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Devolve Weights and Measures – says pro-metric group
Topic Started: Nov 2 2014, 09:04 AM (331 Views)
scorpio
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Devolve Weights and Measures – says pro-metric group

Weights and Measures and related matters (such as road signs) should be devolved to the Scottish Parliament – according to the UK Metric Association.

See link... http://metricviews.org.uk/2014/11/devolve-weights-and-measures-says-pro-metric-group/

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AndyK
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Not a good idea, the SNP would have them driving on the right.

Anyway, as I argued with one Aussie bartender in Sydney a couple weeks ago...who wants to go down the pub for a 425ml ?

Doesn't make sense !
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scorpio
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AndyK
Nov 2 2014, 09:13 AM
Not a good idea, the SNP would have them driving on the right.

Anyway, as I argued with one Aussie bartender in Sydney a couple weeks ago...who wants to go down the pub for a 425ml ?

Doesn't make sense !
But why should the authority to change road signs be devolved in Northern Ireland but not in Scotland.
Edited by scorpio, Nov 2 2014, 09:27 AM.
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AndyK
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scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 09:26 AM
AndyK
Nov 2 2014, 09:13 AM
Not a good idea, the SNP would have them driving on the right.

Anyway, as I argued with one Aussie bartender in Sydney a couple weeks ago...who wants to go down the pub for a 425ml ?

Doesn't make sense !
But why should the authority to change road signs be devolved in Northern Ireland but not in Scotland.
As far as I am aware road signs are put up by councils, the welsh ones are bi-lingual.
Edited by AndyK, Nov 2 2014, 09:46 AM.
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Pro Veritas
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scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 09:26 AM
But why should the authority to change road signs be devolved in Northern Ireland but not in Scotland.
Surely then the ONLY logical extension to this line of thinking (and I know you don't do logic that well) is to de-devolve that power in Northern Ireland.

As it stands it is devolved in NI but not in Scotland, Wales or England.

Were the democratic principle to be applied here (and as a supporter of the EU I know you don't do democracy too well either) that would require that NI lose that devolved power.

All The Best
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scorpio
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Pro Veritas
Nov 2 2014, 10:06 AM
scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 09:26 AM
But why should the authority to change road signs be devolved in Northern Ireland but not in Scotland.
Surely then the ONLY logical extension to this line of thinking (and I know you don't do logic that well) is to de-devolve that power in Northern Ireland.

As it stands it is devolved in NI but not in Scotland, Wales or England.

Were the democratic principle to be applied here (and as a supporter of the EU I know you don't do democracy too well either) that would require that NI lose that devolved power.

All The Best
Well.. The only conclusion I can draw from your comment, is that in your opinion,

A Northern Ireland, that is not devolved, is MORE democratic and,

A Northern Ireland, that is devolved, is LESS democratic.

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Pro Veritas
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scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 10:37 AM
Pro Veritas
Nov 2 2014, 10:06 AM
scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 09:26 AM
But why should the authority to change road signs be devolved in Northern Ireland but not in Scotland.
Surely then the ONLY logical extension to this line of thinking (and I know you don't do logic that well) is to de-devolve that power in Northern Ireland.

As it stands it is devolved in NI but not in Scotland, Wales or England.

Were the democratic principle to be applied here (and as a supporter of the EU I know you don't do democracy too well either) that would require that NI lose that devolved power.

All The Best
Well.. The only conclusion I can draw from your comment, is that in your opinion,

A Northern Ireland, that is not devolved, is MORE democratic and,

A Northern Ireland, that is devolved, is LESS democratic.

As I said, as a supporter of the EU you clearly don't do democracy or understand it as you have completely missed the point I was making.

All The Best
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scorpio
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Pro Veritas
Nov 2 2014, 10:57 AM
scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 10:37 AM
Pro Veritas
Nov 2 2014, 10:06 AM
scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 09:26 AM
But why should the authority to change road signs be devolved in Northern Ireland but not in Scotland.
Surely then the ONLY logical extension to this line of thinking (and I know you don't do logic that well) is to de-devolve that power in Northern Ireland.

As it stands it is devolved in NI but not in Scotland, Wales or England.

Were the democratic principle to be applied here (and as a supporter of the EU I know you don't do democracy too well either) that would require that NI lose that devolved power.

