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Yes Parties Memberhip Increase
Topic Started: Sep 27 2014, 08:08 AM (180 Views)
morayloon
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The referendum may have been lost but the struggle goes on. The SNP now say that membership numbers have soared to over 65,000 http://www.snp.org/media-centre/news/2014/sep/snp-membership-soars-over-65000 since the 19th. This makes it the third party in the UK overtaking the Britain wide LibDem total.
The Nationalists' partners in the campaign have also seen increases - Scottish Greens up 4000 https://www.scottishgreens.org.uk/category/news/
and the SSP: "As of 23 September, more than 2,100 people had joined the party since the referendum result was declared" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_Socialist_Party#Scottish_independence_referendum.2C_2014
Thousands have been politicised because of the campaign, they are not going away any time soon.
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It was obvious that the SNP would blame the English because their countrymen voted to stay in the union and not the will of the majority.
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morayloon
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gansao
Sep 27 2014, 10:55 AM
It was obvious that the SNP would blame the English because their countrymen voted to stay in the union and not the will of the majority.

Blame the English? Who? When?
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Alberich
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The time may well come; in fact it probably will, when a majority north of the border vote in favour of complete independence, in a move that would make the legendary stampede of lemmings over a cliff seem like the epitome of common sense.

But until then, Loon, give it a rest.....please!
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morayloon
Sep 27 2014, 03:41 PM
gansao
Sep 27 2014, 10:55 AM
It was obvious that the SNP would blame the English because their countrymen voted to stay in the union and not the will of the majority.

Blame the English? Who? When?


Oh sorry. So you do accept that the NO campaign was based on truth and English politicians were honest when they warned against the dangers of leaving the union?
Look at this... It is clearly the SNP that the people of Scotland trust to stand up for Scotland’s interests – and to hold the Westminster establishment to account on their vow of substantial more powers for Scotland. This new democratic movement in Scotland won’t accept the same old politics as usual from Westminster.”
Well it is clear that the majority of voters did not trust the SNP to stand up for Scotlands interest. That the NO campaigners are just as interested for Westminster to make good on their ' vow'. They dont need the party that failed to do that....and the new democratic movement in Scotland has moved away from the likes of Salmond and expect Westminster to be part of it.
The problem with you SNP losers is that you cannot trust the people that you pretend to represent...the Scottish people as a whole.
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Also it is unlikely that the new SNP members are disgruntled No voters because the No voters have not had time to be disgruntled .
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morayloon
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Alberich
Sep 27 2014, 03:50 PM

But until then, Loon, give it a rest.....please!
If you are not interested, why bother posting?
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morayloon
Sep 27 2014, 07:32 PM
Alberich
Sep 27 2014, 03:50 PM

But until then, Loon, give it a rest.....please!
If you are not interested, why bother posting?


Same could be said of the likes of you. I think most forums had a chippy Scot who was telling the very people of the UK that had no direct say in the breakup of the UK that its the Sassenachs fault because they were practically all Scot hating Tories.
I think it was the aforesaid chippy Scots honestly believed that they would take their oil and sail off into the utopian sunset.
Fortunately there were enough pragmatic and sensible Scots that realised they could get the best of both worlds with Devo max...and you know what? The SNP losers are telling us that THEY will make sure that Scotland will get what the NO voters asked for!
Good to see they are carrying on the where Salmond left off  ::)
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morayloon
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gansao
Sep 27 2014, 03:52 PM
Gansao
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Oh sorry. So you do accept that the NO campaign was based on truth
I said that I accepted the result. Where in that statement do you get that I accepted ANYTHING the No camp said. Blair McDougall believes that the scaremongering & bullying (project fear) won the day for No.

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English politicians were honest when they warned against the dangers of leaving the union?
Like Scottish Noers, English MPs were less than honest. English MPs, in the main, kept out of the campaign because it was seen as a Scottish affair. Those that did venture North did not hang around long. Cameron & Osborne came here, made pronouncements then left pretty damned quick

It was not about the SNP. Other parties joined the fray and there was a ground-swell of people who, up to that point, were apolitical.
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the new democratic movement in Scotland has moved away from the likes of Salmond and expect Westminster to be part of it
The 'new democratic movement' is the 45. It has emerged from the Yes campaign and does not see Westminster as having any part in Scotland's future.
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The problem with you SNP losers is that you cannot trust the people that you pretend to represent...the Scottish people as a whole
The SNP doesn't pretend to do anything. It has an overall majority of seats and does represent the Scottish people.
As for being losers, the SNPs membership has increased threefold. That is not the mark of losers.
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morayloon
Sep 27 2014, 07:59 PM
gansao
Sep 27 2014, 03:52 PM
Gansao
Quote:
 
Oh sorry. So you do accept that the NO campaign was based on truth
I said that I accepted the result. Where in that statement do you get that I accepted ANYTHING the No camp said. Blair McDougall believes that the scaremongering & bullying (project fear) won the day for No.

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English politicians were honest when they warned against the dangers of leaving the union?
Like Scottish Noers, English MPs were less than honest. English MPs, in the main, kept out of the campaign because it was seen as a Scottish affair. Those that did venture North did not hang around long. Cameron & Osborne came here, made pronouncements then left pretty damned quick

It was not about the SNP. Other parties joined the fray and there was a ground-swell of people who, up to that point, were apolitical.
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the new democratic movement in Scotland has moved away from the likes of Salmond and expect Westminster to be part of it
The 'new democratic movement' is the 45. It has emerged from the Yes campaign and does not see Westminster as having any part in Scotland's future.
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The problem with you SNP losers is that you cannot trust the people that you pretend to represent...the Scottish people as a whole
The SNP doesn't pretend to do anything. It has an overall majority of seats and does represent the Scottish people.
As for being losers, the SNPs membership has increased threefold. That is not the mark of losers.


