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Regional news - Tension escalates between Emilia and Torquelas - the nations of New Erussia, Wolven Peoples and New Queensland rise in Khanalia
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Population and Military Stats
Topic Started: Dec 25 2011, 11:35 AM (532 Views)
Torquelas
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As we all know, the NationStates populations are ridiculous. Most experienced nations have population in the billions, and even new nations go from nothing to superpower in a matter of weeks. And this just isn't realistic. So, when we roleplay, we use a rigid, unchanging population of a realistic level.

The easiest way to come up with a realistic population, but one still big enough to provide a sizable military, is to:
1) Take the population of the countries your nation covers on the map.
2) Add them all up.
3) Multiply that number by a (reasonable sounding) number between 1 and 2.
4) To make sure this doesn't make your nation bursting at the seams, take the total approximate area of your nation.
5) Divide your population by your area. If the number that comes out is above 500, I'd knock down your population a few million.

Here's an example:
1)The United Socialist States of Torquelas covers Finland, a very small part of Russia, half of Poland, a small part of Ukraine, the Baltic states, Slovakia and Hungary.
2) If I say the total population = Finland+Baltic states+Poland+Slovakia+Hungary, then the total population = approximately 74 million.
3) I decided this isn't much for a nation of such a size, and bumped the population up to 140 million.
4) The approximate area of Torquelas is 1.2 million square kilometers.
5) This makes the population density 74 million divided by 1.2 million, which equals 116.666667 people per square kilometer, a very reasonable density, somewhere between Portugal and Syria, and a bit more than mainland France.

If you're having trouble calculating a population, then just give me a buzz, and I'm very willing to draw one up for you.

Now, the second thing you need to do is decide on the size of your military. This is comparatively easier. Your military should be anywhere between 1% and 3% of your population (anything more has a serious detriment on your economy, and is just plain unfair). Remember, the less people in your military, the higher quality your soldiers. The second thing to do is calculate how many of these are active troops, rather than support or reserve, which is incredibly easy; we're just saying that one third of your total military is active.

The third thing, which you don't need to do, is have a GDP calculated. Basically, this will outline how much you spend on stuff (including military, thus showing the quality of your soldiers) according to your set population. This is basically what I will do with your GDP:

1) Take your GDP from NSEconomy, NationStates' premium economy calculator.
2) Multiply it by your "population multiplier". Your population multiplier is basically your set Khanalia population divided by your NS population. Your population multiplier is very important, and will be used in a lot of different equations and activities in the future. You will get a new one, and thus a new GDP and troop effectiveness, every month.

Here's how Torquelas's GDP works out:

1) My GDP according to NSEconomy is $180,572,987,407.91.
2) My population multiplier is 140 million divided by 26 million (as of Christmas Day, 2011), which equals 5.38461538. Therefore, my GDP equals $180,572,987,407.91 times 5.38461538, which equals $972,316,085,000 (approximately).

If you're interested, this brings my military spending to $58,657,964,300, and my military spending per soldier to $17,457.7275

So, if you would like to apply for a population and military size, and a GDP to be calculated. please fill out a form in the following manner:

Quote:
 
Torquelas

Population: 140,000,000
Population density (non-mandatory): 116.666667/sq.km
Percent of population in military: 2.4%
Military size: 3,360,000
Active strength (non-support/non-reserve)(1/3): 1,120,000 men
Divisions of 20,000 each: 56


If you're feeling like it, you can draw up how many divisions will be army, navy, airforce and whatever other military force you wish to have. If you choose to do that, I might draw you up a military map, if I can get around to it.

Approved stats:

Quote:
 
Torquelas - last update 2/1/12

Population: 140,000,000
Population density: 116.666667/sq.km
GDP: $972,316,085,000
GDP per capita: $6,945.11
Percent of population in military: 2.4%
Military size: 3,360,000
Active strength (non-support/non-reserve)(1/3): 1,120,000 men
Divisions of 20,000 each: 56
Defense budget: $223,632,699,550 (23%)
Defense spending per soldier: $66,557.35


Wolven Peoples - last update 1/1/12

Population: 30,700,000
Population density: 97.7919/sq.km
GDP: $217,226,446,000
GDP per capita: $7,075.78
Percent of population in military: 3%
Military size: 921,000
Active strength (non-support/non-reserve): 307,000
Divisions of 20,000: 20 (40 Tumans)
Defense budget: $36,928,495,820 (17%)
Defense spending per soldier: $40,096.09

New Erussia - last update 3/1/12

Population: 150,000,000
GDP: $727,277,595,000
GDP per capita: $4,848.52
Percent of population in military: 2.5%
Military size: 3,750,000
Active strength (non-support/non-reserve)(1/3): 1,250,000 men
Divisions of 20,000 each: 62
Defense budget: $178,148,687,000 (25%)
Defense spending per soldier: $47,506.32


Emilia - non-player nation - last update 25/12/11

Population: 65,000,000
Population density: 254.901961/sq.km
GDP: $400,000,000,000
GDP per capita: $6,153.85
Percent of population in military: 2.8%
Military size: 1,820,000
Active strength (non-support/non-reserve)(1/3): 606,667
Divisions of 20,000 each: 30
Defense budget: $80,000,000,000 (20%)
Defense spending per soldier: $43,956.04
Edited by Torquelas, Jan 3 2012, 08:40 PM.
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New Erussia

The population system is going to be hard to use no matter what, its hard to get any sort of accurate information as far as population goes. So I'll diff be needing help with getting some population figures.

