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| Sonic and the Secret Rings looks excellent | |
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| Topic Started: Dec 2 2006, 11:39 PM (239 Views) | |
| Renegade | Dec 2 2006, 11:39 PM Post #1 |
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what
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Much like a true 3D Sonic game, forget that 360/PS3 crap excuse for a Sonic game, this is what Sonic Team should have focused all their efforts on: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ruxm9D0p6P8 The graphics are great, the sense of speed is there, and the camera, for once, does not get in the way. |
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| RumourMaker18 | Dec 3 2006, 12:22 AM Post #2 |
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The Transcendent Pig
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It was renamed to Sonic and the Secret Rings. And it looks cool, but I'm afraid that it'll rely too much on memorization since you have so little control over your forward motion and could get a bit repetitive. |
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| Renegade | Dec 3 2006, 12:36 AM Post #3 |
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what
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Ohh yeah
To be fair, the 2D Sonics rely on the memorization as well. |
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| Killer Kitty | Dec 3 2006, 12:36 AM Post #4 |
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Wizardry 9
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Wow, that does look awesome. For once, it looks like they've managed to keep the essence of the original game in the jump to 3D (Metroid Prime being a perfect example of this). Hopefully it will turn out good. What system is that for anyway? |
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| Renegade | Dec 3 2006, 12:37 AM Post #5 |
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what
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Wii. Yes, now you have TWO reasons to buy one
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| Killer Kitty | Dec 3 2006, 12:43 AM Post #6 |
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Wizardry 9
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Wow, the graphics look awesome, I was certain it would be for PS3 or 360. And don't worry, I will be buying a Wii, but as I've said, I'm waiting for at least a couple of killer exclusives to be released. If Metroid Prime 3 comes out before February, I'll get one for my birthday. |
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| Carbunkle Flux | Dec 3 2006, 01:03 AM Post #7 |
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Abyssian Legend
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Everyone says Sonic 2006 is crap O_o. Why is this? Why is there such a negative reception to what is essentially Sonic Adventure 3? Anyway, I don't care much for how Secret Rings is turning out. Rumor's assessment pretty much hits the mark for how I feel. Unless they somehow go back on their decision to make the entire game effectively on rails, then my interest is pretty much nil. |
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| Renegade | Dec 3 2006, 01:37 AM Post #8 |
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what
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Sonic 2006, while I haven't played it, I've read that has an extremely stupid plot, really boring town missions (fetch quests, in A SONIC GAME), frequent 5-10 second loading times, frustrating levels (due to the camera), and only 1/3 of the game is actually Sonic. The problem is that Sonic Team promised this would be a refreshing revival of the series, and it's basically just the same problematic 3D Sonic with new graphics. And I really don't get why you guys say on-rails would bad... I see it as the only way a 3D Sonic could work well, and this video is a clear indication that it does, because often times the speed would be interrupted by stupid enemies and moronic puzzles in Sonic Adventure 1/2/Heroes. |
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| Carbunkle Flux | Dec 3 2006, 03:55 AM Post #9 |
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Abyssian Legend
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Sonic 2006, while I haven't played it, I've read that has an extremely stupid plot, really boring town missions (fetch quests, in A SONIC GAME), frequent 5-10 second loading times, frustrating levels (due to the camera), and only 1/3 of the game is actually Sonic. The problem is that Sonic Team promised this would be a refreshing revival of the series, and it's basically just the same problematic 3D Sonic with new graphics. What Sonic game doesn't have a stupid plot? XP Sonic in general is characterized by flashy, useless fluff there just to be cool and dramatic. And I liiiike it like that. Sonic Adventure had fetch quests too, so that is fine by me. From videos, the only loading times were between acts O_o. So I dunno about that. It can't be worse than Shadow the Hedgehog was about it, though. As for the last; of course only 1/3 of the game was Sonic. You have it divided between three main characters :P. Besides, a lot of people have some weird problems in general with playable characters at all besides Sonic lately so I can't really take that kind of criticism seriously. And I really don't get why you guys say on-rails would bad... I see it as the only way a 3D Sonic could work well, and this video is a clear indication that it does, because often times the speed would be interrupted by stupid enemies and moronic puzzles in Sonic Adventure 1/2/Heroes. From the very video you posted, the enemies might as well not be there at all @_@. Trying to kill a few he ended up Homing Attacking past them. Of course, now he can't kill them if he wanted :P. Plus, if it's on rails there's no possible sequence breaking (or if there is, it's all scripted, which defeats the purpose), there's no real sense of speed because you're not in control of it. You're just kind of there watching Sonic go and making him dodge stuff. It's like what would happen if Sonic 3D Blasts' special stages were made into a whole game @_@. I just don't care for that. |
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| Runeslash | Dec 3 2006, 11:57 AM Post #10 |
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109th Star of Destiny
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Wow... this game looks like it actually has a camera that doesn't suck ass. As long as they don't use music like this in the final version, this game could be the one Sonic's been waiting for since 2000.
