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| Tweet Topic Started: Nov 14 2007, 09:08 AM (603 Views) | |
| Islander4cups | Nov 14 2007, 04:19 PM Post #21 |
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In Garth I Trust
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While they were visionaries, they also had their "issues". No offense Webby, but Levitt was a bigot who wouldn't allow blacks to buy homes in "Levittown". My grandfather was one of the first Levit homeowners (on what is now Division HS) and then later in Hicksville. He had two requirements to meet... 1- be a vet of ww2 2- be white While Levitt's vision for making money was something else, not sure I want him being the "image" of LI greatness. And I certainly dont' want Robert Moses brought up in this conversation. He is the prime reason the Dodgers moved to LA. The Dodgers were all set to build a new stadium at their own expense in Brooklyn at the cite of the LIRR hub and Moses wouldn't allow it. Moses wanted the Brooklyn Dodgers to play in Queens at Shea Stadium (which he was planning on building already in 1955). Since Rickey couldn't get the location, he moved the team to LA. While I am a huge fan of Moses and what he did for not just NYC but all of NY state, his love of the automobile ended up driving the Dodgers to Los Angeles and dooming the borough of Brooklyn. As for Grumman, I love those guys. Anyone who had the cajones to send NASA a "towing bill" afte Apollo 13 is Ok in my book. As a joke, since NASA built the lunar lander and the astronauts used it to survive on Apollo 13 until they returned close enough to earth, Grumman sent NASA a "towing bill". Just goes to show how cool that company was once upon a time. They WERE the space race...love em!!!
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| Webb20 | Nov 14 2007, 05:21 PM Post #22 |
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Godfather
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I didn't know that story regarding Robert Moses and the Dodgers, and be it as it may, the Dodger were offered a new stadium. If Nassau County says to the Islanders we'll build you a state of the art 20,000 seat stadium in Bethpage would the Isles take it or say no way, Uniondale or we're packing up? As far as Levitt. Still a visionary even with his prejudices. Remember we're talking late 1940s early 1950s, different thoughts, different view, no Political correctness, and while it would not be tolerated today, nor should it, we are talking about a time before civil rights. dooming? That's a stretch. |
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I sold it all, retired and moved to Fabulous Las Vegas! "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."-Ben Franklin "Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves."-Ronald Reagan | |
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| Nautika16 | Nov 14 2007, 05:33 PM Post #23 |
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4th line
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if this doesn't work...they move to Pilgrim State and there is a LIRR line right there.....and Suffolk will let you build what ever you want |
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<a href="http://s26.photobucket.com/albums/c149/nautika16/?action=view¤t=309small.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c149/nautika16/309small.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a> <a href="http://s26.photobucket.com/albums/c149/nautika16/?action=view¤t=lighthouse-2.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c149/nautika16/lighthouse-2.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a> | |
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| NyIslanders2005 | Nov 14 2007, 05:50 PM Post #24 |
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Isles all the way
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There is no way that is a stretch... Brooklyn is the way it is now primarily because of the move of the Dodgers. Once the Dodgers left all of the wealthy people move to Long Island (no joke) and poverty moved in. |
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| fastymctalent55 | Nov 14 2007, 06:07 PM Post #25 |
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All Star
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The death of Brooklyn is being greatly exaggerated here. Brooklyn has all types of neighborhoods, wealthy, poor, middle class. Park Slope is one of the most affluent areas in the COUNTRY let alone with NY state. The same can be said for Brooklyn Heights, Carrol Gardens, Cobble Hill, etc. etc. I've lived in Brooklyn, in Park Slope, it's got a lot to offer. There are also a BAD areas in Brooklyn just like any city in America, whether or not that's due to the Dodgers leaving the area is really impossible to say. When the Dodgers left Brooklyn it ripped out the hearts and robbed the souls of millions, but the borough kept going, with some areas thriving, and others not standing the test of time. The problem with the Dodgers leaving is that Brooklyn, in some small measure, became a little bit more like the rest of the country when the Dodgers fled. Which brings us back to this thread. I dearly hope the same thing doesn't happen to Long Island, and that it why this attempt, what may be the last attempt to get a new building, MUST succeed, which is something I think we can all agree on. |
