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| Final Fantasy III-DS; The other, OTHER FF topic | |
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| Topic Started: Nov 15 2006, 07:55 PM (1,255 Views) | |
| Justin | Dec 24 2006, 09:39 PM Post #51 |
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Teh RPG Master
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Err. You mean Dark Knight right? The ones that can use the Katanas? They are a pretty decent class with high attack power but, their magic defense aint too great. Ninjas are the same way now. They are monsters in the attack department but, they get raped magic wise and their defense is a tad lower than say the Knight class. Of course I'm not mad the classes needed balancing badly. I just wish the summon magic weren't so...useless this time around. About the only other thing I'm mad about is that Ninjas can no longer equip everything. So you need to use a Knight to use Excalibur and Ragnarok this time around. Like I said it needed to be done. Hell Sages aren't as uber as they used to be. Magus' make better attack mages than they do. Better to use Sage as a back up healer or hell just make another Devout. By ya DK is a solid class, I say go for it. Bear in mind their EQ is a bit limited. I think they can use Crystal stuff. No clue. BTW leveling in Bahamut's lair B2 as Black Belts FTW. |
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| Carbunkle Flux | Dec 25 2006, 01:39 PM Post #52 |
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Abyssian Legend
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I have no idea; it depends entirely on if Black Belt gets those same job level attack/defense bonuses that Monk does. If so, Black Belt is clearly the better of the two. If not, Monk has a really high chance of kicking its ass as job levels go by. In the original, Black Belt (called Master) was the direct upgrade to Monk (called Black Belt); but they've tried to balance all the classes out. Heck, I've heard good things about taking even Fighters/Black Mages/White Mages/Red Mages to the endgame in this version.
Aaaack, yeah. I know about Dark Knight, I just didn't put two and two together in my head. Refia's a DK for me right now and kicking all sorts of ass, so I don't want Arc to be one too. If Ninja didn't come waaaay later, I'd pick that.
Yes, dear god did the classes need balancing. They did a very good job of doing it too. I'm having a hard time actually choosing my final party @_@.
Abusing HP growth, eh? XD |
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| Justin | Dec 25 2006, 03:35 PM Post #53 |
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Teh RPG Master
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Ya... I'm not enjoying the grinding but, my party needs the boost. I really don't want to take on DC at full power. I'm going to try to kill the optional guys first. That and I need money for more shurikens. The battles in Bahamut's lair hand out 5700 EXP and roughly 4700-5100 gil a battle. I've already got 7 of those babies I just need a good 23 more. X_X |
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| SaintAjora | Dec 25 2006, 08:34 PM Post #54 |
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Tatyana Lasaiev
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Well over time whenever I get the chance I'm playing this. In any case I've currently gotten the second set of job classes. As with other FF Job Classes, I'm doing the split thing. Well nearly. Since there are 23 classes in the game. So that evens out to about five per character. Free Lancer is the base class so that's out of the divisio n. Onion Knight is the special class and thus it's out of the division too. So that leaves one class to leave out of the split. Which will be the Red Mage. Main reason is for parts where I must be mini, I'll need magical might. So I may as well train everyone as Red Mages. Thus making Free Lancer, Red Mage, and Onion Knights (If I ever get it) the only shared classes. Currently as of the second Crystal the split goes like this. Refia: White Mage, Scholar, Arc: Thief, Geomancer, Luneth: Black Mage, Ranger, Ignus: Warrior, Knight. Okay then I'll admit the first I think of is simple. What class should Refia be? I just had to make her a White Mage and then I found she looked rather nice as A scholar so I went for it. I'll decide on the rest of the split when I get more jobs. In fact around that point I should actually give someone the Monk class already. Also I'm not dropping old classes complete. For two basic reasons. First I may need/want to come back to them. Second once I do reach the final area it will make easier to experiment in terms of final battle party. One thing I'm trying to decide on is this. Do I want for example Refia to be both the White Mage and Devout. Or would I rather have someone else be the Devout instead. That way I can have both a low level and higher level white magic user. Again each time I have 4+ classes to choose from, I'll ask myself "What should Refia be?" |
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| Carbunkle Flux | Dec 25 2006, 09:33 PM Post #55 |
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Abyssian Legend
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I say have her take the Summoner route. Make her an Evoker and then finally a Summoner. Just don't plan on your Sage getting good summon magic either, though; the Sage gets Evoker's crap @_@. |
