Quote:

 

EXCLUSIVE: Labour attempt to outflank Tories and Ukip on immigration
Rachel Reeves vows to curb access to out-of-work benefits for two years
Also wants to end the ‘absurdity’ of child benefit being exported to the EU
Could limit access to tax credits used by employees to top-up low wages
But agreement would be needed across the EU raising doubts about plan
Tories say: 'Nobody will believe what Labour say on immigration or welfare'

ACH1967

Nov 21 2014, 11:42 AM

C-too

Nov 21 2014, 11:30 AM

Major Sinic

Nov 21 2014, 09:48 AM

Tigger

Nov 20 2014, 07:53 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

You describe a very similar scenario regarding recruitment in your business to the situation I had in mine; the need for technically trained and skilled staff formed the majority of my workforce. In addition, because they were interfacing extensively with professionals they had to be totally fluent in written and spoken English. Therefore I too extensively employed British staff.

I also take on board your comments about housing, certainly in the South East and the damage that this can cause in terms of the aspiration and motivation of skilled staff, and in particular the younger ones. This opens up an entirely different direction for discussion with regard to this category of (skilled) worker.

My post focused on the unskilled and to a lesser extent the semi-skilled who in many cases lack any worth ethic. A fairly comprehensive, in comparative international terms, welfare support system enables people in this social sector or category to enjoy the basics of life without actually having to work. Very often the work that is available for this sector is not of sufficient economic value to justify higher payment and therefore the differential, if indeed a differential even exists in some cases, and it is therefore 'competing' with the welfare system. Without a work ethic and a sense of individual resonsibility the welfare system will always win.

We then throw immigration into the mix. Many economic migrants come from societies which make even our lowest socio-economic groups seem well off in comparision and the rewards they get from even the most menial work exceed their expectations. This either creates a work ethic or fosters one which latently existed and as a result many demonstrate a reliability and wllingness to work hard so often lacking in our own citizens. You can hardly blame a business owner or manager for employing the best option available whether a native Brit or a 'plucky immigrant'. One aside that I would make is that very often the employment exploitation of immigrants is carried out by their own countrymen and not by greedy British businessmen at all.



If these views qualify me as arrogant I will put my hands up. My refusal to suffer fools gladly often earns me this epitaph. Complacent? I don't think I would be debating the issues on a political forum if I was truly complacent.

Quote:

 

Now the disclaimer! I fully understand and accept that within the unskilled, unemployed sector there is a majority who want to work and gain skills. However it is my contention that there is a sizeable minority who don't want to work, either because they are simply bone idle or because any differential between unskilled wages and benefits is too small to be attractive.

There are more scenarios; People who have given up hope of getting a job. People who are suffering low level depression which robs them of enthusiasm, but do not understand their situation. People who suffer from the emotional ownership of rejection at such a level that they know/feel that any interview will end in the painful feelings of rejection.
As human beings are so different anyone with a closed minded attitude about people says more about that individual than it does about those they have fixed closed minded opinions about.

See Major...they are not lazy they are suffering from "the emotional ownership of rejection" the poor little bunny rabbits there there there. And your lack of appreciation and understanding for these poor sould clearly indicates your closed mindedness, shame on you. The rest of us should all dig deep into our pockets to protect these poor fragile souls from the harshness of such things as applying for a job attending an interview and...wait for it...not getting the job. How can they possibly cope with such things or more importantly...are there really that many that fall into this category or is this just another load of PC BS to justify laziness.

C-too

Nov 21 2014, 08:14 PM

ACH1967

Nov 21 2014, 11:42 AM

C-too

Nov 21 2014, 11:30 AM

Major Sinic

Nov 21 2014, 09:48 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Quote:

 

Now the disclaimer! I fully understand and accept that within the unskilled, unemployed sector there is a majority who want to work and gain skills. However it is my contention that there is a sizeable minority who don't want to work, either because they are simply bone idle or because any differential between unskilled wages and benefits is too small to be attractive.