All The Best
Well.. The only conclusion I can draw from your comment, is that in your opinion,

A Northern Ireland, that is not devolved, is MORE democratic and,

A Northern Ireland, that is devolved, is LESS democratic.

As I said, as a supporter of the EU you clearly don't do democracy or understand it as you have completely missed the point I was making.

All The Best
IMO the people of Scotland, should be given the authority to metricate their road signs, the same as the people of Northern Ireland have the authority to metricate their road signs.
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RJD
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AndyK
Nov 2 2014, 09:13 AM
Not a good idea, the SNP would have them driving on the right.

Anyway, as I argued with one Aussie bartender in Sydney a couple weeks ago...who wants to go down the pub for a 425ml ?

Doesn't make sense !
That is OK, but they are likely to do so in phases with Lorries in the first 6 months then private cars.
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RJD
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AndyK
Nov 2 2014, 09:44 AM
scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 09:26 AM
AndyK
Nov 2 2014, 09:13 AM
Not a good idea, the SNP would have them driving on the right.

Anyway, as I argued with one Aussie bartender in Sydney a couple weeks ago...who wants to go down the pub for a 425ml ?

Doesn't make sense !
But why should the authority to change road signs be devolved in Northern Ireland but not in Scotland.
As far as I am aware road signs are put up by councils, the welsh ones are bi-lingual.
They are with the Welsh at the top, however, 99% of us who live there only read the bottom line.
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Pro Veritas
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scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 11:10 AM
IMO the people of Scotland, should be given the authority to metricate their road signs, the same as the people of Northern Ireland have the authority to metricate their road signs.
Still missing the point I see.

So let me explain it to you.

There are 4 constituent parts of GB. England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland.

The principles of democracy are that the "majority rule".

Three of those Nations do NOT have devolved powers on Metrification, one does.

Ergo in order to meet the "majority rule" principle NI should lose devolved powers on Metrification.

All The Best
Edited by Pro Veritas, Nov 2 2014, 05:04 PM.
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scorpio
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Pro Veritas
Nov 2 2014, 05:04 PM
scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 11:10 AM
IMO the people of Scotland, should be given the authority to metricate their road signs, the same as the people of Northern Ireland have the authority to metricate their road signs.
Still missing the point I see.

So let me explain it to you.

There are 4 constituent parts of GB. England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland.

The principles of democracy are that the "majority rule".

Three of those Nations do NOT have devolved powers on Metrification, one does.

Ergo in order to meet the "majority rule" principle NI should lose devolved powers on Metrification.

All The Best
You have been mis-informed.

Your statement that .. Quote. There are 4 constituent parts of GB. England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland. End of quote . Is wrong.

However, although I agree that. .. The principles of democracy are that the "majority rule".... It is the people who should ultimately " majority rule " and if the people of Northern Ireland want the status quo, and there is no indication to the contrary, then the situation should remain as it currently is.

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RoofGardener
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Watch out for these metric devolutionists. Give 'em an inch, and they'll take a kilometer !
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johnofgwent
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AndyK
Nov 2 2014, 09:13 AM
Anyway, as I argued with one Aussie bartender in Sydney a couple weeks ago...who wants to go down the pub for a 425ml ?

Doesn't make sense !
Bloody right it doesn't, it should be 568 ml and FFS I'm only a biologist who is used to a 30% coefficient of variation
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Tigger
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AndyK
Nov 2 2014, 09:13 AM
Not a good idea, the SNP would have them driving on the right.

Anyway, as I argued with one Aussie bartender in Sydney a couple weeks ago...who wants to go down the pub for a 425ml ?

Doesn't make sense !
Don't they call that a schooner (sp?) or something?
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Tigger
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johnofgwent
Nov 2 2014, 09:10 PM
AndyK
Nov 2 2014, 09:13 AM
Anyway, as I argued with one Aussie bartender in Sydney a couple weeks ago...who wants to go down the pub for a 425ml ?

Doesn't make sense !
Bloody right it doesn't, it should be 568 ml and FFS I'm only a biologist who is used to a 30% coefficient of variation
Do you want ice in that or not? ;-)
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AndyK
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Tigger
Nov 2 2014, 09:15 PM
AndyK
Nov 2 2014, 09:13 AM
Not a good idea, the SNP would have them driving on the right.

