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Azula Quest; A princess is you?
Topic Started: Feb 7 2013, 10:23 PM (38,709 Views)
Chibi-Reaper
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Likely to what by a wha?
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I suppose that this would be the best place to pick this up from.

Definitely going to have to re-create or gather together all of the previous posts, of course.

Story Alone, right from post numero uno.

Azula.

15 years old.

Fourth month, ninth day, of year 100 ASC

Master Firebender [23/6]
-"Butterfly Wings" Fire-flight [3/???]
-"Rocket Boost" Advanced flame propulsion [1/???]
-"Dragon's Breath" burning exhalation [3/???]
-"Advanced Fire Stream" focused fire spout [2/???]
--"Hunting Dragon" Flame Spout Seeking Missile [1/???]
-"Flame Wall" basically that. [1/???]
-"Pinwheel Shot" distance projectile [1/???]
-"Butterfly Swarm" razor-fire butterflies [1/???]
-"Lava Bending" Fortress Killer [1/X]
-"Inner Fire Reinforcement" Self-buff [2/???]
-"Edge Enhance" Sword-buff Flames [1/???]
-"Voice of Command?" ...not what it says on the tin? [1/1?]
Air Bender [4/?]
-"Cold Sky Fire" Lighting manipulation. [4/???]
--"???" Force Lightning Taser? [1/???]
--"???" Electro-Net. [1/???]
Advanced Etiquette [2/2?]
Spiritualism [3/3?]
Leadership [6/???]
Politics [6/???]
"Agressive Self Defense" [3/???]
-Unpleasant Surprises [2/?]
Strategy [4/???]
Logistics [2/???]
Second Child Arts [1/???]
Somewhat Cultured [4/???]
Basic Trading Knowledge [2/???]

Creepy child.
Praise the Sun.
Fire Good.
... Jealous. So jealous.
Once burned, twice....?
Tea-sipper.
Ruby Butterfly.
Divine Right of Kings?
Cap'n Jin.
Toph Customer, or some other pun.
Old Man of the Mountain: Not Your Buddy.
Lotus Initiate.
Raijin Approves. Fuujin... not so much.
Edited by Chibi-Reaper, Feb 9 2013, 06:48 PM.
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ScAvenger001
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Hey wait, didn't Zuko go on a tour of all the air temples as the first step of his search for the Avatar after his banishment? Wouldn't he have encountered Pathik already? At the least we could ask him for suggestions on next moves, since he's got the most recent experience with air temples and their contents.
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Yog
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ScAvenger001
Feb 11 2013, 02:09 PM
Hey wait, didn't Zuko go on a tour of all the air temples as the first step of his search for the Avatar after his banishment? Wouldn't he have encountered Pathik already? At the least we could ask him for suggestions on next moves, since he's got the most recent experience with air temples and their contents.
Actually, that's a good point.

And suddenly I suspect that one of the options Iroh mentioned about our spiritual training is sending us to Pathik.

Which is why I think that before we write to Aang we should speak with Iroh.
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Alratan
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Earth-Destroyer
Feb 11 2013, 12:11 PM
You can just as easily make an argument that the spirits interference, at the airtemples, requires Azula to go meet Aang their to prevent them from having freedom to influence events.
I don't think that's how spirits think. Remember how when we were first introduced to spirits it was explained that they generally only respond to what's right in front of them. Out of sight, out of mind. If we're not there, the spirits are much less likely to interfere. That's just not how they seem to work.

The example of the mountain shepherds seems an appropriate one.

On the general subject of Airbending, in the moment of her success, hearing her own Voice, Azula needs to consider what freedom means for her. All her life, Azula has struggled for the greatest freedom of all, the freedom of thought, to rise above what she was born as and not be a slave to her instincts.

She wants the substance of freedom, compared to which, what the Air Nomads embraced was merely the illusion of it. The Air Monks, as we know from Aang, where slaves to their natures. They were not free, merely blown on unseen winds, incapable of choosing to stay in one place long.

Azula, however, has chosen to be free in a way the air nomads never were. This is the freedom of Raijin, the freedom that comes with the strength to throw off the chains that destiny imposed with both nature and nurture. This is the core of what she learned in channeling lightning, of the importance of calm, of controlling your desires, and then of making the choice to act, and unleash the lightning.

All this is why I think we need to develop our own bending style for what Raijin blessed us with. The Air Nomad style is just unsuitable for Azuka.
Edited by Alratan, Feb 11 2013, 04:22 PM.
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Nightblade
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Okay let's have Azula mediate on Freedom
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Yog
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Alratan
Feb 11 2013, 02:14 PM
I don't think that's how spirits think. Remember how when we were first introduced to spirits it was explained that they generally only respond to what's right in front of them. Out of sight, out of mind. If we're not there, the spirits are much less likely to interfere. That's just not how they seem to work.