As for the Military in another region I use to be in that had a Military RP we used a points system based on your current NS Population. For instance,

New Erussian Pop: 5.282
New Erussian Points: 5282

So I would have 5,282 points to use to buy military units. Each purchase was in the sum of 1 Division so when a mock set may look like so:

Ex:

New Erussian Army
Army Points:1950
1st Infantry Division (100)
2nd Infantry Division (100)
3rd Infantry Division (100)
1st Armored Division (250)
2nd Armored Division (250)
3rd Armored Division (250)
1st Mechanized Division (150)
2st Mechanized Division (150)
1st Artillery Division (300)
2nd Artillery Division (300)

New Erussian Missile Corp.
Missile Corp Points: 1500
Nuclear Missile (Strigon IV Nuke) (1000)
Anti ICBM Battery: 500

Then you would do the same thing for an Air Force, Navy, and Special Operations Units. They also had where you had to get Generals to lead your Army's and their ranks were based on how much points you were willing to put towards them. For instance a 3-Star General for your Army may costed 300 points but if he went against a 5-Star General for 500 points chances were the 5-Star General would win the battle.

Battles were determined by using the points system the one with the most points usually won. However I always felt that gave way too much advantage to the larger nations. So I would have opted for a system where the Points where used to an extent then use the "RISK" method of rolling dice to determine which "Divisions" where destroyed and which won the battle.

Just a suggestion :)
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Torquelas
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Thanks for your suggestion, Drecq. I was thinking of a RISK sort of system; I've come up with all these various formulas and factors that influence your "score", such as number of men, quality of men, geographical advantage, quality of roleplay and a random, die-decided factor. The difference between the two scores would dictate who won the battle, how many men were killed, injured, captured and retreated on either side, as well as how many installations, vehicles, aircraft and ships would be destroyed.

I do think the NSpopulation to points system is unfair; a NationStates nation's strength should not be judged on their size, but on their experience, their way with words and their knowledge of military tactics (mine are fairly poor, to be honest). I've been involved in a region that uses a similar system to the one I have proposed, and although the rules of war are a lot looser, the system works really well; all nations have the means to be evenly matched, as long as their NS spending is used to their advantage.
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New Erussia

My problem is I always wanted to make the Military System too complex by bringing in things like Strength (STR), Defense (DEF) so your thing would be like:

Infantry Division
Pts. 100
STR: 10
DEF: 5

or something of that nature but then you have to start creating variables because after a while you would simply start throwing equally matched Armies at each other and yeah then you would be having a lot of DRAW battles lol. Which means a stalemate lol.
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Torquelas
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I think if you keep it simple enough, it works okay. I'm gonna play with some formulas over the next few days, put in some variables, and see if it spits out realistic results.
At first, the deciding factors in a war would be the quality of your roleplay and pure luck. However, once the war began to progress, and a side was a few divisions short of the other, then it would come down more to your soldier quality and how many men you could actually commit to a single battle.
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New Erussia

Well I usually RP War in a couple of Different ways, I use the Journal method sometimes or the "In Character Method". I usually use Journal to explain things happening either prior or after a battle usually starting with something like

Citagrad
0809hrs
5th Mechanized Division
D Company (Crazy 8's Unit)

*story starts*

something like that, I seem to have a lot of good happenings that way.
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Torquelas
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That's exactly what I do! I'm quite fond of the "perspective hat" method, where you write it like a story; not only is it engaging on several levels, but I find I can communicate exactly how the battle went on a lot better.
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New Erussia

Torquelas
Dec 27 2011, 06:10 PM
That's exactly what I do! I'm quite fond of the "perspective hat" method, where you write it like a story; not only is it engaging on several levels, but I find I can communicate exactly how the battle went on a lot better.
I agree, I like getting as in depth as possible *thats the writer side of me coming out* but I will admit I have days where I can't type very much lol.
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Wolven Peoples
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Population: 50,700,000
Area: 314,000 sq km
Pop. Density: 161.4649 per sq km
% of pop. in military: 3%
Military: 1,521,000
Active military: 500,000
Divisions of 20,000: 25 (50 Tumans)
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Torquelas
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Your numbers are approved, Wolven Peoples. If you have any ideas on a different system, or if you like the sounds of the current one, then don't hesitate to post.
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