Anyway, as I argued with one Aussie bartender in Sydney a couple weeks ago...who wants to go down the pub for a 425ml ?

Doesn't make sense !
Don't they call that a schooner (sp?) or something?
Yes it is, and their excuse is a pint gets too warm by the time you get to the bottom.

I would have thought the obvious solution was to have an half !

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AndyK
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johnofgwent
Nov 2 2014, 09:10 PM
AndyK
Nov 2 2014, 09:13 AM
Anyway, as I argued with one Aussie bartender in Sydney a couple weeks ago...who wants to go down the pub for a 425ml ?

Doesn't make sense !
Bloody right it doesn't, it should be 568 ml and FFS I'm only a biologist who is used to a 30% coefficient of variation
As Tigger pointed out, they use a Schooner which is 425ml
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Curious Cdn
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AndyK
Nov 2 2014, 09:31 PM
johnofgwent
Nov 2 2014, 09:10 PM
AndyK
Nov 2 2014, 09:13 AM
Anyway, as I argued with one Aussie bartender in Sydney a couple weeks ago...who wants to go down the pub for a 425ml ?

Doesn't make sense !
Bloody right it doesn't, it should be 568 ml and FFS I'm only a biologist who is used to a 30% coefficient of variation
As Tigger pointed out, they use a Schooner which is 425ml
Buy it by the litre and you will have no worries.

[... pictures a Hobbit saying: "What's that? A liter!!? You can buy it by the litre?!! I'm going to get me one of those!!"]
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scorpio
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johnofgwent
Nov 2 2014, 09:10 PM
AndyK
Nov 2 2014, 09:13 AM
Anyway, as I argued with one Aussie bartender in Sydney a couple weeks ago...who wants to go down the pub for a 425ml ?

Doesn't make sense !
Bloody right it doesn't, it should be 568 ml and FFS I'm only a biologist who is used to a 30% coefficient of variation
Actually the glassware you call a pint is now 570 mL..
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Pro Veritas
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scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 08:26 PM

However, although I agree that. .. The principles of democracy are that the "majority rule".... It is the people who should ultimately " majority rule " and if the people of Northern Ireland want the status quo, and there is no indication to the contrary, then the situation should remain as it currently is.

So you now advocate power being stripped from the EU and returned to the people of the nations who make up the EU?

All The Best
Edited by Pro Veritas, Nov 3 2014, 12:36 AM.
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johnofgwent
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scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 09:49 PM
Actually the glassware you call a pint is now 570 mL..
THAT I would have no problem with ... no weights and measures bastard has ever successfully prosecuted anyone for providing MORE than they have to !

Coming back to the OP then, i wonder, who have this pressure group found in the Scottish Parliament who detests feet and inches then, because I feel it unlikely they would demand devolution of this unless they had a man in the inside ready to seize upon the fruits of their harangueing and implement it ...
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scorpio
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johnofgwent
Nov 3 2014, 07:07 AM
scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 09:49 PM
Actually the glassware you call a pint is now 570 mL..
THAT I would have no problem with ... no weights and measures bastard has ever successfully prosecuted anyone for providing MORE than they have to !

Coming back to the OP then, i wonder, who have this pressure group found in the Scottish Parliament who detests feet and inches then, because I feel it unlikely they would demand devolution of this unless they had a man in the inside ready to seize upon the fruits of their harangueing and implement it ...
Well considering that in a previous document, Scotland, actually the Scottish National Party, stated that there was no requirement, to change the weights and measures policy in Scotland, I think there is a good chance that this submission will be turned down.

Also considering that there other more important matters being discussed, like health, welfare, transport, military, education, etc, the measurement policy is very low on the priority list, and not something that requires immediate action.

But the window of opportunity, was there and the UKMA took that opportunity.
From their point of view, they would have been stupid not to have taken that action.


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AndyK
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scorpio
Nov 3 2014, 08:24 AM
johnofgwent
Nov 3 2014, 07:07 AM
scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 09:49 PM
Actually the glassware you call a pint is now 570 mL..
THAT I would have no problem with ... no weights and measures bastard has ever successfully prosecuted anyone for providing MORE than they have to !