There are more scenarios; People who have given up hope of getting a job. People who are suffering low level depression which robs them of enthusiasm, but do not understand their situation. People who suffer from the emotional ownership of rejection at such a level that they know/feel that any interview will end in the painful feelings of rejection.
As human beings are so different anyone with a closed minded attitude about people says more about that individual than it does about those they have fixed closed minded opinions about.

See Major...they are not lazy they are suffering from "the emotional ownership of rejection" the poor little bunny rabbits there there there. And your lack of appreciation and understanding for these poor sould clearly indicates your closed mindedness, shame on you. The rest of us should all dig deep into our pockets to protect these poor fragile souls from the harshness of such things as applying for a job attending an interview and...wait for it...not getting the job. How can they possibly cope with such things or more importantly...are there really that many that fall into this category or is this just another load of PC BS to justify laziness.

We all, to a greater or lesser degree suffer from the ownership of the feelings (not necessaraly the thoughts or recognition) of rejection, including your stupid self!! Why you post the mutterings of an immature idiot for everyone to see totally undermines your credibility.




+

ACH1967

Nov 22 2014, 11:23 AM

C-too

Nov 21 2014, 08:14 PM

ACH1967

Nov 21 2014, 11:42 AM

C-too

Nov 21 2014, 11:30 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

See Major...they are not lazy they are suffering from "the emotional ownership of rejection" the poor little bunny rabbits there there there. And your lack of appreciation and understanding for these poor sould clearly indicates your closed mindedness, shame on you. The rest of us should all dig deep into our pockets to protect these poor fragile souls from the harshness of such things as applying for a job attending an interview and...wait for it...not getting the job. How can they possibly cope with such things or more importantly...are there really that many that fall into this category or is this just another load of PC BS to justify laziness.

We all, to a greater or lesser degree suffer from the ownership of the feelings (not necessaraly the thoughts or recognition) of rejection, including your stupid self!! Why you post the mutterings of an immature idiot for everyone to see totally undermines your credibility.




+

You lefties are very keen to throw around insults when you don't like what you read. Now who does that make immature?

C-too

Nov 21 2014, 08:14 PM

ACH1967

Nov 21 2014, 11:42 AM

C-too

Nov 21 2014, 11:30 AM

Major Sinic

Nov 21 2014, 09:48 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Quote:

 

Now the disclaimer! I fully understand and accept that within the unskilled, unemployed sector there is a majority who want to work and gain skills. However it is my contention that there is a sizeable minority who don't want to work, either because they are simply bone idle or because any differential between unskilled wages and benefits is too small to be attractive.

There are more scenarios; People who have given up hope of getting a job. People who are suffering low level depression which robs them of enthusiasm, but do not understand their situation. People who suffer from the emotional ownership of rejection at such a level that they know/feel that any interview will end in the painful feelings of rejection.
As human beings are so different anyone with a closed minded attitude about people says more about that individual than it does about those they have fixed closed minded opinions about.

See Major...they are not lazy they are suffering from "the emotional ownership of rejection" the poor little bunny rabbits there there there. And your lack of appreciation and understanding for these poor sould clearly indicates your closed mindedness, shame on you. The rest of us should all dig deep into our pockets to protect these poor fragile souls from the harshness of such things as applying for a job attending an interview and...wait for it...not getting the job. How can they possibly cope with such things or more importantly...are there really that many that fall into this category or is this just another load of PC BS to justify laziness.

We all, to a greater or lesser degree suffer from the ownership of the feelings (not necessaraly the thoughts or recognition) of rejection, including your stupid self!! Why you post the mutterings of an immature idiot for everyone to see totally undermines your credibility.




+

Major Sinic

Nov 22 2014, 12:26 PM

C-too

Nov 21 2014, 08:14 PM

ACH1967

Nov 21 2014, 11:42 AM

C-too

Nov 21 2014, 11:30 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

See Major...they are not lazy they are suffering from "the emotional ownership of rejection" the poor little bunny rabbits there there there. And your lack of appreciation and understanding for these poor sould clearly indicates your closed mindedness, shame on you. The rest of us should all dig deep into our pockets to protect these poor fragile souls from the harshness of such things as applying for a job attending an interview and...wait for it...not getting the job. How can they possibly cope with such things or more importantly...are there really that many that fall into this category or is this just another load of PC BS to justify laziness.

