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| DEBATE - Borland Application | ||||
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| Topic Started: 1st February 2016 - 09:39 PM (636 Views) | ||||
| NordicPeoples | 1st February 2016 - 09:39 PM Post #1 | |||
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On the 1st February 2016 the application of the Principality of Northern Borland has been received by the Secretary General. Having been accompanied by the confirmed support of three nations, namely Supreme Sovereighty, Achkaerin and Luvonia, I therefore ask the Security Council to make a recommendation on whether this nation should be granted membership of the CTO. Once this recommendation has been made it shall fall to the General Assembly to make a final vote. Birgit Strand Secretary General |
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| Gadshack | 1st February 2016 - 09:55 PM Post #2 | |||
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"Toshikawa promotes inviting Borland into the CTO only for effectively enforcing a reasonable resolution on it." | |||
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| Tytor | 1st February 2016 - 10:09 PM Post #3 | |||
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"As the Kingdom of Tytor has officially labelled the organization behind Northern Borland's government as a terrorist organization, Tytor is opposed to admitting the Principality to any international forum. An exception could be made if a multinational investigation sponsored by the CTO were to conclude that the Borlanders have completely and totally disassociated themselves from their terrorist roots, up to and including renouncing any and all claims to the territory of other nations." | |||
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His Majesty Michael the First, by the Grace of God, King of Tytor and her Colonies, and Lord Protector of Floodwater His Excellency Juvenal Massaquoi, President of Ubakasa, Protector of the Revolution, and Father of His People Factbook -- News -- Press Office Former Governor-General of The Infinite Alliance Former Ambassador to Albion and the Global Right Alliance Former Vice Premier and Speaker of the Senate of the Independent Order Professional Procrastinator In firm opposition to Donald Trump's inevitable reelection campaign in 2020 Non-partisan and proud of it "A witty saying proves nothing." - Voltaire | ||||
| Achkaerin | 1st February 2016 - 10:35 PM Post #4 | |||
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![]() Colonel Steven Ayanami Steven brushed at his hair, how he wished he'd dried his hair better after his shower the previous night this was where it counted. "The question is can we admit the Principality of Northern Borland? The answer is yes we can but can we do so with Borland as it presently is? No we cannot. To grant 'full' membership to Borland now would be to admit a state headed by a man wanted for terrorist offences in several countries including Achkaerin, East Moreland and Rokkenjima. Therefore we suggest something originally proposed by the Secretary-General- a 'phased' approach to Borland achieving full membership. Borland would move through the phases by addressing the concerns of the international community thus showing that they had changed. Let us remember the population of the Principality is around 38,000 people and the vast majority of those are not Borland Separatist members only a very small minority are, this majority has as much right as everyone else to live in peace. We would detail this as follows:" Steven said he slid a proposal onto the table
"Obviously this is not an exhaustive list so if anyone can think of anything that needs adding to the conditions then feel free to mention it Edited by Achkaerin, 5th February 2016 - 10:44 AM.
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| Gadshack | 1st February 2016 - 10:52 PM Post #5 | |||
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"I can agree to this three phased proposal. I support to formally present this proposal to the General Assembly." | |||
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Factbook of Tokulel Ahkabnil Wiki | ||||
| DaveIronside | 2nd February 2016 - 09:46 AM Post #6 | |||
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Bendix Landau (1880-1939)
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OOC- Cough....B....this is the security council thread. They make a recommendation, then we vote on it in the GA. | |||
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| Beatrice | 2nd February 2016 - 09:53 AM Post #7 | |||
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OOC: It's 5 AM, you saw nothing.
