|
Islanders way of "playing"; coaching or talent or WHAT?
|
|
Topic Started: Nov 13 2008, 09:04 AM (1,854 Views)
|
|
Islander4cups
|
Nov 15 2008, 11:14 AM
Post #21
|
In Garth I Trust
- Posts:
- 9,987
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #595
- Joined:
- March 2, 2007
|
- bumpkin,Nov 15 2008
- 09:40 AM
And that's why a great many players, when they leave the Isles, seem to have their talent mystically return as they play their asses off with, seemingly, a rebirth of determined work ethic (Satan, for instance).
Can u please list ALL THESE players who seem to improve once they leave the Islanders in the past decade? I don't know these "great many players" you are referring to.
As for Satan, he better improve. He's playing with two of the top scorers the past 3 years on a team with tons of offensive talent. He is going to have more chances to score. Even Andy Hilbert had 18 points in 19 games playing for Pitt.
who are all these players who have suddenly improved once they left LI?
|
I miss these and want more of them

|
| |
|
Webb20
|
Nov 15 2008, 11:32 AM
Post #22
|
Godfather
- Posts:
- 27,170
- Group:
- Admin
- Member
- #1
- Joined:
- May 9, 2005
|
- bumpkin,Nov 15 2008
- 09:40 AM
And that's why a great many players, when they leave the Isles, seem to have their talent mystically return as they play their asses off with, seemingly, a rebirth of determined work ethic (Satan, for instance).
Okay, I have been following him, but unable to actually watch the games. He has spent limited time with Sid and Malkin, one goal I think he was just out of the box when they hit him on a breakaway, a few tip ins, and some fans are complaining that he is slow and lazy(although Nolan taught him something-he now back checks). The complaining is calming down, and because he is the leading goal scorer of their high scoring team. He is going to get points and goals, maybe bettering his highs of 40 goals or 75 points if he stays healthy. But, and I like him, he is the same player on a better team.
Feto did have a big goal this week, but he has not done much. I would not expect him to, 3rd line player.
The point is, they HAVE moved on to greener pastures.
We need to improve the roster-top to bottom, in order to get a decent base for the future. Get better, not just younger. Draft better, not just differently-last year seems to have been a start.
You have to wonder what life would have been like by now with Smith and Nolan together. Conflict is necessary between the coach and GM, yes men are not important. Gordon doe not want to be one, he just wants to coach. Does Garth read this forum?
Just like Jason Blake, Tom Poti, Viktor Kozlov, Alexei Yashin, Chris Simon, Sean Hill, Aaron Asham, Dave Scatchard, Mark Parrish, Mike Peca, Jason Weimer, Oleg, Mariusz Czerkawski, Claude Lapointe, Travis Green, Chico Resch, Mikko Makala, Randy Wood, and I could on all afternoon.
Many many more players have never again achieved their expected returns after they left the Island.
|
I sold it all, retired and moved to Fabulous Las Vegas! "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."-Ben Franklin "Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves."-Ronald Reagan
|
| |
|
Islander4cups
|
Nov 15 2008, 11:37 AM
Post #23
|
In Garth I Trust
- Posts:
- 9,987
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #595
- Joined:
- March 2, 2007
|
- Webb20,Nov 15 2008
- 11:32 AM
- bumpkin,Nov 15 2008
- 09:40 AM
And that's why a great many players, when they leave the Isles, seem to have their talent mystically return as they play their asses off with, seemingly, a rebirth of determined work ethic (Satan, for instance).
Okay, I have been following him, but unable to actually watch the games. He has spent limited time with Sid and Malkin, one goal I think he was just out of the box when they hit him on a breakaway, a few tip ins, and some fans are complaining that he is slow and lazy(although Nolan taught him something-he now back checks). The complaining is calming down, and because he is the leading goal scorer of their high scoring team. He is going to get points and goals, maybe bettering his highs of 40 goals or 75 points if he stays healthy. But, and I like him, he is the same player on a better team.
Feto did have a big goal this week, but he has not done much. I would not expect him to, 3rd line player.
The point is, they HAVE moved on to greener pastures.
We need to improve the roster-top to bottom, in order to get a decent base for the future. Get better, not just younger. Draft better, not just differently-last year seems to have been a start.
You have to wonder what life would have been like by now with Smith and Nolan together. Conflict is necessary between the coach and GM, yes men are not important. Gordon doe not want to be one, he just wants to coach. Does Garth read this forum?
Just like Jason Blake, Tom Poti, Viktor Kozlov, Alexei Yashin, Chris Simon, Sean Hill, Aaron Asham, Dave Scatchard, Mark Parrish, Mike Peca, Jason Weimer, Oleg, Mariusz Czerkawski, Claude Lapointe, Travis Green, Chico Resch, Mikko Makala, Randy Wood, and I could on all afternoon. Many many more players have never again achieved their expected returns after they left the Island.
BINGO.....we have a winner. Randy, tell him what he's won!!!
|
I miss these and want more of them

|
| |
|
wood11
|
Nov 15 2008, 01:06 PM
Post #24
|
4th line
- Posts:
- 123
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #2,295
- Joined:
- June 4, 2008
|
- bumpkin,Nov 15 2008
- 09:40 AM
And that's why a great many players, when they leave the Isles, seem to have their talent mystically return as they play their asses off with, seemingly, a rebirth of determined work ethic (Satan, for instance).
Okay, I have been following him, but unable to actually watch the games. He has spent limited time with Sid and Malkin, one goal I think he was just out of the box when they hit him on a breakaway, a few tip ins, and some fans are complaining that he is slow and lazy(although Nolan taught him something-he now back checks). The complaining is calming down, and because he is the leading goal scorer of their high scoring team. He is going to get points and goals, maybe bettering his highs of 40 goals or 75 points if he stays healthy. But, and I like him, he is the same player on a better team.