The NO campaign agreed in general with the assertions that a independent Scotland was not the Utopia that Salmond and the gang said it was. Salmond was adamant that any negative view or assertion about indy Scotland was English propaganda. In other words the failure of SNP was due to the English....
Edit..in case you cannot comprehend it..the SNP are saying that the NO voters were taken in by English lies.

English MPs especially the head of the main political parties were the ones stressing the dangers and the delusions of SNP.
As for being a Scottish affair, when they finally did come to Scotland the SNP rent a mob shouted them down.

You dont get to define the 'new democratic movement' even if you try to hi jack it . The new democratic movement in reality has nothing to do with the SNP losers..they are trying to hi jack it .
Also the ' new democratic movement' has an English wing that proposes to have a voice in the brave new UK world. It is not the preserve of the Scots any more. Devolution is on the cards for the whole of the UK and the Scots will not be able to be remote from it.

The SNP MEMBERSHIP has increases 3 fold maybe. That just means that 3 times as many SNP voters have committed to pay contributions ( and presumably get a badge)
The whole premise of SNP has been rejected by the Scottish people. The game is up and all they have is to attempt to be champions of the people who voted against them. You cant get much more of a bunch of losers than that ! ;-)
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morayloon
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gansao
Sep 27 2014, 07:49 PM

gansao
 
Same could be said of the likes of you. I think most forums had a chippy Scot who was telling the very people of the UK that had no direct say in the breakup of the UK that its the Sassenachs fault because they were practically all Scot hating Tories
The UK includes Scotland!!! We were telling the people of the rUK they had no say in the future of our country. You will have to give evidence of this anti Englishness. It is obvious you are not from Scotland as, if you were, you would know just how ridiculous your statement really is

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I think it was the aforesaid chippy Scots honestly believed that they would take their oil and sail off into the utopian sunset
Don't worry, the oil is still ours.

Quote:
 
Fortunately there were enough pragmatic and sensible Scots that realised they could get the best of both worlds with Devo max
Cameron prevented Devo-Max from being an option in the plebiscite. When the polls showed the gap closing, the Establishment decided they would throw the offer of more powers into the fray despite being totally set against it before. It was a blatant attempt to buy off the many voters who wanted more powers and were ready to back Yes to get just that. The bribe worked and enough people accepted the vow, at face value,to give the Noers victory.
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The SNP losers are telling us that THEY will make sure that Scotland will get what the NO voters asked for!
WTF are you on about? Are you making this up as you go along?
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The Buccaneer
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morayloon
Sep 27 2014, 08:08 AM
The referendum may have been lost but the struggle goes on. The SNP now say that membership numbers have soared to over 65,000 http://www.snp.org/media-centre/news/2014/sep/snp-membership-soars-over-65000 since the 19th. This makes it the third party in the UK overtaking the Britain wide LibDem total.
The Nationalists' partners in the campaign have also seen increases - Scottish Greens up 4000 https://www.scottishgreens.org.uk/category/news/
and the SSP: "As of 23 September, more than 2,100 people had joined the party since the referendum result was declared" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_Socialist_Party#Scottish_independence_referendum.2C_2014
Thousands have been politicised because of the campaign, they are not going away any time soon.

So the relevance, now is ?

If the whining Scots eventually muster enough of their ilk who are happy to live without the significant subsidies provided by we ENGLISH, then good luck to them, the rest of us will be lots better off.
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jeevesnwooster
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Haha it's quite amusing, the Westminster politicians probably thought voters would flock to Scottish Labour, I hope they move over to the SNP in ever bigger numbers just to show the electorate what they really thought. Having said that, voting yes was an equally **itty option
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morayloon
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gansao
Sep 27 2014, 08:14 PM
gansao
 
The NO campaign agreed in general with the assertions that a independent Scotland was not the Utopia that Salmond and the gang said it was
The problem is that the SNP NEVER once said it would be a utopia. The No campaign attempted to say that was what the Yes campaign was all about and it looks as if you fell for it hook, line & sinker. You should really widen your reading from the Mail, or is it the Telegraph?

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Salmond was adamant that any negative view or assertion about indy Scotland was English propaganda
He did? When? Where?

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In other words the failure of SNP was due to the English...
You just can't make it up.
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Edit..in case you cannot comprehend it..the SNP are saying that the NO voters were taken in by English lies
Awa'n bile yer heid min.

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English MPs especially the head of the main political parties were the ones stressing the dangers and the delusions of SNP
They seldom set foot in Scotland. When they did they took no part in debates answered no questions. Indeed did not allow questions to be asked. The ones who were dishing out the lies were the Labour party and its Tory & LD allies in Scotland. Certainly they were fed by their masters in the Establishment. This inot ant-English it is anti-Westminster

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As for being a Scottish affair, when they finally did come to Scotland the SNP rent a mob shouted them down
Are we talking about Farage here, because he was the only English politician who was heckled as far as I am aware. Again, is it the Mail or Telegraph?

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You dont get to define the 'new democratic movement' even if you try to hi jack it
But you do?

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The new democratic movement in reality has nothing to do with the SNP losers..they are trying to hi jack it
The 45 is the new democratic movement in Scotland

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Also the ' new democratic movement' has an English wing that proposes to have a voice in the brave new UK world. It is not the preserve of the Scots any more. Devolution is on the cards for the whole of the UK and the Scots will not be able to be remote from it
It was a bluff. There will be no further powers transferred to Holyrood and England will get nothing either.

