Rise of the career Politician

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Rise of the career Politician
Topic Started: Nov 25 2014, 08:44 AM (427 Views)
RJD	Nov 25 2014, 08:44 AM Post #1
Prudence and Thrift Posts: 12,499 Group: Members Member #9 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	Quote: House of Commons Library figures show that 21 of the MPs elected in 1979 were previously employed in politics, 3.4 per cent of the total. Quote: A University College London study, tracks everyone fighting a seat in May. Its figures show that a third of all candidates already have political jobs as councillors, advisers or union officials. Fully 48 per cent of Labour candidates are political professionals. For Tories, it’s 33 per cent. Quote: If the big parties really want to buck the trend, the 2020 general election could be fought between leaders with rather different careers. The Conservatives would be led by Dr Dan Poulter, a health minister who spends his weekends practising in NHS hospitals, or maybe Stephen Crabb, a council-house kid who’s now Welsh Secretary. And Labour would follow Dan Jarvis, a former Para, or Gloria de Piero, raised in a workless home in Bradford. Yet none of those is a leadership favourite. Those who are – Boris Johnson, George Osborne, Theresa May, Chuka Umunna, Andy Burnham, Yvette Cooper – are all career politicians, their working lives spent at Westminster or trying to get there. The professionals remain in charge. LINK How are we ever to obtain a Parliament which represents, to a higher degree, the make up and social structure of the UK, these Career Politicians are a scab on the body politik of this country and we need to find some way of blocking their easy ride to the Trough of State. I know it will sound somewhat undemocratic when vested interests are pushing for votes at 16, but why not consider making the minimum age of a MP 30 say? Why not insist of a full CV including a section that embraces "Real World Experience"?



papasmurf	Nov 25 2014, 08:52 AM Post #2
Senior Member Posts: 17,280 Group: Members Member #13 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	RJD Nov 25 2014, 08:44 AM How are we ever to obtain a Parliament which represents, to a higher degree, the make up and social structure of the UK, The revolution will not be televised, will not be televised, will not be televised, will not be televised. The revolution will be no re-run brothers; The revolution will be live. Gil Scott-Heron



RJD	Nov 25 2014, 09:05 AM Post #3
Prudence and Thrift Posts: 12,499 Group: Members Member #9 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	papasmurf Nov 25 2014, 08:52 AM RJD Nov 25 2014, 08:44 AM How are we ever to obtain a Parliament which represents, to a higher degree, the make up and social structure of the UK, The revolution will not be televised, will not be televised, will not be televised, will not be televised. The revolution will be no re-run brothers; The revolution will be live. Gil Scott-Heron Heard the same twaddle generation after generation, a revolution is less likely now than any time since 1945. A revolution would be about the worst thing there could be for the poor in this country. Learn from history and stop seeking to repeat the stupid mistakes of the past. The forces at the disposal of the State would wipe out the malcontents within a matter of days, the only chance these Loons would have is if they can get ISIS on side.



papasmurf	Nov 25 2014, 09:19 AM Post #4
Senior Member Posts: 17,280 Group: Members Member #13 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:05 AM A revolution would be about the worst thing there could be for the poor in this country. Their "World View" is somewhat different to yours RJD.



RJD	Nov 25 2014, 09:30 AM Post #5
Prudence and Thrift Posts: 12,499 Group: Members Member #9 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	papasmurf Nov 25 2014, 09:19 AM RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:05 AM A revolution would be about the worst thing there could be for the poor in this country. Their "World View" is somewhat different to yours RJD. I think not and that is why they are not banging drums or rattling their spears. They don't even seem to bother to attend organised strikes. Me thinks you are the one living in Cloud Cuckoo-land. When the left was rioting and causing mayhem across Europe in 1968 what were the young lefty Brits about? Going to their studies in a peaceful manner that's what. All this talk of revolution is the idle dreaming of the unreconstructed Marxist left. Pity they did not all die off in the 20th C. No revolution here in the UK and that is official. The poor know exactly what the Party Bosses would do to them and they do not like the idea.



papasmurf	Nov 25 2014, 09:32 AM Post #6
Senior Member Posts: 17,280 Group: Members Member #13 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:30 AM I think not and that is why they are not banging drums or rattling their spears. But they are RJD, the media are not reporting it. (It has nothing to do with trade unions.) Edited by papasmurf, Nov 25 2014, 09:33 AM.



