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| IS IT TOO LATE | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Dec 3 2007, 08:40 PM (1,326 Views) | |
| puckhead | Dec 5 2007, 11:22 AM Post #61 |
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All Star
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IMO......if we don't adapt a slight change to our philosophy and build longer term, draft a helluva lot better and do a better job with amateur scouting and evaluation....you'll just see more of the same. Win a few, lose a few.....finish 500 and make the playoffs and then get blitzed. Its what predominantly has taken place here the last few years. I'm not saying I don't like Snow/ Nolan's approach to getting guys who love to compete. But at some point, you either have attract some big time premium talent or draft it. And we've done neither the last few years. |
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| Webb20 | Dec 5 2007, 11:23 AM Post #62 |
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Godfather
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With the lack of potential real star powered talent in our system Garth has to look to building a team thru trades. We are not going to get a blue chipper in the draft as we will finish above the bottom dwellers, but that doesnt mean there arent good picks out there mid round or second round. The FA market is only good for a player here or there, but we cant look to it each year to try and build a winner. I dont want to sacrifice 2-3 years to get good draft choices either. There are no guarantees you'll find that ace, but you'll be guaranteed of watching frustrating hockey for a long time, and I already lived thru the late '90s. Back to basics when it comes to drafting. Do like Torrey used to do, throw most of the scouting reports based on "talent and potential" out the window, look for players who were leaders on championship Juniors or collegiate teams and draft them. I want players who know what it takes to win before they ever get here, players who have tasted success, players who cant stand losing. |
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I sold it all, retired and moved to Fabulous Las Vegas! "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."-Ben Franklin "Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves."-Ronald Reagan | |
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| Nautika16 | Dec 5 2007, 11:24 AM Post #63 |
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4th line
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ryder - cheecho...one of these guys would help us a lot. They are not crazy expensive and we would not have to part with a lot. |
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| lifirefighter | Dec 5 2007, 12:24 PM Post #64 |
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3rd line
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While I like Ryder (not so much cheecho) I disagree. We don't have to worry about expense, we need to find a team that is willing to dump salary. Look no further than St. Louis last year. Guerin, Weight, Thkacuk were all available, and it didn't take much to get them. Look at what San Jose did to Boston in the Thornton trade. You can get superstars via trade now that you could not get before if a team needs to dump salary. This team needs to avoid the low-cost trap of people like Ryder and really become a vulture and prey on those teams that are in trouble. Look at the names from the trade deadline last year: Forsberg, Smyth, Guerin, Tkachuck, Upshaw even someone like a Roberts could help this team. We actually have pieces we can move (a defenseman or two plus a couple of prospect forwards) Now its our turn to pillage teams like we were pillaged in the 90's. |
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| Dark Helmet | Dec 5 2007, 01:24 PM Post #65 |
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My helmet is bigger than yours
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I agree with you guys who are saying that we need to improve our scouting. But, we did sign Ken Morrow to a multi-year deal to improve that situation. I would imagine he would do well scouting in Canada/U.S. but i just dont see ken morrow spending significant time overseas scouting playings in countries like Russia or Finland. I think that through Free Agency we can build a solid core of players that can be the glue to the overall product, but we're missing those few big-time guys that can put us over the hump. To the Rangers credit, they've done that this past summer but I dont think the guys they overpaid for were the right guys for what they were trying to do. I think it was a mistake that we didn't overpay for a guy like Briere. It's guys like that that can turn a franchise from a loser to a winner. (I know philly made more moves than that, but signing Briere was key there). So, all in all, I think we have the right coaching staff/GM to put together a winner. But unless our drafting improves we're going to have to take a loss either this year or next via trade(or free agency but it's harder to do that) to get the kind of guy/s that are going to put us over the top. Edit: For instance, I would trade anybody on the team aside from DP to get a guy like LeCavalier or a Zetterberg and just rebuild around him in the upcoming years. Every winning team needs 3 things(but not limited to); A franchise goalie, a franchise forward, and a franchise defenseman. I feel like we have only 1 of the 3. No discredit to Witt but we need a guy that plays a D-game like witt but can rack up more points offensively. Seem like alot to ask? It is, but if you want a cup contending team, these are the foundations of that. |
| "Evil will always triumph because Good is dumb." | |
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| dragoneye | Dec 5 2007, 10:46 PM Post #66 |
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Kung Fu Hockey
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Free agency drives prices for any decent to good player up, so there will be very few of them that any one team can afford. There is also the fact that they don't all pan out, even the big names. Just look at the Rangers as an example regarding that. I think the best thing is to have a good philosophy, a system, and stick to it for several years. We all know the components of it, but the luck factor of drafting is huge. Having a good coach goes a long way toward maximizing your talent too. People around here love Nolan, and I think he should get a few years to right the ship form the top down to the minors, but statistically speaking ie wins and losses, he has been average here. I can see a sh!t storm of posts about this coming too. It isn't a diss, just imagine yourself 15 years from now looking at the stats about Ted Nolan the coach, while comparing them to the best coaches in the game. If things don't change, he won't go down as one of the best. Now I will hide
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| puckhead | Dec 6 2007, 04:34 AM Post #67 |
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All Star
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Nolan's stats record is average because that's the type of team he has been given personnel wise......average. And he got more mileage out of last year's team than anyone could have gotten. But he aint no magician.......no one is. |
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| LEDZEP | Dec 6 2007, 04:37 AM Post #68 |
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The Best That Ever Skated 80-81-82-83
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Morning puckhead
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Sometimes I grow so tired, but I know I've got one thing I got to do... ![]() What puckhead says is Islander law Come in with the milk "A leader, once convinced a particular course of action is the right one, must have the determination to stick with it and be undaunted when the going gets rough." Ronald Reagan | |
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| puckhead | Dec 6 2007, 05:53 AM Post #69 |
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All Star
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Morning Zepee.........what are you doing up this early? |
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| dragoneye | Dec 6 2007, 08:49 AM Post #70 |
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Kung Fu Hockey
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Probably just going to sleep after a night of :jester: ![]() Hahah. It is evening here!