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The SNP MEMBERSHIP has increases 3 fold maybe. That just means that 3 times as many SNP voters have committed to pay contributions ( and presumably get a badge)
Most of those who have joined are past non-voters or had nothing to do with the SNP ... until the grass-roots campaign got underway.
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The whole premise of SNP has been rejected by the Scottish people
Independence has been rejected by 55% of the electorate. However that means a very large minority - a 5% swing would have been enough for victory - voted for their country's Independence.
How do you account for the fact that the SNP is riding high in the polls?

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morayloon
Sep 27 2014, 08:18 PM
gansao
Sep 27 2014, 07:49 PM

gansao
 
Same could be said of the likes of you. I think most forums had a chippy Scot who was telling the very people of the UK that had no direct say in the breakup of the UK that its the Sassenachs fault because they were practically all Scot hating Tories
The UK includes Scotland!!! We were telling the people of the rUK they had no say in the future of our country. You will have to give evidence of this anti Englishness. It is obvious you are not from Scotland as, if you were, you would know just how ridiculous your statement really is

Quote:
 
I think it was the aforesaid chippy Scots honestly believed that they would take their oil and sail off into the utopian sunset
Don't worry, the oil is still ours.

Quote:
 
Fortunately there were enough pragmatic and sensible Scots that realised they could get the best of both worlds with Devo max
Cameron prevented Devo-Max from being an option in the plebiscite. When the polls showed the gap closing, the Establishment decided they would throw the offer of more powers into the fray despite being totally set against it before. It was a blatant attempt to buy off the many voters who wanted more powers and were ready to back Yes to get just that. The bribe worked and enough people accepted the vow, at face value,to give the Noers victory.
Quote:
 
The SNP losers are telling us that THEY will make sure that Scotland will get what the NO voters asked for!
WTF are you on about? Are you making this up as you go along?


This illustrates the small world of the SNP devotee. You still have not got the wit to realise that the Scots independence would be seen as the break uf the UK by the English...and you accuse ME of being ridiculous.
You also seem to be oblivious of the fact that practically any criticism , warning, in fact any refutation of the Salmond delusional model of an independent Scotland was written off as English lies and bullying. Hence any opinion from England that mirrored it was met with an irate Scot telling us that we hate and underestimate Scots. Just look around the few UK debate forums and find out for yourself.
The oil belongs to the oil companies. You may get revenue but that revenue will decrease over time. Then its just Whisky and Tartan.. :P
There will be far more devolution for Scotland. Your trouble is that it probably will become part of a general UK debate before you get it.
The Scots have decided to stay in the union so the question of devolution should be a considered throughout the UK not just in Scotland.
Believe me the Scots will not be allowed to dominate the question of ' what is right and fair'.

WTF am I on about? I'm on about the Scottish voters rejecting the primary reason for SNP existence. Now the SNP have been told emphatically that the Scots do not want to break from the union it is trying to champion the premise of the NO vote. If you cant understand this then you are probably an asset to the SNP ;-)
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morayloon
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The Buccaneer
Sep 27 2014, 08:36 PM
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So the relevance, now is ?
The relevance is that, despite losing on the 18th, the three parties involved in the Yes campaign saw massive increases in membership.

Quote:
 
If the whining Scots eventually muster enough of their ilk who are happy to live without the significant subsidies provided by we ENGLISH, then good luck to them, the rest of us will be lots better off
What subsidies are these then?
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morayloon
Sep 27 2014, 08:48 PM
gansao
Sep 27 2014, 08:14 PM
gansao
 
The NO campaign agreed in general with the assertions that a independent Scotland was not the Utopia that Salmond and the gang said it was
The problem is that the SNP NEVER once said it would be a utopia. The No campaign attempted to say that was what the Yes campaign was all about and it looks as if you fell for it hook, line & sinker. You should really widen your reading from the Mail, or is it the Telegraph?

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Salmond was adamant that any negative view or assertion about indy Scotland was English propaganda
He did? When? Where?

Quote:
 
In other words the failure of SNP was due to the English...
You just can't make it up.
Quote:
 
Edit..in case you cannot comprehend it..the SNP are saying that the NO voters were taken in by English lies
Awa'n bile yer heid min.

Quote:
 
English MPs especially the head of the main political parties were the ones stressing the dangers and the delusions of SNP
They seldom set foot in Scotland. When they did they took no part in debates answered no questions. Indeed did not allow questions to be asked. The ones who were dishing out the lies were the Labour party and its Tory & LD allies in Scotland. Certainly they were fed by their masters in the Establishment. This inot ant-English it is anti-Westminster

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As for being a Scottish affair, when they finally did come to Scotland the SNP rent a mob shouted them down
Are we talking about Farage here, because he was the only English politician who was heckled as far as I am aware. Again, is it the Mail or Telegraph?

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You dont get to define the 'new democratic movement' even if you try to hi jack it
But you do?

Quote:
 
The new democratic movement in reality has nothing to do with the SNP losers..they are trying to hi jack it
The 45 is the new democratic movement in Scotland

Quote:
 
Also the ' new democratic movement' has an English wing that proposes to have a voice in the brave new UK world. It is not the preserve of the Scots any more. Devolution is on the cards for the whole of the UK and the Scots will not be able to be remote from it
It was a bluff. There will be no further powers transferred to Holyrood and England will get nothing either.

