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NY POST: Dougie does not want to go
Topic Started: Dec 30 2008, 08:21 PM (1,240 Views)
Snowday
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4th line
This isn't surprising. Guerin most likely won't waive his trade clause and Weight wants to stay with his buddy in hopes they both get resigned for high dollars.

Weight is a must trade in a rebuild situation on a comeback year, especially a guy of his age who can get hurt or slump at any moment.
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tsharaf
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You've Just Been Served!
Webb20,Dec 31 2008
08:32 AM
Keep Guerin and Weight, and package Witt and Comrie. :thumbsup:

I'd say you trade Weight, but not Guerin. Here's why: In the off-season, just like this past one, Guerin will lure his best buddy back. Guerin, I believe has a no-trade clause anyway. If so, he has earned an extension.

The others I would trade as well: Comrie, Sillinger, Martinek and reluctantly Witt.

Sillinger needs to play more than 2 games in a row to bring us anything of value, though.
The Boss - The Greatest Goal Scorer Ever
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Bexlyspeed
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bexlyspeed- 3rd round draft pick
I am sure weight will be traded, hopefully his value wont go down before the trade deadline. i think a #1 pick is kind of unrealistic perhaps a second or a decent prospect?
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Webb20
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Godfather
Why trade the guy? Why? Just because you can? You dont think with all the picks last year, and all the choice ones we have this year it'll really matter. We have a guy who's fun to watch, plays like he enjoys it, publically states he LIKES it here, has been a very productive scorer, and we like him, we have a special impromptu 'ole' chant for him too. Can't we just sign him for another year and enjoy that he's an Islander?

Garth(or anyone who can relay this), are you reading this? Don't listen to those guys. We like him.
I sold it all, retired and moved to Fabulous Las Vegas!
"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety."-Ben Franklin
"Government exists to protect us from each other. Where government has gone beyond its limits is in deciding to protect us from ourselves."-Ronald Reagan
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oldislesfan
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You know what it's like Nick, everybody's a GM.

:blah:
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3POTI
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Bring back...PRIDE OF THE ISLAND
yeah I really like him too...I just want whats best for the Islanders..Hate to be in Snow's shoes :blink:
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Live For The Moment!

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Shooter
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Guerin plays half the ice. Send him away for a draft pick.
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clebo99
1st line
Webb20,Dec 31 2008
07:12 PM
Why trade the guy? Why? Just because you can? You dont think with all the picks last year, and all the choice ones we have this year it'll really matter. We have a guy who's fun to watch, plays like he enjoys it, publically states he LIKES it here, has been a very productive scorer, and we like him, we have a special impromptu 'ole' chant for him too. Can't we just sign him for another year and enjoy that he's an Islander?

Garth(or anyone who can relay this), are you reading this? Don't listen to those guys. We like him.

Sorry Webby, but I disagree....if you want to rebuild, you sell EVERYTHING that you have today for tomorrow. If we were in the hunt or had some other assets to maybe build around, then yes, keep him. But he is 37 and has some value out there. You trade him for a nice pick and a prospect (and we would get that for him).

this is what rebuilding is all all about.....getting rid of guys you may like for the change to win 4 years from now. I never wanted to do it, but that is where we are...
"When you've loved and lost like Frank has, you know what life's all about".
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tsharaf
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clebo99,Dec 31 2008
09:30 PM
Webb20,Dec 31 2008
07:12 PM
Why trade the guy? Why?  Just because you can?  You dont think with all the picks last year, and all the choice ones we have this year it'll really matter.    We have a guy who's fun to watch, plays like he enjoys it, publically states he LIKES it here, has been a very productive scorer, and we like him, we have a special impromptu 'ole' chant for him too.  Can't we just sign him for another year and enjoy that he's an Islander?

Garth(or anyone who can relay this), are you reading this?  Don't listen to those guys.  We like him.

Sorry Webby, but I disagree....if you want to rebuild, you sell EVERYTHING that you have today for tomorrow. If we were in the hunt or had some other assets to maybe build around, then yes, keep him. But he is 37 and has some value out there. You trade him for a nice pick and a prospect (and we would get that for him).

this is what rebuilding is all all about.....getting rid of guys you may like for the change to win 4 years from now. I never wanted to do it, but that is where we are...

I tend to agree. Last year, we had Fedotanko, Miro and Vasicek all pass the deadline and go elsewhere in the off-season. I think he could have gotten rid of them last year for SOMETHING. If Snow is in the same boat this year, he has to be committed to speeding the rebuild and get picks for just about any of the veterans we have.
The Boss - The Greatest Goal Scorer Ever
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smittyrules31
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Repeat a lie frequently enough....
This will be the great debate on this board until the deadline and/or if/when Weight gets moved. There are some very compelling arguments on both sides and I really think this is a win-win for the Isles. The obvious call, based on Snow's moves at the draft, is to try and package your soon-to-be UFAs, especially older ones who may be at a disadvantage with "overspeed" hockey, for picks/youth. I don't have a problem with that.

