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King's view
Topic Started: Jan 3 2015, 11:56 PM (241 Views)
gee4444
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Seem's Kingy has decided to air his views:

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Recession+'not+the+fault+of+Labour'+Ex-bank+boss+blow+to+PM.-a0395302193


Let's see Cammecrony and his ardent Tory boys debate their way out of this one.

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Steve K
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Mervyn King was a Feckwit who let the money supply go out of control on his watch. Of course he wants to blame anyone else but him for his part.

As for his "I don't think it is easy to go back and say any one country on its own could have found their way through it." well it's not like Australia is so hard to find on an Atlas is it Mervyn, Canada didn't do too bad either but perhaps he can't spot that either. Taxi to Specsavers for Mr King



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gee4444
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King isn't deflecting blame from himself, so your views on his character and motivation are not very relevant.

The fact is NL did not 'leave a mess' because of their actions. It was because of the actions of the financial sector. Policies may have allowed the financial sectors to undertake their disgusting behaviour but ultimately the buck stops with them and not NL. That's the point that needs debating.

I don't know the economic details of Canada or Australia. Maybe you'd like to show me some that prove your claim in a new post, if that's what you want to debate?
Edited by gee4444, Jan 4 2015, 12:29 AM.
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Affa
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Quote:
 
The Tory PM has frequently accused Labour of "crashing the economy" while in power in a bid to scare voters into backing the Tories instead.

Quote:
 

And he warned Mr Cameron and other world leaders have not done enough to prevent another banking meltdown and believes policy makers have "not yet got to the heart of what went wrong".


If there is any point in playing the blame game it should be by demonstarting that what went wrong has been addressed and made preventable - that hasn't happened.
Merv could not have made his criticism of Cameron if the Coalition had honoured its pre-election pledge to bring the bankers to account - instead they tried hardest to prevent the EU from limiting their opportunities to do damage.

Edited by Affa, Jan 4 2015, 01:09 AM.
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johnofgwent
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It .. It is GREEN !!
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gee4444
Jan 4 2015, 12:27 AM
The fact is NL did not 'leave a mess' because of their actions. It was because of the actions of the financial sector. Policies may have allowed the financial sectors to undertake their disgusting behaviour but ultimately the buck stops with them and not NL. That's the point that needs debating.
Good point

When I did my economics o level the old labour party had exchange controls almost as tight as the ones italy still had when I took my honeymoon there six years later ... and banks were forced to retain percentages of their paper worth ... in solid form ...

Interezting to note briwn had none if that in place ...
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Lewis
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gee4444
Jan 4 2015, 12:27 AM
King isn't deflecting blame from himself, so your views on his character and motivation are not very relevant.

The fact is NL did not 'leave a mess' because of their actions. It was because of the actions of the financial sector. Policies may have allowed the financial sectors to undertake their disgusting behaviour but ultimately the buck stops with them and not NL. That's the point that needs debating.

I don't know the economic details of Canada or Australia. Maybe you'd like to show me some that prove your claim in a new post, if that's what you want to debate?
Totally agree, if any political party is to blame more, then it is the incompetents with their deregulation of the banking system.
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Steve K
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gee4444
Jan 4 2015, 12:27 AM
King isn't deflecting blame from himself, so your views on his character and motivation are not very relevant.

The fact is NL did not 'leave a mess' because of their actions. It was because of the actions of the financial sector. Policies may have allowed the financial sectors to undertake their disgusting behaviour but ultimately the buck stops with them and not NL. That's the point that needs debating.

I don't know the economic details of Canada or Australia. Maybe you'd like to show me some that prove your claim in a new post, if that's what you want to debate?
Well he more than anyone should have challenged that reckless taking on of household debt that then fuelled a GDP and tax intake bubble that of course was unsustainable. If the BoE lets the like of Northern Rock lend recklessly then the other banks have two choices: also lend recklessly with Mervyn King's full approval or die.

King has much to ponder.

Oh and as for Oz, see if you can spot the massive impact the world recession had on their GDP

Posted Image

Apparently King thinks he can. But that's because he's a 'King idiot if he thinks he can get away with that deception.
Edited by Steve K, Jan 4 2015, 12:04 PM.
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Steve K
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Lewis
Jan 4 2015, 08:10 AM
gee4444
Jan 4 2015, 12:27 AM
King isn't deflecting blame from himself, so your views on his character and motivation are not very relevant.

The fact is NL did not 'leave a mess' because of their actions. It was because of the actions of the financial sector. Policies may have allowed the financial sectors to undertake their disgusting behaviour but ultimately the buck stops with them and not NL. That's the point that needs debating.

I don't know the economic details of Canada or Australia. Maybe you'd like to show me some that prove your claim in a new post, if that's what you want to debate?
Totally agree, if any political party is to blame more, then it is the incompetents with their deregulation of the banking system.
yes Thatcher, Major, Blair and Brown did deregulate too much.

Osborne (to an extent at the EU's strong suggestion) has brought in the real stress tests that have forced the banks to be far more responsible in not lending idiotically. He may be an odious self serving little git but surely he should get some credit for re-regulating the banks.
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Affa
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Steve K
Jan 4 2015, 12:03 PM


King has much to ponder.