Quote:
 
The SNP MEMBERSHIP has increases 3 fold maybe. That just means that 3 times as many SNP voters have committed to pay contributions ( and presumably get a badge)
Most of those who have joined are past non-voters or had nothing to do with the SNP ... until the grass-roots campaign got underway.
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The whole premise of SNP has been rejected by the Scottish people
Independence has been rejected by 55% of the electorate. However that means a very large minority - a 5% swing would have been enough for victory - voted for their country's Independence.
How do you account for the fact that the SNP is riding high in the polls?



They said exactly that. There would be no problem about sterling, the EU,NATO, business flight. They would become the new Scandinavians.
It wasnt the media who claimed that , it was Salmond and his deluded crew and YOU were obviously one of them who bought it.
Salmond said time and time again and so did his minions. At least try to be less obtuse and a little more honest.
I didnt need to make it up. It was the SNP who made it up ..and in the end it the more sensible Scots who saw through it.
Shuup yer scaly bak basterd.
The NO campaign rightly recruited Scottish heavyweights to front the campaign. When the Sssenachs turned up the SNP rent a mob turned up with them and shouted them down. The same would have happened if the turned up a year ago. I know that, you know that . Its just that you are not honest enough to admit it.
Dont give us the BS about not being anti English but anti Westminster because it wont wash. The SNP were anti anything that contradicted its claims..including JK Rowling ffs.
Nope Prescott was barracked as soon as he opened his mouth. Maybe its you that reads the Mail not me.
The big guns were not stupid enough to put themselves in that position..
The words new democratic or movement is not the preserve of the SNP. 45 you can have all your very own if you want.
It wasnt a bluff . The West Lothian question will be addressed. Also the Northern counties will not allow assets to pass over their heads into Scotland. If you have a problem with that then tell a Geordie .
You dont know who joined....and if they are non voters they are not enough to have an impact.
Well a 5% increase in the NO vote would have meant an even more crushing victory....so what? The reality is that there was quite a large margin between the victors and losers.
The SNP may or may not be riding high in the polls. That means nothing. What matters is that Scotland voted by a clear margin to stay in the union.
The SNP is on the run and claiming to ensure that Westminster keeps to its promises that it gave to the NO voters.
All the bluff and bluster by SNP losers cannot refute it :P
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morayloon
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gansao
Sep 27 2014, 08:51 PM


gansao
 
You still have not got the wit to realise that the Scots independence would be seen as the break uf the UK by the English...and you accuse ME of being ridiculous
WTF are you on about? I, as a Scottish Nationalist, don't know it is about the break up of the UK? What else is it about?
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You also seem to be oblivious of the fact that practically any criticism , warning, in fact any refutation of the Salmond delusional model of an independent Scotland was written off as English lies and bullying
So, you equate Westminser with the English then? I think you have been taken in by the propaganda. Provide evidence of when AS uttered an anti-English statement.

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Hence any opinion from England that mirrored it was met with an irate Scot telling us that we hate and underestimate Scots. Just look around the few UK debate forums and find out for yourself
I take part in several and have yet to encounter anyone who has uttered an anti-English statement. Again, provide some evidence.
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The oil belongs to the oil companies. You may get revenue but that revenue will decrease over time
The same thing applies to the UK.

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Then its just Whisky and Tartan..
Distilling & Tourism, two very important industries in the Scottish economy.

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There will be far more devolution for Scotland. Your trouble is that it probably will become part of a general UK debate before you get it
I hope more powers will be transferred - anything is better than nothing! However the Establishment has form: 1979.
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Believe me the Scots will not be allowed to dominate the question of ' what is right and fair'
We will be the arbiters of 'what is right and fair' in Scotland.

Quote:
 
I'm on about the Scottish voters rejecting the primary reason for SNP existence
1.6 million voted for Independence. A swing of just over 5% would have won it for Yes.
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Now the SNP have been told emphatically that the Scots do not want to break from the union it is trying to champion the premise of the NO vote
I will repeat, WTF are you on about? The SNP taking on the No arguments? What planet are you on?

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morayloon
Sep 27 2014, 09:24 PM
gansao
Sep 27 2014, 08:51 PM


gansao
 
You still have not got the wit to realise that the Scots independence would be seen as the break uf the UK by the English...and you accuse ME of being ridiculous
WTF are you on about? I, as a Scottish Nationalist, don't know it is about the break up of the UK? What else is it about?
Quote:
 
You also seem to be oblivious of the fact that practically any criticism , warning, in fact any refutation of the Salmond delusional model of an independent Scotland was written off as English lies and bullying
So, you equate Westminser with the English then? I think you have been taken in by the propaganda. Provide evidence of when AS uttered an anti-English statement.

Quote:
 
Hence any opinion from England that mirrored it was met with an irate Scot telling us that we hate and underestimate Scots. Just look around the few UK debate forums and find out for yourself
I take part in several and have yet to encounter anyone who has uttered an anti-English statement. Again, provide some evidence.
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The oil belongs to the oil companies. You may get revenue but that revenue will decrease over time
The same thing applies to the UK.

Quote:
 
Then its just Whisky and Tartan..
Distilling & Tourism, two very important industries in the Scottish economy.

Quote:
 
There will be far more devolution for Scotland. Your trouble is that it probably will become part of a general UK debate before you get it
I hope more powers will be transferred - anything is better than nothing! However the Establishment has form: 1979.
Quote:
 
Believe me the Scots will not be allowed to dominate the question of ' what is right and fair'
We will be the arbiters of 'what is right and fair' in Scotland.