We all, to a greater or lesser degree suffer from the ownership of the feelings (not necessaraly the thoughts or recognition) of rejection, including your stupid self!! Why you post the mutterings of an immature idiot for everyone to see totally undermines your credibility.




+

Rather a negative and unnecessarily offensive post toward a poster guilty of little more than heavy irony and who regularly makes worthwhile posts.

ACH1967

Nov 22 2014, 12:49 PM

I was going to say that if someone was so "traumatised by rejection" that perhaps they were in such a mental state that they required real help and as such weren't really lazy but genuinely mentally ill.

ACH1967

Nov 22 2014, 12:49 PM

Ok I am happy to put that in the past and move on.

I was going to say that if someone was so "traumatised by rejection" that perhaps they were in such a mental state that they required real help and as such weren't really lazy but genuinely mentally ill.

The other point was how large a number would this actually be.

ACH1967

Nov 20 2014, 12:17 PM

But are you comparing Apples with Apples?

If the english guy has two kids and a family and because of benfits only earns £2 more an hour is that the same for the Polish guy? If not, for example the Pole is living in a bed sit sending money home, then because of benefits the job is worth £4 an hour then it's hardly a fair comparison.

The point is...is it the people's lack of will, are they disincentivised by the welfare system or are you not paying enough?

johnofgwent

Nov 22 2014, 01:28 PM

... Has everyone forgotten how the Poles and others arriving here to take advantage of Blair's decison NOT to keep the gates tightly shut found they were earning three, four, five or even six times what they could at home, but then found to their horror how much it cost to eat ...

Heinrich

Nov 22 2014, 02:02 PM

johnofgwent

Nov 22 2014, 01:28 PM

... Has everyone forgotten how the Poles and others arriving here to take advantage of Blair's decison NOT to keep the gates tightly shut found they were earning three, four, five or even six times what they could at home, but then found to their horror how much it cost to eat ...

As citizens of the European Union (EU), hardworking Polish people can move to work anywhere in the EU regardless of anything Tony Blair might have tried.

ACH1967

Nov 22 2014, 02:09 PM

Heinrich

Nov 22 2014, 02:02 PM

johnofgwent

Nov 22 2014, 01:28 PM

... Has everyone forgotten how the Poles and others arriving here to take advantage of Blair's decison NOT to keep the gates tightly shut found they were earning three, four, five or even six times what they could at home, but then found to their horror how much it cost to eat ...

As citizens of the European Union (EU), hardworking Polish people can move to work anywhere in the EU regardless of anything Tony Blair might have tried.

Didn't Mr Blair open the gates before the other countries?

Heinrich

Nov 22 2014, 02:02 PM

johnofgwent

Nov 22 2014, 01:28 PM

... Has everyone forgotten how the Poles and others arriving here to take advantage of Blair's decison NOT to keep the gates tightly shut found they were earning three, four, five or even six times what they could at home, but then found to their horror how much it cost to eat ...

As citizens of the European Union (EU), hardworking Polish people can move to work anywhere in the EU regardless of anything Tony Blair might have tried.

RJD

Nov 22 2014, 02:54 PM

ACH1967

Nov 22 2014, 02:09 PM

Heinrich

Nov 22 2014, 02:02 PM

johnofgwent

Nov 22 2014, 01:28 PM

... Has everyone forgotten how the Poles and others arriving here to take advantage of Blair's decison NOT to keep the gates tightly shut found they were earning three, four, five or even six times what they could at home, but then found to their horror how much it cost to eat ...

As citizens of the European Union (EU), hardworking Polish people can move to work anywhere in the EU regardless of anything Tony Blair might have tried.

Didn't Mr Blair open the gates before the other countries?

