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Billy Bob's cryptic comments on New Years 1988 show tape
Topic Started: Mar 5 2015, 04:34 PM (1,855 Views)
PaulKTF
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At the end of the New Years 1988 show, Billy Bob comments "Whoever we are and whatever we turn into...".

That kind of makes me think that they knew (or at least suspected) that Concept Unification was going to happen even by the end of 1987.

What do you guys think?
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Cyberhawk
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billy bob got scrapped though
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ShowbizPizzaFan
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ShowbizPizzaFan
Js96er
Mar 5 2015, 06:04 PM
billy bob got scrapped though
Did Aaron know that?
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CECArizona
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Proud owner of a Studio C Alpha
PaulKTF
Mar 5 2015, 04:34 PM
At the end of the New Years 1988 show, Billy Bob comments "Whoever we are and whatever we turn into...".

That kind of makes me think that they knew (or at least suspected) that Concept Unification was going to happen even by the end of 1987.

What do you guys think?
The concept unidentification prototype started in 1988.
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80sgirl
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Electroidal Animal Doctor
Well, 1987 was when SPT corporate made that attraction development program document where they talk about all the possible RAE retrofits. Not sure if anyone at CEI knew about it at the time, though. I think people at corporate were probably planning on ways of giving CEI the boot almost as soon as the ink was dry on the merger agreement.

When did Showbiz give Aaron the ultimatum about handing over the character rights? I suppose if they gave the ultimatum far enough in advance, that could have been the reason for Billy Bob's statement.

I've heard conflicting information. Some seems to indicate it was shortly before they started working on CU, other sources say much sooner. Some say corporate dropped the subject when he refused and he didn't find out they were going ahead with it until after the stores started converting.
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PaulKTF
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CEI was selling the RAE to independent FECs by 1987 if that matters (theres a brochure in the CEI documents section) so they had to have known by then that they weren't going to build any more Showizes. They probably knew earlier than that though.

I have a feeling that once the merger happened, at least some people at Showbiz Pizza Time were thinking that they had to merge the concepts in order to keep the ship afloat.

Showbiz took over recording and programing of the RAE show tapes in '86 and I think the plan at that point was to keep doing the programing and somehow convert the stages into something other than the RAE as soon as it was (financially) feasible. It just took a few years to nail down what they really wanted to convert the characters to.

I love that Attraction Development Program binder because it shows all the concepts we could have gotten:

http://www.showbizpizza.com/info/documents/spt/spt_adp-binder.pdf
Edited by PaulKTF, Mar 6 2015, 04:50 AM.
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Cyberhawk
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is their a video of the 88 new year show?
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PaulKTF
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Js96er
Mar 6 2015, 08:02 PM
is their a video of the 88 new year show?
No, it was before Cyberstar was used on a regular basis. The audio gets played on Radio Showbiz all the time though.

Could someone upload the show audio to YouTube please?
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Cyberhawk
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PaulKTF
Mar 6 2015, 08:13 PM
Js96er
Mar 6 2015, 08:02 PM
is their a video of the 88 new year show?
No, it was before Cyberstar was used on a regular basis. The audio gets played on Radio Showbiz all the time though.

Could someone upload the show audio to YouTube please?
dose radio showbiz still work i cant get it to work on crome
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PaulKTF
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Js96er
Mar 6 2015, 08:34 PM
PaulKTF
Mar 6 2015, 08:13 PM
Js96er
Mar 6 2015, 08:02 PM
is their a video of the 88 new year show?
No, it was before Cyberstar was used on a regular basis. The audio gets played on Radio Showbiz all the time though.

Could someone upload the show audio to YouTube please?
dose radio showbiz still work i cant get it to work on crome
If you go to the Radio Showbiz section on the site, and in the FAQ it has links so you can listen in iTunes or Windows Media Player directly. Try that. I listen in iTunes and it works fine for me there.
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WickedWonder

PaulKTF
Mar 5 2015, 04:34 PM
At the end of the New Years 1988 show, Billy Bob comments "Whoever we are and whatever we turn into...".

That kind of makes me think that they knew (or at least suspected) that Concept Unification was going to happen even by the end of 1987.

What do you guys think?
I'm sure they knew, but I love that statement, along with "It's a be what you are kinda situation". It's a good philosophy to live by- be okay with the upcoming road ahead. The only constant in life is change, and you can either be trampled by it or roll with it and enjoy it!
I was sure you were going to ask about Billy Bob's "if we're okay with dropping a hole in the show here..." when Earl's "Louie Louie" gets interrupted. It was obviously a rehearsed song, and I got that he kinda derails himself by going into "Wild Thing", but it's an odd moment all around. NYE '88 is my favorite showtape, hands down, and I certainly wouldn't have minded a full version of both songs!
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PaulKTF
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80sgirl
Mar 6 2015, 03:55 AM
Well, 1987 was when SPT corporate made that attraction development program document where they talk about all the possible RAE retrofits. Not sure if anyone at CEI knew about it at the time, though. I think people at corporate were probably planning on ways of giving CEI the boot almost as soon as the ink was dry on the merger agreement.