The example of the mountain shepherds seems an appropriate one.

On the general subject of Airbending, Azula needs to consider what freedom means for her. All her life, Azula has struggled for the greatest freedom of all, the freedom of thought, to rise above what she was born as and not be a slave to her instincts.

She wants the substance of freedom, compared to which, what the Air Nomads embraced was merely the illusion of it. The Air Monks, as we know from Aang, where slaves to their natures. They were not free, merely blown on unseen winds, incapable of choosing to stay in one place long.

Azula, however, has chosen to be free in a way the air nomads never were. This is the freedom of Raijin, the freedom that comes with the strength to throw off the chains that destiny imposed with both nature and nurture. This is the core of what she learned in channeling lightning, of the importance of calm, of controlling your desires, and then of making the choice to act, and unleash the lightning.

All this
That thinking seems to be the feature of Navi, not spirits in general.

Fuujin still weeps for his nomads and still hates us for one. Wai Shi Tong certainly isn't out of sight out of mind kind of guy.

And then yhere js not our buddy. We certainly are out of his sight.

Also, I think that you are overstating the danger of spirits. They can arrange things, somewhat, yes, but not on the minute notice.

The almost civil war situation was worked on for decades, with us acting as a spark.

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Yog
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Nightblade
Feb 11 2013, 02:18 PM
Okay let's have Azula mediate on Freedom
I think that the first and most important meditation Azula needs to do right mkw is on her self identity. On who and what she is, fully and in detail. Necause her identity is shifting, and she is repressing, and she needs to find inner balance and harmony.

I can see this meditation like this (combination with other suggestions) deserted island somewhere private, no one around. Deep meditation. Azula speaks to herself, in Voice of Command, concentrating on what she is saying, listening to it (this is a mantra to chant, basically): "I am Azula, daughter of Ozai and Ursa, granddaughter of Azulon, descendant of Sozin and Roku, kin of dragons. Sister and betrothed of Zuko. White Lotus leaf, spreader of knowledge, Future of the Fire Nations. Firebender, held firmly by Agni, airbender, favored by Raijin. Bound together with Yosei. Struggler against destiny."

I think this may help us.

Or get us a meeting with Lion Turtle if we are lucky.
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ryuan
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Alratan
Feb 11 2013, 02:14 PM
I don't think that's how spirits think. Remember how when we were first introduced to spirits it was explained that they generally only respond to what's right in front of them. Out of sight, out of mind. If we're not there, the spirits are much less likely to interfere. That's just not how they seem to work.

The example of the mountain shepherds seems an appropriate one.

On the general subject of Airbending, Azula needs to consider what freedom means for her. All her life, Azula has struggled for the greatest freedom of all, the freedom of thought, to rise above what she was born as and not be a slave to her instincts.

She wants the substance of freedom, compared to which, what the Air Nomads embraced was merely the illusion of it. The Air Monks, as we know from Aang, where slaves to their natures. They were not free, merely blown on unseen winds, incapable of choosing to stay in one place long.

Azula, however, has chosen to be free in a way the air nomads never were. This is the freedom of Raijin, the freedom that comes with the strength to throw off the chains that destiny imposed with both nature and nurture. This is the core of what she learned in channeling lightning, of the importance of calm, of controlling your desires, and then of making the choice to act, and unleash the lightning.

All this is why I think we need to develop our own bending style for what Raijin blessed us with. The Air Nomad style is just unsuitable for Azuka.
You get all my likes, damn it!
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Zasnul
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Alratan
Feb 11 2013, 02:14 PM
I don't think that's how spirits think. Remember how when we were first introduced to spirits it was explained that they generally only respond to what's right in front of them. Out of sight, out of mind. If we're not there, the spirits are much less likely to interfere. That's just not how they seem to work.

The example of the mountain shepherds seems an appropriate one.

On the general subject of Airbending, Azula needs to consider what freedom means for her. All her life, Azula has struggled for the greatest freedom of all, the freedom of thought, to rise above what she was born as and not be a slave to her instincts.

She wants the substance of freedom, compared to which, what the Air Nomads embraced was merely the illusion of it. The Air Monks, as we know from Aang, where slaves to their natures. They were not free, merely blown on unseen winds, incapable of choosing to stay in one place long.

