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Big Pharma; Just take another pill
Topic Started: Apr 18 2011, 05:13 PM (1,122 Views)
Yide
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General of the Chariots and Cavalry
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHXXTCc-IVg

I think this guy is right. These companies make billions of dollars each year selling peace of mind in the form of pills. Over-weight? don't waste time with exercise, there is pills for that. Depressed? There is pills for that. Not getting enough calcium? don't bother with milk, there is pills for that. Have high blood pressure? Here take some Lipitor, we make 13 billion annually (and rising) off of that pill alone.

The key is to not make cures, but relief from pain and disease. Don't fix the problem, just cover it up.Posted Image
Zhang Fei (Yide)
張飛 (益德)

~In a challenge to Lü Bu, Zhang Fei said, “Stay, O twice bastard! I, Zhang Fei of Yan, await you!”

~While defending Liu Bei's retreat, Zhang Fei wards off Cao Cao's Force at Changban Bridge by shouting, "I am Zhang Fei of Yan! Have you a man who'll fight it out to the death?"

~Cao Cao, assessing Zhang Fei's challenge says this before pulling back his troops, "Once Lord Guan told me that Zhang Fei had taken the head of a chief general before the eyes of his own legions as easily as removing an object from a sack. Today we have crossed his path and must take care."
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nroejb
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Zombie Knight
That can't be true, Bayer founded and for a long time supported a soccer team (Bayer Uerdingen), they are the good guys!
Sisteena has no green shoes!
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Yide
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General of the Chariots and Cavalry
Well, I am sure that infograph contains biased information, but I also don't think it is all that misleading either. There is some truth in there.

I also don't know anything about Bayer, but funding a soccer team doesn't automatically make them the 'good guys' in my books.

What does Bayer produce? I am sure if you do some research you will be shocked at what you find. Maybe not though.

I think I did this out of bordem once for Procter and Gamble after buying some Pringles. Its amazing all the stuff these guys have their hands in.
Zhang Fei (Yide)
張飛 (益德)

~In a challenge to Lü Bu, Zhang Fei said, “Stay, O twice bastard! I, Zhang Fei of Yan, await you!”

~While defending Liu Bei's retreat, Zhang Fei wards off Cao Cao's Force at Changban Bridge by shouting, "I am Zhang Fei of Yan! Have you a man who'll fight it out to the death?"

~Cao Cao, assessing Zhang Fei's challenge says this before pulling back his troops, "Once Lord Guan told me that Zhang Fei had taken the head of a chief general before the eyes of his own legions as easily as removing an object from a sack. Today we have crossed his path and must take care."
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nroejb
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Zombie Knight
Wicked_Joker
Apr 18 2011, 11:41 PM
Well, I am sure that infograph contains biased information, but I also don't think it is all that misleading either. There is some truth in there.

I also don't know anything about Bayer, but funding a soccer team doesn't automatically make them the 'good guys' in my books.

What does Bayer produce? I am sure if you do some research you will be shocked at what you find. Maybe not though.

I think I did this out of bordem once for Procter and Gamble after buying some Pringles. Its amazing all the stuff these guys have their hands in.

That was sarcasm anyway...
They funded that soccer team for PR reasons (soccer is like the national sport here, though I don't care).
In my point of view, if a pharmaceutical company, a company that "makes medicine to heal people" has to rely on sport for their image, it's obvious they have something to hide.
Not that they are the most evil company out there, but free market economy certainly isn't nice to the weak ones.
Sisteena has no green shoes!
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A Novel Idea
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Don't think too hard, Denim. I will always be on your side.

i can post the protocol i followed to make aspirin in the lab last week. my product came out 99% pure based on the analysis i ran. let's take the first step towards slugging big pharma in the nuts
Posted Image
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Brutacox
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Templar Knight
Here's the 94-95' tshirt of that team featuring the bayer logo and even the name of some drug. That is a bit weird, seeing the name of a drug so large in a sports shirt http://www.diariosdefutbol.com/images/2010/07/uerdingen.jpg

By the way the tshirt design is conclusive proof that they're evil to some extent. There was a general lack of taste in the 90's, but that's one of the ugliest designs I've seen in my life :yakult:


Hehe, restless leg syndrome, I do that sometimes. I can't believe they expect you to take a drug for it. I'm not against drugs, but I don't think every problem can be solved with one.
Sapere aude!
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nroejb
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Zombie Knight
Brutacox
Apr 19 2011, 01:25 AM
Hehe, restless leg syndrome, I do that sometimes. I can't believe they expect you to take a drug for it. I'm not against drugs, but I don't think every problem can be solved with one.