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| SaintAjora | Dec 26 2006, 02:16 AM Post #56 |
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Tatyana Lasaiev
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Honestly speaking in the original version I rather liked using the Evoker's Summons. Sure eventually it was better to use a Summoner, but well it was kind of fun to see which of the two effects would come up. Perhaps my memory is off, but I remember some of the status effect stuff working rather well. If I remember right I made quite a bit of use of Leviathan in Bahamut's cave thing. Still I am considering making one of Refia's five personal classes either an Evoker or Summoner. There is also the option of both classes as you suggested. Which would make sense in one regard. I could just buy one set of summon spells and in the case of the ones that require me to beat the said summon, I would not be able to buy them until later. Granted there is also the option of neither for her. As in give them both to another or split them between two others. Also while it is interesting suggestion the real issue at hand had to do with the whole White Magic thing. Which was only an example. The same idea applies to Black Magic which of course is the other thing to consider. Heck Summon Magic something I forgot to consider, but I was remind thanks to you. Thus now I have a good idea what I should do. Refia will take both White Mage and Devout. While Luneth will take both Black Mage and Magus. Granted it would not be that hard to give two characters White Magic spells and two Black Magic spells. With the only real difference being that the W/B Mages would not have any level 8 spells. However when you add in the Summon factor the split becomes a bit more uneven. A more even split would be White/Summon/Black/Multi. As in the fourth member who does not specialize gets to be the Sage. So it's either Arc as the Sage and Ignus as the Summoner/Evoker or the other way around. Luneth is already eliminated since he's got Black Mage/Magus covered. While Refia is out of the race since she has White Mage/Devout covered. The fate of those two has been sealed. |
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| Justin | Dec 26 2006, 02:49 PM Post #57 |
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Teh RPG Master
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I am so bored. I forgot how rotten getting money for shurikens is. It needs to be done though. Wait. The summon magic was like that in FF3j as well? Hmm well I guess I never bothered with it then because I sure don't remember it working like that. The only time I used summon magic was when I got the Sage class. Of course they can't use summon magic anymore. Well high summons anyways. BTW SA, where is that quote from in your sig? I rather like it. |
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| SaintAjora | Dec 26 2006, 06:23 PM Post #58 |
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Tatyana Lasaiev
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I suppose in my case the reason I remember the difference between Evoker and Summoner is I started using Summons as soon as I could. I used summons under all three classes that can use. In some ways it's understandable that they made it so Sages can't use the higher summons. They probably didn't want the Summoner to be easily replaceable. In the end this results in the Sage being even closer to a higher level Red Mage with the main difference being the addition of Summon Magic. In any case during my level up phase to get all chosen classes to level 30 roughly, I had noticed Ignus was lagging behind in terms of Job levels, I eventually let the other three be Red Mages to let Ignus catch up. Since Red Mage was not something I really plan to use that much beyond some parts. In fact I did not bother to get anyone in Red Mage to level 30. However then again if anything it may make more sense for Monk to be the shared class. After all there is the problem of limited equipment. Also while potentially deadly, I'm not sure if retaliate is a skill I'd want to rely on in real battles. As in going through an area as opposed to just leveling up, classing up, earning cash, etc. Thus if I were to go for this strategy what would happen is this. Ignus would get to be the Evoker/Summoner. The main reason is that Arc has more levels in Red Mage than Ignus. Thus I may as well have Arc go the Red Mage/Sage route. When characters do manage to reach the goal "level" for their classes, I'll switch the said character(s) to a Monk for awhile until the other member(s) reach their goal level(s). Granted you could say "Why not just continue leveling up a chosen class? Why bother with Monk then?" Well the reason being two things. I'd class their classes levels to be relative even. I don't want huge gaps where the Refia has job level 80 in White Mage while Ignus is a poor level 45 Warrior. Second I want to make use of nearly every single class and Monk works best as the class to switch to when a character is done. Obviously if I'm in the middle of a dungeon, I'm not going to have a character repeatedly switch his/her class every time one gains a level. That would just be insane. Justin, my current sig comes from Unlimited SaGa. To be exact it's from Mythe's quest and is said near the end of his quest. |
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| Carbunkle Flux | Dec 26 2006, 08:18 PM Post #59 |
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Abyssian Legend