Azula, however, has chosen to be free in a way the air nomads never were. This is the freedom of Raijin, the freedom that comes with the strength to throw off the chains that destiny imposed with both nature and nurture. This is the core of what she learned in channeling lightning, of the importance of calm, of controlling your desires, and then of making the choice to act, and unleash the lightning.

All this is why I think we need to develop our own bending style for what Raijin blessed us with. The Air Nomad style is just unsuitable for Azuka.
Wow.

You rolled natural twenty, it seems.

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Aranfan
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Alratan
Feb 11 2013, 02:14 PM
On the general subject of Airbending, Azula needs to consider what freedom means for her. All her life, Azula has struggled for the greatest freedom of all, the freedom of thought, to rise above what she was born as and not be a slave to her instincts.

She wants the substance of freedom, compared to which, what the Air Nomads embraced was merely the illusion of it. The Air Monks, as we know from Aang, where slaves to their natures. They were not free, merely blown on unseen winds, incapable of choosing to stay in one place long.

Azula, however, has chosen to be free in a way the air nomads never were. This is the freedom of Raijin, the freedom that comes with the strength to throw off the chains that destiny imposed with both nature and nurture. This is the core of what she learned in channeling lightning, of the importance of calm, of controlling your desires, and then of making the choice to act, and unleash the lightning.

All this is why I think we need to develop our own bending style for what Raijin blessed us with. The Air Nomad style is just unsuitable for Azuka.
Wow. I really miss the Like button here.

Azula should meditate on this.
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Alratan
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Yog
Feb 11 2013, 02:22 PM
That thinking seems to be the feature of Navi, not spirits in general.

Fuujin still weeps for his nomads and still hates us for one. Wai Shi Tong certainly isn't out of sight out of mind kind of guy.

And then yhere js not our buddy. We certainly are out of his sight.

Also, I think that you are overstating the danger of spirits. They can arrange things, somewhat, yes, but not on the minute notice.

The almost civil war situation was worked on for decades, with us acting as a spark.
It's apparently a general feature of spirits, as it was described to us before we even met Navi. It was explained to us that:

You learn that, despite this, most spirits do not move far from where they know. The spirit of a grand mountain may look down upon a village in the valley being sacked and burned, and so long as the mountain sheperds, who it knows, are not touched where it can see them, it will not lift a finger. The valley is not the demense of a spirit of the mountain's peak.

You learn, more than that, how spirits behave. Think. A spirit is alien, wholly. It does not forgive. If appeased, it will forget that it had been crossed in the first place, and usually return to its own business, ignoring the human world. For the most part. But it does not forgive those who have crossed it.


Based on this, I really don't fancy visiting the air temples. They are incapable of letting this go. We haven't appeased them, after all, so they'll still hate her and want to kill us.
Edited by Alratan, Feb 11 2013, 03:35 PM.
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Pipeman
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Alratan
Feb 11 2013, 02:14 PM
snip
I still think we need to get Aang's input on airbending first.

Not only because there could and should be more to bending than the proper mindset, but because all Azula has right now, is the basic air-freedom correlation and going from that straight into pseudo-philosophical contemplations about the nature of freedom seems horribly OOC for her.

Doing this stuff, if at all, after she gets Aang's input and it just doesn't work for her seems far more IC for her to do.
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Alratan
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Feb 11 2013, 03:38 PM
Alratan
Feb 11 2013, 02:14 PM
snip
I still think we need to get Aang's input on airbending first.

Not only because there could and should be more to bending than the proper mindset, but because all Azula has right now, is the basic air-freedom correlation and going from that straight into pseudo-philosophical contemplations about the nature of freedom seems horribly OOC for her.

Doing this stuff, if at all, after she gets Aang's input and it just doesn't work for her seems far more IC for her to do.
Azula has all the information she needs to put this together. She's been taught the calm->decision lightning bend style, she's heard Aang tell her he can't stay in one place by her nature, she's struggled with her own nature all her life, and after Ran and Sho rejected her she had her dark night of the soul to prompt such existentialist thoughts. She's also just had a moment of insight and used the Voice of Command to vocalise it. If any moment is appropriate for a breakthrough, it's this. Remember that Azula's meant to be a genius.

Instead you want to ignore the opportunity to build on this, and rely on someone else. I think Asuka asking Aang for help is really very OOC myself, but hey.

I think going to Aang first would make it actively harder to get to insights like this, as rather than starting from scratch she'd be actively heading in the wrong direction, and she'd be getting frustrated with trying and failing, which will prompt the exact opposite mind set to what she needs to develop this.