I feel a rant coming on... Well, why shouldn't they? Shadow especially has fucked everything up by doubling as a hero AND villain that I don't give two shits about, but everyone else loves because of his overly forced "badass" factor. We've already got two vastly superior and well established hedgehog heroes in the forms of Sonic and Amy. AND we've already got a "Sonic rip-off" villain in the form of Metal Sonic. So Shadow just feels completely superfluous. To be fair, I do like some of the supporting cast... Amy, Tails, and to lesser extents, Rouge, E-101/Omega, Blaze, and MAYBE Cream are kinda tolerable. Robotnik/Eggman used to be a badass almost on par with Sonic himself, but has really, really, REALLY, gotten fucked up his fat ass by the developers for every 3D Sonic game (except maybe for SA2 since he had a "unique" role in that game). He might be able to redeem himself if by some miracle he's the REAL final boss of Sonic and the Secret Rings. OK, done ranting.
As someone who will never own a PS3/360, could someone tell me who the other two are? |
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| RumourMaker18 | Dec 3 2006, 01:16 PM Post #11 |
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The Transcendent Pig
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Shadow and Silver, I think. Shadow is Shadow, and Silver is psychic. I played a bit of Sonic 06 at my friend's house and it really was pretty bad. Worse than SA2, which I really enjoyed until I got stuck/gave up on a stupid Knuckles level. The camera has gotten worse, if that is possible, and it just lacks any sense of speed; you have to stop every few seconds to kill something or pull a switch or something and it really took me out of it. Anyway, in regards to the actual topic at hand, I'll just say what I said when the game was first announced/demoed: I'll enjoy this game just because I'll play it like a weird racing game.
Yes, but if you mess up short of falling into a hole you can always go back. And like Carb said, there isn't anyway to backtrack. |
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| RiotGrrl | Dec 3 2006, 01:39 PM Post #12 |
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Errant Dreamer
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I'm not a big fan of the Sonic games as a whole - hence why my copy of Sonic Rush is still sealed. Anyway, Sonic and the Secret Rings does look pretty damned awesome, and the levels look absolutely gorgeous. Wow. |
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| Carbunkle Flux | Dec 3 2006, 03:13 PM Post #13 |
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Abyssian Legend
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I feel a rant coming on... Well, why shouldn't they? Shadow especially has fucked everything up by doubling as a hero AND villain that I don't give two shits about, but everyone else loves because of his overly forced "badass" factor. We've already got two vastly superior and well established hedgehog heroes in the forms of Sonic and Amy. AND we've already got a "Sonic rip-off" villain in the form of Metal Sonic. So Shadow just feels completely superfluous. To be fair, I do like some of the supporting cast... Amy, Tails, and to lesser extents, Rouge, E-101/Omega, Blaze, and MAYBE Cream are kinda tolerable. Robotnik/Eggman used to be a badass almost on par with Sonic himself, but has really, really, REALLY, gotten fucked up his fat ass by the developers for every 3D Sonic game (except maybe for SA2 since he had a "unique" role in that game). He might be able to redeem himself if by some miracle he's the REAL final boss of Sonic and the Secret Rings. OK, done ranting. I was mostly talking about the support in general. I've seen people bitch about having playable Tails and Knuckles before. Seriously. It isn't just Shadow. But as far as Shadow goes, he is ridiculous as hell with regards to his lack of consistent history and characterization. But eh, I like him just because he's there :P. The Guns gimmick would've made a great one to finally separate him from Sonic, but apparently the creators of Sonic 2006 thought the vehicles were cooler despite that in Shadow they were worthless. I can see exactly why everyone doesn't like Shadow in particular. As far as Eggman goes, ehh. I liked the way he was in Adventure onward and he's been the real final boss in enough Sonic games (Sonic 1, 2, 3, K, 1 GG, 2 GG, Chaos, Triple Trouble, Advance, Advance 2, Rush) that it'd be boring for me now. I like it when they go episodic with a new villain of the day because it keeps the games fresh. It's not like Megaman where you know Wily is ALWAYS the source of the whole world's problems :P. I played a bit of Sonic 06 at my friend's house and it really was pretty bad. Worse than SA2, which I really enjoyed until I got stuck/gave up on a stupid Knuckles level. The camera has gotten worse, if that is possible, and it just lacks any sense of speed; you have to stop every few seconds to kill something or pull a switch or something and it really took me out of it. I will have to see when I play it. I'm oddly a little more tolerant of the Sonic 3D engine's crap than I would be of other 3D engines. How else could I still love Shadow the Hedgehog after falling through floors, jumping in wrong directions etc. |