Only for the new East European members and they were warned, but preferred to ignore the warning. A delay would have been helpful, but not the solution. IF you are a young aspiring hardworking East European with the EU now your oyster why not go to where there are, in your terms, well paid jobs and better welfare benefits. It's a no brainer.
If we accept the status quo then the UK is no longer a sovereign State and it has relinquished control over it's borders. I think that is what the vast majority object to, we are not the racists as painted by Labour, but those that think it sensible that we retain and maintain control over who does and does not come here to work and indeed to live. Leaving the door open with a "Welcome All" sign was always going to end up in tears.

C-too

Nov 22 2014, 09:46 PM

RJD

Nov 22 2014, 02:54 PM

ACH1967

Nov 22 2014, 02:09 PM

Heinrich

Nov 22 2014, 02:02 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Didn't Mr Blair open the gates before the other countries?

Only for the new East European members and they were warned, but preferred to ignore the warning. A delay would have been helpful, but not the solution. IF you are a young aspiring hardworking East European with the EU now your oyster why not go to where there are, in your terms, well paid jobs and better welfare benefits. It's a no brainer.
If we accept the status quo then the UK is no longer a sovereign State and it has relinquished control over it's borders. I think that is what the vast majority object to, we are not the racists as painted by Labour, but those that think it sensible that we retain and maintain control over who does and does not come here to work and indeed to live. Leaving the door open with a "Welcome All" sign was always going to end up in tears.

One of the things I noticed while abroad was the number of foreigners who spoke perfect English. Speeking to one young barman in one of the Warner Hotels in this country, his English was very good his manners were excellent but the local lads would need to watch out because he was a healthy, moderately built good looking lad. Damn foreigners.

gansao

Nov 22 2014, 09:59 PM

C-too

Nov 22 2014, 09:46 PM

RJD

Nov 22 2014, 02:54 PM

ACH1967

Nov 22 2014, 02:09 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Only for the new East European members and they were warned, but preferred to ignore the warning. A delay would have been helpful, but not the solution. IF you are a young aspiring hardworking East European with the EU now your oyster why not go to where there are, in your terms, well paid jobs and better welfare benefits. It's a no brainer.
If we accept the status quo then the UK is no longer a sovereign State and it has relinquished control over it's borders. I think that is what the vast majority object to, we are not the racists as painted by Labour, but those that think it sensible that we retain and maintain control over who does and does not come here to work and indeed to live. Leaving the door open with a "Welcome All" sign was always going to end up in tears.

One of the things I noticed while abroad was the number of foreigners who spoke perfect English. Speeking to one young barman in one of the Warner Hotels in this country, his English was very good his manners were excellent but the local lads would need to watch out because he was a healthy, moderately built good looking lad. Damn foreigners.

Well at least there's one of them that can speak good English. I see very few who speak good English and I've worked with at least a hundred or so more than one.

C-too

Nov 22 2014, 10:35 PM

gansao

Nov 22 2014, 09:59 PM

C-too

Nov 22 2014, 09:46 PM

RJD

Nov 22 2014, 02:54 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

One of the things I noticed while abroad was the number of foreigners who spoke perfect English. Speeking to one young barman in one of the Warner Hotels in this country, his English was very good his manners were excellent but the local lads would need to watch out because he was a healthy, moderately built good looking lad. Damn foreigners.

Well at least there's one of them that can speak good English. I see very few who speak good English and I've worked with at least a hundred or so more than one.

I guess it depends upon the areas of work the individuals are working in?

C-too

Nov 22 2014, 09:46 PM

RJD

Nov 22 2014, 02:54 PM

ACH1967

Nov 22 2014, 02:09 PM

Heinrich

Nov 22 2014, 02:02 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Didn't Mr Blair open the gates before the other countries?

Only for the new East European members and they were warned, but preferred to ignore the warning. A delay would have been helpful, but not the solution. IF you are a young aspiring hardworking East European with the EU now your oyster why not go to where there are, in your terms, well paid jobs and better welfare benefits. It's a no brainer.
If we accept the status quo then the UK is no longer a sovereign State and it has relinquished control over it's borders. I think that is what the vast majority object to, we are not the racists as painted by Labour, but those that think it sensible that we retain and maintain control over who does and does not come here to work and indeed to live. Leaving the door open with a "Welcome All" sign was always going to end up in tears.