But, I also think a good point can be made to keep some of these guys (Weight and Guerin anyway) as they can still produce and offer guidance and tutelage for the kids here. I'm not against this so long as we aren't offered anything particularly juicy for them. If a team comes along with a pretty good offer...geez, I think you have to do it. Even if it is just a decent offer, we can still go back and try to sign them over the summer.

Some very tough decisions need to be made and it will be interesting to see how it plays out. Will Comrie continue to produce? If so, do you move him or try to sign him to a long term deal? If he keeps on playing as he has over the last few weeks, I'd like to see the Isles offer him an extension. If he doesn't sign before the deadline, then I'd prefer to see them move him. Hard to keep seeing all UFAs leave without getting any compensation...especially as we have acknowledged we are rebuilding.

Authority without wisdom is like a heavy axe without an edge: fitter to bruise than polish.

Anger makes dull men witty, but it keeps them poor.

In the beginning, the Universe was created. This made a lot of people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.
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Islander4cups
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tsharaf,Dec 31 2008
09:44 PM
clebo99,Dec 31 2008
09:30 PM
Webb20,Dec 31 2008
07:12 PM
Why trade the guy? Why?  Just because you can?   You dont think with all the picks last year, and all the choice ones we have this year it'll really matter.    We have a guy who's fun to watch, plays like he enjoys it, publically states he LIKES it here, has been a very productive scorer, and we like him, we have a special impromptu 'ole' chant for him too.   Can't we just sign him for another year and enjoy that he's an Islander?

Garth(or anyone who can relay this), are you reading this?  Don't listen to those guys.  We like him.

Sorry Webby, but I disagree....if you want to rebuild, you sell EVERYTHING that you have today for tomorrow. If we were in the hunt or had some other assets to maybe build around, then yes, keep him. But he is 37 and has some value out there. You trade him for a nice pick and a prospect (and we would get that for him).

this is what rebuilding is all all about.....getting rid of guys you may like for the change to win 4 years from now. I never wanted to do it, but that is where we are...

I tend to agree. Last year, we had Fedotanko, Miro and Vasicek all pass the deadline and go elsewhere in the off-season. I think he could have gotten rid of them last year for SOMETHING. If Snow is in the same boat this year, he has to be committed to speeding the rebuild and get picks for just about any of the veterans we have.

It all depends on what we get offered.

No offense, but we didn't even get offered 2nd round picks for Satan, Tank or Vas. You just don't move guys for the sake of moving them.

If we get good offers for guys like Comrie, Guerin, Witt and Weight, then we have to strongly consider the moves. If not, there is no reason to ship guys just so you can say "we made a deadline move".

I wouldn't trade Guerin, Witt, or Weight for anything less than a second round pick (and depending on the team, a first if it is going to be late in the first round). Comrie might just up his value into the second round if he can keep playing as he has the last 4 games.

It all depends on who's calling and what's offered. That is what determines whether these guys get moved or not. Plain and simple.

And Nick...I love having both Guerin and Weight here too. Wish we had them 5 years ago. However, by the time we are competitive again they will be sipping LI Ice Teas on the porch together. I'm all for having them bring the youth along. But we also have to keep our ears open for "the right offer".
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dragoneye
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Islander4cups,Jan 1 2009
03:26 PM
tsharaf,Dec 31 2008
09:44 PM
clebo99,Dec 31 2008
09:30 PM
Webb20,Dec 31 2008
07:12 PM
Why trade the guy? Why?  Just because you can?   You dont think with all the picks last year, and all the choice ones we have this year it'll really matter.    We have a guy who's fun to watch, plays like he enjoys it, publically states he LIKES it here, has been a very productive scorer, and we like him, we have a special impromptu 'ole' chant for him too.   Can't we just sign him for another year and enjoy that he's an Islander?

Garth(or anyone who can relay this), are you reading this?  Don't listen to those guys.  We like him.

Sorry Webby, but I disagree....if you want to rebuild, you sell EVERYTHING that you have today for tomorrow. If we were in the hunt or had some other assets to maybe build around, then yes, keep him. But he is 37 and has some value out there. You trade him for a nice pick and a prospect (and we would get that for him).

this is what rebuilding is all all about.....getting rid of guys you may like for the change to win 4 years from now. I never wanted to do it, but that is where we are...

I tend to agree. Last year, we had Fedotanko, Miro and Vasicek all pass the deadline and go elsewhere in the off-season. I think he could have gotten rid of them last year for SOMETHING. If Snow is in the same boat this year, he has to be committed to speeding the rebuild and get picks for just about any of the veterans we have.