Quote:
 
I'm on about the Scottish voters rejecting the primary reason for SNP existence
1.6 million voted for Independence. A swing of just over 5% would have won it for Yes.
Quote:
 
Now the SNP have been told emphatically that the Scots do not want to break from the union it is trying to champion the premise of the NO vote
I will repeat, WTF are you on about? The SNP taking on the No arguments? What planet are you on?



WTF are you on about? As a Scottish nationalist it has nothing to do with the break up of the union. Its about Scotland breaking away from it and the rest of the union having no say in it. If you cant see the difference then you have tunnel vision .
Either you have not seen Salmond on the TV or you are being deliberately disingenuous. I have watched Salmond and other SNP members claim time after time that warnings about post indy problems concerning currency, business flight, NATO and EU were nothing but lies and bullying.
I am not going to search the 'net for it.As for equating Westminster with England, yes in case you didnt know Westminster is actually in England..ffs.

I do not believe that you have taken part in many and never encountered a Scot telling that most if any English poster that criticised the SNP view of being anti Scottish.Do not misrepresent what I post. Again I am not searching other forums that I post and posting links. In fact this view from many Scottish posters is so common that I believe you are not being honest in denying it.
The UK is not so dependent on oil as a independent Scotland or any Scotland that relies on or claims its revenues as its own.
Powers will be transferred throughout the UK and Scotland will not dominate the debate.
Nope Scotland will be part of the debate of what is right and fair throughout the UK.As part of the Union they will have the appropriate influence in what happens in the union,
And a further 5% swing to the NO vote would have been a crushing blow to the SNP...now get back to reality..
Obviously on planet reality. The SNP LOST ffs. They have no mandate for independence so they are telling us that they will make sure that ' westminster' keeps its promises to the NO voters. Are you really that thick?
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morayloon
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gansao
Sep 27 2014, 09:21 PM

gansao
 
]They said exactly that. There would be no problem about sterling, the EU,NATO, business flight. They would become the new Scandinavians
There would be no problem with sterling. Only in the minds of the bullying Establishment was this an issue. We would have been members of the EU, NATO and the UN. Scandinavia, especially Norway, was used as an example of how we could run our country.
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It wasnt the media who claimed that , it was Salmond and his deluded crew and YOU were obviously one of them who bought it
It is very evident that you like making accusations without providing any evidence. Neither AS nor the SNP has said an Independent Scotland would be a utopia ... prove otherwise.
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Salmond said time and time again and so did his minions
If he said it so often you should have no problem coming up with examples.

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Shuup yer scaly bak basterd
Is this really the best you can come up with?

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When the Sssenachs turned up the SNP rent a mob turned up with them and shouted them down
The media furore over Farage's contretemp with a few students is the only occasion I know of.

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Dont give us the BS about not being anti English but anti Westminster because it wont wash
I will ask you again to provide evidence of the SNP being anti-English!!!

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The SNP were anti anything that contradicted its claims..including JK Rowling ffs
The SNP had nothing to do with the small number of comments on twitter. Prove otherwise

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The words new democratic or movement is not the preserve of the SNP. 45 you can have all your very own if you want
The 45 is the only democratic movement that has come from the referendum
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he West Lothian question will be addressed
It is very seldom that Scots MPs make the difference in English only matters. However it has worked the other way many times: think Poll Tax & Bedroom Tax.
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You dont know who joined...
But then, neither do you. I do know several people who have joined. Some were SNP voters who were enthused by the campaign and wanted to take a more active part in party politics. Others have not voted for some time but were similarly enthused.
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and if they are non voters they are not enough to have an impact
84% voted. Only 50%+ voted in 2011with about 64% in 2010. That is a lot of non voters who decided to take part in the referendum

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The SNP may or may not be riding high in the polls. That means nothing. What matters is that Scotland voted by a clear margin to stay in the union
And the 45 continues the struggle.
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The SNP is on the run and claiming to ensure that Westminster keeps to its promises that it gave to the NO voters
A party riding high in the polls is, by definition, not 'on the run'. The promise was given to that small number of people who were 'soft' Yes backers. The vast majority of No's had made up their minds long before the panic driven vow came from Westminster.
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morayloon
Sep 27 2014, 10:00 PM
gansao
Sep 27 2014, 09:21 PM

gansao
 
]They said exactly that. There would be no problem about sterling, the EU,NATO, business flight. They would become the new Scandinavians
There would be no problem with sterling. Only in the minds of the bullying Establishment was this an issue. We would have been members of the EU, NATO and the UN. Scandinavia, especially Norway, was used as an example of how we could run our country.
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It wasnt the media who claimed that , it was Salmond and his deluded crew and YOU were obviously one of them who bought it
It is very evident that you like making accusations without providing any evidence. Neither AS nor the SNP has said an Independent Scotland would be a utopia ... prove otherwise.
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Salmond said time and time again and so did his minions
If he said it so often you should have no problem coming up with examples.

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Shuup yer scaly bak basterd
Is this really the best you can come up with?

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When the Sssenachs turned up the SNP rent a mob turned up with them and shouted them down
The media furore over Farage's contretemp with a few students is the only occasion I know of.

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Dont give us the BS about not being anti English but anti Westminster because it wont wash
I will ask you again to provide evidence of the SNP being anti-English!!!