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| Renegade | Dec 3 2006, 03:42 PM Post #14 |
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what
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Maybe I should have clarified... it has a ridiculously stupid plot for a Sonic game. Sure enough, all the Sonics have had storylines that can only be compared to Mario Bros., but please, apparently the new Sonic takes itself way too seriously and that is a serious turn off for most Sonic fans, including myself. We don't want Sonic RPG, we want mother fucking SONIC the HEDGEHOG and all of his 1000MPH glory. I just really need to say this... Fetch Quests... in Sonic? No. Just no. Might as well add some kind of DDR minigame for DMC while we're ruining games people used to love by adding gameplay elements no one asked for or even wanted. When people think Sonic, people think speed and fast paced gameplay. I'm pretty sure a large chunk of the fanbase would wtf at the simple thought of fetch quests in a Sonic game. Nobody liked the fetch quests in Sonic Adventure. Sonic Team apparently doesn't care. I guess you did like Shadow the Hedgehog, so, err, well, more power to you for that :\ You know why people have a problem with playable characters other than Sonic? Because nobody cares about other characters other than Sonic. It's SONIC for crying out loud, not Sonic & Shadow & Silver & Friends. I, for one, would love if Sonic Team just removed every single character they have created over the years except Tails, Knuckles, and Eggman. And sure, you could say "well Sonic 3 & Knuckles was only 1/3 Sonic!"... but at least I could play through the entire game AS Sonic, and not be forced other characters when I sure as hell don't want to play as them. Sonic was the most enjoyable parts of Sonic Adventure and Sonic Adventure 2. Why just WHY can't Sonic Team understand this? Enemies were really irrelevant in the 2D Sonics as well. They were just there to make sure you weren't just sleeping on that "Forward" button. And I'm pretty sure even if all the enemies were removed from the game, it would still be loads of fun. Sequence breaking... I suppose you didn't like Metroid Prime as well because you couldn't sequence break? While it adds replayability to the game, keep in mind that a very, very tiny minority of gamers actually do this. Hell the only games I've ever sequence breaked are Super Metroid and Castlevania: SotN. It's a cool extra feature, but it's not something people look for in their games. Sonic's speed in this game is dependant on how many rings you have. So the more rings = faster you go, therefore it's not only about dodging things. And in any case, seriously, just go back to the earlier Sonics. This game has more in common with them than Sonic Adventure or the other 3D Sonics will ever have, and that's what the fans want: high-speed Sonic gameplay. That is what Sonic and the Secret Rings is about. |
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| SaintAjora | Dec 3 2006, 04:18 PM Post #15 |
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Tatyana Lasaiev
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I'm not sure how I feel about this one. It's not that it looks terrible per say. I think there is potential, but then again any game can look good or bad on the surface yet in actual play be the reverse. My problem is my early experience with Sonic is good. However I could never really get into the Adventure series and well Heroes seemed to suffer from poor control over all. Still in terms of Sonic games having multiple characters, I'm not against it and I kind of like the idea. Just so long as they make sure the characters are varied. In short I don't want a bunch of Sonic-color swaps as my choices. Either way it will be a long time before I try any of the new sonic games since I don't have any next-gen system. Although I am tempted despite the problems to try the other paths in Sonic Heroes. For the record I beat the game with Team Rose. However the temptation gives way to remembering the problems and then the temptation vanishes. |
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| Carbunkle Flux | Dec 3 2006, 04:39 PM Post #16 |
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Abyssian Legend