One of the things I noticed while abroad was the number of foreigners who spoke perfect English. Speeking to one young barman in one of the Warner Hotels in this country, his English was very good his manners were excellent but the local lads would need to watch out because he was a healthy, moderately built good looking lad. Damn foreigners.

RJD

Nov 23 2014, 09:10 AM

C-too

Nov 22 2014, 09:46 PM

RJD

Nov 22 2014, 02:54 PM

ACH1967

Nov 22 2014, 02:09 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Only for the new East European members and they were warned, but preferred to ignore the warning. A delay would have been helpful, but not the solution. IF you are a young aspiring hardworking East European with the EU now your oyster why not go to where there are, in your terms, well paid jobs and better welfare benefits. It's a no brainer.
If we accept the status quo then the UK is no longer a sovereign State and it has relinquished control over it's borders. I think that is what the vast majority object to, we are not the racists as painted by Labour, but those that think it sensible that we retain and maintain control over who does and does not come here to work and indeed to live. Leaving the door open with a "Welcome All" sign was always going to end up in tears.

One of the things I noticed while abroad was the number of foreigners who spoke perfect English. Speeking to one young barman in one of the Warner Hotels in this country, his English was very good his manners were excellent but the local lads would need to watch out because he was a healthy, moderately built good looking lad. Damn foreigners.

I think you will find that the majority of 16 year old Germans have a reasonable command of English and the Dutch even more so. I wonder how they manage to squeeze in the learning of foreign languages in their crowded curriculum?
I understand that Linguists are less likely to suffer from Alzheimer's in old age, so maybe we should divert some of the NHS budget into teaching languages?

gansao

Nov 22 2014, 10:38 PM

C-too

Nov 22 2014, 10:35 PM

gansao

Nov 22 2014, 09:59 PM

C-too

Nov 22 2014, 09:46 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Well at least there's one of them that can speak good English. I see very few who speak good English and I've worked with at least a hundred or so more than one.

I guess it depends upon the areas of work the individuals are working in?

Of course but you must stop and think. A job that demands good English would require someone who spoke it. That doesnt mean that he is typical of Poles in the UK per se.

C-too

Nov 23 2014, 10:27 AM

RJD

Nov 23 2014, 09:10 AM

C-too

Nov 22 2014, 09:46 PM

RJD

Nov 22 2014, 02:54 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

One of the things I noticed while abroad was the number of foreigners who spoke perfect English. Speeking to one young barman in one of the Warner Hotels in this country, his English was very good his manners were excellent but the local lads would need to watch out because he was a healthy, moderately built good looking lad. Damn foreigners.

I think you will find that the majority of 16 year old Germans have a reasonable command of English and the Dutch even more so. I wonder how they manage to squeeze in the learning of foreign languages in their crowded curriculum?
I understand that Linguists are less likely to suffer from Alzheimer's in old age, so maybe we should divert some of the NHS budget into teaching languages?

Speeking to a female in Crete, estimated age 19 or 20, she spoke such perfect English without a notable accent That I enquired if she was English, she wasn't she was Cretian.

AndyK

Nov 23 2014, 10:33 AM

C-too

Nov 23 2014, 10:27 AM

RJD

Nov 23 2014, 09:10 AM

C-too

Nov 22 2014, 09:46 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

I think you will find that the majority of 16 year old Germans have a reasonable command of English and the Dutch even more so. I wonder how they manage to squeeze in the learning of foreign languages in their crowded curriculum?
I understand that Linguists are less likely to suffer from Alzheimer's in old age, so maybe we should divert some of the NHS budget into teaching languages?

Speeking to a female in Crete, estimated age 19 or 20, she spoke such perfect English without a notable accent That I enquired if she was English, she wasn't she was Cretian.

Cretian?

Surely they are Cretins?

C-too

Nov 23 2014, 10:30 AM

gansao

Nov 22 2014, 10:38 PM

C-too

Nov 22 2014, 10:35 PM

gansao

Nov 22 2014, 09:59 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

I guess it depends upon the areas of work the individuals are working in?