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| Achkaerin | 2nd February 2016 - 07:03 PM Post #8 | |||
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OOC- I've correct a slight oversight by adding 'May vote in Security Council and Secretary General elections' to the phase one list since this is a basic right of members. | |||
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| Achkaerin | 3rd February 2016 - 10:55 PM Post #9 | |||
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"I'm happy to take this to the General Assembly, but I do suggest that when we do that the General Assembly be invited to suggest further conditions for Borland to meet as I've said this isn't an exhaustive list, but we should also make clear that there is a line that has been drawn by bringing the Borland application this far and that we won't be able to include conditions that step across that line in the final recommendation. Now seeing as myself and my colleague from Toshikawa agree we do have a majority for this recommendation but I believe it prudent to find out whether our friend from Tytor agrees with this proposal before we take it to the General Assembly." OOC- I normally don't make requests like this but I'm going to ask (since it's tied up slightly with King's Blood) that when this goes to the GA that Steven present the recommendation and that it be the first post in the thread after the Sec-Gen opens it if that's at all possible. |
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| Tytor | 3rd February 2016 - 11:11 PM Post #10 | |||
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"As there are currently as many conditions as there are phases, I would suggest changing the requirements for each phase so that they correspond with the number of conditions met. Thus, phase one would take effect when at least one condition had been met; phase two would take effect with two conditions met, and so on. In short, I do not feel comfortable with admitting the Borlanders to any international organization before they have met even one of the criteria. Obviously, if the two of you disagree, I am, as the saying goes, outvoted, but I would ask that you at least consider my concerns." | |||
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His Majesty Michael the First, by the Grace of God, King of Tytor and her Colonies, and Lord Protector of Floodwater His Excellency Juvenal Massaquoi, President of Ubakasa, Protector of the Revolution, and Father of His People Factbook -- News -- Press Office Former Governor-General of The Infinite Alliance Former Ambassador to Albion and the Global Right Alliance Former Vice Premier and Speaker of the Senate of the Independent Order Professional Procrastinator In firm opposition to Donald Trump's inevitable reelection campaign in 2020 Non-partisan and proud of it "A witty saying proves nothing." - Voltaire | ||||
| Achkaerin | 3rd February 2016 - 11:56 PM Post #11 | |||
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"I get your concern." Steven said "However it does to an extent run counter to the position Borland would be in if they were admitted. As a member nation they would have certain rights some of these such as the right to have the five delegates in the General Assembly to participate in debate and the validity of signatures on documents such as the MCUR are automatically granted due to either this organisation's treaty or international law. What the proposal strives to do is to spell out in Phase one the most basic of these rights which is to say the ones that we cannot restrict Borland on, they can do no real damage with anything in Phase one as it stands with the possible exception of the voting rights in elections which we could consider moving to Phase two. In short we with hold the voting ability for as long as we can to provide enticement for Borland to meet the criteria we recommend. It is unfortunate that we have to spell out the rights Borland would have but as we have seen in the first debate on this matter there is a clear difference of opinion as to where Borland's position on this is, it is therefore vital that in light of the new admissions procedure we clarify where that position is. I am however in agreement that if there are only these three conditions that it makes sense for Phase two to only be reached at a time when two of the conditions are met. But I do not like the idea of saying to Borland that they're admitted but can't do anything until they meet at least one of these criteria that does seem to me to be a constructive way to 'integrate' Borland into the international community." |
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| Achkaerin | 5th February 2016 - 10:45 AM Post #12 | |||
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OOC- Unless Tytor wishes to respond to Steven I'm going to suggest we move this proposal to vote. | |||
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| hobbes | 5th February 2016 - 05:46 PM Post #13 | |||
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"I feel we don't need to restate we're opposed" Ambassador Askeland nodded, looking over the delegation. "Not only do we not see a terrorist organization as worthy of statehood, but we wish to draw concern to the use of the Mundus Convention of Universal Rights, as well as the Mundus Health Organization and Mundus Refugee Council as gauges for 'civility' and 'statehood.' It seems evident that the use of such mechanisms, particularly when my own nation and that of the Tytorian delegation[1], are not signatory to one or more of the above agreements, particularly when none are required for membership to this Chamber, represent political liberalism being injected into this debate. Our lack of membership in these accords does not make us more or less of independent self-governing nations, despite what political liberalistic agenda may be being pushed with the inclusion of these." [1] Could be wrong, but I'm pretty confident Tytor isnt a signatory to MCUR Edited by hobbes, 5th February 2016 - 05:48 PM.