I also think that telling Aang that the Fire Nation has now stolen airbending from his people, and that Azula's now here to pretty much literally rob their grave of techniques so she can learn to defile their legacy by killing people with it is likely to go rather less well than people expect. Whatever we say, that's how he's going to hear it.

Remember his reaction to Toph and Azula flying.
Edited by Alratan, Feb 11 2013, 04:02 PM.
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Pipeman
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Alratan
Feb 11 2013, 03:55 PM
Azula has all the information she needs to put this together. She's been taught the calm->decision lightning bend style, she's heard Aang tell her he can't stay in one place by her nature, she's struggled with her own nature all her life, and after Ran and Sho rejected her she had her dark night of the soul to prompt such existentialist thoughts. She's also just had a moment of insight and used the Voice of Command to vocalise it. If any moment is appropriate for a breakthrough, it's this.

Instead you want to ignore the opportunity to build on this, and rely on someone else. I think Asuka asking Aang for help is really very OOC myself, but hey.

I think going to Aang first would make it actively harder to get to insights like this, as rather than starting from scratch she'd be actively heading in the wrong direction, and she'd be getting frustrated with trying and failing, which will prompt the exact opposite mind set to what she needs to develop this.

I also think that telling Aang that the Fire Nation has now stolen airbending from his people, and that Azula's now here to pretty much literally rob their grave of techniques so she can learn to defile their legacy by killing people with it is likely to go rather less well than people expect. Whatever we say, that's how he's going to hear it.

Remember his reaction to Toph and Azula flying.
My main problem with this is, that Azula just doesn't seem like the kind of person to grow spiritually by sitting on her ass and meditating over shit.

She works best, when she has some kind of opposition to fight against, when she is confronted with a position that she just can't stand and disagrees with on a fundamental level.

In a way, she grows as a person out of pure spite, like with those asshole dragons.

I simply can't see her doing this any other way and, in my opinion, going to meet Aang will not make her head into the wrong direction but rather make her all the more determined to do this her way.

That and I simply don't believe that Aang can teach her nothing at all about airbending.
Ther has to be more aboout it than getting into the proper mindset.
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Hymn of Ragnarok
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Honestly, if we meet Aang neart the Mechanist and all the people on gliders, I expect him to look between us. On one side, power of airbending. On the other side, spirit of airbending.

Pretty good chance of him falling on the latter's side, and saying the spirit of the art is more important and that he doesn't want to teach us things we'll only use to kill.

We can tell Aang that we intend to use it to advance our studies of Lightning into new heights, not necessarily lethal either, and we want to learn airbending, but we aren't really planning to use it for peaceful resolutions. Sure, we can say we want to fly better. Dodge. New lightning usage. But murder for fun and profit is also on our list of things to do.
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Alratan
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Feb 11 2013, 04:03 PM
My main problem with this is, that Azula just doesn't seem like the kind of person to grow spiritually by sitting on her ass and meditating over shit.

She works best, when she has some kind of opposition to fight against, when she is confronted with a position that she just can't stand and disagrees with on a fundamental level.


I'm not proposing meditation. I'm saying that Azula should experience a moment of satori as a result of her victory over the Joo Dee's brainwashing and hearing her own insight spoken with the Voice of Command.

Pipeman
Feb 11 2013, 04:03 PM
In a way, she grows as a person out of pure spite, like with those asshole dragons.


Some of the biggest personal growth Azula has seen, like recognising Zuko was hurt by having to execute Jet, and offering what comfort she could afterwards, have had nothing whatsoever to do with spite.

Pipeman
Feb 11 2013, 04:03 PM
I simply can't see her doing this any other way and, in my opinion, going to meet Aang will not make her head into the wrong direction but rather make her all the more determined to do this her way.


I think it will make her furious with herself, feed the insecurity she's been developing about her bending, rattling her inner dragon's cage, and make it even harder to develop a useful approach to air bending.

Pipeman
Feb 11 2013, 04:03 PM
That and I simply don't believe that Aang can teach her nothing at all about airbending.
Ther has to be more aboout it than getting into the proper mindset.


I suspect you need the right mindset as a prerequisite. Without that, the proper forms are empty. You simply can't make your chi move in the right way. Remember that everyone in the Fire Nation has the potential to firebend. Most just don't have the aptitude/temperament for it - a result I suspect of the standard Fire Nation style not being appropriate for them.

I also think that there's a more than even chance he'll point-blank refuse to teach Azula, and is quite likely to become hostile over it. Remember the time when we tried to get flying tips out of him, and it went down like a sack of sick? I suspect it'll be like that times a thousand.