It all depends on what we get offered.

No offense, but we didn't even get offered 2nd round picks for Satan, Tank or Vas. You just don't move guys for the sake of moving them.

If we get good offers for guys like Comrie, Guerin, Witt and Weight, then we have to strongly consider the moves. If not, there is no reason to ship guys just so you can say "we made a deadline move".

I wouldn't trade Guerin, Witt, or Weight for anything less than a second round pick (and depending on the team, a first if it is going to be late in the first round). Comrie might just up his value into the second round if he can keep playing as he has the last 4 games.

It all depends on who's calling and what's offered. That is what determines whether these guys get moved or not. Plain and simple.

And Nick...I love having both Guerin and Weight here too. Wish we had them 5 years ago. However, by the time we are competitive again they will be sipping LI Ice Teas on the porch together. I'm all for having them bring the youth along. But we also have to keep our ears open for "the right offer".

I think that you should trade them even if it is for later rounds. If they are a part of the long term plan they will have a contract. If not they are expendable (depending on RFA/UFA status) because they may leave/retire anyway. Sign them before or trade them unless it really doens't make sense.

If the team is out of playoff contention (as we all know very well is going to happen) than you need to focus on the future. Get rid of the marginal players that are easier to resign (hell, we signed the guys in the first place... We will likely be able to get similar players next time) and bring up any talent from the AHL.

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smittyrules31
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Repeat a lie frequently enough....
A later round pick may be harder to justify, as you have to compare that with the value of keeping them around (i.e., leadership and providing a veteran presence for the kids). It's damn near impossible to quantify things like this but this is where Snow has to earn his $ and the respect that comes with the position. I'd love to see a bunch of players moved at the dealing for picks and/or prospects. But if the market isn't there, or the return is not good enough, it may be that the best trade we make is the one we don't.

Anyway, FWIW, my New Year's wish is to move some of our vets for picks and/prospects and then make an offer to one or two UFA vets that can fill the same role. If it happens to be Guerin and Witt again, so be it. I wonder what the possibility of a player-ass't coach role would be?

Id also like to see Snow be a bit more aggressive, though not overly so. Especially with Comrie. If he continues to perform, make an offer prior to the deadline. 3 or 4 years at 3 or 3.5 million. If he doesn't accept, move him.
Authority without wisdom is like a heavy axe without an edge: fitter to bruise than polish.

Anger makes dull men witty, but it keeps them poor.

In the beginning, the Universe was created. This made a lot of people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.
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Snowday
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If Weight keeps his pace, he can fetch a first rounder because he has Cup experience. If I had to guess right now I'd say Calgary or Washington would be interested after Wash gets rid of Nylander. Probably projected to be a first round pick somewhere between 20-25 would be my guess.

Oh, and San Jose as well. They are dying for players with Cup experience(ala Claude Lemieux)
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Westfall18
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We are the Loyal Fan Base.
I don't want the Islanders to trade Weight or Guerin, but there not in our long range plans. Guerin and Weight are first class guys..who knows they trade them for picks and we wind up taking them back in a season or so...
The Keeper of All Things Westfall
William H. McCue Sr. 1934-2015 Rest in Peace Poppa.
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dragoneye
Kung Fu Hockey
smittyrules31,Jan 2 2009
05:38 AM
A later round pick may be harder to justify, as you have to compare that with the value of keeping them around (i.e., leadership and providing a veteran presence for the kids). It's damn near impossible to quantify things like this but this is where Snow has to earn his $ and the respect that comes with the position. I'd love to see a bunch of players moved at the dealing for picks and/or prospects. But if the market isn't there, or the return is not good enough, it may be that the best trade we make is the one we don't.

Anyway, FWIW, my New Year's wish is to move some of our vets for picks and/prospects and then make an offer to one or two UFA vets that can fill the same role. If it happens to be Guerin and Witt again, so be it. I wonder what the possibility of a player-ass't coach role would be?

Id also like to see Snow be a bit more aggressive, though not overly so. Especially with Comrie. If he continues to perform, make an offer prior to the deadline. 3 or 4 years at 3 or 3.5 million. If he doesn't accept, move him.

The NHL trade deadline this year is March 4. There are 19 games for us after the deadline. There are 82 games in the season. Those post trade deadline games represent a total of 23% of our season, or nearly 1/4. Would you be willing to sell some of our players and lose the one ice leadership for 1/4 of the season, especially in a year where you want to tank and be in the bottom two of the league?
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Islander4cups
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Snowday,Jan 1 2009
05:17 PM
If Weight keeps his pace, he can fetch a first rounder because he has Cup experience. If I had to guess right now I'd say Calgary or Washington would be interested after Wash gets rid of Nylander. Probably projected to be a first round pick somewhere between 20-25 would be my guess.