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There isn't a whole lot of point to balancing the job levels out; it's better to keep everyone going at their own pace IMO. Sure, you get huge gaps but honestly the difference in performance stops becoming readily apparent around job level like...35 or so. The characters only really suck at what they're doing while you're still trying to get them off the ground. It just seems like a lot of work to do that for no real purpose or reward, but that's just me. Enjoy the game how you like, yo ^^. I tried making Arc an Evoker on a larc since in all honesty I don't think I gave them a proper chance before judging them; especially after Ajora's insistence that they were useful. Lo and behold; an Evoker isn't really that bad at all. They can use staves so their regular attack becomes any level 1 spell of my choice, Titan is an attack summon nomatter what I do so I have consistent high level damage and Ifrit is just plain useful (1500 HP healed on my whole party? Hell yes!). My Evoker is a handy attack and support mage all rolled up in one. And I like that. I do believe it'll be going up to 99 like Scholar now. My only real gripe is that somebody was on crack when naming the summon spells themselves. Ifrit is called 'Heatra' when you buy it, but neither of Ifrit's attacks are 'Heatra'. With Evoker it's Fire's Blessing, with Summoner it's Hellfire. All of the summons appear to be named in this retarded manner O_o. |
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| SaintAjora | Dec 26 2006, 10:12 PM Post #60 |
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Tatyana Lasaiev
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Honestly speaking you're right. Trying to balance all the various classes would just get too tedious. However I still want to get new jobs up to speed. Thus I'll probably make the goal level for new jobs the 30s. This works based on what I've already done and based on the level 35 thing you mentioned. Edit: I'm removing the information about the split for a reason. It's being updated in another post. |
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| SaintAjora | Dec 29 2006, 02:05 AM Post #61 |
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Tatyana Lasaiev
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Shared: Free Lancer, Monk, Onion Knight. Refia: W.Mage, Scholar, Dragoon, Ninja, Devout. Arc: Thief, Geomancer, R.Mage, Black Belt, Sage. Luneth: B.Mage, Ranger, Bard, D.Knight, Magus. Ignus: Warrior, Knight, Viking, Evoker, Summoner. All right this is my final choice in terms of the classes now that I got to see what Refia looked like as certain classes. In any case the classes are definitely better balanced in this version. It was fun watching Refia the Scholar pull out an item for intense lightning damage and murder the Kraken. Well it took some damage before, but still just think if half that damage was not enough to kill it. In any case once Arc and Ignus reach level 20 Monk, I'll move forward. I'm not even going to bother with Evoker and Dark Knight right now. Maybe I'll work on them later when I can get some Summons for the Evoker to use. Actually Ignus is an Evoker right now, but only because Arc has the Monk's equipment and I don't feel like buying a second set. I'm not sure if this is the best split per se, but I don't really care as it is the one I want. If such a split hampers me then well I must accept as part of the challenge. If I want Refia to jump on people then I can't rely on her to heal. If I want her to study things then I can't throw Shurikens into people's eyes. Err you get the idea. You can tell I'm enjoying this game right? |
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| Runeslash | Dec 31 2006, 01:22 AM Post #62 |
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109th Star of Destiny
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Despite my better judgement, I picked this game back up today. And I'm happy to report that, after extensive... or perhaps excessive might be a better word... preparations I finally beat that stupid asshole Kraken (I only had Luneth and Arc left, but I did beat him by golly). I wasted a lot of money on Ice Armor/Helms/Shields setups though, thinking wrongly that they'd protect me from Blizzara. Oh well. Now I'm to a point where even regular encounters are getting tough. In a sense, this is actually good... the game is finally starting to make no bones that it's even tougher than it's original NES version, so maybe it'll be easier to accept the higher difficulty when it's constant like this. So... yeah, I'm back on good, but not great, terms with this game again. I dunno if it'll last... some of the dungeons sound like nightmares from what I've read here. But I'll at least give it a shot. Part of me admittedly likes the challenge. |
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| Justin | Dec 31 2006, 11:24 PM Post #63 |
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Teh RPG Master
