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Annihilation Barge vs. Night Scythe
Topic Started: Jul 22 2014, 04:32 PM (268 Views)
Jaba San
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I'm trying to develop a list for Torney that I have coming up and I have enough money to add one piece to my collection for this spcific list.

My list will consist of:

2 Ghost Arcs

2 CCB's

2 Annihilation Barges
and
1 Night Scythe

My question is should I add a Night Scythe or another annihilation barge to this list.
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SurrenderAndDie
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Lychguard
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Jaba San
Jul 22 2014, 04:32 PM
I'm trying to develop a list for Torney that I have coming up and I have enough money to add one piece to my collection for this spcific list.

My list will consist of:

2 Ghost Arcs

2 CCB's

2 Annihilation Barges
and
1 Night Scythe

My question is should I add a Night Scythe or another annihilation barge to this list.
It depends on what you want.... More firepower or more mobility?

Plus, what's the tourney list point limit?
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Jaba San
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It the 1500pt feast of blades quailifier
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Unholyllama
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Lord
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I tend to favor Night Scythes; however, they are only Dedicated Transports with a minimum tax of 65pts (for a min squad of warriors). So it's not a straight 90 vs 100pt comparison but 90 vs 165pts. Likewise, you can't take 2 DTs for 1 squad.

The other item to remember is Night Scythes are zooming flyers and have to come on via reserves. This isn't a bad thing if you can mitigate the randomness of reserve rolls (i.e. comms relay, lucky strategy trait, or Orikan) but can also leave you in a bad position if your dice refuse to bring it on until turn 4.

The benefit about the scythe is that it is more reliable against flyers. Annihilation barges are decent against flyers due to being twin linked and tesla; however, we have all had those rolls where we roll 0 6's even after the reroll. Scythes don't need the 6s so can yield a more dependable anti-air model.

So my take depends on the situation.
- You are tight on points - Barge
- You have a lot of Nid, Wolves, and Chaos players in your group - Scythe
- You can manage reserves - Scythe
- You are losing first blood a lot - Barge (additional early threat).
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Jaba San
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Due to the fact that the night scythe and the Annihilation barge have the same primary weapon, I was struggling more with the addition of another flier that can move an ob-sec unit around the boarb quickly or the durability of a AV 13 skimmer with jink
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Olfgund
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I would add another question
what would be carried in by the nightscythe ? It might come in empty in unbound list but then I would prefer another barge available turn 1
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Unholyllama
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Jaba San
 
Due to the fact that the night scythe and the Annihilation barge have the same primary weapon, I was struggling more with the addition of another flier that can move an ob-sec unit around the boarb quickly or the durability of a AV 13 skimmer with jink


Given the 90 degree turning limit on the Night Scythe, the likelihood of the number of embarking, disembarking that needs to happen to make night scythes worthwhile in that aspect wouldn't be advisable. it CAN be done but remember, when the unit embarks, you're removing a full unit from shooting that turn until it disembarks the following turn. While the 5-man warrior drop was a decent strategy in 5th and early 6th, it has lost some of its effectiveness in 7th (in my opinion).

From my experiences, eternal war missions are about the same but accentuate objective secure more than maelstrom missions. Maelstrom missions tend to focus on "how do I achieve my cards/tasks this turn" instead of truly controlling objectives or destroying my enemy outright. The exception to this is Control Lost which requires you to control objectives in general.

So from all of that - I would recommend an Annihilation barge for you. Good fire power plus can still control an objective against many units.

One thing to keep in mind too - Formations and even some new detachments do not get objective secured. The new Ork codex and supplements have different formations and FOCs that don't have objective secure and work well. I suspect the Space Wolves will have a FoC w/o Objective Secured as well next month. They can always take the CAD from the BRB but for the armies that aren't objective secured, they can still do REALLY well with different strategies and focuses.
Olfgund
Jul 22 2014, 05:12 PM
I would add another question
what would be carried in by the nightscythe ? It might come in empty in unbound list but then I would prefer another barge available turn 1
From my understanding, you still can't take a DT w/o the purchasing it as an upgrade to a unit....even in unbound. Battle forged or unbound, it can arrive empty (the unit is deployed separately) but you'd still need to pay for a unit to get the transport upgrade. Same goes for Royal Courts - army lists are still bound to the restrictions of general list building but there's no FoC to prevent you from taking 15 fast attack units.
Edited by Unholyllama, Jul 22 2014, 05:34 PM.
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Olfgund
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Unholyllama
Jul 22 2014, 05:31 PM
From my understanding, you still can't take a DT w/o the purchasing it as an upgrade to a unit....even in unbound. Battle forged or unbound, it can arrive empty (the unit is deployed separately) but you'd still need to pay for a unit to get the transport upgrade.
I read again the dedicated transport section and the unbound description ... Not sure... The unbound text does say we can "pick anything from our collection" and no much more in term of clarification.
I haven't updated my battles scribe yet, don't know what it allows in unbound list
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