Oh, and San Jose as well. They are dying for players with Cup experience(ala Claude Lemieux)

But Washington is very hesitant to give up their first round picks. George McPhee is under orders from owner Leonsis to "keep it young" and you have to have picks in order to do that.

I don't see the Crapitals giving away a first round pick on an aging forward "rental" which is essentially what Weight would be. Additionally, they have Federov who hasn't played due to injury but will be back by the AS break. That is addition without giving up any picks.

Besides, the Crapitals need to add DEFENSE, not offense. They have an undersized defense that is not good in corners or in front of their netminders. They also need a netminder due to the fact that Theodore couldn't stop traffic if he brought a naked Heidi Klum with him.

and didn't SJ just trade for Weight last season and then forget to use him? Doubt that's happening again.
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smittyrules31
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Repeat a lie frequently enough....
dragoneye,Jan 1 2009
11:41 PM
smittyrules31,Jan 2 2009
05:38 AM
A later round pick may be harder to justify, as you have to compare that with the value of keeping them around (i.e., leadership and providing a veteran presence for the kids).  It's damn near impossible to quantify things like this but this is where Snow has to earn his $ and the respect that comes with the position.  I'd love to see a bunch of players moved at the dealing for picks and/or prospects.  But if the market isn't there, or the return is not good enough, it may be that the best trade we make is the one we don't.

Anyway, FWIW, my New Year's wish is to move some of our vets for picks and/prospects and then make an offer to one or two UFA vets that can fill the same role.  If it happens to be Guerin and Witt again, so be it.  I wonder what the possibility of a player-ass't coach role would be?

Id also like to see Snow be a bit more aggressive, though not overly so.  Especially with Comrie.  If he continues to perform, make an offer prior to the deadline.  3 or 4 years at 3 or 3.5 million.  If he doesn't accept, move him.

The NHL trade deadline this year is March 4. There are 19 games for us after the deadline. There are 82 games in the season. Those post trade deadline games represent a total of 23% of our season, or nearly 1/4. Would you be willing to sell some of our players and lose the one ice leadership for 1/4 of the season, especially in a year where you want to tank and be in the bottom two of the league?

Yes. Especially because of your last question.
Authority without wisdom is like a heavy axe without an edge: fitter to bruise than polish.

Anger makes dull men witty, but it keeps them poor.

In the beginning, the Universe was created. This made a lot of people very angry and has been widely regarded as a bad move.
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Mulefan
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tsharaf,Dec 31 2008
01:52 PM
Webb20,Dec 31 2008
08:32 AM
Keep Guerin and Weight, and package Witt and Comrie.  :thumbsup:

I'd say you trade Weight, but not Guerin. Here's why: In the off-season, just like this past one, Guerin will lure his best buddy back. Guerin, I believe has a no-trade clause anyway. If so, he has earned an extension.

The others I would trade as well: Comrie, Sillinger, Martinek and reluctantly Witt.

Sillinger needs to play more than 2 games in a row to bring us anything of value, though.

What about cement skate Sutton. I am sick of watching such a huge player with such a reach advantage get beat time and time again. Cairns was a speedster compared to Sutton. He should go before Witt. I don't think Witt is the most talented but he has the heart of a lion and that brushes off on younger players. He reminds me of Rich Pilon. He will skate through a wall for you.
Pete
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Islander4cups
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In Garth I Trust
Mulefan,Jan 1 2009
11:10 PM
tsharaf,Dec 31 2008
01:52 PM
Webb20,Dec 31 2008
08:32 AM
Keep Guerin and Weight, and package Witt and Comrie.  :thumbsup:

I'd say you trade Weight, but not Guerin. Here's why: In the off-season, just like this past one, Guerin will lure his best buddy back. Guerin, I believe has a no-trade clause anyway. If so, he has earned an extension.

The others I would trade as well: Comrie, Sillinger, Martinek and reluctantly Witt.

Sillinger needs to play more than 2 games in a row to bring us anything of value, though.

What about cement skate Sutton. I am sick of watching such a huge player with such a reach advantage get beat time and time again. Cairns was a speedster compared to Sutton. He should go before Witt. I don't think Witt is the most talented but he has the heart of a lion and that brushes off on younger players. He reminds me of Rich Pilon. He will skate through a wall for you.

Who is going to get you more in return...Sutton or Witt? Also, Sutton is on IR and cannot be traded. Who knows if he will be off IR in time to get any team interested in him by the deadline. Plus, both Sutton and Witt have atleast another year on their deals, so it isn't like someone would be taking a flyer on Sutton and can let him walk if he doesn't work out. They'd be stuck with him.
I miss these :cup: :cup: :cup: :cup: and want more of them
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