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| Going up against Chaos, Grey Knights or Nids this Sunday; Need help with tactics | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: Aug 7 2014, 11:34 PM (201 Views) | |
| Overlord_Tarekh | Aug 7 2014, 11:34 PM Post #1 |
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Canoptek Scarab
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Pretty much what the title says. I've got a 1500-1850 pt army, and am pretty new to 40k. So far, I've had my ass handed to me every game, but hopefully with ya'lls advice I can make a comeback. I've got: 1 overlord 1 cryptek CCB/AB GA/DA 20 warriors 10 immortals w/ tesla 1 spyder 5 scarab bases 5 wraiths I'm considering getting 5 deathmarks tomorrow I was thinking about making the overlord Trollzyn if I face nids, Anrakyr for the others For the Chaos army; hes a pro player with years of experience. I have very little chance of beating him, but we'll see. I was thinking of putting Anrakyr in the CCB and flying him near enough to the 2nd in line of tank things (dunno what theyre called; he has 3 small ones and 1 large one) and using MitM to disable/explode the first in line, then utilize the DA to take out the rear. from there, pelt the middle tanks with gauss till they explode. Then i dunno. For Nids, I get defeated within the first 3 turns so I have no clue what to do besides rely on Trollzyn to use Empathic Obliterate on most of his army and try like hell not to get in CC. For Grey knights, I've never actually played them, so I have no idea what to do. Any advice would be appreciated! |
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| OhLongJohnson | Aug 8 2014, 01:02 AM Post #2 |
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Cryptek
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Hey there, here some general advice: Knowing the opponents army is KEY to win, so dont be shy to ask EVERYTHING before the game begins. Which unit has which special rules? Which unit does have meltas/ melta bombs? Which unit has HIt&run? How fast can each of the opponents unit move? What weapons do they have? Dont get surprised by that stuff in mid-game! Some opponents hesitate to explain you everything (as they dont want to reveal their "secrets"). Dont let them hide anything from you. CCB: If you choose to use the CCB, watch it carefully. Dont get it tarpitted with units that can bound it in CC all game long. So do the information-thing: be shure to find out the possible charge ranges of your opponents units. This includes 6'' or 12''? Fleet? Special rules?. Stuff like that. Your CCB is there to take out the big targets...vehicles, MCs...so dont get it tarpitted. You dont always have to get to the opponent as fast as possible, sometimes its better to wait and strike on some flank, where the CCB can create some chaos. If the CCB gets caught and tarpitted, try to free it with your wraiths...wraiths do great especially against those targets that tend to tarpit the CCB. On the other hand, you may use your CCB to free warriors that are caught in combat. If they are caught in combat (and survived the enemies CC-phase) the CCB can charge the enemies unit. Then choose to fail morale with the necronwarriors after your CC-phase. As the opponent is still in CC with the CCB, he will not be able to sweep advance your warriors That said: Another thing thats always worth considering is sacrificing a unit. Lets say the opponent charged one of your necron-warrior-units, and your unit remains with just a few (like 2-3) models...choose to fail morale! This way your unit will probably get swept, but in your next shooting turn you may shoot at the opponents unit. If you dont choose to fail morale, the opponent may kill the warriors in YOUR CC-Phase...and will then be able to charge another unit his next turn! As for the cryptek: You may convert him into Harbinger of despair and give him a veil of darkness. Then stick him into the deathmark unit you want to buy, or stick him into a unit of warriors to evacuate them when the Nids are close. As for Wraiths: Do they have whip coils? You want whip coils in there. at least 2-3. As for the Scarabs: You may choose to hide them till they grow a bit (do you have additional bases to let them grow? Or will your opponent allow you to use empty bases as scarabs?? ) |
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| C'tan_you_dig_it? | Aug 8 2014, 02:11 AM Post #3 |
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Immortal
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I also regularly play with a decades long player who has won large tournaments. The key there is: have him teach you! If he's any thing like my friend he's bored of always winning and wants to build himself some competition. Try out low point games first. For one, you'll have an advantage over the expensive space marine units. Secondly, focusing on just a few units at a time will teach you their strengths and weaknesses. The big games are fun, but for a beginning player there's too much to watch and you won't even recognize the tactical errors you are making. |
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| Secundum | Aug 8 2014, 02:34 AM Post #4 |
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Phaeron
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Per the latest FAQ, only Overlords can take the CCB-not special characters. |
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| Olfgund | Aug 8 2014, 04:57 PM Post #5 |
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Praetorian
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Couldn't agree more with C'tan-you dig it, you have fought against integrated lists with opponents accustomed to those lists. 1000 points games are better to test things. Of the three, I only know nids so here my two cents on going against them: Av13: ghost ark and barge shoud be useful and resilient 5 warriors in the ghost arc, 15 on foot besides within 6" initially to benefit from repair Does the nid players use gaunt swarm? If so, putting an harbinger of the storm with lightning shield with either the foot warrior or immortal will sour any nid charge attempts Keep your 5 wraiths close, don't rush them up board, they are best as counter charge rather than pure charge against cc armies. Classic Overlord (SW, RO, WS, Mss) with one of the two foot slogging units. I'd use the same unit as stormtek to give cryptek sacrifial option in case of strong challengers. And keep having fun ! |