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The SNP were anti anything that contradicted its claims..including JK Rowling ffs
The SNP had nothing to do with the small number of comments on twitter. Prove otherwise

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The words new democratic or movement is not the preserve of the SNP. 45 you can have all your very own if you want
The 45 is the only democratic movement that has come from the referendum
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he West Lothian question will be addressed
It is very seldom that Scots MPs make the difference in English only matters. However it has worked the other way many times: think Poll Tax & Bedroom Tax.
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You dont know who joined...
But then, neither do you. I do know several people who have joined. Some were SNP voters who were enthused by the campaign and wanted to take a more active part in party politics. Others have not voted for some time but were similarly enthused.
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and if they are non voters they are not enough to have an impact
84% voted. Only 50%+ voted in 2011with about 64% in 2010. That is a lot of non voters who decided to take part in the referendum

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The SNP may or may not be riding high in the polls. That means nothing. What matters is that Scotland voted by a clear margin to stay in the union
And the 45 continues the struggle.
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The SNP is on the run and claiming to ensure that Westminster keeps to its promises that it gave to the NO voters
A party riding high in the polls is, by definition, not 'on the run'. The promise was given to that small number of people who were 'soft' Yes backers. The vast majority of No's had made up their minds long before the panic driven vow came from Westminster.


There you go. You bought the SNP kool aid and still like the taste. You are lucky that the NO voters saved you from yourself.
Jeez you are so stupid that you want me to provide evidence when you did it yourself in you first line...There would be no problem with sterling. Only in the minds of the bullying Establishment was this an issue. We would have been members of the EU, NATO and the UN. Scandinavia, especially Norway, was used as an example of how we could run our country.

..
Are you actually saying that Salmond did not say the very thing that you said in your first line?...There would be no problem with sterling. Only in the minds of the BULLYING ESTABLISHMENT was this an issue. We would have been members of the EU, NATO and the UN. Scandinavia, especially Norway, was used as an example of how we could run our country.

You should of set the bar higher if you wanted wit.

Then you should have looked a bit more. The barracking of Prescott wasnt a secret.
By telling us that the heart of English government ( in SNP eyes) is a source of lies and bullying you are making an anti English claim.
I'm sure you will say that the SNP has nothing to do with the barracking of English politicians when they tried to make a case but that would be rather disingenuous as the SNP set the anti English ( establishment) tone.
Scottish labour MPs potentially make the difference between a labour and Tory UK government. As you said WTF, are you making this up?
No I dont know who joined but even a tiny bit of intelligence will indicate that people who voted NO would be unlikely to join a party that they voted against just a few weeks ago .
I referred to the spanking new SNP members not all of the non voters. If ALL of the new SNP members were non voters it wouldnt matter anyway because the vote has been taken and will not be repeated for a while yet, if ever. Sorry for the bad news.
45 may be continuing the struggle but unlike the pre referendum UK, the rest of us want a say in the WHOLE of the union that Scotland does not want to leave. This is not just your debate anymore.
TBH polls at this point mean nothing. There is a chance that SNP will become irrelevant in the near future..and dont forget there was a poll that indicated that the YES votes would win..they didnt.
I am glad that you recognise that the vast majority of NO voters were already not convinced by the SNP delusion. I am convinced that the late promises by Cameron were not needed. In fact IMO they did nothing to sway the No voters but gave the SNP another hobby horse to ride.

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morayloon
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gansao
Sep 27 2014, 09:50 PM
gansao
 
WTF are you on about? As a Scottish nationalist it has nothing to do with the break up of the union
What is that supposed to mean?
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Its about Scotland breaking away from it and the rest of the union having no say in it. If you cant see the difference then you have tunnel vision
Scotland leaving the Union is a matter for the people of Scotland.

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Either you have not seen Salmond on the TV or you are being deliberately disingenuous
Salmond has never uttered any anti English statement

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I have watched Salmond and other SNP members claim time after time that warnings about post indy problems concerning currency, business flight, NATO and EU were nothing but lies and bullying
And when was it ever asserted it was 'English' bullying. As I asked, what planet are you on?

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I am not going to search the 'net for it.As for equating Westminster with England, yes in case you didnt know Westminster is actually in England..ffs
So, you can't tell the difference?
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I do not believe that you have taken part in many and never encountered a Scot telling that most if any English poster that criticised the SNP view of being anti Scottish
I have never come across it and I post on several forums.

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Do not misrepresent what I post
I do not think I did.
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Again I am not searching other forums that I post and posting links
In other words you can't back up your scurrilous accusations

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In fact this view from many Scottish posters is so common that I believe you are not being honest in denying it
I am denying it because in my experience it does not happen. Perhaps I am not posting on forums you look at. But if you make accusations you should have the decency to provide something to back them up.

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The UK is not so dependent on oil as a independent Scotland or any Scotland that relies on or claims its revenues as its own
Without the oil money Thatcher would not have been able to carry out her social experiments. Scotland would not be as reliant on oil as you seem to think.
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Powers will be transferred throughout the UK and Scotland will not dominate the debate
We shall see

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Nope Scotland will be part of the debate of what is right and fair throughout the UK
If Scots thinks their country is not being treated fairly, support for Independence will rise. The genie is out of the bottle, the constitutioal question will be with us for years to come - until Independence arrives.

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And a further 5% swing to the NO vote would have been a crushing blow to the SNP...
Not only can you not tell the difference between Westminster & England,. It is obvious you have the same problem with Yes and SNP. The reason the 5% is important is that the Establishment more or less bought the votes of prospective Yessers. Without the vow Yes might actually have won.
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Obviously on planet reality
Obviously? A bit of a dreamer aren't you?