They can, but should they?
With one cyanite capsule all problems are over...
Until not so long ago Docktors in this countrys tried to only use drugs if all other means failed, the trend to all purpose drugs was more or less limited to America, however it changed, for the worse.
Sisteena has no green shoes!
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SgtPigeon
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Zombie Knight
I`m sure my family and friends would be buying me stacks of RLS (restless leg syndrome) pills if they knew they existed, and then breaking the capsules and sneak them into my dinners.

I`m studying a bit of pharmacy now, the lesson I am reading is actually going over all the laws they passed through the 1900`s that pretty much led to this event, the 20 year patent mentioned here, there used to be a law that actually stated doctors had to use brand name drugs, which are more cheap, but do the same work a generic drug on the market would. This made Americas health care sky-rocket. But they did that to limit the amount of counterfeit drugs. But this has changed since then, now doctors prescribe a lot more of the generic drugs, or at least they can now.

Another fun fact is that as we use more and more medications, some viruses and diseases in the community develop antibodies, and immunities to them. As this becomes more the trend, prescription drugs are going to have to become that much stronger to combat the viruses they fight. Stonger bugs, stronger drugs.
"A thousand pigeons, each with a two ounce explosive capsule, landed at intervals on a specific target might be a seriously inconvenient surprise." - Lea Rayner, 1945
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Yide
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General of the Chariots and Cavalry
SgtPigeon
Apr 19 2011, 10:59 AM
the 20 year patent mentioned here, there used to be a law that actually stated doctors had to use brand name drugs, which are more cheap, but do the same work a generic drug on the market would. This made Americas health care sky-rocket.

I believe you meant to say that brand names are more expensive. As a matter of fact Pfizier's bread and butter Lipitor is coming to that 20 year patent mark and there are already some generics out there. They risk falling down the ladder a few steps because that drug represented most of their revenue.
Zhang Fei (Yide)
張飛 (益德)

~In a challenge to Lü Bu, Zhang Fei said, “Stay, O twice bastard! I, Zhang Fei of Yan, await you!”

~While defending Liu Bei's retreat, Zhang Fei wards off Cao Cao's Force at Changban Bridge by shouting, "I am Zhang Fei of Yan! Have you a man who'll fight it out to the death?"

~Cao Cao, assessing Zhang Fei's challenge says this before pulling back his troops, "Once Lord Guan told me that Zhang Fei had taken the head of a chief general before the eyes of his own legions as easily as removing an object from a sack. Today we have crossed his path and must take care."
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SgtPigeon
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Zombie Knight
durp, yeah I meant generic was cheaper. :cookie:

"A thousand pigeons, each with a two ounce explosive capsule, landed at intervals on a specific target might be a seriously inconvenient surprise." - Lea Rayner, 1945
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Temperance
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Wicked_Joker
Apr 18 2011, 02:13 PM
Depressed? There is pills for that.

I'm not pro pharmaceutical companies, but on this side of things, I have personal experience. I remember years back, Ghoulzy posted about being depressed, and it turned into a thread of replies saying (and I'm paraphrasing here), "man up". If that was all the help I had received, I wouldn't be here today.

Pharmaceutical companies and their researchers have done great things for us, but they're being dicks about it. You can go back to a time where half your children were killed from a simple sinus infection. Medical advancement is a wonder to behold, but greed is king. You can't blame the pill for the actions of those that market it. If it works, use it.
Reputation's on the rise, everyone's feeling fine!
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Yide
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General of the Chariots and Cavalry
Temperance
Apr 20 2011, 01:45 PM
Wicked_Joker
Apr 18 2011, 02:13 PM
Depressed? There is pills for that.

I'm not pro pharmaceutical companies, but on this side of things, I have personal experience. I remember years back, Ghoulzy posted about being depressed, and it turned into a thread of replies saying (and I'm paraphrasing here), "man up". If that was all the help I had received, I wouldn't be here today.

Pharmaceutical companies and their researchers have done great things for us, but they're being dicks about it. You can go back to a time where half your children were killed from a simple sinus infection. Medical advancement is a wonder to behold, but greed is king. You can't blame the pill for the actions of those that market it. If it works, use it.