Feto did have a big goal this week, but he has not done much. I would not expect him to, 3rd line player.
The point is, they HAVE moved on to greener pastures.
We need to improve the roster-top to bottom, in order to get a decent base for the future. Get better, not just younger. Draft better, not just differently-last year seems to have been a start.
You have to wonder what life would have been like by now with Smith and Nolan together. Conflict is necessary between the coach and GM, yes men are not important. Gordon doe not want to be one, he just wants to coach. Does Garth read this forum?
The system sucks you cant pressure the puck constantly with the forwards the Isles have, and the d-men cant pinch all the time they do not have the talent, when you take chances you give up too many odd man rushes this is a problem with this system, yes they dont have the talent, but FISHERMAN GORDEN should adjust to the talent he has, it would be interesting too see if Neil Smith and Ted Nolan were around it would be better, Gorden is Snows puppet he just wants to coach in the nhl hell who could blame him, fact is this is going to be a long season and there is not much hope on the horizon, see Tambellni. There are some young guys but there not good yet and who knows if they will every be good. Most of these guys could not crack a good teams 4th line.
|
|
|
| |
|
Islander4cups
|
Nov 15 2008, 11:48 PM
Post #25
|
In Garth I Trust
- Posts:
- 9,987
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #595
- Joined:
- March 2, 2007
|
- wood11,Nov 15 2008
- 01:06 PM
- bumpkin,Nov 15 2008
- 09:40 AM
And that's why a great many players, when they leave the Isles, seem to have their talent mystically return as they play their asses off with, seemingly, a rebirth of determined work ethic (Satan, for instance).
Okay, I have been following him, but unable to actually watch the games. He has spent limited time with Sid and Malkin, one goal I think he was just out of the box when they hit him on a breakaway, a few tip ins, and some fans are complaining that he is slow and lazy(although Nolan taught him something-he now back checks). The complaining is calming down, and because he is the leading goal scorer of their high scoring team. He is going to get points and goals, maybe bettering his highs of 40 goals or 75 points if he stays healthy. But, and I like him, he is the same player on a better team.
Feto did have a big goal this week, but he has not done much. I would not expect him to, 3rd line player.
The point is, they HAVE moved on to greener pastures.
We need to improve the roster-top to bottom, in order to get a decent base for the future. Get better, not just younger. Draft better, not just differently-last year seems to have been a start.
You have to wonder what life would have been like by now with Smith and Nolan together. Conflict is necessary between the coach and GM, yes men are not important. Gordon doe not want to be one, he just wants to coach. Does Garth read this forum?
 The system sucks you cant pressure the puck constantly with the forwards the Isles have, and the d-men cant pinch all the time they do not have the talent, when you take chances you give up too many odd man rushes this is a problem with this system, yes they dont have the talent, but FISHERMAN GORDEN should adjust to the talent he has, it would be interesting too see if Neil Smith and Ted Nolan were around it would be better, Gorden is Snows puppet he just wants to coach in the nhl hell who could blame him, fact is this is going to be a long season and there is not much hope on the horizon, see Tambellni. There are some young guys but there not good yet and who knows if they will every be good. Most of these guys could not crack a good teams 4th line.
Do you get what this year is about? This year isn't about winning this year. It is about developing the young kids that we have so that in 3-4 years this system is engrained and second nature.
It doesn't matter what system you play with. This team does lack the talent to make the playoffs. However, what we do have is a bunch of young kids. We have Tambelini, Okposo, Bailey, Bergie, Neilsen who need to be developed and need to play at a high level of speed non-stop. They need to do this because that is what ANY system in the nhl would demand from them.
As it has been, this system has not proven to be the problem. The Islanders have blown 3rd period leads when they STOP pressuring the puck and STOP forechecking because they STOPPED skating. That isn't part of the system, to go into a shell for the final 10 minutes. Like any system it takes time, and as we saw with Nolan, Lavy and Sterling behind the bench this organization has had a hard time skating for a solid 60 minutes.
Gordon has alot of old habits that this team needs to break. But he's been doing a solid job so far. If you were going to tell me that by mid Nov. the Islanders would take a home and home from Ottawa, fail to show up for only 2 games and would be in nearly every game they played, based on my expectations with what we have I would be happy.
And I'd venture to say that Bergie, Okposo and Bailey would "crack a good team's 4th line". You have to play the kids to develop them. That is what we are doing. Look for what kids are improving this year because that is what the year is about.
BTW- the Islanders HAVE TO pressure the puck with the forwards they have, and have done so successfully for most games this season. If your forwards can't pressure the puck, you can't play in the nhl.
|
I miss these and want more of them

|
| |
|
LEDZEP
|
Nov 16 2008, 01:21 AM
Post #26
|
The Best That Ever Skated 80-81-82-83
- Posts:
- 38,988
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #49
- Joined:
- June 1, 2005
|
- Islander4cups,Nov 16 2008
- 12:48 AM
- wood11,Nov 15 2008
- 01:06 PM
- bumpkin,Nov 15 2008
- 09:40 AM
And that's why a great many players, when they leave the Isles, seem to have their talent mystically return as they play their asses off with, seemingly, a rebirth of determined work ethic (Satan, for instance).
Okay, I have been following him, but unable to actually watch the games. He has spent limited time with Sid and Malkin, one goal I think he was just out of the box when they hit him on a breakaway, a few tip ins, and some fans are complaining that he is slow and lazy(although Nolan taught him something-he now back checks). The complaining is calming down, and because he is the leading goal scorer of their high scoring team. He is going to get points and goals, maybe bettering his highs of 40 goals or 75 points if he stays healthy. But, and I like him, he is the same player on a better team.
Feto did have a big goal this week, but he has not done much. I would not expect him to, 3rd line player.