Edit: In any case I see literally no downside in trying to prompt Azula to have a moment of insight as a result of her success. Why on earth would you want to vote that Azula not consider it, if she can? I really don't see why. It's not like it costs anything (well, probably).
Edited by Alratan, Feb 11 2013, 04:56 PM.
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EnderofWorlds
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[X] Flash of insight a la Alratan
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NSMS
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Edited by NSMS, Feb 11 2013, 04:25 PM.
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HioH
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croaker
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Alratan
Feb 11 2013, 04:14 PM
Edit: In any case I see literally no downside in trying to prompt Azula to have a moment of insight as a result of her success. Why on earth would you want to vote that Azula not consider it, if she can? I really don't see why. It's not like it costs anything (well, probably).
What do you think she can do with this insight? Will it make her depressed? Happy? Sad? Will she throw caution to the winds and openly declare war on destiny?

What will it do to her character? How will it change her goals? etc.
Alatran
 
Asuka

We really need an eyepatch one of these days.
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Nightblade
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Alratan
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croaker
Feb 11 2013, 04:53 PM
What do you think she can do with this insight? Will it make her depressed? Happy? Sad? Will she throw caution to the winds and openly declare war on destiny?

What will it do to her character? How will it change her goals? etc.
The idea would be to get the inspiration for an approach to Airbending that she's comfortable with, at least.

Hopefully it would also give her something to hold on to make it easier to resist the dictates of her instincts. I still hope that at some point we can get Azula to learn some non-destructive Firebending, as I've high hopes that slowly shifting her approach to Firebending to be more constructive and less based around rage and hate will have sympathetic effects on her inner dragon, but that's in the future for now. We'll have to stick with her air/lightning bending for now.

Although I think she's pretty openly declared war on destiny already, as far as the spirits are concerned, throwing caution to the wind wouldn't really be in line with the philosophy I described though, being about the importance of decision making and choices.

On a side note I proposed seeing what reaction that the Joo Dee would have to Zuko's presence, now he's a shadow bender (and possibly his bending), on the basis that Azula's presence did something, and that the absence of fire in her soul may have left a shadow behind. At least it seems that it would be interesting, but does anyone have any other thoughts along a similar vein? Might be something better left for the next update I suppose.
Edited by Alratan, Feb 11 2013, 05:10 PM.
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Aranfan
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Liam-don
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Meh, self-inflicted bondage is still bondage. I'd rather Azula put it all out in the open and learn to accept all she is before deciding on how she will behave in the future. Not because she's afraid of not fitting in, not because she fears everyone will turn away from her, but out of her own free will. That's a much more healthy approach than keeping it all inside and pretending this part of her doesn't exist. You're only your own worst enemy until you've learned to accept who you are and decided to work with it.
Edited by Liam-don, Feb 11 2013, 05:27 PM.
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croaker
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Although I think she's pretty openly declared war on destiny already,


No, no, she hasn't shook her fists at heaven and proclaimed her hatred, her anger, and all her disdain for meddling spirits yet, and really would like to keep it that way. Making it official just invites them to launch the ICBMs.

Alatran
 
throwing caution to the wind wouldn't really be in line with the philosophy I described though, being about the importance of decision making and choices.

Getting mad in the middle of realizing this is pretty bad, and we all know the dragon itches to climb out.

Not to mention that we get shoved into yet another existential crisis.
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Hymn of Ragnarok
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Liam-don
Feb 11 2013, 05:20 PM
Meh, self-inflicted bondage is still bondage. I'd rather Azula put it all out in the open and learn to accept all she is before taking making decide on how she will behave in the future. Not because she's afraid of not fitting in, not because she fears everyone will turn away from her, but out of her own free will. That's a much more healthy approach than keeping it all inside and pretending this part of her doesn't exist. Your only your own worst enemy until you've learned to accept who you are and decided to work with it.
I don't think you give Azula enough credit. She knows full well what she is. Remember back when the dragons threw everything she is, in her face?

Quote:
 
Yes.

You like violence. You enjoy the smell of victory. You'll kill, not just as a predator to eat or defend itself personally, and you would feel nothing about it. And taunting the tribal girl into fury does warm your heart.

But that's not fair.

You don't kill indiscriminately. Not without a purpose. You control yourself. You do things because they are smart, and not just to sate your craving for burning things! You can't help liking what you like, when the only thing you could possibly do is lie about it and try to convince yourself that you really don't. What does it matter that you don't care when someone unimportant to you dies?

And you're sane, damn it. You're functional. You're stable. You don't, don't gibber at plush toys, or bark orders at walls and things only you can see, damn them, you aren't crazy. You aren't in danger of going mad!