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Actually everything evens off a bit after Kraken. Though I do advise you to level up a bit in the sewers and make sure you have the money you need for equipment and items. Goldor isn't too tough, I just don't like his maze like mansion. BTW don't waste your time using magic on him. Does nonsense for dmg. Of course this doesn't mean you need to adjust your party's jobs at all. Just keep what you have and let your Black Mage defend. Better if he takes a hit or two as opposed to your offensive attackers. The one nasty part that's coming up is Garuda. He is a ROYAL pain in the ass. Power leveling won't help you in the fight against him. Your best bet is a pair of Dragoons, a White mage, and whatever else you want. After that it's a bit of luck. The good thing is that once you beat him and get the Natulus things get a bit easier. You get access to the sunken cave for leveling and you get your 2nd level spell rods. So keep your chin up, you'll do fine. |
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| Runeslash | Jan 1 2007, 01:47 AM Post #64 |
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109th Star of Destiny
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Actually, I got kinda lucky... I went through the sewers twice (party got weak enough I had to teleport out on my first attempt), PLUS I went through Goldur's palace three times because I forgot that all locked doors are supposed to be opened by a thief and kept searching for another way. So yeah, I got a nice bit of leveling done without really trying ^_^ I'm currently right after the point where your ship gets shot down over Saronia; Luneth is at level 27, everyone else is at 26. The game has suddenly gotten quite a bit easier between having a Dark Knight at my disposal and me finally starting to get a good grasp of this game's version of the Job System (FFV spoiled me). My party is more or less proficient with the following classes... Luneth: Dragoon, Knight, and Warrior Ingus: Dark Knight, Thief, and Scholar Refia: White and Red Mage Arc: Black and Red Mage So yeah... a dedicated fighter, a moderate fighter, a healer, and a mage. Anyhow I just hope the game stays on my good side this time. |
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| Justin | Jan 1 2007, 02:04 AM Post #65 |
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Teh RPG Master
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That's good. By the looks of your levels you're doing just fine. Though I feel I should warn you, Garuda is right around the corner. In fact you're less than 5 mins from him now. Be sure to climb the Dragon Spire in NE Saronia. Got some good stuff at it's top. You may want to temporarily make Ingus a Dragoon for the battle like I said. After that it's mostly luck. You'll see what I mean. Just have Refia heal each turn, have the Dragoons jump and have Arc cast his strongest spell, or use a lv3 battle item IF you had the fortune of getting one as a drop. After you get your sub I highly suggest going to the Suken Cave in the lower SE corner of the map. It's that odd semi-triangle shaped island. Got some nice stuff and some damn nice EXP there. |
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| SaintAjora | Jan 1 2007, 07:11 AM Post #66 |
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Tatyana Lasaiev
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I now have the final set of jobs and thus I'm nearly done with the game. It's mainly a case of preparation and completing the remaining area I plan/have to do. Granted depending on who you ask my preparations may be a bit much, but I'd rather be safe than sorry. I already have a basic plan set up as it were. I think the real issue will be deciding the final party for the final boss. Preparation means gaining money, character levels, job levels, and buying stuff. For certain I'll want spells of magical might for the mages. Speaking of Garuda, I decided to be defiant and not use Dragoons. It worked out just fine. Granted level 32 may have been a bit much, but the party I chose of Scholar, Geomancer, Bard, and Warrior would have likely been crushed in the original even if my levels were much higher. So that left me with a good. It also makes deciding the final party make up a bit more challenging. Since it's not as simple as dump everything for Ninja and Sage. |
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| Runeslash | Jan 1 2007, 04:22 PM Post #67 |
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109th Star of Destiny
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Whoooo... I just trounced Garuda. My levels weren't much better than I posted earlier (might've been slightly higher due to the Dragoon Tower), and I decided to stick with Dragoon, Dark Knight, White Mage, and Black Mage... yet I had no problems. The fight lasted only four rounds, and no one died except him. Hmm... lucky shot perhaps? I'm just shocked I had so little trouble with him after reading all your posts... Anyhow... now I've got a super fast airship, medium to high end magic, and summons to mess around with. Yay! |
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| Justin | Jan 1 2007, 06:58 PM Post #68 |
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Teh RPG Master
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He did use Lightning right? If he did do you recall how much dmg it did to you? It's supposed to hit for at least 450-500 dmg per person. Save for the magic classes IIRC. I'm thinking you might have gotten some heal spells off before his next attack if you beat him in one go. Consider yourself lucky. |
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| Runeslash | Jan 1 2007, 07:21 PM Post #69 |
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109th Star of Destiny
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Yep... did around 350 - 450 damage to everyone (my mages took less damage).