RJD	Nov 25 2014, 09:36 AM Post #7
Prudence and Thrift Posts: 12,499 Group: Members Member #9 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	papasmurf Nov 25 2014, 09:32 AM RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:30 AM I think not and that is why they are not banging drums or rattling their spears. But they are RJD, the media are not reporting it. (It has nothing to do with trade unions.) Stop it Mr Smurf as you are making yourself appear as a Loon. Why would the lefty Press not report such if it existed? Do you really think that the Gruaniad and ilk would be easily muzzled. I know you are in favour of State control of the Press but we today are still a long way from such.



papasmurf	Nov 25 2014, 09:42 AM Post #8
Senior Member Posts: 17,280 Group: Members Member #13 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:36 AM Stop it Mr Smurf as you are making yourself appear as a Loon. Why would the lefty Press not report such if it existed? RJD, I suggest someone as ill informed and by your own self confession has no intention of being informed stop the personal insults. There is no "lefty" press, they can't afford to lose the advertising revenue.



RJD	Nov 25 2014, 09:50 AM Post #9
Prudence and Thrift Posts: 12,499 Group: Members Member #9 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	papasmurf Nov 25 2014, 09:42 AM RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:36 AM Stop it Mr Smurf as you are making yourself appear as a Loon. Why would the lefty Press not report such if it existed? RJD, I suggest someone as ill informed and by your own self confession has no intention of being informed stop the personal insults. There is no "lefty" press, they can't afford to lose the advertising revenue. No insult intended, in fact I was seeking to protect your reputation which today you appear to want to destroy. Just put up your evidence or shut up as you are being fanciful and on a debating forum fancy has no place.



papasmurf	Nov 25 2014, 09:52 AM Post #10
Senior Member Posts: 17,280 Group: Members Member #13 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:50 AM Just put up your evidence No point in your case RJD, you never read it.



Malum Unus	Nov 25 2014, 10:01 AM Post #11
Hater of Political Correctness and Legalese Posts: 1,389 Group: Members Member #24 Joined: Jun 28, 2014	RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:36 AM papasmurf Nov 25 2014, 09:32 AM RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:30 AM I think not and that is why they are not banging drums or rattling their spears. But they are RJD, the media are not reporting it. (It has nothing to do with trade unions.) Stop it Mr Smurf as you are making yourself appear as a Loon. Why would the lefty Press not report such if it existed? Do you really think that the Gruaniad and ilk would be easily muzzled. I know you are in favour of State control of the Press but we today are still a long way from such. Don't be so sure about that, most protests only get media time when/if they turn violent, otherwise they're kept quiet so the public doesn't know about the growing unrest. It's in the 'nations best interests', I believe is the phrase typically used... Which usually means it's in the governments best interests.



papasmurf	Nov 25 2014, 10:13 AM Post #12
Senior Member Posts: 17,280 Group: Members Member #13 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	Malum Unus Nov 25 2014, 10:01 AM It's in the 'nations best interests', I believe is the phrase typically used... Which usually means it's in the governments best interests. Precisely, the police are all over even the smallest "anti government" protest like a rash, and being heavy handed even when the protesters are disabled and in wheelchairs. (I have challenged ACPO about this, on going exchange due to separating disabled people from their carers and access to their medication will cause a death or deaths at some point due to an ever increasing number of demonstrations.) For the last few years more and more police are being riot trained and even here in the South West there is this from today's news:- http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cornwall-30187818 25 November 2014 Last updated at 01:41 More firearms officers are being recruited to improve armed response cover in Devon and Cornwall, the BBC has learned. The number of officers is being increased by just under 15 per cent from 105 to 120. The police say it is not in response to any new threat, but part of a revised strategy to improve security. The move follows a review of firearms cover, particularly in the more rural areas of the two counties. The force is advertising for qualified firearms officers to join from other police areas.



Heinrich	Nov 25 2014, 10:57 AM Post #13
Regular Guy Posts: 2,920 Group: Members Member #51 Joined: Jul 22, 2014	It is a cushy number riddled with cronyism and nepotism. Voters accept and like it.



Affa	Nov 25 2014, 01:57 PM Post #14
Senior Member Posts: 11,999 Group: Members Member #58 Joined: Jul 26, 2014	Recruitment starts early, at school, mentoring follows on from that, and ideologies established according to the doctrine ........ none more so than our present PM & Chancellor. A system designed to ensure the status quo of the establishment no matter what the electorate want.