When did Showbiz give Aaron the ultimatum about handing over the character rights? I suppose if they gave the ultimatum far enough in advance, that could have been the reason for Billy Bob's statement.

I've heard conflicting information. Some seems to indicate it was shortly before they started working on CU, other sources say much sooner. Some say corporate dropped the subject when he refused and he didn't find out they were going ahead with it until after the stores started converting.
If you read the letter that Aaron's father Melvin (who was an attorney) sent to ShowBiz's attorney, it's clear that the CU test was done "under the radar" and that CEI found out about the CU test only via third parties instead of directly from ShowBiz themselves:

http://www.showbizpizza.com/info/documents/cei/cei_cu-response.pdf

But even as early as 1985/86 Aaron had to have known that the relationship was probably coming to an end sooner rather than later.

Without Bob Brock in place, there was really nobody at ShowBiz who had any personal or business attachment to Aaron/CEI and by that point ShowBiz was already doing the Chuck E. Cheese show tape material in-house anyway (plus they owned the characters outright, unlike The RAE).

I think (and this is only my opinion) that ShowBiz wanted to sever ties with CEI as soon as they possibly could from a financial and business standpoint as a key part of their restructuring plans to make the company profitable again.

Doing everything in-house instead of contracting it out to CEI just made the most sense.

If they could have afforded to do it, we would have gotten Concept Unification in 1986 or '87 instead of 1990 (they were obviously tossing ideas out there as early as 1986 before they decided to do the RAE show tapes themselves which was probably a lot cheaper than converting them to other characters).

Remember that ShowBiz never did very well financially before the merger (in fact, they very well could have gone under before the merger had a chance to happen).

It was only after the merger and when Dick Frank came onboard that they finally began to stop the bleeding.

Concept Unification ended up being a good thing for both sides. It allowed ShowBiz/CEC to save money and have one unified brand, and it allowed CEI to sell shows and show material to third party FECs and develop other concepts and ideas.

Of course, this is all just my opinion and I could very well be wrong about one or more facts of the situation. This is just how I see it based on what I've read and heard from multiple sources over the years.

On a side note, I wonder how many man-hours it took to program the New Year's 1988 show? It must have taken a lot of time!
Edited by PaulKTF, May 7 2016, 07:31 AM.
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Cyberhawk
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in that letter it seemed Arron wanted them to remove the bots or change the movements in a significant way but besides dooks ears and rolfe's hand the things that he considered to be iconic to the rae like fatzs foot tap remained intact with different cosmetics
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PaulKTF
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CyberWolf13
May 7 2016, 07:37 AM
in that letter it seemed Arron wanted them to remove the bots or change the movements in a significant way but besides dooks ears and rolfe's hand the things that he considered to be iconic to the rae like fatzs foot tap remained intact with different cosmetics
I believe that ShowBiz and CEI likely ended up coming to an agreement about Concept Unification which is why it went forward without any further incident.

But yes, CEi's issue with CU seemed to be that they didn't want their characters retrofitted to look like any other characters (which is understandable). It seems as if CEI would have preferred that the RAE be removed entirely instead of being retrofitted into CEC characters that all had the same underlying mechanics and movements.

Going by what Melvin said in the letter, it seems like there was language in the contract that ShowBiz signed that prohibited them from doing that (but again, I don't know any details about the actual contract itself- I'm just speculating).

I can certainly see why CEI/Aaron/Melvin would have taken issue with ShowBiz's decision to do CU and how they went about it.

Anyway, it's all water under the bridge now and everyone has moved on to bigger, and better things.
Edited by PaulKTF, May 7 2016, 08:37 AM.
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Patrick Boots CEC

There's proof to support your theory-Some RAEs were removed in favor of Rocker stages using the CEC characters.
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BrenBill
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PaulKTF
Mar 6 2015, 08:13 PM
Could someone upload the show audio to YouTube please?
Why, yes, i'd be glad to! :)

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PaulKTF
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BrenBill
May 8 2016, 03:55 PM
PaulKTF
Mar 6 2015, 08:13 PM
Could someone upload the show audio to YouTube please?
Why, yes, i'd be glad to! :)

Thank you very much. :)
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