Of course but you must stop and think. A job that demands good English would require someone who spoke it. That doesnt mean that he is typical of Poles in the UK per se.

As it happened he was not Polish. But I think the point I was getting at is that English is a very widely spoken language.

gansao

Nov 23 2014, 05:23 PM

C-too

Nov 23 2014, 10:30 AM

gansao

Nov 22 2014, 10:38 PM

C-too

Nov 22 2014, 10:35 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Of course but you must stop and think. A job that demands good English would require someone who spoke it. That doesnt mean that he is typical of Poles in the UK per se.

As it happened he was not Polish. But I think the point I was getting at is that English is a very widely spoken language.

What country did he come from?
Of course English is a widely spoken language. A European who understand English can access and understand both US' culture ' and any other advantages of the Lingua franca.
What advantage has person who lives in an English speaking country by learning a foreign language if they intend to work in their native country and have no yearning to watch Spanish, French, Portuguese, etc etc TV or films?

RJD

Nov 23 2014, 06:23 PM

gansao

Nov 23 2014, 05:23 PM

C-too

Nov 23 2014, 10:30 AM

gansao

Nov 22 2014, 10:38 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

As it happened he was not Polish. But I think the point I was getting at is that English is a very widely spoken language.

What country did he come from?
Of course English is a widely spoken language. A European who understand English can access and understand both US' culture ' and any other advantages of the Lingua franca.
What advantage has person who lives in an English speaking country by learning a foreign language if they intend to work in their native country and have no yearning to watch Spanish, French, Portuguese, etc etc TV or films?

Enormous cultural advantages. I would not live in France or any other European country unless I intended to learn the language and attempt to understand their culture. When in Rome as they say.

gansao

Nov 23 2014, 06:35 PM

RJD

Nov 23 2014, 06:23 PM

gansao

Nov 23 2014, 05:23 PM

C-too

Nov 23 2014, 10:30 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

What country did he come from?
Of course English is a widely spoken language. A European who understand English can access and understand both US' culture ' and any other advantages of the Lingua franca.
What advantage has person who lives in an English speaking country by learning a foreign language if they intend to work in their native country and have no yearning to watch Spanish, French, Portuguese, etc etc TV or films?

Enormous cultural advantages. I would not live in France or any other European country unless I intended to learn the language and attempt to understand their culture. When in Rome as they say.

' if they intend to work in their native country' . You seemed to have failed to read that bit.

gansao

Nov 23 2014, 05:23 PM

C-too

Nov 23 2014, 10:30 AM

gansao

Nov 22 2014, 10:38 PM

C-too

Nov 22 2014, 10:35 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Of course but you must stop and think. A job that demands good English would require someone who spoke it. That doesnt mean that he is typical of Poles in the UK per se.

As it happened he was not Polish. But I think the point I was getting at is that English is a very widely spoken language.

What country did he come from?
Of course English is a widely spoken language. A European who understand English can access and understand both US' culture ' and any other advantages of the Lingua franca.
What advantage has person who lives in an English speaking country by learning a foreign language if they intend to work in their native country and have no yearning to watch Spanish, French, Portuguese, etc etc TV or films?

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 08:45 AM

gansao

Nov 23 2014, 05:23 PM

C-too

Nov 23 2014, 10:30 AM

gansao

Nov 22 2014, 10:38 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

As it happened he was not Polish. But I think the point I was getting at is that English is a very widely spoken language.

What country did he come from?
Of course English is a widely spoken language. A European who understand English can access and understand both US' culture ' and any other advantages of the Lingua franca.
What advantage has person who lives in an English speaking country by learning a foreign language if they intend to work in their native country and have no yearning to watch Spanish, French, Portuguese, etc etc TV or films?

Can't remember which country he came from but it was one of the later countries to gain EU membership.

The thinking behind my comment that English is a widely spoken language is that it is one of the reasons why so many migrants head for the UK. I can't see many EU migrants heading for the UK who have no understanding of English at all.