RJD	Nov 25 2014, 04:02 PM Post #15
Prudence and Thrift Posts: 12,499 Group: Members Member #9 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	papasmurf Nov 25 2014, 09:52 AM RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:50 AM Just put up your evidence No point in your case RJD, you never read it. I would if you demonstrated you understood the evidence and posted a synopsis of how and why this supports your claims, but you don't you post far too many wild geese.



RJD	Nov 25 2014, 04:06 PM Post #16
Prudence and Thrift Posts: 12,499 Group: Members Member #9 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	Malum Unus Nov 25 2014, 10:01 AM RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:36 AM papasmurf Nov 25 2014, 09:32 AM RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:30 AM I think not and that is why they are not banging drums or rattling their spears. But they are RJD, the media are not reporting it. (It has nothing to do with trade unions.) Stop it Mr Smurf as you are making yourself appear as a Loon. Why would the lefty Press not report such if it existed? Do you really think that the Gruaniad and ilk would be easily muzzled. I know you are in favour of State control of the Press but we today are still a long way from such. Don't be so sure about that, most protests only get media time when/if they turn violent, otherwise they're kept quiet so the public doesn't know about the growing unrest. It's in the 'nations best interests', I believe is the phrase typically used... Which usually means it's in the governments best interests. Name a revolution that has no Leader, no Agenda and zero mass following? Without such you will only get a spate of civil unrest, usual by criminals or wannabe criminals, that is easily extinguished. I see no Lenin, no Trotsky, no Castro, no Che, nobody, not one single person with an agenda.



papasmurf	Nov 25 2014, 04:07 PM Post #17
Senior Member Posts: 17,280 Group: Members Member #13 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	RJD Nov 25 2014, 04:02 PM I would if you demonstrated you understood the evidence and posted a synopsis of how and why this supports your claims, but you don't you post far too many wild geese. A synopsis is no good, you need to read all of a reference. You don't read a synopsis anyway when I do put one.



RJD	Nov 25 2014, 04:10 PM Post #18
Prudence and Thrift Posts: 12,499 Group: Members Member #9 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	papasmurf Nov 25 2014, 04:07 PM RJD Nov 25 2014, 04:02 PM I would if you demonstrated you understood the evidence and posted a synopsis of how and why this supports your claims, but you don't you post far too many wild geese. A synopsis is no good, you need to read all of a reference. You don't read a synopsis anyway when I do put one. You have to show you understand the data to which you refer as being evidence that supports your claims. That is the synopsis as I and others I note, are not prepared to let you waste time with your myriad of links which only appear to indicate that you have done zero research. No more Mr Smurf as you have in the past proven to be a time waster.



papasmurf	Nov 25 2014, 04:31 PM Post #19
Senior Member Posts: 17,280 Group: Members Member #13 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	RJD Nov 25 2014, 04:10 PM No more Mr Smurf as you have in the past proven to be a time waster. You are the time waster, gaining knowledge take effort not just reading the conclusions in massive bit of research. If you cannot be bothered to do so, that is your problem not mine.



jaguar	Nov 25 2014, 04:49 PM Post #20
Regular Member Posts: 980 Group: Members Member #26 Joined: Jun 28, 2014	papasmurf Nov 25 2014, 04:31 PM RJD Nov 25 2014, 04:10 PM No more Mr Smurf as you have in the past proven to be a time waster. You are the time waster, gaining knowledge take effort not just reading the conclusions in massive bit of research. If you cannot be bothered to do so, that is your problem not mine. Have to agree with RJD on that. I use to read your links, and like others, when asked to point out the relevant part in question, you either don't answer, or, as you have done again say "that is your problem not mine". I don't want to spend hours reading a link that doesn't answer the question. Just put the relevant part of the question and maybe more people will take note, and maybe we will believe you know what you are talking about. I say this respectably.



RJD	Nov 26 2014, 05:01 PM Post #21
Prudence and Thrift Posts: 12,499 Group: Members Member #9 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	papasmurf Nov 25 2014, 04:31 PM RJD Nov 25 2014, 04:10 PM No more Mr Smurf as you have in the past proven to be a time waster. You are the time waster, gaining knowledge take effort not just reading the conclusions in massive bit of research. If you cannot be bothered to do so, that is your problem not mine. It does and you do not invest such time, you are just a time waster as others, not just myself, have pointed out month after month. I thought you might have realised by now but the Devil is in the detail(s) and that is exactly what you avoid. If you really did proper analysis you would be able to articulate your claims, but you cannot so we get a massive "copy n paste" and/or a myriad of links which may or may not be related. You need to take your own advice Mr Smurf.