The point is, they HAVE moved on to greener pastures.
We need to improve the roster-top to bottom, in order to get a decent base for the future. Get better, not just younger. Draft better, not just differently-last year seems to have been a start.
You have to wonder what life would have been like by now with Smith and Nolan together. Conflict is necessary between the coach and GM, yes men are not important. Gordon doe not want to be one, he just wants to coach. Does Garth read this forum?
 The system sucks you cant pressure the puck constantly with the forwards the Isles have, and the d-men cant pinch all the time they do not have the talent, when you take chances you give up too many odd man rushes this is a problem with this system, yes they dont have the talent, but FISHERMAN GORDEN should adjust to the talent he has, it would be interesting too see if Neil Smith and Ted Nolan were around it would be better, Gorden is Snows puppet he just wants to coach in the nhl hell who could blame him, fact is this is going to be a long season and there is not much hope on the horizon, see Tambellni. There are some young guys but there not good yet and who knows if they will every be good. Most of these guys could not crack a good teams 4th line.
This year isn't about winning this year. It is about developing the young kids that we have so that in 3-4 years this system is engrained and second nature.
May 12, 1984 amd then................
...................................................................
.................................................................................. Joey Joey Joey Joey Joey Joey
|
Sometimes I grow so tired, but I know I've got one thing I got to do... 
What puckhead says is Islander law
Come in with the milk
"A leader, once convinced a particular course of action is the right one, must have the determination to stick with it and be undaunted when the going gets rough."
Ronald Reagan
|
| |
|
LEDZEP
|
Nov 16 2008, 01:23 AM
Post #27
|
The Best That Ever Skated 80-81-82-83
- Posts:
- 38,988
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #49
- Joined:
- June 1, 2005
|
- LEDZEP,Nov 16 2008
- 02:21 AM
- Islander4cups,Nov 16 2008
- 12:48 AM
- wood11,Nov 15 2008
- 01:06 PM
- bumpkin,Nov 15 2008
- 09:40 AM
And that's why a great many players, when they leave the Isles, seem to have their talent mystically return as they play their asses off with, seemingly, a rebirth of determined work ethic (Satan, for instance).
Okay, I have been following him, but unable to actually watch the games. He has spent limited time with Sid and Malkin, one goal I think he was just out of the box when they hit him on a breakaway, a few tip ins, and some fans are complaining that he is slow and lazy(although Nolan taught him something-he now back checks). The complaining is calming down, and because he is the leading goal scorer of their high scoring team. He is going to get points and goals, maybe bettering his highs of 40 goals or 75 points if he stays healthy. But, and I like him, he is the same player on a better team.
Feto did have a big goal this week, but he has not done much. I would not expect him to, 3rd line player.
The point is, they HAVE moved on to greener pastures.
We need to improve the roster-top to bottom, in order to get a decent base for the future. Get better, not just younger. Draft better, not just differently-last year seems to have been a start.
You have to wonder what life would have been like by now with Smith and Nolan together. Conflict is necessary between the coach and GM, yes men are not important. Gordon doe not want to be one, he just wants to coach. Does Garth read this forum?
 The system sucks you cant pressure the puck constantly with the forwards the Isles have, and the d-men cant pinch all the time they do not have the talent, when you take chances you give up too many odd man rushes this is a problem with this system, yes they dont have the talent, but FISHERMAN GORDEN should adjust to the talent he has, it would be interesting too see if Neil Smith and Ted Nolan were around it would be better, Gorden is Snows puppet he just wants to coach in the nhl hell who could blame him, fact is this is going to be a long season and there is not much hope on the horizon, see Tambellni. There are some young guys but there not good yet and who knows if they will every be good. Most of these guys could not crack a good teams 4th line.
This year isn't about winning this year. It is about developing the young kids that we have so that in 3-4 years this system is engrained and second nature.
May 12, 1984 amd then................ ................................................................... .................................................................................. Joey Joey  Joey Joey  Joey Joey 
TAKE 2
May 12, 1984 and then................
...................................................................
.................................................................................. Joey Joey Joey Joey Joey Joey
|
Sometimes I grow so tired, but I know I've got one thing I got to do... 
What puckhead says is Islander law
Come in with the milk
"A leader, once convinced a particular course of action is the right one, must have the determination to stick with it and be undaunted when the going gets rough."
Ronald Reagan
|
| |
|
bumpkin
|
Nov 16 2008, 05:39 AM
Post #28
|
1st line
- Posts:
- 1,059
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #1,048
- Joined:
- August 23, 2007
|
- Islander4cups,Nov 15 2008
- 11:37 AM
- Webb20,Nov 15 2008
- 11:32 AM
- bumpkin,Nov 15 2008
- 09:40 AM
And that's why a great many players, when they leave the Isles, seem to have their talent mystically return as they play their asses off with, seemingly, a rebirth of determined work ethic (Satan, for instance).
Okay, I have been following him, but unable to actually watch the games. He has spent limited time with Sid and Malkin, one goal I think he was just out of the box when they hit him on a breakaway, a few tip ins, and some fans are complaining that he is slow and lazy(although Nolan taught him something-he now back checks). The complaining is calming down, and because he is the leading goal scorer of their high scoring team. He is going to get points and goals, maybe bettering his highs of 40 goals or 75 points if he stays healthy. But, and I like him, he is the same player on a better team.
Feto did have a big goal this week, but he has not done much. I would not expect him to, 3rd line player.
The point is, they HAVE moved on to greener pastures.
We need to improve the roster-top to bottom, in order to get a decent base for the future. Get better, not just younger. Draft better, not just differently-last year seems to have been a start.
You have to wonder what life would have been like by now with Smith and Nolan together. Conflict is necessary between the coach and GM, yes men are not important. Gordon doe not want to be one, he just wants to coach. Does Garth read this forum?