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important message![]() <@CGJ> Hobbes wants to save lives, not end them <@CGJ> He creates enough burn victims in a day to effectively keep himself paid ![]() Sparta: (hobbes is) the god the Independent Order deserves, but not the one anyone cares about right now. | ||||
| Achkaerin | 5th February 2016 - 05:48 PM Post #14 | |||
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OOC- Security Council debate Hobbes. | |||
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| hobbes | 5th February 2016 - 05:50 PM Post #15 | |||
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OOC - Can't members still discuss on the floor, regardless of a vote or not? Also, I thought admissions were GA votes? |
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important message![]() <@CGJ> Hobbes wants to save lives, not end them <@CGJ> He creates enough burn victims in a day to effectively keep himself paid ![]() Sparta: (hobbes is) the god the Independent Order deserves, but not the one anyone cares about right now. | ||||
| Achkaerin | 5th February 2016 - 05:55 PM Post #16 | |||
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OOC- to answer the first question the only people in the room are the SC delegates from Achkaerin, Toshikawa and Tytor as well as the Sec-Gen since this is not ICly taking place in the GA chamber but the SC chamber. to answer the second yes admissions are a GA vote the purpose of this debate is to establish what the recommendation of the Security Council is as to whether Borland in its opinion should be admitted or not as per both the new admissions procedure and Commonwealth Treaty. Once we've established the recommendation Nord will open the debate on Borland's admission to the GA and the first thing that will happen is that the recommendation will be delivered and then debate will follow. |
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| hobbes | 5th February 2016 - 05:59 PM Post #17 | |||
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ooc - k then, reminded why i rarely lurk here. void my post or whatever |
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important message![]() <@CGJ> Hobbes wants to save lives, not end them <@CGJ> He creates enough burn victims in a day to effectively keep himself paid ![]() Sparta: (hobbes is) the god the Independent Order deserves, but not the one anyone cares about right now. | ||||
| Tytor | 5th February 2016 - 07:22 PM Post #18 | |||
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"Well, my thought was that they wouldn't be admitted until they had met at least one condition. If that's not workable, then we can pass it as-is, and I'll just have to register Tytor's dissension when it comes to a vote." | |||
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His Majesty Michael the First, by the Grace of God, King of Tytor and her Colonies, and Lord Protector of Floodwater His Excellency Juvenal Massaquoi, President of Ubakasa, Protector of the Revolution, and Father of His People Factbook -- News -- Press Office Former Governor-General of The Infinite Alliance Former Ambassador to Albion and the Global Right Alliance Former Vice Premier and Speaker of the Senate of the Independent Order Professional Procrastinator In firm opposition to Donald Trump's inevitable reelection campaign in 2020 Non-partisan and proud of it "A witty saying proves nothing." - Voltaire | ||||
| Achkaerin | 9th February 2016 - 11:00 PM Post #19 | |||
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OOC- Not for nothing guys but the present Sec-Gen term expires on the 20th of February so we do need to clear both this and the Aquitaine recommendation before then. "While I'm personally quite happy to entertain that idea, we do however have to remember that the debate the General Assembly will be having as a result of our recommendation will ask a single question- 'Should the Principality of Northern Borland be admitted to the CTO?' now the implication of that is that if the vote is a Yes then Borland is admitted as a member. So while I understand the need to be strict with Borland I also note that we must not be overly prejudicial lest we let Barren use his weapon of choice- the media against us, I believe we can take this to the General Assembly and say that we recommend Borland be admitted using this. And in the event of a No vote then Borland would have a record of the concerns of the international community and would be able to address them it also sends the message we need to send. I therefore move that we take this to the General Assembly for the final vote." |
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| Tytor | 10th February 2016 - 04:27 AM Post #20 | |||
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"Very well. Seconded." (OOC: Sorry for the short post...) |
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His Majesty Michael the First, by the Grace of God, King of Tytor and her Colonies, and Lord Protector of Floodwater His Excellency Juvenal Massaquoi, President of Ubakasa, Protector of the Revolution, and Father of His People Factbook -- News -- Press Office Former Governor-General of The Infinite Alliance Former Ambassador to Albion and the Global Right Alliance Former Vice Premier and Speaker of the Senate of the Independent Order Professional Procrastinator In firm opposition to Donald Trump's inevitable reelection campaign in 2020 Non-partisan and proud of it "A witty saying proves nothing." - Voltaire | ||||
| NordicPeoples | 10th February 2016 - 09:44 PM Post #21 | |||
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"Following that then may I ask you to vote on whether this should be presented to the General Assembly for their approval. The motion is therefore that Borland should be admitted to the CTO on completion of various milestones as laid at below."
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| Achkaerin | 10th February 2016 - 09:49 PM Post #22 | |||
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"Achkaerin votes Aye." OOC- Can we please assume that this and the associated GA debate that will follow occur after the East Moreland ultimatum but before Hamlet kicks off otherwise we just complicate things a heck of a lot more than they already are. Edited by Achkaerin, 10th February 2016 - 09:55 PM.
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| DaveIronside | 10th February 2016 - 10:01 PM Post #23 | |||
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Bendix Landau (1880-1939)
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OOC_ Fine with me | |||
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