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The SNP LOST ffs
Yes lost
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They have no mandate for independence so they are telling us that they will make sure that ' westminster' keeps its promises to the NO voters
It should be rather obvious, even to you, that, having accepted defeat, the SNP, Greens & SSP are intent on ensuring that promises made in the last week of the campaign are kept.
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Are you really that thick?
Pot & kettle springs to mind.
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morayloon
Sep 27 2014, 10:35 PM
gansao
Sep 27 2014, 09:50 PM
gansao
 
WTF are you on about? As a Scottish nationalist it has nothing to do with the break up of the union
What is that supposed to mean?
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Its about Scotland breaking away from it and the rest of the union having no say in it. If you cant see the difference then you have tunnel vision
Scotland leaving the Union is a matter for the people of Scotland.

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Either you have not seen Salmond on the TV or you are being deliberately disingenuous
Salmond has never uttered any anti English statement

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I have watched Salmond and other SNP members claim time after time that warnings about post indy problems concerning currency, business flight, NATO and EU were nothing but lies and bullying
And when was it ever asserted it was 'English' bullying. As I asked, what planet are you on?

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I am not going to search the 'net for it.As for equating Westminster with England, yes in case you didnt know Westminster is actually in England..ffs
So, you can't tell the difference?
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I do not believe that you have taken part in many and never encountered a Scot telling that most if any English poster that criticised the SNP view of being anti Scottish
I have never come across it and I post on several forums.

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Do not misrepresent what I post
I do not think I did.
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Again I am not searching other forums that I post and posting links
In other words you can't back up your scurrilous accusations

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In fact this view from many Scottish posters is so common that I believe you are not being honest in denying it
I am denying it because in my experience it does not happen. Perhaps I am not posting on forums you look at. But if you make accusations you should have the decency to provide something to back them up.

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The UK is not so dependent on oil as a independent Scotland or any Scotland that relies on or claims its revenues as its own
Without the oil money Thatcher would not have been able to carry out her social experiments. Scotland would not be as reliant on oil as you seem to think.
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Powers will be transferred throughout the UK and Scotland will not dominate the debate
We shall see

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Nope Scotland will be part of the debate of what is right and fair throughout the UK
If Scots thinks their country is not being treated fairly, support for Independence will rise. The genie is out of the bottle, the constitutioal question will be with us for years to come - until Independence arrives.

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And a further 5% swing to the NO vote would have been a crushing blow to the SNP...
Not only can you not tell the difference between Westminster & England,. It is obvious you have the same problem with Yes and SNP. The reason the 5% is important is that the Establishment more or less bought the votes of prospective Yessers. Without the vow Yes might actually have won.
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Obviously on planet reality
Obviously? A bit of a dreamer aren't you?

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The SNP LOST ffs
Yes lost
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They have no mandate for independence so they are telling us that they will make sure that ' westminster' keeps its promises to the NO voters
It should be rather obvious, even to you, that, having accepted defeat, the SNP, Greens & SSP are intent on ensuring that promises made in the last week of the campaign are kept.
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Are you really that thick?
Pot & kettle springs to mind.


And that where you demonstrate your ignorance. Scotland breaking away from the union equates to the union breaking up. Yet according to you and your SNP friends the break up of the union has nothing to do with the rest of the union .
Salmond has credited the bullying to Westminster.Westminster is the heart of English politics and the politicians that he accused of bullying are English.
You seem to be just as shifty as Salmond.
As you do not seem to be able to recognise a connection between Westminster and England. I am starting to believe that you may not be able to recognise the accusation of English people being accused of being anti Scottish.
You did not think.
No I admit that I cant be bothered to post links and TBH I dont want to provide links to other peoples posts on other forums.
Nope I will just accuse you of being dishonest .
Scotland was banking on the oil. It was a major part of the YES campaign. So important that there was a debate of how long the oil would be viable. Maybe you never saw this.
Now Scotland has decided to keep in the union they will have the consideration that a that should be accorded to them.
If the debate starts again in Scotland regarding independence they will still have to come to terms with the problems that they would encounter post independence. No sterling, no Nato, business flight, problems regarding EU etc etc. They will need to produce an SNP leader that has a ' plan B' instead of persistently denying reality . The NO votes will probably be higher than the last referendum.
Your problem is that you still are trying to peddle the illusion that when the SNP claim that Westminster is full of liars and bullies they are claiming that Westminster does not represent the whole of England. If you accuse the heart of English politics then by association you accuse the rest of the country.

I have to say that if you are anything to go by, the SNP has not learned anything from its defeat.
You do not recognise that the premise of the SNP ( independence) has been rejected by the people of Scotland and all you have left is the promise to make good the assurances given to the people who voted NO . The SNP is fast becoming irrelevant and seems to be relying on Cameron breaking his promise for its future existence.
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Stan Still
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morayloon
Sep 27 2014, 08:08 AM
The referendum may have been lost but the struggle goes on. The SNP now say that membership numbers have soared to over 65,000 http://www.snp.org/media-centre/news/2014/sep/snp-membership-soars-over-65000 since the 19th. This makes it the third party in the UK overtaking the Britain wide LibDem total.
The Nationalists' partners in the campaign have also seen increases - Scottish Greens up 4000 https://www.scottishgreens.org.uk/category/news/
and the SSP: "As of 23 September, more than 2,100 people had joined the party since the referendum result was declared" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_Socialist_Party#Scottish_independence_referendum.2C_2014
Thousands have been politicised because of the campaign, they are not going away any time soon.
Those living in Scotland not all of them Scots were asked for their opinion they gave it, like it or not you have to accept their decision, at least you were asked a yes vote may have badly damaged the 50 odd million in the Union who were not.
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Tytoalba
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morayloon
Sep 27 2014, 08:08 AM
The referendum may have been lost but the struggle goes on. The SNP now say that membership numbers have soared to over 65,000 http://www.snp.org/media-centre/news/2014/sep/snp-membership-soars-over-65000 since the 19th. This makes it the third party in the UK overtaking the Britain wide LibDem total.
The Nationalists' partners in the campaign have also seen increases - Scottish Greens up 4000 https://www.scottishgreens.org.uk/category/news/
and the SSP: "As of 23 September, more than 2,100 people had joined the party since the referendum result was declared" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scottish_Socialist_Party#Scottish_independence_referendum.2C_2014
Thousands have been politicised because of the campaign, they are not going away any time soon.
65 000 out of a population of six million is miniscule in comparison.Gibve it a year or two and they will drift away.
The Referendum was lost by the Yes vote by a big margin, so accept it and unify. It was a bad idea anyway and in ten years time the oil which the Yes campaign depended on wil have depleted even more.
The democratic vote was a big NO and its not going to change.
United we stand, divided we fall.
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morayloon
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gansao
Sep 27 2014, 11:18 PM
gansao
Sep 27 2014, 09:50 PM

