours is more important than theirs to Miletos. But, yeah, I agree this is getting a little silly, calm down guys. |
Brawl code: 1118-0273-4847
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| Phoenix Wright | Jul 17 2009, 03:00 PM Post #171 |
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that moron that forgot this is s11
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argh, I had a response and accidentally deleted it, so here comes the skeletal version (and everyone rejoices that it's a skeletal version): 1. Concessions: We are dealing with people that don't seem to know what they're doing; It seems unlikely Manster would be demanded to help in the attack, or help Miletos in any way that has actual value. 2. I don't know Wirt, so I don't have your precedent. So I assume(d) he would help an ally he promised to help, and thus we have our enemy benefiting from the 5% discount deal. No paranoia there at all. (And I'm not really inclined yet, due to lack of clear evidence, just to accept someone's character profile and call it done.) 3. Clarification 1: I was not intending to propose simultaneous invasions of Silesia and Yied. I was trying to propose supporting Isaac now by attacking Yied, and then getting them to return the favor in Silesia later. I keep mentioning Madino because it's rather important to securing right away, since its capture will prevent Silesia from mounting a serious offensive on our side of the bay/sea/whatever, but we don't have to attack Madino right this minute IF we can instead attack Yied and get Isaac's help. 4. Clarification 2: I *am* (or was, before you started going on personal attacks) enjoying this. I thought we were having a good discussion. I suppose you don't share that view.
Out of curiosity -- and not interest, for the record -- how would you go about the latter?
Well, neutrality helps in peacekeeping. Just saying, putting words in my mouth (When did I ever actually question Hakado's ability to lead a nation?) and calling me names is not making me any more conducive to your admittedly well-meant intentions. |
Previously: Ron DeLite, Simon
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| Hakado | Jul 17 2009, 03:14 PM Post #172 |
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The Card Master
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1. Glad you see my point. I call them idiots because, well, they are. But your way is more politically correct, I guess. 2. The 5% discount deal is open to everyone thanks to the Manster Trade Accord. This has nothing to do with our enemies, or allies, or neutral countries, really. Merely Wirt playing his country's advantage to the Hilt. 3. A point I never got from any of your posts, but I guess it wasnt specified either way, so it was my bad too. Madino is our first Silesian target, for obvious reasons, yes. And I'll enjoy crushing Tripz, but that's for personal reasons <.< 4. If all your posts were skeletan versions like this one, I probably would've enjoyed it much more. I dislike reading walls of text all the time, and then having to reply to them. And the paranoid part started to irritate me alot when you didnt even want to use a free discount everyone has access to. The latter would be, essentially, kicking you from Agustria. To be honest I'm not sure if it's allowed, since we havent formulated any rules on the matter as Judges, but I have the capability as effective owner of the Agustria group. |
Previously known as: Serra, Hakato, Hakado, Dorgie Poo, Pearl Fey, Kallen and Sailor Moon ![]() HakaDSie>Kovutachi
Weird as fuck, isnt he? | |
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| Hollie | Jul 17 2009, 03:23 PM Post #173 |
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Resident Brit
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Neee, sorry, I was more inferring there a general "do you really know anything about politics and/or debating?" (To quote, "Or are you incapable of proving that point, too?"). If that was not your intention, I apologise, but that was what I got from reading between the lines. Also, considering this is a player-run RPG on the internet... you are being a little paranoid. Really. I'm glad this seems to be resolved now, though. Srs bsns arguments are not fun. |
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| Phoenix Wright | Jul 17 2009, 08:12 PM Post #174 |
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that moron that forgot this is s11
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Well, I can definitely understand why you'd read into it. I tend to use a lot of implications. But no, I was being straightforward with the question -- I'd been challenging his proof the entire time, so that was another instance of doing so, not questioning his abilities. Hakado is a great leader, and I'm not saying that to cast a reconciliatory mood -- I mean it. I wouldn't have joined Agustry otherwise. I stand firm on my plea regarding paranoia, though -- the fact that this is a player-run RPG means little to nothing to me. You see, I've been doing a lot of Diplomacy lately, and Diplomacy runs off of realpolitik (which I may have mentioned earlier). Realpolitik isn't some kind of tag-team and trust other nations mode of operation; it runs off of how world leaders conduct themselves, or in other words, you're expected to act in the best interests of your own nation (yourself). And since everyone else has that hypercompetitive, utilitarian mentality, you either adopt it or die. Quickly. I had (falsely, as it were) thought this might be a similar mindset, so I brought that mentality to this game. ...And apparently, it's not realpolitik at all >.> EDIT: yes, it looks more like a wall of text, but bear with me, the explanation was necessary given how polarized the two modicums of operation (this and realpolitik) are. Edited by Phoenix Wright, Jul 17 2009, 08:12 PM.
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Previously: Ron DeLite, Simon
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| Tiaro | Jul 17 2009, 10:50 PM Post #175 |
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BOOM! Headshot.
:3
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Naw, not really. It's an RPG. Friends will help out friends, enemies will target enemies, etc, etc. Strategy is, of course, a smart thing to use, but we don't really need to dig into it that much. |
Brawl code: 1118-0273-4847
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| Phoenix Wright | Jul 18 2009, 12:42 PM Post #176 |
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that moron that forgot this is s11
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Well, then, for future reference, could someone compile a list of the nations' leaders' close friends that are also leaders? This would help predict the nations' actions if friendships are a good indicator. So for example, Hakado/Wirt would be an entry 'cause y'all are close and Hakado can predict Wirt's actions based on their friendship. In case it's not obvious, I've been out of the loop for a while, so... |
Previously: Ron DeLite, Simon
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| Hakado | Jul 18 2009, 12:45 PM Post #177 |
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The Card Master
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Uhm, I dont know other people's relationships all that well. But I figured Jordan me and Wirt would be obvious since we were, like, the only active people in Sol ;>_> |
Previously known as: Serra, Hakato, Hakado, Dorgie Poo, Pearl Fey, Kallen and Sailor Moon ![]() HakaDSie>Kovutachi
Weird as fuck, isnt he? | |
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| Tiaro | Jul 18 2009, 01:18 PM Post #178 |
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BOOM! Headshot.
:3
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It's not our friendship it's based on. We KNOW him, which allows us to predict his actions. Saying it's based on friendship sounds retarded. XP |
Brawl code: 1118-0273-4847
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| Hakado | Jul 18 2009, 01:18 PM Post #179 |
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The Card Master
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It's true in essence, though. |
Previously known as: Serra, Hakato, Hakado, Dorgie Poo, Pearl Fey, Kallen and Sailor Moon ![]() HakaDSie>Kovutachi
Weird as fuck, isnt he? | |
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| Tiaro | Jul 18 2009, 01:26 PM Post #180 |
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BOOM! Headshot.
:3
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Not really, you don't have to be best friends with someone to know them generally. |
Brawl code: 1118-0273-4847
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3:45 AM Jul 11