She's not hiding and pretending it isn't there. Hell, she deliberately opens her Box of Crazy to intimidate Hama. She just keeps her instincts locked down tight because generally speaking, she knows that her instincts are the wrong answer to most situations.

And while one can argue that her claiming she's not in danger of going mad is unhealthy, well, if the unyielding insistence that this is so is what allows her to essentially Become The Mask, then good on her. She admits her faults and virtues, and refuses to become a lunatic or slave to them.

Honestly, I think she's doing pretty good as she is.
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minuseven
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Alratan
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Liam-don
Feb 11 2013, 05:20 PM
Meh, self-inflicted bondage is still bondage. I'd rather Azula put it all out in the open and learn to accept all she is before taking making decide on how she will behave in the future. Not because she's afraid of not fitting in, not because she fears everyone will turn away from her, but out of her own free will. That's a much more healthy approach than keeping it all inside and pretending this part of her doesn't exist. Your only your own worst enemy until you've learned to accept who you are and decided to work with it.


This isn't about self-inflicted imprisonment at all. It's about being the one in charge of your instincts, not vice versa. It may be what Azula needs to allow her to open the box, as it would give her the strength to eventually master what's inside.

croaker
Feb 11 2013, 05:21 PM
No, no, she hasn't shook her fists at heaven and proclaimed her hatred, her anger, and all her disdain for meddling spirits yet, and really would like to keep it that way. Making it official just invites them to launch the ICBMs.


And this shouldn't prompt her to. She already knows all about the spirits. There's nothing in the write-in that should prompt any form of public declarations. It's all about internal patterns of thought, nothing about external behaviour. Indeed, the whole point is that her behaviour shouldn't be mandated like that.

croaker
Feb 11 2013, 05:21 PM
Getting mad in the middle of realizing this is pretty bad, and we all know the dragon itches to climb out.Not to mention that we get shoved into yet another existential crisis.


All she's really realising is how things she already knows could relate to how she should use airbending. There's no reason at all to prompt an existential crisis. This is all stuff she's had to deal with already when it comes to her general behaviour. All we're doing here is systematising and dealing with the consequences of what she's already learned and applying it to her bending. As Hymn says, it isn't really something that new for her. She's just working out a way to make it work for her in another field.

It actually represents at least partially dealing with the existential crisis of knowing the spirits are our to make her the bad guy, by converting her determination not to fall into the path they want to force her down into a bending style that determines how she makes her chi flow.

This should be seen as an opportunity, not as a threat.
Edited by Alratan, Feb 11 2013, 05:34 PM.
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ryuan
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Liam-don
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Hymn of Ragnarok
Feb 11 2013, 05:28 PM
I don't think you give Azula enough credit. She knows full well what she is. Remember back when the dragons threw everything she is, in her face?




She's not hiding and pretending it isn't there. Hell, she deliberately opens her Box of Crazy to intimidate Hama. She just keeps her instincts locked down tight because generally speaking, she knows that her instincts are the wrong answer to most situations.

And while one can argue that her claiming she's not in danger of going mad is unhealthy, well, if the unyielding insistence that this is so is what allows her to essentially Become The Mask, then good on her. She admits her faults and virtues, and refuses to become a lunatic or slave to them.

Honestly, I think she's doing pretty good as she is.
She's still tearing herself apart, creating a false didvide between Altaran's "pure intellect" and everything else, let's call it "the monster," where in fact there's only Azula. She puts the majority of herself in a box, so tightly bound that she can't allow herself much in term of emotion for fear of it breaking open and unleashing something she can't control.

You can talk about becoming the mask, but the truth of the matter is that it would take one tragedy for Azula to lose it so completely her actions would make Sozin's genocide of the Air Nomads seems reasonable.


You talk about faults and virtues and lunacy, I'm talking about Azula seeing herself for what she is, really, not an untimely peek in or a spur of emotion, but in full, to acknowledge all her instincts and urges in their entirety and decides that there's nothing wrong with them.

There's nothing wrong with her, that's the state of mind she should reach. From then on, it wouldn't be a matter of keeping her instinct locked permanently frozen behind a wall of cold logic. It'd be just deciding to not follow them because that's not what she wants to do.

Not "inefficient", not "suboptimal," not "monstruous," "evil" or any other justification she has to come up with everyday. Just not what she wants to do.
Edited by Liam-don, Feb 11 2013, 05:50 PM.
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EnderofWorlds
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Liam-don
Feb 11 2013, 05:45 PM
She's still tearing herself apart, creating a false didvide between Altaran's "pure intellect" and everything else, let's call it "the monster," where in fact there's only Azula. She puts the majority of herself in a box, so tightly bound that she can't allow herself much in term of emotion for fear of it breaking open and unleashing something she can't control.