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| Islander4cups | Nov 14 2007, 07:38 PM Post #26 |
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In Garth I Trust
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Webby. That is the problem with my being a history teacher. There is more useless crap stuck in my head... The Dodgers owner didn't want to move to LA. In fact, he didn't start talking to the LA city council until the 1955 World Series. He had been stonewalled by Moses and the NYC government. In fact, he had a prime spot picked out in Brooklyn. I believe it was where the LIRR hub was (Flatbush Ave?) and there was a big unused market there that the Dodgers wanted to build and put a completely team-paid new stadium there in the heart of Brooklyn. Moses objected because he believed the train was obsolete and the car was the future. He wanted a stadium in Flushing with wide highways for cars. The Dodgers wanted to be near the train hub because so many of their fans had moved to LI that driving a car into Brooklyn wasn't feesible for many (especially with Ebbets Field having only 300 car spaces for parking). When the Dodgers approached Moses with their proposal in 1954, Moses TOLD the Dodgers where their stadium would be. The Dodgers reaction was, if the Dodgers aren't going to play in Brooklyn what does it matter if it is in Queens or 3,000 miles away. Then the Dodgers had to convince the Giants to make the move west because they didn't want to be the only west coast team and since the Giants couldn't get a replacement for the Polo Grounds, they left too. And yes, it was the beginning of the end of Brooklyn. That team was the focal point of most Brooklynites and when that team left, a large part of Brooklyn's identity, culture and unity died with it. That is what I am afraid of with the NVMC. I'd hate to see LI's identity (the Islanders) move on because of another politican who can't see the forrest for the trees. As for Levitt, you are correct. That wasn't uncommon at all for that time. heck, Henry Ford and Charles Lindberg were raving anti-semites. Ford even had a newspaper dedicated to the subject. Our history textbooks cover that stuff up (like the fact that Hellen Keller was a Socialist that loved the Soviet Union and hated Woodrow Wilson- another racist), but when I cover those subjects in class I include it because I think the kids should get a full measure of the person. I am honestly terrified that this is the last chance for the Isles to stay on LI and that Charles will have no choice but to move them if Hempstead says no. |
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| Islander4cups | Nov 14 2007, 07:46 PM Post #27 |
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In Garth I Trust
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The Dodgers weren't selling out in 55, 56, 57 which is a reason why the Dodgers needed a new stadium. Ebbets only had 300 parking spaces and many of their fans had moved out to LI by the 55 season. The Dodgers ownership didn't think fans would car into brooklyn from LI for games but they would do it by train if they could get a stadium at that hub. HBO did a really good documentary about the Dodgers and how a large part of Brooklyn's identity died when they moved. It was excellent. |
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| klynch | Nov 14 2007, 10:24 PM Post #28 |
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4th line
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Has anyone watched the video? Is it just me or will the NVMC have no roof? There is one arial shot where you can see through the "sail" and see the ice, how is that going to work?!?! |
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| fastymctalent55 | Nov 14 2007, 10:37 PM Post #29 |
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All Star
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Ghosts of Flatbush if anyone wants to check it out. |
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| Webb20 | Nov 15 2007, 08:20 AM Post #30 |
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Godfather
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Thanks for the education I4C. |
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I sold it all, retired and moved to Fabulous Las Vegas! "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."-Ben Franklin "Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves."-Ronald Reagan | |
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| lifirefighter | Nov 15 2007, 09:19 AM Post #31 |
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3rd line
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Its all about progress, you want to argue Moses drove out the dodgers, you could also argue then that it was because of Moses that we have west coast baseaball. He's done too much to toss it all on account of a baseball team. put it this way, if there was no moses, there would be no islanders. Northern, Southern, LIE, Meadowbrook were all moses ideas, NVMC sits in the middle of all of that, with no rail hub. without those parkways, they never would have built a major sporting venue on LI, and we'd all still be trucking into the city to watch the americans get pasted by the rangers. That being said, without his arrogance and stubborness and complete disregard for people that got in his way, we'd have a completely different look on LI today. |
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3:26 AM Jul 11