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| LEDZEP | Dec 6 2007, 09:00 AM Post #71 |
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The Best That Ever Skated 80-81-82-83
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Maybe 20 years ago but I'm on the verge of OZ---12/10/2007
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Sometimes I grow so tired, but I know I've got one thing I got to do... ![]() What puckhead says is Islander law Come in with the milk "A leader, once convinced a particular course of action is the right one, must have the determination to stick with it and be undaunted when the going gets rough." Ronald Reagan | |
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| IslanderQueen | Dec 6 2007, 09:32 AM Post #72 |
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Unregistered
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there was no place to be early this morning-other than snug as a bug under piles of warm covers too cold for me.....:snowman: |
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| MrsDP | Dec 6 2007, 11:02 AM Post #73 |
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Unregistered
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Sutton made a SICK move last night and got past the defenders and then dropped back. Why Andy Why??? Also we should start booing him at home. It seemed to motivate him... and ps Atlanta's jerseys are hideous. Cobalt Blue, not a good look on a hockey jersey. |
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| vprophet | Dec 6 2007, 02:17 PM Post #74 |
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AHL Callup
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theres no hope, when they call Tambellini up, and than give him a measley 7.50 of ice time. Something tells me Nolan has his head up his oprhus give the kid 15 to 20 minutes a game. Bergenheim got just under 4 minutes of ice time. |
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| aries44475 | Dec 6 2007, 10:22 PM Post #75 |
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Topic Merger
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Or maybe its the fact we spent half the game on the PK? Those guys see very little time when we spend 18 minutes on the PK. Bergie is playing 4th line duties...on a great night he is going to see 10-12min's. |
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| Islander4cups | Dec 6 2007, 10:58 PM Post #76 |
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In Garth I Trust
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You are kidding right? Keith T. went to Atlanta for a king's ransom. You think we gave up alot for Smyth??? Atlanta gave up more for Keith T and he's a bum. Guerin didn't go cheaply to SJ either. While I agree that there will be players available for a steal every now and then, you have to rely on a few things... 1- a bad team having a good player with an idiot GM (all those factors came together in Boston to make that Thorton deal happen)...where could it all happen again??? Atlanta with Kolv could be your answer. 2- You must have something in your pipeline other teams want. BTW-- Ken Morrow is the head of PRO SCOUTING so he has a say in who we go after on the FA market. I think he's done a terrific job the last two years. What my worry is has been the draft. Whomever has been running that fiasco from 02-05 better be gone now (and I'm not talking Milbury. I mean the head of amateur scouting during those years). I've said it from the beginning--- 01- Bergenheim, 02- Nilsson, 03- Nolielienen were all TERRIBLE first round picks and they still haven't shown anything at the pro level. Bergie will have not only no trade value at the deadline this year, but he's a FA at the end of the year I believe. He'll have no leverage on the market. The kid is playing his way right back to Europe so far this season. |
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| 3POTI | Dec 6 2007, 11:08 PM Post #77 |
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Bring back...PRIDE OF THE ISLAND
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considering that bergie has no trade value, wouldn't it be wise of the Islanders now to showcase him...not that I WANT to see him go, I would love for him to light him. |
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Today Is A Great Day To Be An Islander Fan! Live For The Moment! | |
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| Webb20 | Dec 7 2007, 08:49 AM Post #78 |
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Godfather
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I think you might be talking about Anders Kallur's picks. |
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I sold it all, retired and moved to Fabulous Las Vegas! "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."-Ben Franklin "Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves."-Ronald Reagan | |
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| lifirefighter | Dec 7 2007, 09:08 AM Post #79 |
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3rd line
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prospects are not, and should never be considered "king's ransom" we didn't give up a lot for Smyth, we gave up "maybe" Anytime you can land a top flight guy for a bunch of guys who could be good is a great deal. Take a look at the isles stable right now, we have bergie, tambs and okoposo. Bergie was highly touted and hasn't shown much in the last 3 years. tambs seems destined to be a taxi type guy, and okoposo hasn't exactly been tearing it up in college. To me there is no such thing as a can't miss prospect, and no prospect should ever be considered untouchable. It's one big guessing game that no one can predict. For every one Crosby there are hundreds of Pavel Rosas. |
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as an example regarding that.

:jester:



3:21 AM Jul 11