Just like Jason Blake, Tom Poti, Viktor Kozlov, Alexei Yashin, Chris Simon, Sean Hill, Aaron Asham, Dave Scatchard, Mark Parrish, Mike Peca, Jason Weimer, Oleg, Mariusz Czerkawski, Claude Lapointe, Travis Green, Chico Resch, Mikko Makala, Randy Wood, and I could on all afternoon. Many many more players have never again achieved their expected returns after they left the Island.
BINGO.....we have a winner. Randy, tell him what he's won!!!
I was not agreeing that everyone gets better after they leave, obviously not the case. Maybe it is the expanded role they have to play here, but I think the original post was lamenting Jokinen, Bertuzzi, and whoever else has done better since leaving the Island.
I really do not care, except for whoever is on the Team. And I want them to get better, which may not include trading all of the vets at the deadline. Because if we do that, we will be worse for it next year. Our prospect pool is of wading depth still.
|
|
Where in the World is Sebastian Collberg?
|
| |
|
wood11
|
Nov 16 2008, 10:27 AM
Post #29
|
4th line
- Posts:
- 123
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #2,295
- Joined:
- June 4, 2008
|
- Islander4cups,Nov 15 2008
- 11:48 PM
- wood11,Nov 15 2008
- 01:06 PM
- bumpkin,Nov 15 2008
- 09:40 AM
And that's why a great many players, when they leave the Isles, seem to have their talent mystically return as they play their asses off with, seemingly, a rebirth of determined work ethic (Satan, for instance).
Okay, I have been following him, but unable to actually watch the games. He has spent limited time with Sid and Malkin, one goal I think he was just out of the box when they hit him on a breakaway, a few tip ins, and some fans are complaining that he is slow and lazy(although Nolan taught him something-he now back checks). The complaining is calming down, and because he is the leading goal scorer of their high scoring team. He is going to get points and goals, maybe bettering his highs of 40 goals or 75 points if he stays healthy. But, and I like him, he is the same player on a better team.
Feto did have a big goal this week, but he has not done much. I would not expect him to, 3rd line player.
The point is, they HAVE moved on to greener pastures.
We need to improve the roster-top to bottom, in order to get a decent base for the future. Get better, not just younger. Draft better, not just differently-last year seems to have been a start.
You have to wonder what life would have been like by now with Smith and Nolan together. Conflict is necessary between the coach and GM, yes men are not important. Gordon doe not want to be one, he just wants to coach. Does Garth read this forum?
 The system sucks you cant pressure the puck constantly with the forwards the Isles have, and the d-men cant pinch all the time they do not have the talent, when you take chances you give up too many odd man rushes this is a problem with this system, yes they dont have the talent, but FISHERMAN GORDEN should adjust to the talent he has, it would be interesting too see if Neil Smith and Ted Nolan were around it would be better, Gorden is Snows puppet he just wants to coach in the nhl hell who could blame him, fact is this is going to be a long season and there is not much hope on the horizon, see Tambellni. There are some young guys but there not good yet and who knows if they will every be good. Most of these guys could not crack a good teams 4th line.
Do you get what this year is about? This year isn't about winning this year. It is about developing the young kids that we have so that in 3-4 years this system is engrained and second nature. It doesn't matter what system you play with. This team does lack the talent to make the playoffs. However, what we do have is a bunch of young kids. We have Tambelini, Okposo, Bailey, Bergie, Neilsen who need to be developed and need to play at a high level of speed non-stop. They need to do this because that is what ANY system in the nhl would demand from them. As it has been, this system has not proven to be the problem. The Islanders have blown 3rd period leads when they STOP pressuring the puck and STOP forechecking because they STOPPED skating. That isn't part of the system, to go into a shell for the final 10 minutes. Like any system it takes time, and as we saw with Nolan, Lavy and Sterling behind the bench this organization has had a hard time skating for a solid 60 minutes. Gordon has alot of old habits that this team needs to break. But he's been doing a solid job so far. If you were going to tell me that by mid Nov. the Islanders would take a home and home from Ottawa, fail to show up for only 2 games and would be in nearly every game they played, based on my expectations with what we have I would be happy. And I'd venture to say that Bergie, Okposo and Bailey would "crack a good team's 4th line". You have to play the kids to develop them. That is what we are doing. Look for what kids are improving this year because that is what the year is about. BTW- the Islanders HAVE TO pressure the puck with the forwards they have, and have done so successfully for most games this season. If your forwards can't pressure the puck, you can't play in the nhl.
Wait so you want to throw the whole season away because this year is about developing, you develop people in the minors and bring them up when there ready yes the last few games they have been playing well, but how can you except losing all season, the worse they do no fans and no Lighthouse deal means goodbye Islanders maybe Kansas Dorthy or sleepless in Seattle. Cant except losing see New York Yankees.
|
|
|
| |
|
Islander4cups
|
Nov 16 2008, 10:44 AM
Post #30
|
In Garth I Trust
- Posts:
- 9,987
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #595
- Joined:
- March 2, 2007
|
That's funny. I had no problem ACCEPTING losing in 1974 because it was about development...and those kids developed
Last I checked, the Penguins, who lost in the finals, failed to make the playoffs in Crosby's first year.
Last I checked, Chicago has missed the playoffs the last two years, but have a solid young team that will make it this year.
They developed players AT THE NHL LEVEL, not the AHL level. You don't have teams bringing up a ton of players from the ahl that turn out to be impact players. How much time did Lacavallier, Trottier, Bossy, Potvin, LaFontaine, Turgeon spend at the AHL level again? How about LeClaire in Columbus or Price in Montreal? What about HIggins and Komaserek?
Some players need more time to mature both physically and in their game and that is what the AHL is for. Its for guys like Franz Neilsen. It isn't for guys like Okposo.