RJD

Nov 24 2014, 09:30 AM

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 08:45 AM

gansao

Nov 23 2014, 05:23 PM

C-too

Nov 23 2014, 10:30 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

What country did he come from?
Of course English is a widely spoken language. A European who understand English can access and understand both US' culture ' and any other advantages of the Lingua franca.
What advantage has person who lives in an English speaking country by learning a foreign language if they intend to work in their native country and have no yearning to watch Spanish, French, Portuguese, etc etc TV or films?

Can't remember which country he came from but it was one of the later countries to gain EU membership.

The thinking behind my comment that English is a widely spoken language is that it is one of the reasons why so many migrants head for the UK. I can't see many EU migrants heading for the UK who have no understanding of English at all.

But they do. Young men tend to come with friends and I bet at least one has good or passable facility with the English language. As we can see from the latest ONS numbers the none EU numbers, since we rid ourselves of the last lot in Gov. are in decline, but it is the EU numbers that will not budge. Bet they go up.

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 08:45 AM

gansao

Nov 23 2014, 05:23 PM

C-too

Nov 23 2014, 10:30 AM

gansao

Nov 22 2014, 10:38 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

As it happened he was not Polish. But I think the point I was getting at is that English is a very widely spoken language.

What country did he come from?
Of course English is a widely spoken language. A European who understand English can access and understand both US' culture ' and any other advantages of the Lingua franca.
What advantage has person who lives in an English speaking country by learning a foreign language if they intend to work in their native country and have no yearning to watch Spanish, French, Portuguese, etc etc TV or films?

Can't remember which country he came from but it was one of the later countries to gain EU membership.

The thinking behind my comment that English is a widely spoken language is that it is one of the reasons why so many migrants head for the UK. I can't see many EU migrants heading for the UK who have no understanding of English at all.

gansao

Nov 24 2014, 02:28 PM

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 08:45 AM

gansao

Nov 23 2014, 05:23 PM

C-too

Nov 23 2014, 10:30 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

What country did he come from?
Of course English is a widely spoken language. A European who understand English can access and understand both US' culture ' and any other advantages of the Lingua franca.
What advantage has person who lives in an English speaking country by learning a foreign language if they intend to work in their native country and have no yearning to watch Spanish, French, Portuguese, etc etc TV or films?

Can't remember which country he came from but it was one of the later countries to gain EU membership.

The thinking behind my comment that English is a widely spoken language is that it is one of the reasons why so many migrants head for the UK. I can't see many EU migrants heading for the UK who have no understanding of English at all.

Then you wrong. I find few speak passable English at first. Most learn enough to get by. Baltic state immigrants tend to speak Russian as well as their own languages but little English. The Poles occasionally speak passable English and some very good.
So far the Romanians seem speak little or no English. As said I have worked with or around hundreds of EU immigrants over the past few years.
Of course everywhere else in the UK they might speak English like Noel Coward ( as I suspect your will claim) but I doubt it.
Also I have spoken to a few Lithuanians who told me that the Germans will generally not the East Europeans who do not speak passable German.

gansao

Nov 24 2014, 02:28 PM

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 08:45 AM

gansao

Nov 23 2014, 05:23 PM

C-too

Nov 23 2014, 10:30 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

What country did he come from?
Of course English is a widely spoken language. A European who understand English can access and understand both US' culture ' and any other advantages of the Lingua franca.
What advantage has person who lives in an English speaking country by learning a foreign language if they intend to work in their native country and have no yearning to watch Spanish, French, Portuguese, etc etc TV or films?

Can't remember which country he came from but it was one of the later countries to gain EU membership.

The thinking behind my comment that English is a widely spoken language is that it is one of the reasons why so many migrants head for the UK. I can't see many EU migrants heading for the UK who have no understanding of English at all.

Then you wrong. I find few speak passable English at first. Most learn enough to get by. Baltic state immigrants tend to speak Russian as well as their own languages but little English. The Poles occasionally speak passable English and some very good.
So far the Romanians seem speak little or no English. As said I have worked with or around hundreds of EU immigrants over the past few years.
Of course everywhere else in the UK they might speak English like Noel Coward ( as I suspect your will claim) but I doubt it.
Also I have spoken to a few Lithuanians who told me that the Germans will generally not the East Europeans who do not speak passable German.

marybrown

Nov 24 2014, 02:53 PM

And anyway..Labour are so desperate now they'd jump on anyone's bandwagon!!