You can talk about becoming the mask, but the truth of the matter is that it would take one tragedy for Azula to lose it so completely her actions would make Sozin's genocide of the Air Nomads seems reasonable.


You talk about faults and virtues and lunacy, I'm talking about Azula seeing herself for what she is, really, not an untimely peek in or a spurred of emotion, but in full, to acknowledge all her instincts and urges in their entirety and decides that there's nothing wrong with them.

There's nothing wrong with her, that's the state of mind she should reach. From then on, it wouldn't be a matter of keeping her instinct locked permanently frozen behind a wall of cold logic. It'd be just deciding to not follow them because that's not what she wants to do.

Not "inefficient", not "suboptimal," not "monstruous," "evil" or any other justification she has to come up with everyday. Just not what she wants to do.
I'm hoping that's part of the 'freedom' insight we get from Alratan's spark of inspiration. If that's not enough, we can do something further about it; maybe meditation or something like that.
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Alratan
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Liam-don
Feb 11 2013, 05:45 PM
She's still tearing herself apart, creating a false didvide between Altaran's "pure intellect" and everything else, let's call it "the monster," where in fact there's only Azula. She puts the majority of herself in a box, so tightly bound that she can't allow herself much in term of emotion for fear of it breaking open and unleashing something she can't control.

You can talk about becoming the mask, but the truth of the matter is that it would take one tragedy for Azula to lose it so completely her actions would make Sozin's genocide of the Air Nomads seems reasonable.


You talk about faults and virtues and lunacy, I'm talking about Azula seeing herself for what she is, really, not an untimely peek in or a spurred of emotion, but in full, to acknowledge all her instincts and urges in their entirety and decides that there's nothing wrong with them.

There's nothing wrong with her, that's the state of mind she should reach. From then on, it wouldn't be a matter of keeping her instinct locked permanently frozen behind a wall of cold logic. It'd be just deciding to not follow them because that's not what she wants to do.

Not "inefficient", not "suboptimal," not "monstruous," "evil" or any other justification she has to come up with everyday. Just not what she wants to do.
You're partially misreading the point of my write-in. It's doesn't advocate denying your instincts, or annihilating them, or being a creature of pure intellect. It says you have to rise above them rather than be their slave. That doesn't mean that they don't exist, or you pretend they don't, but that don't determine your actions. You do.

The freedom that I'm talking about my write-in also requires that she isn't terrified of her instincts. If she's their master, then there is no reason to keep them in a box forever.

Before she lets them out though, she has to be strong enough, and have the right mindset so that they don't overwhelm her. That's what I'm hoping this helps with.

More importantly, this write-in is mainly designed to help Azula develop a compatible Air-bending technique. I wouldn't expect it to "fix" her, just be a step in helping her deal with what she is, if that.
Edited by Alratan, Feb 11 2013, 06:02 PM.
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Hymn of Ragnarok
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Liam-don
Feb 11 2013, 05:45 PM
She's still tearing herself apart, creating a false didvide between Altaran's "pure intellect" and everything else, let's call it "the monster," where in fact there's only Azula. She puts the majority of herself in a box, so tightly bound that she can't allow herself much in term of emotion for fear of it breaking open and unleashing something she can't control.

You can talk about becoming the mask, but the truth of the matter is that it would take one tragedy for Azula to lose it so completely her actions would make Sozin's genocide of the Air Nomads seems reasonable.


You talk about faults and virtues and lunacy, I'm talking about Azula seeing herself for what she is, really, not an untimely peek in or a spurred of emotion, but in full, to acknowledge all her instincts and urges in their entirety and decides that there's nothing wrong with them.

There's nothing wrong with her, that's the state of mind she should reach. From then on, it wouldn't be a matter of keeping her instinct locked permanently frozen behind a wall of cold logic. It'd be just deciding to not follow them because that's not what she wants to do.

Not "inefficient", not "suboptimal," not "monstruous," "evil" or any other justification she has to come up with everyday. Just not what she wants to do.
What false divide? Azula here ain't an emotionless automatron. She loves the smell of burning flesh. She enjoys the utter defeat of her opponents, and relishes in their misery. Hakoda, Katara, Azula isn't denied that she enjoys watching them suffer. She might WANT to solve all of her problems with burning, but she chooses not to.