Correct again. I just noticed Refia is level 36 as a White Mage and Arc is 35 as a Black Mage. Perhaps that helped with their speed and defenses? I always like keeping mages in my party since they can stay in the back row while still having semi-decent attack power via using staffs as spells, in addition to the fact that they're always useful just in themselves. Of course, those are their current levels, but still, I'm not a whole lot farther... I'm about to enter the Temple of Time (OFF TOPIC: sorry... but I have to say it... Zelda's gonna sue someone). I might add, Luneth was doing around 3500 HP with each jump, plus Arc and Ingus were doing about 1500 each with Blizzaga and Souleater respectively. Don't ask me how, I'm not sure myself. |
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| SaintAjora | Jan 2 2007, 01:26 AM Post #70 |
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Tatyana Lasaiev
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Ah yes I've finally beaten Final Fantasy 3 DS. While I switched my party on occasion and this true of even the final area. I will likely try a different set up next time I face the thing. I just wanted the security of a Devout before I tried a Scholar. The party I used for the final boss was the following set up. Refia was a Devout and she was healing everyone. Arc was a Geomancer and he use the power of nature to attack. Luneth was a Bard and he'd alternate between singing a song to reduce damage and singing a song that does damage to all based on remaining HP. Which meant the final boss would take a lot of damage and I'd get a clue it was almost dead. Finally Ignus was a Warrior that used advance to do extra damage. In any case my final verdict as one who has completed the original and this remake is that the DS version is far superior to the NES version that it's not even a contest. I mean about the only advantage the NES version may have is the classic challenge thanks to terrible design. And if well that's your advantage then well it's not saying much. They weren't kidding when they said the Jobs were more balanced. Now mind you some Jobs are still better than others which is a given. However at least in this version Jobs that were pointless to use have become plausible to use. This makes the game a lot more fun as I no longer feel jobs were just thrown into inflate numbers. The characters being actual characters helped a lot. Each one has their own personal connection to the story. It's no longer a case of story character talks to random orphan. The points they used to introduce each character worked out rather well in the long run. Granted this doesn't make the story deeeeeeeeep, but it does help flesh it out and leaves one feeling content. Finally as required and expected of me. I'll mention the absolute most important improvement is the fact one of the main characters is now female because I'm shallow. Seriously Refia is rather cute. She looks so nice in some of the classes. I especially like her look as a Scholar. |
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| Justin | Jan 2 2007, 09:56 PM Post #71 |
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Teh RPG Master
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Ay, I'd say you lucked out and you were well prepared in that regard RS.
That sounds about right. Though Luneth must have had some nice spears if you were doing that much dmg. Or maybe my memory is fuzzy, hmmm. Anyways with that bump in the road out of the way the real fun starts. First off I'd go to the sunken cave now. I know I've said it 3 times now but, seriously it's an awesome leveling spot and even if you don't use the treasure you can make a good bit of gil selling it. Lower right hand corner of the world map. Just dive near the triangle like island. Unless of course you've beaten me to the punch and have already gone there? Now then you're on your way to get the invincible. The next 2 dungeons and other dungeons from now on will have splitting enemies that divide in two when attacked by normal weapons. Only Katanas can kill them without causing them to split. Magic works too. So you might want to make Luneth a DK. It's your call really. Now the other thing I wanted to tell you is that rather than go back and see Doga and Unei after you claim the Earth Fang you can go to the Ancients Maze and get your 4th set of jobs. Trust me you WANT to do this. The Maze surrounds Crystal Tower in the NE corner of the map. Just walk through the 4 statues on foot and use the Invincible to cross over the moutains. After that just enter the maze and bear stright ahead. Be ready for a boss fight. If you can handle the boss in the shadow carvern you should be fine. |
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| Carbunkle Flux | Jan 3 2007, 02:31 AM Post #72 |
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Abyssian Legend
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Should be easy to; you get some really nice spears by climbing the Dragon Tower in Saronia ^_^. I'm veeeery damn slow playing this game; I've only just gotten the sub and have mostly been trying to earn money to buy Doga's ridiculously overpriced spells. I guess I'll take your indication that I should probably move on to the Sunken Cave instead of trying to farm cash in Dragon Tower o_o. |
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| Runeslash | Jan 3 2007, 09:39 PM Post #73 |
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109th Star of Destiny
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Yes, I climed the Dragoon Tower in the middle of town first. If for some reason I ever need an entire army of Dragoons as opposed to a balanced party, I'm all set.