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Maybe I should have clarified... it has a ridiculously stupid plot for a Sonic game. Sure enough, all the Sonics have had storylines that can only be compared to Mario Bros., but please, apparently the new Sonic takes itself way too seriously and that is a serious turn off for most Sonic fans, including myself. We don't want Sonic RPG, we want mother fucking SONIC the HEDGEHOG and all of his 1000MPH glory. It can't possibly take itself more seriously than Shadow the Hedgehog does :P. And Shadow did to the point of ridiculousness that you COULDN'T take it seriously. I don't mind it so much. I just really need to say this... Fetch Quests... in Sonic? No. Just no. Might as well add some kind of DDR minigame for DMC while we're ruining games people used to love by adding gameplay elements no one asked for or even wanted. When people think Sonic, people think speed and fast paced gameplay. I'm pretty sure a large chunk of the fanbase would wtf at the simple thought of fetch quests in a Sonic game. Nobody liked the fetch quests in Sonic Adventure. Sonic Team apparently doesn't care. I don't think it's really as bad as you're making it out to be O_o. But whatever. You know why people have a problem with playable characters other than Sonic? Because nobody cares about other characters other than Sonic. It's SONIC for crying out loud, not Sonic & Shadow & Silver & Friends. I, for one, would love if Sonic Team just removed every single character they have created over the years except Tails, Knuckles, and Eggman. And sure, you could say "well Sonic 3 & Knuckles was only 1/3 Sonic!"... but at least I could play through the entire game AS Sonic, and not be forced other characters when I sure as hell don't want to play as them. Sonic was the most enjoyable parts of Sonic Adventure and Sonic Adventure 2. Why just WHY can't Sonic Team understand this? I care about characters other than Sonic >_<. Sonic Rush was partially so boring because all you had was Sonic and Blaze. They have a large cast with potential for a variety of different gameplay styles and since Sonic Advance 3, they've been deathly afraid to utilize them properly. I don't care for everyone having different kinds of stages, although I will deal with it and still have fun. I would like everyone to be playable in every stage, though and the stages made to accomodate this. I honestly can't go back to the way it was during the Genesis games where you only had Sonic, Tails and Knuckles and it was always vs. Eggman. That'd pretty much step the series right into stagnation. And I don't understand why every Sonic fan wants this. I loved S3&K as much as the next guy, but I must be the only one that has genuinely loved all of the 'progress' made since. If Sonic were to go back to no cutscenes, no random 'cool just for the sake of being cool' plot and no other playables, its appeal would be pretty much lost to me. Enemies were really irrelevant in the 2D Sonics as well. They were just there to make sure you weren't just sleeping on that "Forward" button. And I'm pretty sure even if all the enemies were removed from the game, it would still be loads of fun. Not really :P. The enemies are there to provide a threat besides the environment and without them, the stages would be kind of boring. Sequence breaking... I suppose you didn't like Metroid Prime as well because you couldn't sequence break? While it adds replayability to the game, keep in mind that a very, very tiny minority of gamers actually do this. Hell the only games I've ever sequence breaked are Super Metroid and Castlevania: SotN. It's a cool extra feature, but it's not something people look for in their games. The the original Metroid Prime? Ehh XP. Not as big a fan as I am the 2D ones. But I can say one thing for certain; it definitely has sequence breaking. Besides, different sequences makes for replay value. Can you honestly say you've explored a Sonic 3 & K stage in its entirety like, ever? Have you ever searched out the fastest path through a stage for a speedrun? But that's the best part; if you want to, you can. In SoSR, you're not even given the option. The stage is literally just an obstacle course you're plowing through with no other recourse. Kind of like a behind-the-back version of Battletoads' speeder bike stage. No thanks. Sonic's speed in this game is dependant on how many rings you have. So the more rings = faster you go, therefore it's not only about dodging things. And in any case, seriously, just go back to the earlier Sonics. This game has more in common with them than Sonic Adventure or the other 3D Sonics will ever have, and that's what the fans want: high-speed Sonic gameplay. That is what Sonic and the Secret Rings is about. And in order to keep a large amount of rings, what do you have to do? Dodge things. @_@ I just don't care for it, yo. |