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 03:11 PM

gansao

Nov 24 2014, 02:28 PM

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 08:45 AM

gansao

Nov 23 2014, 05:23 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Can't remember which country he came from but it was one of the later countries to gain EU membership.

The thinking behind my comment that English is a widely spoken language is that it is one of the reasons why so many migrants head for the UK. I can't see many EU migrants heading for the UK who have no understanding of English at all.

Then you wrong. I find few speak passable English at first. Most learn enough to get by. Baltic state immigrants tend to speak Russian as well as their own languages but little English. The Poles occasionally speak passable English and some very good.
So far the Romanians seem speak little or no English. As said I have worked with or around hundreds of EU immigrants over the past few years.
Of course everywhere else in the UK they might speak English like Noel Coward ( as I suspect your will claim) but I doubt it.
Also I have spoken to a few Lithuanians who told me that the Germans will generally not the East Europeans who do not speak passable German.

If that is your experience then so be it. But goodness knows where the immigrants you have worked with actually worked or what they did. Heading for a foreign country with virtually no understanding of the language makes little sense to me and it must certainly limit work possibilities for those that do it.

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 03:13 PM

marybrown

Nov 24 2014, 02:53 PM

And anyway..Labour are so desperate now they'd jump on anyone's bandwagon!!

NL began to limit immigration before they left office. The effects of the international financial meltdown made it a necessity.

marybrown

Nov 24 2014, 03:20 PM

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 03:11 PM

gansao

Nov 24 2014, 02:28 PM

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 08:45 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

Then you wrong. I find few speak passable English at first. Most learn enough to get by. Baltic state immigrants tend to speak Russian as well as their own languages but little English. The Poles occasionally speak passable English and some very good.
So far the Romanians seem speak little or no English. As said I have worked with or around hundreds of EU immigrants over the past few years.
Of course everywhere else in the UK they might speak English like Noel Coward ( as I suspect your will claim) but I doubt it.
Also I have spoken to a few Lithuanians who told me that the Germans will generally not the East Europeans who do not speak passable German.

If that is your experience then so be it. But goodness knows where the immigrants you have worked with actually worked or what they did. Heading for a foreign country with virtually no understanding of the language makes little sense to me and it must certainly limit work possibilities for those that do it.

I had an argument about this with health and safety..they were working on machines with huge sharp blades..untrained..and the potential to kill or maim themselves..or someone else..

But the lure of cheap workers was much too strong for the management..

marybrown

Nov 24 2014, 03:21 PM

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 03:13 PM

marybrown

Nov 24 2014, 02:53 PM

And anyway..Labour are so desperate now they'd jump on anyone's bandwagon!!

NL began to limit immigration before they left office. The effects of the international financial meltdown made it a necessity.

That must have been when they were throwing money at people to stay at home!!

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 04:10 PM

marybrown

Nov 24 2014, 03:20 PM

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 03:11 PM

gansao

Nov 24 2014, 02:28 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep

If that is your experience then so be it. But goodness knows where the immigrants you have worked with actually worked or what they did. Heading for a foreign country with virtually no understanding of the language makes little sense to me and it must certainly limit work possibilities for those that do it.

I had an argument about this with health and safety..they were working on machines with huge sharp blades..untrained..and the potential to kill or maim themselves..or someone else..

But the lure of cheap workers was much too strong for the management..

No one should operate dangerous equipment without proper training. I hope you have some success with health and safety.

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 04:11 PM

marybrown

Nov 24 2014, 03:21 PM

C-too

Nov 24 2014, 03:13 PM

marybrown

Nov 24 2014, 02:53 PM

And anyway..Labour are so desperate now they'd jump on anyone's bandwagon!!

NL began to limit immigration before they left office. The effects of the international financial meltdown made it a necessity.

That must have been when they were throwing money at people to stay at home!!

It was about limiting non-EU migrants to those with skills or professions needed by the UK.