As for the Islanders moving, it is going to take more than losing, but developing hockey for the Isles to move so settle down Chicken Little...the sky ain't falling.
and the Yankees would be a LOUSY model for any NHL team to follow. The Yankees and Red Sox can spend liberally whereas NHL teams cannot. The Yankees can pay Pavano's entire contract and get nothing, but still cover it up by going out and signing other huge FA's because they have bottomless pockets. No NHL team can do that. This idea that the Yankees "don't accept losing"...gimme a break. They built a team of overpaid former all stars that don't play like all-stars anymore. They are the Rangers of 1997-2004. Who cares if they "don't accept" losing. Their management and players now have no idea of how to avoid it.
|
I miss these and want more of them

|
| |
|
wood11
|
Nov 16 2008, 01:16 PM
Post #31
|
4th line
- Posts:
- 123
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #2,295
- Joined:
- June 4, 2008
|
- Islander4cups,Nov 16 2008
- 10:44 AM
That's funny. I had no problem ACCEPTING losing in 1974 because it was about development...and those kids developed
Last I checked, the Penguins, who lost in the finals, failed to make the playoffs in Crosby's first year.
Last I checked, Chicago has missed the playoffs the last two years, but have a solid young team that will make it this year.
They developed players AT THE NHL LEVEL, not the AHL level. You don't have teams bringing up a ton of players from the ahl that turn out to be impact players. How much time did Lacavallier, Trottier, Bossy, Potvin, LaFontaine, Turgeon spend at the AHL level again? How about LeClaire in Columbus or Price in Montreal? What about HIggins and Komaserek?
Some players need more time to mature both physically and in their game and that is what the AHL is for. Its for guys like Franz Neilsen. It isn't for guys like Okposo.
As for the Islanders moving, it is going to take more than losing, but developing hockey for the Isles to move so settle down Chicken Little...the sky ain't falling.
and the Yankees would be a LOUSY model for any NHL team to follow. The Yankees and Red Sox can spend liberally whereas NHL teams cannot. The Yankees can pay Pavano's entire contract and get nothing, but still cover it up by going out and signing other huge FA's because they have bottomless pockets. No NHL team can do that. This idea that the Yankees "don't accept losing"...gimme a break. They built a team of overpaid former all stars that don't play like all-stars anymore. They are the Rangers of 1997-2004. Who cares if they "don't accept" losing. Their management and players now have no idea of how to avoid it.
I am not talking so much of the Yankees of today but the 90s they mixed youth and added players, see Jeter, Posada, Williams and Mo developed by the Yankees. Yes Trottier, Potvin,, Gillies all high draft picks, so develop Okposo, Bailey maybe they will be great players, but do they have too waste time with the Tambellinis of the world, look at there past years of drafting who in this lineup is going to be the next Trottier or Bossy or Potvin not going to happen oh wait Frans Nielson, you need youth and have some good vets, the Old Isles had a good mix back in the 70s and 80s and in 92-93 they had guys like Green and Mccinnis mixed with vets like Thomas and Turgeon. This sacrificing a whole season to get a draft pick mentality sucks hell the price of tickets I want to see a quality hockey team on the ice every night I dont want to see Brideport.
|
|
|
| |
|
LEDZEP
|
Nov 16 2008, 01:20 PM
Post #32
|
The Best That Ever Skated 80-81-82-83
- Posts:
- 38,988
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #49
- Joined:
- June 1, 2005
|
- wood11,Nov 16 2008
- 02:16 PM
- Islander4cups,Nov 16 2008
- 10:44 AM
That's funny. I had no problem ACCEPTING losing in 1974 because it was about development...and those kids developed
Last I checked, the Penguins, who lost in the finals, failed to make the playoffs in Crosby's first year.
Last I checked, Chicago has missed the playoffs the last two years, but have a solid young team that will make it this year.
They developed players AT THE NHL LEVEL, not the AHL level. You don't have teams bringing up a ton of players from the ahl that turn out to be impact players. How much time did Lacavallier, Trottier, Bossy, Potvin, LaFontaine, Turgeon spend at the AHL level again? How about LeClaire in Columbus or Price in Montreal? What about HIggins and Komaserek?
Some players need more time to mature both physically and in their game and that is what the AHL is for. Its for guys like Franz Neilsen. It isn't for guys like Okposo.
As for the Islanders moving, it is going to take more than losing, but developing hockey for the Isles to move so settle down Chicken Little...the sky ain't falling.
and the Yankees would be a LOUSY model for any NHL team to follow. The Yankees and Red Sox can spend liberally whereas NHL teams cannot. The Yankees can pay Pavano's entire contract and get nothing, but still cover it up by going out and signing other huge FA's because they have bottomless pockets. No NHL team can do that. This idea that the Yankees "don't accept losing"...gimme a break. They built a team of overpaid former all stars that don't play like all-stars anymore. They are the Rangers of 1997-2004. Who cares if they "don't accept" losing. Their management and players now have no idea of how to avoid it.
 This sacrificing a whole season to get a draft pick mentality sucks hell the price of tickets I want to see a quality hockey team on the ice every night I dont want to see Brideport.
YUP Now the Islanders have TWO Count them TWO Bridgeport Sound Tiger hockey teams
|
Sometimes I grow so tired, but I know I've got one thing I got to do... 
What puckhead says is Islander law
Come in with the milk
"A leader, once convinced a particular course of action is the right one, must have the determination to stick with it and be undaunted when the going gets rough."