True enough, it is just the fact that not many people who need certain pills can afford them (e.g. the elderly.) And as for depression, I have been hearing that some of these pills have been leading to suicide (isn't that what they are supposed to prevent?). If you watched that video, which is probably a couple years old, the guy says that studies have shown that 'exercise' can also help people get through depression. The thing is there are alternative ways to deal with pretty much everything that you can take a pill for. But most people won't put in the extra effort if all they have to do is swallow half a dozen pills a day instead. Also since drugs are such a big part of the economy, you don't hear about alternative methods very often.

And the media can never get their stories straight, one day fish is the best thing you can eat, the next, don't eat the fish!!!
Zhang Fei (Yide)
張飛 (益德)

~In a challenge to Lü Bu, Zhang Fei said, “Stay, O twice bastard! I, Zhang Fei of Yan, await you!”

~While defending Liu Bei's retreat, Zhang Fei wards off Cao Cao's Force at Changban Bridge by shouting, "I am Zhang Fei of Yan! Have you a man who'll fight it out to the death?"

~Cao Cao, assessing Zhang Fei's challenge says this before pulling back his troops, "Once Lord Guan told me that Zhang Fei had taken the head of a chief general before the eyes of his own legions as easily as removing an object from a sack. Today we have crossed his path and must take care."
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SgtPigeon
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Zombie Knight
I could be wrong here but I think the FDA not drug manufacturers are scooping up all this stuff about fish, and peanut butter, and whatever not being good for you.

Mind you manufacturers have to go directly through the FDA to get their drugs approved and on the market. So their hands are certainly in the pot anyway.

As for dietary supplements and stuff, interesting thing I recall reading.. they don't have to be proven effective to be marketed. As long as the bottle doesn't state it, they don't have to do anything. The same is not true of over the counter and prescription drugs though. Those go through rigorous testing to be proven both effective and safe..
"A thousand pigeons, each with a two ounce explosive capsule, landed at intervals on a specific target might be a seriously inconvenient surprise." - Lea Rayner, 1945
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Temperance
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Steampunk Tinker Extraordinaire
I've taken Kempo for years now. There's no denying the effect it has had on my life from day one on. This didn't start until years after I was diagnosed and 'cured'. My depression was crippling. At the time, there was no way I would even consider taking a kempo class, let alone jogging around the block. People wanted to help me, but I didn't want to do anything they asked of me. I wanted them to leave me alone. My medical doctor got me on some medication to help. Soon I found that I was at a therapist. Soon I found the root of my problems and found myself trying to fix them and change. Today, I don't see a therapist or take medicine. I still feel depressed sometimes, but I've found new ways to counter it before it becomes crippling again.

The Male saved my life. I've told him this before. He's been there for me when I was down, reminding me of the good times that were out there without bringing me down while doing so. 'Pull yourself up by your bootstraps' always seemed a negative to me: "Normal people do it, so why can't I?" It would just pushed me down deeper.

The Male, kempo, and even medication and psychiatry have made my life better at one point or another. Where kempo and The Male have kept me going to this day, medication brought that first ray of light to me, so when I see people slam medication because of what a company does, I see them as foolish. Yes, corporations are out for themselves and their bottom line, but that doesn't belittle what they have done medically. Those that want to go back to the dark ages of medicine can if they wish, but to ignore advancements because of a corporation? Yeah, that's showing them.

I don't argue the point to just argue. I'm a success case, and there's so much negativity over pharmaceuticals that it's sometimes lost that some of these 'bad things' work.
Reputation's on the rise, everyone's feeling fine!
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SgtPigeon
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Zombie Knight
I think a lot of the negativity towards these drugs comes from people who cannot relate. Its easy for someone who has never been seriously depressed to tell another to man up, who needs drugs, just do some exercise.. whatever.

I agree that medication for depression and some other conceived as "silly" diagnoses are good stepping stones. But the person affected should not allow those things to rule their lives either, it is a stepping stone, not a crutch. You found other things to keep yourself out of depression, and should you or any one suffering from depression fall back into that crippling state, I don't see why they shouldn't be looked down upon for taking a medication for it. It's there to help people out. But its only a stepping stone, the rest is up to the individual.
"A thousand pigeons, each with a two ounce explosive capsule, landed at intervals on a specific target might be a seriously inconvenient surprise." - Lea Rayner, 1945
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