RJD	Nov 26 2014, 05:04 PM Post #22
Prudence and Thrift Posts: 12,499 Group: Members Member #9 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	jaguar Nov 25 2014, 04:49 PM papasmurf Nov 25 2014, 04:31 PM RJD Nov 25 2014, 04:10 PM No more Mr Smurf as you have in the past proven to be a time waster. You are the time waster, gaining knowledge take effort not just reading the conclusions in massive bit of research. If you cannot be bothered to do so, that is your problem not mine. Have to agree with RJD on that. I use to read your links, and like others, when asked to point out the relevant part in question, you either don't answer, or, as you have done again say "that is your problem not mine". I don't want to spend hours reading a link that doesn't answer the question. Just put the relevant part of the question and maybe more people will take note, and maybe we will believe you know what you are talking about. I say this respectably. No doubt those that have suffered at the superficiality of Mr Smurf's research and consequent claims can also put up their hands to be counted. I have not followed his links for a long while and have not seen any evidence that he has improved.



papasmurf	Nov 26 2014, 05:27 PM Post #23
Senior Member Posts: 17,280 Group: Members Member #13 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	jaguar Nov 25 2014, 04:49 PM I don't want to spend hours reading a link that doesn't answer the question. But they do answer the question, it really is NOT my fault if people are too thick to see it.



RJD	Nov 26 2014, 05:44 PM Post #24
Prudence and Thrift Posts: 12,499 Group: Members Member #9 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	papasmurf Nov 26 2014, 05:27 PM jaguar Nov 25 2014, 04:49 PM I don't want to spend hours reading a link that doesn't answer the question. But they do answer the question, it really is NOT my fault if people are too thick to see it. Maybe you are too thick to understand this is a debating forum not a reference library and it is incumbent on you to explain why the links you offer support your claims. What is it with you and details, do you have some sort of aversion to dealing with these yourself? A myriad of links presented by you that you clearly have not read is rude and insulting as out time is also precious. Simply stating "not my problem" is unacceptable as it is.



Malden Capell	Nov 26 2014, 06:22 PM Post #25
New Member Posts: 14 Group: Members Member #5 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	There's zero chance of a revolution. The media aren't reporting on the 'protests' that occur because they are tiny and about as remote from the concerns of most people in this country as they can get. The radicals are treated with as much disdain as the Establishment are.



papasmurf	Nov 26 2014, 07:43 PM Post #26
Senior Member Posts: 17,280 Group: Members Member #13 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	Malden Capell Nov 26 2014, 06:22 PM The media aren't reporting on the 'protests' that occur because they are tiny They aren't tiny at all. They just are not getting reported on/in British media, they are on/in foreign media. It has got to the point the government is getting rattled. The disgusting way a representative of 38 degrees got treated at a Business Innovation and Skills Committee meeting recently shows that https://soundcloud.com/38degrees/davidbabbsttip



Rich	Nov 26 2014, 07:50 PM Post #27
Senior Member Posts: 14,463 Group: Members Member #30 Joined: Jun 28, 2014	RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:30 AM papasmurf Nov 25 2014, 09:19 AM RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:05 AM A revolution would be about the worst thing there could be for the poor in this country. Their "World View" is somewhat different to yours RJD. I think not and that is why they are not banging drums or rattling their spears. They don't even seem to bother to attend organised strikes. Me thinks you are the one living in Cloud Cuckoo-land. When the left was rioting and causing mayhem across Europe in 1968 what were the young lefty Brits about? Going to their studies in a peaceful manner that's what. All this talk of revolution is the idle dreaming of the unreconstructed Marxist left. Pity they did not all die off in the 20th C. No revolution here in the UK and that is official. The poor know exactly what the Party Bosses would do to them and they do not like the idea. There were THREE people picketing the gate outside Prospect Park hospital on Monday morning and one of those was the hospital unison rep, according to the unions the strike countrywide was well represented.