Coming back to the OP then, i wonder, who have this pressure group found in the Scottish Parliament who detests feet and inches then, because I feel it unlikely they would demand devolution of this unless they had a man in the inside ready to seize upon the fruits of their harangueing and implement it ...
Well considering that in a previous document, Scotland, actually the Scottish National Party, stated that there was no requirement, to change the weights and measures policy in Scotland, I think there is a good chance that this submission will be turned down.

Also considering that there other more important matters being discussed, like health, welfare, transport, military, education, etc, the measurement policy is very low on the priority list, and not something that requires immediate action.

But the window of opportunity, was there and the UKMA took that opportunity.
From their point of view, they would have been stupid not to have taken that action.


Not to mention the sheer cost of changing all the road signs (and speed cameras) from miles to km.
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scorpio
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AndyK
Nov 3 2014, 08:32 AM
scorpio
Nov 3 2014, 08:24 AM
johnofgwent
Nov 3 2014, 07:07 AM
scorpio
Nov 2 2014, 09:49 PM
Actually the glassware you call a pint is now 570 mL..
THAT I would have no problem with ... no weights and measures bastard has ever successfully prosecuted anyone for providing MORE than they have to !

Coming back to the OP then, i wonder, who have this pressure group found in the Scottish Parliament who detests feet and inches then, because I feel it unlikely they would demand devolution of this unless they had a man in the inside ready to seize upon the fruits of their harangueing and implement it ...
Well considering that in a previous document, Scotland, actually the Scottish National Party, stated that there was no requirement, to change the weights and measures policy in Scotland, I think there is a good chance that this submission will be turned down.

Also considering that there other more important matters being discussed, like health, welfare, transport, military, education, etc, the measurement policy is very low on the priority list, and not something that requires immediate action.

But the window of opportunity, was there and the UKMA took that opportunity.
From their point of view, they would have been stupid not to have taken that action.


Not to mention the sheer cost of changing all the road signs (and speed cameras) from miles to km.
That cost is not as high as you may think. The Republic of Ireland took about a decade to change their distance signs, many of which were due for replacement anyway. It is a "one of cost" and a pittance, about 3% of the transport budget.

Also many of the speed cameras have and Imperial/metric option on them because they are also used in metric countries.
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AndyK
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scorpio
Nov 3 2014, 08:49 AM
AndyK
Nov 3 2014, 08:32 AM
scorpio
Nov 3 2014, 08:24 AM
johnofgwent
Nov 3 2014, 07:07 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
Well considering that in a previous document, Scotland, actually the Scottish National Party, stated that there was no requirement, to change the weights and measures policy in Scotland, I think there is a good chance that this submission will be turned down.

Also considering that there other more important matters being discussed, like health, welfare, transport, military, education, etc, the measurement policy is very low on the priority list, and not something that requires immediate action.

But the window of opportunity, was there and the UKMA took that opportunity.
From their point of view, they would have been stupid not to have taken that action.


Not to mention the sheer cost of changing all the road signs (and speed cameras) from miles to km.
That cost is not as high as you may think. The Republic of Ireland took about a decade to change their distance signs, many of which were due for replacement anyway. It is a "one of cost" and a pittance, about 3% of the transport budget.

Also many of the speed cameras have and Imperial/metric option on them because they are also used in metric countries.
I would prefer to keep miles ans they actually mean something....I mean, people will go the extra mile for something, nobodies going to go the extra km.

and what about height, if you are 6ft, it means something that people understand, its a tall bloke. Whats 1.8228m mean ? nobodies going to know if he's tall or a midget !

Yes I'll have those feet anyday, ask anybody what a third of a foot is and they will know its 4 inches exactly, try asking for a third of a meter.... oh yeah thats 333.333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333333.......mm

See? gonna take all day to say that !, just not practical at all these metric measures.

Who thought up this everything divided by ten nonsense anyway?


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Tigger
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AndyK
Nov 3 2014, 11:51 AM


Who thought up this everything divided by ten nonsense anyway?


Well if you hold your hands out in front of you and count the digits you might gain some insight on this thorny question. ;-)

And for someone who claims to work in a branch of the sciences your support of horse and cart era imperial seems all the more bizarre, although never discount pig headed intransigence.....
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Affa
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AndyK
Nov 3 2014, 11:51 AM


Who thought up this everything divided by ten nonsense anyway?