I would not say the majority of her is in a box. The divide is not as severe as you claim it is.

This emotional resolution you want her to have, accepting her for what she is? She had it. Back when she broke down and spilled her guts to Iroh and Zuko. She already decides what to do, because she wants to do it and not purely cold logic. If it was cold logic, she'd never antagonize Katara for the hell of it. She wouldn't joke around and tell Ty Lee to hug Mai for her. She wouldn't essentially throw a slumber party and get drunk just to have fun with her friends. Or decide that she wants to sleep in Zuko's bed for the company. Yes, all the touchy feely stuff makes her uncomfortable, but no one's claiming she's perfect as she is. I just think she's doing good, and making slow and steady progress with regards to her friends.

For the matter, emotion helps power fire bending. And she clearly doesn't have problems with that.

You really are not giving her enough credit.
Edited by Hymn of Ragnarok, Feb 11 2013, 05:56 PM.
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MacroDaemon
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I still want us to go to the NAT and see how Aang is doing and what the Mechanist has cooked up. Though, if we come up with our own method of airbending before then, I don't see a reason to tell Aang that we are an airbender.
Edited by MacroDaemon, Feb 11 2013, 06:51 PM.
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Border42
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Bandwagoning~

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Chibi-Reaper
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Likely to what by a wha?
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Note:

I'm ready to begin writering, but am waiting for feedback on whether to move this back.

In the meantime, I'm considering something else. Wait warmly.
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serapheus
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Feb 11 2013, 08:46 PM
In the meantime, I'm considering something else. Wait warmly.
Hmm...Should I take this as something ominous or hopeful...

Well I guess I'll be optimistic for now.
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Larekko12
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Eh Keep it here no lag reasonable speed. People need to get avatars transferred but it's cool here.
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WizardOne
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Feb 11 2013, 08:46 PM
Note:

I'm ready to begin writering, but am waiting for feedback on whether to move this back.

In the meantime, I'm considering something else. Wait warmly.
Take it where you'll get the most enjoyment out of it.


Though we will be sad to see you go if you do.
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Border42
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Go where you want Chibi. Personally, I prefer it here if only because there's no lag making it so no one is able to do anything half the day.
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Chibi-Reaper
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Go?

http://w11.zetaboards.com/Questionable_Gaming/topic/8480060/1/
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Hymn of Ragnarok
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Tis as I feared. A new plot bunny has taken root.
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ScAvenger001
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I'd just as soon keep the actual discussion here, but continuing to post updates on SB will help keep a larger base of people interested (as long as it's clear the actual voting all takes place in one spot or the other, and this place doesn't have SB's performance issues).

Not thrilled about Riddle Quest though, tbh.
Edited by ScAvenger001, Feb 11 2013, 09:07 PM.
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Khiruki
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Eh. Just go where the flow takes things.
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minuseven
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Well damn it.... I think.
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EnderofWorlds
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minuseven
Feb 11 2013, 09:08 PM
Well damn it.... I think.

Hymn of Ragnarok
Feb 11 2013, 09:02 PM
Tis as I feared. A new plot bunny has taken root.

Ahem;
Chibi-Reaper
Feb 11 2013, 08:46 PM
Note:

I'm ready to begin writering, but am waiting for feedback on whether to move this back.

In the meantime, I'm considering something else. Wait warmly.


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target
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did you talk to the mods chibi ? i thought this quest was getting to pg 13 for them
Edited by target, Feb 11 2013, 09:13 PM.
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minuseven
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EnderofWorlds
Feb 11 2013, 09:11 PM

Ahem;
Chibi-Reaper
Feb 11 2013, 08:46 PM
Note:

I'm ready to begin writering, but am waiting for feedback on whether to move this back.

In the meantime, I'm considering something else. Wait warmly.




I know, I read that post too. I'm just seeing how eventually Riddle quest might sap Chibi's attention. Not that that's entirely a bad thing, but I really like Azula way more.
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WizardOne
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They're both so evil... how to choose?!
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Megaolix
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Another Quest... Why never wait to end your current one before starting another one, Chibi?
Edited by Megaolix, Feb 11 2013, 09:21 PM.
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Hymn of Ragnarok
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Feb 11 2013, 09:18 PM


I know, I read that post too. I'm just seeing how eventually Riddle quest might sap Chibi's attention. Not that that's entirely a bad thing, but I really like Azula way more.
This. What I said is entirely true: A new plot bunny has taken root in Chibi's most fertile mind. This being Chibi, they are probably Vorpal Plot Bunnies.

TWO BUNNIES ENTER, ONE BUNNY LEAVES.
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