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| Overlord_Tarekh | Aug 10 2014, 01:21 AM Post #6 |
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Canoptek Scarab
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Thanks for the advice! Gaunt swarm? No idea. What do you mean by "cryptek sacrificial option"? |
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| Olfgund | Aug 10 2014, 02:07 AM Post #7 |
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Praetorian
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One nid classic build is to have very large amount of small cheap troops ("gaunts) that are individually easy to kill but they come in swarm. You just gun them down or go after synapse creature. In close combat, if a very nasty cc beast challenges you, you have to respond to the challenge with a "character" but not necessarily your main overlord. If the challengers has tons of attacks, Ap2 and such, you can send a cryptek (also a character) from the same unit instead, keeping your overlord safe and yet able to participate in the combat. I had one case (6 th ed rules however) where the heroic cryptek kept rue animating after each assault phases in which was killed! |
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| Quinten87 | Aug 11 2014, 06:13 AM Post #8 |
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Lychguard
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I face grey knights more than any other army in the game and have even played them a few times so I know the codex inside out. Take the doomsday ark if you play grey knights as these blow up pretty much anything he can throw at you. He will most likely take either a MEQ army or a deepstrike army. If he takes MEQ you should focus on destroying the vehicles with your warriors and then using the doomsday ark to blow up the survivors. Resist the temptation to use the doomsday ark to blow up vehicles as it is much better served against his 2++/3++ saves. I personally like taking monoliths against grey knights as they have a tough time against vehicles. If you are facing a deepstrike army make sure to spread your guys out (use that full 2") and use the terrain to your advantage to prevent him from deepstriking where he wants to. Try to keep all your units together so he can't pick off stragglers with his deepstriking units. Deathmarks are a good way to deal with a dreadknight as nothing in your army right now would provide a consistent way to counter one. Use whipcoils on your wraiths otherwise they will get crushed. One last thing MINDSHACKLE SCARABS - they destroy against grey knights. |
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| Overlord_Tarekh | Aug 14 2014, 02:08 AM Post #9 |
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Canoptek Scarab
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Thanks for all the advice ya'll! Unfortunately, we had to call it after 2 rounds, due to my book club meeting :/. We agreed on a tie. I faced Chaos marines. A summation of the battle as follows: 1,500 points each, 4 objectives. 2 on my side, 1 in the middle, 1 on his side. I'll bring a little imagination into the battle, as you'll see. Forest map, played short style (rather than having to slog toward each other for 2 turns going long ways). lots of debris and cover. I made a mistake upon deployment; put my DA on top of a piece of cover to give a view of the entire map, not knowing his chaos marines had some incredibly long range weapons. 1st turn was his: my DA got taken out instantly first turn by his demon-tank thing. His big demon took off and began flying over my immortals. He got a plus to his demon, making it tough 8, and nigh invincible to everything but my wraiths and C'tan shard. He killed 3 of my warriors with the demon while flying. 2 got back up. After his turn, I was pretty shaken up by the loss of my DA. Marched my warriors w/ stormtek and immortals toward the middle objective. Kept my Spyder guarding the leftmost of my objectives, making scarabs to form a conga line towards the left area, following my wraiths. I waffled on what to do with my Overlord in CCB. Drove him about 8 inches away from my rightmost objective that was behind cover to fire at a couple tanks. Missed. Missed with everything I had on the tanks. 2nd turn: He drove up one of his tanks to claim my right most objective, hiding behind the cover from my CCB. The other tank popped smoke. His demon kept flying above my immortals, tried to fire his demon breath at them, but it didn't go off. He killed 2 of my warriors and my cryptek with a squad peeking between 2 rocks. They got back up. Another squad shot at my advancing wraiths, killing one. His demon tank thing shot at my scarabs, killing one. 2nd my turn: I rushed my CCB back to the objective. Rushed my wraiths to the hapless squad in front of them. Another scarab was born from my spyder to join the line snaking to the middle objective. My warriors, angered at the loss of their teammate, poured fired on the squad hunkered between the two rocks, killing their sgt and 2 of the 5 marines. Meanwhile, the Wraiths spotted the squad firing on them. Fueled by the rage from the loss of their comrade, they rushed the hapless marines. In a panic, the squad fired on them, managing to wound one before the wraiths pounced. It was a complete and utter decimation. No Chaos marine survived the ensuing melee, being torn apart limb from limb by the unsympathetic wraiths. My overlord, filled with hate for the primitive and flimsy tank daring to take an objective from him, sliced it open with his warscythe, totaling it. Afterward, upon seeing the marines piling out of the wreck of a tank, he retreated a modest distance away. After the game, the chaos player suggested that I should have made the CCB an AB, and put the DA behind some cover, giving it a modest amount of firing ability. He also suggested that I should have stuck with either a defensive or offensive play style, rather than playing middle-ground and waffling as much as I did. He admitted that he probably wouldn't have landed his demon, as I had too much stuff that could've conceivably taken him on, such as the C'tan shard or OL. He also suggested that I move my rightmost objective to the center of my army, rather than having it be so far away from the core, and easily taken as it was. So that was my game. Any thoughts, suggestions, or criticisms? |
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