Ronald Reagan
|
| |
|
wood11
|
Nov 16 2008, 04:31 PM
Post #33
|
4th line
- Posts:
- 123
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #2,295
- Joined:
- June 4, 2008
|
- LEDZEP,Nov 16 2008
- 01:20 PM
- wood11,Nov 16 2008
- 02:16 PM
- Islander4cups,Nov 16 2008
- 10:44 AM
That's funny. I had no problem ACCEPTING losing in 1974 because it was about development...and those kids developed
Last I checked, the Penguins, who lost in the finals, failed to make the playoffs in Crosby's first year.
Last I checked, Chicago has missed the playoffs the last two years, but have a solid young team that will make it this year.
They developed players AT THE NHL LEVEL, not the AHL level. You don't have teams bringing up a ton of players from the ahl that turn out to be impact players. How much time did Lacavallier, Trottier, Bossy, Potvin, LaFontaine, Turgeon spend at the AHL level again? How about LeClaire in Columbus or Price in Montreal? What about HIggins and Komaserek?
Some players need more time to mature both physically and in their game and that is what the AHL is for. Its for guys like Franz Neilsen. It isn't for guys like Okposo.
As for the Islanders moving, it is going to take more than losing, but developing hockey for the Isles to move so settle down Chicken Little...the sky ain't falling.
and the Yankees would be a LOUSY model for any NHL team to follow. The Yankees and Red Sox can spend liberally whereas NHL teams cannot. The Yankees can pay Pavano's entire contract and get nothing, but still cover it up by going out and signing other huge FA's because they have bottomless pockets. No NHL team can do that. This idea that the Yankees "don't accept losing"...gimme a break. They built a team of overpaid former all stars that don't play like all-stars anymore. They are the Rangers of 1997-2004. Who cares if they "don't accept" losing. Their management and players now have no idea of how to avoid it.
 This sacrificing a whole season to get a draft pick mentality sucks hell the price of tickets I want to see a quality hockey team on the ice every night I dont want to see Brideport.
YUP Now the Islanders have TWO Count them TWO Bridgeport Sound Tiger hockey teams
Thank You Zep someone understands.
|
|
|
| |
|
Islander4cups
|
Nov 16 2008, 05:38 PM
Post #34
|
In Garth I Trust
- Posts:
- 9,987
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #595
- Joined:
- March 2, 2007
|
- wood11,Nov 16 2008
- 01:16 PM
- Islander4cups,Nov 16 2008
- 10:44 AM
That's funny. I had no problem ACCEPTING losing in 1974 because it was about development...and those kids developed
Last I checked, the Penguins, who lost in the finals, failed to make the playoffs in Crosby's first year.
Last I checked, Chicago has missed the playoffs the last two years, but have a solid young team that will make it this year.
They developed players AT THE NHL LEVEL, not the AHL level. You don't have teams bringing up a ton of players from the ahl that turn out to be impact players. How much time did Lacavallier, Trottier, Bossy, Potvin, LaFontaine, Turgeon spend at the AHL level again? How about LeClaire in Columbus or Price in Montreal? What about HIggins and Komaserek?
Some players need more time to mature both physically and in their game and that is what the AHL is for. Its for guys like Franz Neilsen. It isn't for guys like Okposo.
As for the Islanders moving, it is going to take more than losing, but developing hockey for the Isles to move so settle down Chicken Little...the sky ain't falling.
and the Yankees would be a LOUSY model for any NHL team to follow. The Yankees and Red Sox can spend liberally whereas NHL teams cannot. The Yankees can pay Pavano's entire contract and get nothing, but still cover it up by going out and signing other huge FA's because they have bottomless pockets. No NHL team can do that. This idea that the Yankees "don't accept losing"...gimme a break. They built a team of overpaid former all stars that don't play like all-stars anymore. They are the Rangers of 1997-2004. Who cares if they "don't accept" losing. Their management and players now have no idea of how to avoid it.
 I am not talking so much of the Yankees of today but the 90s they mixed youth and added players, see Jeter, Posada, Williams and Mo developed by the Yankees. Yes Trottier, Potvin,, Gillies all high draft picks, so develop Okposo, Bailey maybe they will be great players, but do they have too waste time with the Tambellinis of the world, look at there past years of drafting who in this lineup is going to be the next Trottier or Bossy or Potvin not going to happen oh wait Frans Nielson, you need youth and have some good vets, the Old Isles had a good mix back in the 70s and 80s and in 92-93 they had guys like Green and Mccinnis mixed with vets like Thomas and Turgeon. This sacrificing a whole season to get a draft pick mentality sucks hell the price of tickets I want to see a quality hockey team on the ice every night I dont want to see Brideport.
I wanted to be 6' 4" and the Islanders center, but that didn't happen either.
Question- Did the Penguins "sacrifice" the season in 2005-06? They had just drafted Crosby and MAF, Brooks Orpik, Lyle Odelin, Ryan Whitney, Colby Armstrong, Mario Lemieux, John LeClair, and Mark Recci. THEY MISSED THE PLAYOFFS. They were dead last the year prior and missed the playoffs again. Was that a "wasted season" or was it a season where the young kids gained experience like Crosby, MAF, Orpik, Whitney, Armstrong and developed towards making a run to the finals in 08?
Was last season a "waste" for Chicago? They played a ton of kids like Towes and missed the playoffs. Do you think they won't be better for it this year and next?
This whole "I pay for tickets so I expect..." means nothing to me. There is a way to build a team and a wrong way to build a team. Going the FA route is NOT the right way. Building through the draft IS the right way to go. Look at the teams that annually contend in the NHL. They aren't FA built. They are built through the draft. See Detroit, Buffalo, Ducks, and now Pitt and Crapitals. Each of those teams will contend for their division or have for a 5 year period.
We've tried the FA route. Guess what. They don't come here. We need to build our own players. Last year's draft was a step in that direction. Do I want to TANK a season? No. And in my eyes that isn't what we are doing. These kids are playing hard, getting experience and aren't getting blown out. They are in nearly every game. Yeah, they have breakdowns and klunkers now and then, but what young team doesn't. The key is, will they still have them come December, come February and the end of March?