Yeah; and how long before 10 yards at a free kick becomes 9.1 meter confusing refs as to how to pace that distance out correctly? I have visions of John Cleese and the ministry of silly Walks.




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AndyK
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Tigger
Nov 3 2014, 12:08 PM
AndyK
Nov 3 2014, 11:51 AM


Who thought up this everything divided by ten nonsense anyway?


Well if you hold your hands out in front of you and count the digits you might gain some insight on this thorny question. ;-)

And for someone who claims to work in a branch of the sciences your support of horse and cart era imperial seems all the more bizarre, although never discount pig headed intransigence.....
Are you sure your not German?

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scorpio
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AndyK
Nov 3 2014, 08:32 AM [/quote


Who thought up this everything divided by ten nonsense anyway?


Actually it was an Englishman

John Wilkins FRS (14 February 1614 – 19 November 1672) was an English clergyman, natural philosopher and author, as well as one of the founders of the Royal Society. He was Bishop of Chester from 1668 until his death.

Wilkins is one of the few persons to have headed a college at both the University of Oxford and the University of Cambridge.

He is particularly known for An Essay towards a Real Character and a Philosophical Language (1668) in which, amongst other things, he proposed a universal language and a decimal system of measure not unlike the modern metric system.
Edited by scorpio, Nov 3 2014, 12:28 PM.
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Tigger
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AndyK
Nov 3 2014, 12:21 PM
Tigger
Nov 3 2014, 12:08 PM
AndyK
Nov 3 2014, 11:51 AM


Who thought up this everything divided by ten nonsense anyway?


Well if you hold your hands out in front of you and count the digits you might gain some insight on this thorny question. ;-)

And for someone who claims to work in a branch of the sciences your support of horse and cart era imperial seems all the more bizarre, although never discount pig headed intransigence.....
Are you sure your not German?

No, just rational.

Are you sure you are not Italian or Spanish? So much thinking with your heart and not your head. ;-)
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Tigger
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scorpio
Nov 3 2014, 12:26 PM
AndyK
Nov 3 2014, 08:32 AM [/quote


Who thought up this everything divided by ten nonsense anyway?


Actually it was an Englishman

John Wilkins FRS (14 February 1614 – 19 November 1672) was an English clergyman, natural philosopher and author, as well as one of the founders of the Royal Society. He was Bishop of Chester from 1668 until his death.

Wilkins is one of the few persons to have headed a college at both the University of Oxford and the University of Cambridge.

He is particularly known for An Essay towards a Real Character and a Philosophical Language (1668) in which, amongst other things, he proposed a universal language and a decimal system of measure not unlike the modern metric system.
HERETIC BURN HIM! ;D
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Steve K
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Affa
Nov 3 2014, 12:15 PM
AndyK
Nov 3 2014, 11:51 AM


Who thought up this everything divided by ten nonsense anyway?



Yeah; and how long before 10 yards at a free kick becomes 9.1 meter confusing refs as to how to pace that distance out correctly? I have visions of John Cleese and the ministry of silly Walks.




I hate to tell you this but they already have

http://www.thefa.com/football-rules-governance/laws/football-11-11/law-13---free-kicks

Watch the ref next time, they pace out 9 strides and paint their white line  :(
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AndyK
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Tigger
Nov 3 2014, 12:32 PM
AndyK
Nov 3 2014, 12:21 PM
Tigger
Nov 3 2014, 12:08 PM
AndyK
Nov 3 2014, 11:51 AM


Who thought up this everything divided by ten nonsense anyway?


Well if you hold your hands out in front of you and count the digits you might gain some insight on this thorny question. ;-)

And for someone who claims to work in a branch of the sciences your support of horse and cart era imperial seems all the more bizarre, although never discount pig headed intransigence.....
Are you sure your not German?

No, just rational.

Are you sure you are not Italian or Spanish? So much thinking with your heart and not your head. ;-)
Are you sure you have no German hereditary?

Quote:
 
People say the Germans have no sense of Humour ! But its not true, the only difference between the British and the Germans is that the Germans laugh when the work is done.


Henning Wehn
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RoofGardener
Nov 2 2014, 08:29 PM
Watch out for these metric devolutionists. Give 'em an inch, and they'll take a kilometer !
!clp!  !bgrin!
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