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| Runeslash | Dec 3 2006, 06:23 PM Post #17 |
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109th Star of Destiny
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One thing I'll agree with Carbunkle Flux on is that I don't want the series to go back to having zero cutscenes. One of the things that really irked me back in the Genesis days was Sonic's personality. He was the first character I ever saw in a video game who actually seemed to have personality during gameplay. Sure there were games like Ninja Gaiden and FFIV with in-depth stories... but Sonic... was different. He smiled, he got impatient, he got pissed off, and he actually looked like he was in pain when he landed on a spike or got hit by an enemy or something. Whereas most other characters at the time had very static sprites. I just kept thinking, "Now if only he could talk..." And like CF, I don't wanna go back to those days either. On the other hand, Sonic Adventure 1 and Sonic Rush are the only games in the series where the story doesn't flat out suck. And surprise, surprise, those are the ones that have focused the most on Sonic (relatively speaking), and actually feel like they're still set in the Sonic universe instead of a "shadow" one (pun definately intended). We waited so long for Sonic to get a personality... and now we waste it watching crap about some other lame amnesiac hedgehog. Who would've thought? So yeah, I am indeed still glad they put actual cutscenes and such in the games, but those need to focus on Sonic just like the gameplay needs to. Sonic Team really needs to wake up and realize that. Hopefully Sonic and the Secret Rings is that wake up call. |
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| Deleted User | Dec 3 2006, 07:57 PM Post #18 |
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Deleted User
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Well, I think It's about time for me to say something, seeing as Sonic is my favorite franchise. I really don't see what people have against the supporting cast in the games. I thought that SA1 was an amazing game that handled it quite well. I mean, you had people other than Sonic in it, but his story mode was twice as long as everyone else's. No one bring up Big, that's just something Sonic Team should never ever repeat. Ever. Shadow the Hedgehog is in my opinion even worse than fishing minigames. I hated how they tried to make him 'badass' by giving him guns. That was inexcusable. He doesn't need them, he's a super fast hedgehog with magic abilities! As for the vehicles, why? WHY?! And I played the new Sonic game as well. Ren, I hate to agree with you on this but you were right on the mark. It really dissapoints. The level design is so slow that it reminds me of Sonic Advance 3 with all it's constant pit stops and obstacles. The voice acting lacks any real emotion. (Tails' is HORRIBLE. It's a damn shame too, he's my favorite character :[) That being said, Mike Pollock plays an excellent Robotnik. He's fantastic. The boss fights are horrendously repetitive, the battle with Silver is so fucking annoying that you'll want to have some small animal to punt to relieve your stress. "It's no use!" *cuts wrists* So yeah, I only got so far as Silver's first level, and I really like him, but the game itself annoys the piss out of me. I really hope they get their act together soon. |
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| Deleted User | Dec 3 2006, 10:04 PM Post #19 |
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Deleted User
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The on-rails thing doesn't really bother me. One of my favorite moments of SA1 was just jamming forward in the first level as the bridge collapsed, and the whale tried to swallow Sonic. As for the characters, I truly don't care for them at all. Sonic, Tails, Knuckles, and maybe are the only characters I need, and even then I don't want lame "fly around in tank/ search for master emerald shards." Sonic Team apparently doesn't care sine it just keeps piling on crap characters to the roster. This is Sonic the Hedgehog franchise, not Sonic and Co. Lastly, I want cutscenes to be gone. I'm so annoyed when replaying through SA2 or Mario because of those damn scenes. Sonic does not need a heavy story, it's fucking Sonic. |
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| Deleted User | Dec 3 2006, 10:40 PM Post #20 |
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Deleted User
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Is it such a crime for a game to give depth to its characters? ._. |
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| Deleted User | Dec 3 2006, 10:46 PM Post #21 |