Tigger	Nov 26 2014, 07:55 PM Post #28
Senior Member Posts: 20,106 Group: Members Member #18 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	jaguar Nov 25 2014, 04:49 PM I say this respectably. I've found most of his links are fine, it's funny that when he can back up a point the other "usuals" cry wolf. I want to see opinion and I'd rather do my own checking and mention the source of the information, that way others can check and you can then avoid the accusations of cherry picking, if you are honest that is......



Tigger	Nov 26 2014, 08:00 PM Post #29
Senior Member Posts: 20,106 Group: Members Member #18 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	Malden Capell Nov 26 2014, 06:22 PM There's zero chance of a revolution. The media aren't reporting on the 'protests' that occur because they are tiny and about as remote from the concerns of most people in this country as they can get. The radicals are treated with as much disdain as the Establishment are. There were thousands on an anti capitalist march earlier this month, on the fifth and in Trafalgar Square. I knew nothing about the scores of arrests and mayhem until I tuned into France 24, needless to say Russia Today was on the case as well but the facts seemed to be mixed up with lurid predictions, virtually nothing from our domestic broadcasters.........



Tigger	Nov 26 2014, 08:03 PM Post #30
Senior Member Posts: 20,106 Group: Members Member #18 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	Rich Nov 26 2014, 07:50 PM RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:30 AM papasmurf Nov 25 2014, 09:19 AM RJD Nov 25 2014, 09:05 AM A revolution would be about the worst thing there could be for the poor in this country. Their "World View" is somewhat different to yours RJD. I think not and that is why they are not banging drums or rattling their spears. They don't even seem to bother to attend organised strikes. Me thinks you are the one living in Cloud Cuckoo-land. When the left was rioting and causing mayhem across Europe in 1968 what were the young lefty Brits about? Going to their studies in a peaceful manner that's what. All this talk of revolution is the idle dreaming of the unreconstructed Marxist left. Pity they did not all die off in the 20th C. No revolution here in the UK and that is official. The poor know exactly what the Party Bosses would do to them and they do not like the idea. There were THREE people picketing the gate outside Prospect Park hospital on Monday morning and one of those was the hospital unison rep, according to the unions the strike countrywide was well represented. I'm surprised you didn't try and break the strike personally and by yourself considering the piddling opposition. Always nice to do down your fellow worker when you've be stuffed yourself isn't it?



RJD	Nov 27 2014, 08:49 AM Post #31
Prudence and Thrift Posts: 12,499 Group: Members Member #9 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	"Fellow worker" what a load of old fashioned 1970s nonsense. There is no such thing as the Working Classes or Working Class solidarity anymore, that disappeared in the last century. There are literally dozens of categories of those that once could be considered "Working Classes" and they no longer share a similar experience of life. That is Labour's problem, there is no longer a focal point. Example if Labour come out and claim it will scrap IDS Welfare Reforms some on the left, the politicised minority will be ecstatic, but very many others will be p155ed off. That is why Labour now aim at the "dumpCameronatanycost-twitterati" at least these are identifiable. As we have seen "white van man" maybe one of those you consider "Working Class", but that does not mean he holds old fashion Labour values or believes in solidarity.



Tigger	Nov 27 2014, 09:37 PM Post #32
Senior Member Posts: 20,106 Group: Members Member #18 Joined: Jun 27, 2014	RJD Nov 27 2014, 08:49 AM "Fellow worker" what a load of old fashioned 1970s nonsense. There is no such thing as the Working Classes or Working Class solidarity anymore, that disappeared in the last century. There are literally dozens of categories of those that once could be considered "Working Classes" and they no longer share a similar experience of life. That is Labour's problem, there is no longer a focal point. Example if Labour come out and claim it will scrap IDS Welfare Reforms some on the left, the politicised minority will be ecstatic, but very many others will be p155ed off. That is why Labour now aim at the "dumpCameronatanycost-twitterati" at least these are identifiable. As we have seen "white van man" maybe one of those you consider "Working Class", but that does not mean he holds old fashion Labour values or believes in solidarity. More outdated old bollocks from the ex council lad dun gud I worked for a large multi national for years and watched them steal our pensions and get more out of us for less whilst the share price rocketed, morale at the sharp end was of course trashed in the process. One thing I did notice is that those "fellow workers" who lost out wanted you to lose out as well, the resentment if you resisted or tried to stand up for yourself was palpable. Disgusting and shameful and the reason I do not tolerate undignified weak minded spineless fools any more, if they'll stab you their fellow worker in the back they'll stab anyone in the back.......



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