Yet according to you and your SNP friends the break up of the union has nothing to do with the rest of the union
Of course it hasn't. Why should 55 million people have a say on whether 5 million are going to leave the union? Scotland united with England - it was not taken over by England. Scots retain the right to self-determination - and that means deciding its own future, not being forced to accept the will of the larger partner.

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Salmond has credited the bullying to Westminster.Westminster is the heart of English politics and the politicians that he accused of bullying are English
He criticises English politicians? So what! He has criticised Scots as well. Anyway what has denigrating a few pompous politicians got to do with anti-Englishness?

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As you do not seem to be able to recognise a connection between Westminster and England
Westminster is in England. So what? Criticism of the former is not a mark of anti-Englishness

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No I admit that I cant be bothered to post links and TBH I dont want to provide links to other peoples posts on other forums
So you can't locate anything then? What are you scared of? That your links would be ridiculed?
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Nope I will just accuse you of being dishonest
At it again. Give some proof of my dishonesty.

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Scotland was banking on the oil
Not so. Oil revenue would have been the icing on the cake.
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It was a major part of the YES campaign
No it wasn't. The Noers tried to make it an issue but all their accusations and scare stories were knocked back and shown to be utter ****.
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So important that there was a debate of how long the oil would be viable. Maybe you never saw this
New fields are coming on tap, new fields are being found and technological advances mean that oil can be reached when previosly it couldn't. Notable that a big find was reported http://www.businessforscotland.co.uk/clair-ridge-and-scotlands-new-oil-boom/

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If the debate starts again in Scotland regarding independence they will still have to come to terms with the problems that they would encounter post independence. No sterling, no Nato, business flight, problems regarding EU etc etc. They will need to produce an SNP leader that has a ' plan B' instead of persistently denying reality . The NO votes will probably be higher than the last referendum
Stuff and nonsense.

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Your problem is that you still are trying to peddle the illusion that when the SNP claim that Westminster is full of liars and bullies they are claiming that Westminster does not represent the whole of England
??? Are you now equating England with the UK?

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I have to say that if you are anything to go by, the SNP has not learned anything from its defeat
Rubbish. It has learned that 45% of Scots support Independence,

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You do not recognise that the premise of the SNP ( independence) has been rejected by the people of Scotland and all you have left is the promise to make good the assurances given to the people who voted NO
Point to where I posted that I did nor recognise that we were defeated. However one battle is not the end of a war. The 45 will keep the fire burning and we will be ready to win the next time round.
As for the assurances. These were not made to the whole of the Noers. The vow only appeared in the last week. Cameron had ensured that devo-max was not on the table, but the Establishment, seeing their lead drift away, resurrected the policy in an attempt to prevent defeat. It worked. The jury is out on whether the promises will be delivered.

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The SNP is fast becoming irrelevant and seems to be relying on Cameron breaking his promise for its future existence
No idea of what is happening in Scotland have you? 45,000 new members for the SNPwhilst the other Yes parties increased membership dramatically. The Westminster parties stagnating. The SNP at 49% in a recent poll (Survation) and in the lead on Westminster voting intentions.
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morayloon
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Stan Still
Sep 28 2014, 08:36 AM
StanStill
 
Those living in Scotland not all of them Scots were asked for their opinion they gave it, like it or not you have to accept their decision
I accept defeat but that doesn't mean the fight is over. Thousands have been energised and enthused by the campaign. They are not going away any time soon.

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at least you were asked a yes vote may have badly damaged the 50 odd million in the Union who were not
The issue was Scotland's Independence. It was a matter for Scots. What right has another country to decide Scotland's future?

Tytoalba
 
65 000 out of a population of six million is miniscule in comparison.Gibve it a year or two and they will drift away
The figures are 70,000 and 5.3 million. 1.3% of the population are members of one political party.
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The Referendum was lost by the Yes vote by a big margin, so accept it and unify
For umpteenth time, I accept defeay BUT that does not mean I sop working for the independence of my country

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It was a bad idea anyway and in ten years time the oil which the Yes campaign depended on wil have depleted even more
It was a very good idea. The oil is going to last for decades. We in Scotland have become used to Westminster underplaying the quantity and value of oil left. Anyway, if there is not so much oil remaining. it is going to affect the UK.
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The democratic vote was a big NO and its not going to change
A swing of only just over 5% would have been enough to win it for Yes. Who knows what would have happened if the vow had not been made.
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