Also... I'm rather intrigued AND rather frustrated again... twice now while trying to finish the Temple of Time, I've been ambushed and killed by Lightning spamming baddies. Surprisingly, my mages can survive at least two direct hits, but my other two obviously can't at this point. Not that it does me any good, as the mages both failed to run away in both cases. UGH. Still... it's interesting to see a FF game be this punishing. |
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| Justin | Jan 3 2007, 10:50 PM Post #74 |
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Teh RPG Master
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Ya the Chimeras in there can goto hell. The funny thing is some leveling and a couple of run ins and teleport outs for treasure really helped. The temple isn't as long once all the loot has been hoarded. Speaking of which I am so happy that the dungeons were balanced too. A lot of them are so straight forward now it's silly. The Ancients Maze, Dragon Tower, Eureka, Cystal Tower, ETC all come to mind. It really needed to be done. The Ancients maze in particular could have used a bloody short cut but, having to pass through it isn't so bad now. I noticed that the airship battling around the Shadow cave and just in general was near cut in half. I didn't run into a single enemy when I went to the Shadow cave with the Invincible. I got in and out with no problems at all. |
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| Justin | Jan 5 2007, 03:22 PM Post #75 |
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Teh RPG Master
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Hopefully with the cable connection I'll have off at school I can get my DS working Wi-fi wise. So if you guys want to share Friend Codes go ahead and post them. I'll post mine when I get it tommorow. |
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| Justin | Jan 7 2007, 06:12 PM Post #76 |
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Teh RPG Master
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Here's my Friend Code guys. Drop me an "e-mail" sometime so I can get moving on the extra goodies ; ) 210542325409 |
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| Carbunkle Flux | Jan 7 2007, 09:15 PM Post #77 |
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Abyssian Legend
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That sunken cave really made the difference; I got a TON of cash and Ingus mastered Scholar to boot ^_^. I can't wait until I start getting those master cards with the ultimate weapons I keep hearing about. Temple of Time is out of the way and now I'm on to wherever Unei is. And we should totally start exchanging when that happens too. Hmm...*swipes Justin's friend code, leaves his* 163293736669 Also- if anyone hasn't played with the mail system yet; don't send 4 mails to Cid before you have to get his last reply. I heard there was a glitch where if you did that, you'll never receive his final reply O_o;. Another thing; I think we have to both 'catch' eachother online first before we can start exchanging mails. |
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| Justin | Jan 7 2007, 09:21 PM Post #78 |
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Teh RPG Master
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I've no idea. Let me go find out.
EDIT - Hmm ya it seems I have to catch you. We'll figure it out, no worries. |
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| Runeslash | Jan 8 2007, 12:18 PM Post #79 |
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109th Star of Destiny
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I, sadly, do not have Wi-Fi access in my house, but if that ever changes, I'll happily disclose my friend code. Anyhow, this game is still in my good book... I'm about to go into the Ancient Cave north of Unei's Shrine, and I've honestly enjoyed the game aside from that stupid Kraken. I have a feeling that I'm getting close to the end of the game too... I'm already dreading the final dungeon... |
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| Carbunkle Flux | Jan 8 2007, 07:35 PM Post #80 |
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Abyssian Legend
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I'm around and will be for a little while. I'd just leave my DS on the network but they put a kill timer on it in the stupidest move ever. Just post when you've got it up and I'll sign on too...and we'll see what happens O_o. I hope we'll be able to exchange Master cards at least. I'd like to bag some nice Ultimates >_>. |
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