Try building something for the long haul instead of a quick fix which your precious Yankees have done for the past decade and the Isles have also done. All the moves in 01 did for the Isles is move them temporarily out of laughing stock. Let's try rebuilding the right way this time.
As for your "I buy tickets..." I could care less. If you don't have the patience for a rebuild or don't know what to look for as far as progress goes, that is your problem, not the organization's. If they rebuild the right way, you'll be back in a year or two lining up for tickets again.
|
I miss these and want more of them

|
| |
|
wood11
|
Nov 16 2008, 06:12 PM
Post #35
|
4th line
- Posts:
- 123
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #2,295
- Joined:
- June 4, 2008
|
- Islander4cups,Nov 16 2008
- 05:38 PM
- wood11,Nov 16 2008
- 01:16 PM
- Islander4cups,Nov 16 2008
- 10:44 AM
That's funny. I had no problem ACCEPTING losing in 1974 because it was about development...and those kids developed
Last I checked, the Penguins, who lost in the finals, failed to make the playoffs in Crosby's first year.
Last I checked, Chicago has missed the playoffs the last two years, but have a solid young team that will make it this year.
They developed players AT THE NHL LEVEL, not the AHL level. You don't have teams bringing up a ton of players from the ahl that turn out to be impact players. How much time did Lacavallier, Trottier, Bossy, Potvin, LaFontaine, Turgeon spend at the AHL level again? How about LeClaire in Columbus or Price in Montreal? What about HIggins and Komaserek?
Some players need more time to mature both physically and in their game and that is what the AHL is for. Its for guys like Franz Neilsen. It isn't for guys like Okposo.
As for the Islanders moving, it is going to take more than losing, but developing hockey for the Isles to move so settle down Chicken Little...the sky ain't falling.
and the Yankees would be a LOUSY model for any NHL team to follow. The Yankees and Red Sox can spend liberally whereas NHL teams cannot. The Yankees can pay Pavano's entire contract and get nothing, but still cover it up by going out and signing other huge FA's because they have bottomless pockets. No NHL team can do that. This idea that the Yankees "don't accept losing"...gimme a break. They built a team of overpaid former all stars that don't play like all-stars anymore. They are the Rangers of 1997-2004. Who cares if they "don't accept" losing. Their management and players now have no idea of how to avoid it.
 I am not talking so much of the Yankees of today but the 90s they mixed youth and added players, see Jeter, Posada, Williams and Mo developed by the Yankees. Yes Trottier, Potvin,, Gillies all high draft picks, so develop Okposo, Bailey maybe they will be great players, but do they have too waste time with the Tambellinis of the world, look at there past years of drafting who in this lineup is going to be the next Trottier or Bossy or Potvin not going to happen oh wait Frans Nielson, you need youth and have some good vets, the Old Isles had a good mix back in the 70s and 80s and in 92-93 they had guys like Green and Mccinnis mixed with vets like Thomas and Turgeon. This sacrificing a whole season to get a draft pick mentality sucks hell the price of tickets I want to see a quality hockey team on the ice every night I dont want to see Brideport.
I wanted to be 6' 4" and the Islanders center, but that didn't happen either. Question- Did the Penguins "sacrifice" the season in 2005-06? They had just drafted Crosby and MAF, Brooks Orpik, Lyle Odelin, Ryan Whitney, Colby Armstrong, Mario Lemieux, John LeClair, and Mark Recci. THEY MISSED THE PLAYOFFS. They were dead last the year prior and missed the playoffs again. Was that a "wasted season" or was it a season where the young kids gained experience like Crosby, MAF, Orpik, Whitney, Armstrong and developed towards making a run to the finals in 08? Was last season a "waste" for Chicago? They played a ton of kids like Towes and missed the playoffs. Do you think they won't be better for it this year and next? This whole "I pay for tickets so I expect..." means nothing to me. There is a way to build a team and a wrong way to build a team. Going the FA route is NOT the right way. Building through the draft IS the right way to go. Look at the teams that annually contend in the NHL. They aren't FA built. They are built through the draft. See Detroit, Buffalo, Ducks, and now Pitt and Crapitals. Each of those teams will contend for their division or have for a 5 year period. We've tried the FA route. Guess what. They don't come here. We need to build our own players. Last year's draft was a step in that direction. Do I want to TANK a season? No. And in my eyes that isn't what we are doing. These kids are playing hard, getting experience and aren't getting blown out. They are in nearly every game. Yeah, they have breakdowns and klunkers now and then, but what young team doesn't. The key is, will they still have them come December, come February and the end of March? Try building something for the long haul instead of a quick fix which your precious Yankees have done for the past decade and the Isles have also done. All the moves in 01 did for the Isles is move them temporarily out of laughing stock. Let's try rebuilding the right way this time. As for your "I buy tickets..." I could care less. If you don't have the patience for a rebuild or don't know what to look for as far as progress goes, that is your problem, not the organization's. If they rebuild the right way, you'll be back in a year or two lining up for tickets again.