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Deleted User
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The characters don't need depth: Sonic is confident and likes to go fast, Tails loves him some Sonic, and Knuckles is an overzealous gaurdian of the master emerald. Everything we need to know about the characters was in the Genesis games. |
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| Deleted User | Dec 3 2006, 11:03 PM Post #22 |
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Deleted User
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I disagree. In this current age of gaming, there is almost no games now that do not have some form of cutscene in it. They are great methods of storytelling, something I think Sonic can benefit from. I think that Sonic Adventure 2 was a perfect example of this. Seeing the characters interact with each other in the struggle to save the world really helped progress the plot, not to mention helped you care for those in harm's way. I like some explanation of what's going on, and cutscenes are one of the best ways to do so. |
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| Renegade | Dec 3 2006, 11:04 PM Post #23 |
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what
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There you go. That's all I want to know about Sonic. Wanting character depth in Sonic is like wanting character depth in Contra. While we're at it, here's the gameplay outline which Sonic Team should just use for every Sonic game starting now: Story: Eggman has taken the Chaos Emeralds, it's up to Sonic, Tails, and Knuckles to stop him. Enemies: Robot A, Robot B, Robot C, Big Eggman Robot, Spikes, various mechanical animals Puzzles: None. Can go through the entire game as any of the three characters?: Yes. Town? No. Every level is a high-speed race to the finish line? Yes. I really don't get what's so hard for Sonic Team to comprehend about what the basic Sonic fan wants. Seriously. |
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| Deleted User | Dec 4 2006, 12:14 AM Post #24 |
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Deleted User
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Popularity does not make things right. Mario, Sonic, racing games... I could go on. Not ever game needs cutscenes, not even close. The story is SA2 was horrendous, and I was constantly wondering why I couldn't just skip them and play as Sonic. This is when I was about ten or eleven on my Dreamcast, mind you. If there has to be cutscenes and a story in a Sonic game, they should be there to supplement the gameplay- not break up the fast gameplay we were all accustomed to. Ren- that's exactly would I like. Take out the crap characters, RPG elements, and heavy story. Make every stage fast, with branching paths depending on the characters/ if the player can find them. |
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| Deleted User | Dec 4 2006, 12:22 AM Post #25 |
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Deleted User
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Well, I'm outnumbered and outgunned. So rather than being a dick and dragging this topic down further, I'll just remain quiet. |
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| Runeslash | Dec 4 2006, 03:34 PM Post #26 |
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109th Star of Destiny
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There you go. That's all I want to know about Sonic. Wanting character depth in Sonic is like wanting character depth in Contra. I never liked this kind of reasoning. It's not that different from saying "Wanting character depth in FF12 is like wanting character depth in FF1, so why bother?" Cutscenes shouldn't be just thrown out simply because they suck. They CAN work when done correctly. Now, to be fair, Sonic Team hasn't shown much competence in their stories. Sonic Adventure 1 was decent, it was mainly about Sonic and the core characters in the series and still felt like it was set in the same universe as the older games. Sonic Rush was OK, the focus was almost exclusively on Sonic, Robotnik, and one new character who didn't flat out suck for once, and it still felt like Sonic's universe overall. But the rest of the Sonic games since and including SA2 have stunk horribly, and often they can't even get the settings right. And indeed, if Sonic Team can't get back to their roots and pull off a decent story, then they probably should just give up in that department, as no story would indeed be better than one that's actually painful to watch. But if they can do something on par with SA1 and Sonic Rush or better, then I'm all for them doing more story content. |
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