Detroit builds there team and adds free agents see Rafalski, Hossa and built with a young mix, Pitt added free agents also. And yes I will still buy tickets not as much but the one thing I am not is a fair weather fan, I have been a fan of this team for 30 years and it is getting frustrating of the constant change, and as for the Yankees I happen to be a met fan, the Yankees are a great organization that will be around forever. I dont know how you think that Mr. Wang will not get frustrated as well with no people in the stands and losing 20million dollars a year, he will soon, we have been fortuate he has not been frustrated yet but you can bank if he cant get the lighthouse deal done, this team will be playinging somewhere else.
|
|
|
| |
|
Islander4cups
|
Nov 16 2008, 06:39 PM
Post #36
|
In Garth I Trust
- Posts:
- 9,987
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #595
- Joined:
- March 2, 2007
|
- wood11,Nov 16 2008
- 06:12 PM
 Detroit builds there team and adds free agents see Rafalski, Hossa and built with a young mix, Pitt added free agents also. And yes I will still buy tickets not as much but the one thing I am not is a fair weather fan, I have been a fan of this team for 30 years and it is getting frustrating of the constant change, and as for the Yankees I happen to be a met fan, the Yankees are a great organization that will be around forever. I dont know how you think that Mr. Wang will not get frustrated as well with no people in the stands and losing 20million dollars a year, he will soon, we have been fortuate he has not been frustrated yet but you can bank if he cant get the lighthouse deal done, this team will be playinging somewhere else.
Really? For Detroit you can name 1 FA for their cup winner? yeah...they really used FA to build a winner. Now look at the roster and see how many guys they either drafted or traded for.
Same with Pitt. Who are those those key FA's Pitt had in their run to the finals? Wasn't Crosby, MAF, Malkin, Malone, Whitney was it?
As for your baseball analogy, it doesn't apply. That was my point. The Yankees, Red Sox and Mets all just throw money at their problems. You can do that when you have ungodly sources of revenue and no salary cap to speak of. That isn't the case in the NHL. And last I checked, the formula of getting FA's to fill their holes hasn't worked for the Yankees this century...oh, and they were just passed in the standings by a very young team from TB that spent the last 4-5 seasons building through...THE DRAFT.
Since you are convinced the Isles are wrong to play their kids, who should they have gotten/or play in their place? What should the Isles have done this offseason...that was actually possible?
I find it amusing that the Islanders said since late last season that we are in a youth movment...which means playing the kids...and here we are less than 20 games into the season and some fans are shocked we are ... playing kids.
Did you not believe them when you bought your tickets? Did you expect to walk into NVMC and see Hossa or Drury or god forbid Avery in an Isles uniform?
The Isles were very up front about what they were doing this year. If people weren't listening when they bought their tickets, that is on them.
Rebuilds don't happen overnight.
|
I miss these and want more of them

|
| |
|
LEDZEP
|
Nov 16 2008, 07:07 PM
Post #37
|
The Best That Ever Skated 80-81-82-83
- Posts:
- 38,988
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #49
- Joined:
- June 1, 2005
|
What about dipee
|
Sometimes I grow so tired, but I know I've got one thing I got to do... 
What puckhead says is Islander law
Come in with the milk
"A leader, once convinced a particular course of action is the right one, must have the determination to stick with it and be undaunted when the going gets rough."
Ronald Reagan
|
| |
|
Islander4cups
|
Nov 16 2008, 07:19 PM
Post #38
|
In Garth I Trust
- Posts:
- 9,987
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #595
- Joined:
- March 2, 2007
|
- LEDZEP,Nov 16 2008
- 07:07 PM
what about him?
|
I miss these and want more of them

|
| |
|
Snowy
|
Nov 16 2008, 08:28 PM
Post #39
|
The Dark Knight
- Posts:
- 11,438
- Group:
- Admin
- Member
- #15
- Joined:
- May 9, 2005
|
- Islander4cups,Nov 16 2008
- 06:39 PM
- wood11,Nov 16 2008
- 06:12 PM
 Detroit builds there team and adds free agents see Rafalski, Hossa and built with a young mix, Pitt added free agents also. And yes I will still buy tickets not as much but the one thing I am not is a fair weather fan, I have been a fan of this team for 30 years and it is getting frustrating of the constant change, and as for the Yankees I happen to be a met fan, the Yankees are a great organization that will be around forever. I dont know how you think that Mr. Wang will not get frustrated as well with no people in the stands and losing 20million dollars a year, he will soon, we have been fortuate he has not been frustrated yet but you can bank if he cant get the lighthouse deal done, this team will be playinging somewhere else.
Really? For Detroit you can name 1 FA for their cup winner? yeah...they really used FA to build a winner. Now look at the roster and see how many guys they either drafted or traded for. Same with Pitt. Who are those those key FA's Pitt had in their run to the finals? Wasn't Crosby, MAF, Malkin, Malone, Whitney was it? As for your baseball analogy, it doesn't apply. That was my point. The Yankees, Red Sox and Mets all just throw money at their problems. You can do that when you have ungodly sources of revenue and no salary cap to speak of. That isn't the case in the NHL. And last I checked, the formula of getting FA's to fill their holes hasn't worked for the Yankees this century...oh, and they were just passed in the standings by a very young team from TB that spent the last 4-5 seasons building through...THE DRAFT. Since you are convinced the Isles are wrong to play their kids, who should they have gotten/or play in their place? What should the Isles have done this offseason...that was actually possible? I find it amusing that the Islanders said since late last season that we are in a youth movment...which means playing the kids...and here we are less than 20 games into the season and some fans are shocked we are ... playing kids. Did you not believe them when you bought your tickets? Did you expect to walk into NVMC and see Hossa or Drury or god forbid Avery in an Isles uniform? The Isles were very up front about what they were doing this year. If people weren't listening when they bought their tickets, that is on them. Rebuilds don't happen overnight.
|
|
| |
|
LEDZEP
|
Nov 16 2008, 08:45 PM
Post #40
|
The Best That Ever Skated 80-81-82-83
- Posts:
- 38,988
- Group:
- Members
- Member
- #49
- Joined:
- June 1, 2005
|
Rebuilds don't happen in 2008
|
Sometimes I grow so tired, but I know I've got one thing I got to do... 
What puckhead says is Islander law
Come in with the milk
"A leader, once convinced a particular course of action is the right one, must have the determination to stick with it and be undaunted when the going gets rough."
Ronald Reagan
|
| |
| 1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous)
|