Oh and as for Oz, see if you can spot the massive impact the world recession had on their GDP

Of course the focus shifting to commodities and minerals/metals (China buying everything it could for eg), had nothing to do with Australia making a fortune???

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Affa
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Steve K
Jan 4 2015, 12:07 PM


Osborne (to an extent at the EU's strong suggestion) has brought in the real stress tests that have forced the banks to be far more responsible in not lending idiotically. He may be an odious self serving little git but surely he should get some credit for re-regulating the banks.


Does anybody seriously believe that had NL (Brown) attempted to tighten regulations on the City that there would not have been an outrage?
The whole economy rested on the UK FS being the world's major centre for banking .... an inherited position that no government of any colour could have jeopardised ..... imo.

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RJD
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Affa
Jan 4 2015, 01:29 PM
Steve K
Jan 4 2015, 12:07 PM


Osborne (to an extent at the EU's strong suggestion) has brought in the real stress tests that have forced the banks to be far more responsible in not lending idiotically. He may be an odious self serving little git but surely he should get some credit for re-regulating the banks.


Does anybody seriously believe that had NL (Brown) attempted to tighten regulations on the City that there would not have been an outrage?
The whole economy rested on the UK FS being the world's major centre for banking .... an inherited position that no government of any colour could have jeopardised ..... imo.

Ah the old "what if" question.

It is best to read every word King has had to say ion this matter in order to obtain context. Nobody anywhere has claimed that NL was 100% culpable for the recession, so once again we find a Strawman. Basically their actions just exacerbated what was inevitable and made the UK the worst placed economy to accommodate the recession. Spin that any which way you like, but it will always end up the same. Look for justifications for the spending spree and if you are convinced we should have had one then you will find them. Call me old fashioned but I do not believe in purchasing what I cannot afford and when I can I ensure I get good value.



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Affa
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RJD
Jan 4 2015, 03:58 PM
Affa
Jan 4 2015, 01:29 PM
Steve K
Jan 4 2015, 12:07 PM


Osborne (to an extent at the EU's strong suggestion) has brought in the real stress tests that have forced the banks to be far more responsible in not lending idiotically. He may be an odious self serving little git but surely he should get some credit for re-regulating the banks.


Does anybody seriously believe that had NL (Brown) attempted to tighten regulations on the City that there would not have been an outrage?
The whole economy rested on the UK FS being the world's major centre for banking .... an inherited position that no government of any colour could have jeopardised ..... imo.

Ah the old "what if" question.

It is best to read every word King has had to say ion this matter in order to obtain context. Nobody anywhere has claimed that NL was 100% culpable for the recession, so once again we find a Strawman. Basically their actions just exacerbated what was inevitable and made the UK the worst placed economy to accommodate the recession. Spin that any which way you like, but it will always end up the same. Look for justifications for the spending spree and if you are convinced we should have had one then you will find them. Call me old fashioned but I do not believe in purchasing what I cannot afford and when I can I ensure I get good value.




You seem somewhat confused here.
The global crisis that was in the banking sector is a different topic to the one you seem focussed on, i.e. the UK's inability to ride the storm and the consequential price of the Bail-out.
In essence it was the loss of revenue from that sector which precipitated the deficit, that and the added burden of debt interest repayments.
The bottom line is that Bank deregulation was at the root of the problem, an action that gave a once respectable profession the scope to become unscrupulous.
Every other sector continued tp perform and deliver as it had previously, damaged somewhat by the sudden lack of credit availability that the banks (again) were not able to give as a facility.



.
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Steve K
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Affa
Jan 4 2015, 01:23 PM
Steve K
Jan 4 2015, 12:03 PM


King has much to ponder.

Oh and as for Oz, see if you can spot the massive impact the world recession had on their GDP

Of course the focus shifting to commodities and minerals/metals (China buying everything it could for eg), had nothing to do with Australia making a fortune???

You're missing the point. I was showing King to be sus because in the OP linked article he said

"I don't think it is easy to go back and say any one country on its own could have found their way through it."

Well it took me about 10 seconds to find one and I didn't have to even get to B in the alphabet. Mervyn King lost control and now he wants to fondly look back seemingly having lost the plot since.

Just to prove the point here's another spot the imagined recession chart a lot nearer and less minerals resourced than Oz

Posted Image

As I said Mervyn needs a taxi to Specsavers - well either that or Bullshitters Anonymous
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gee4444
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RJD: '...Nobody anywhere has claimed that NL was 100% culpable for the recession...'

You cannot be serious?

Evidence: PMQs July 2010 to the last one: '....The mess left by the last lot (NL)....' and many, many variants used to rebut any criticism of ConDem policies. Additionally it's plastered all over the news, in the papers and generally mentioned in any interview with a Tory MP.

NL's actions did not cause the crisis. The actions of the bankers did. NL and the Tories provided the necessary environment to make their actions all the more reckless and costly (for us). But the point is no country was able to avoid the crisis (even considering SteveK's opinion) and the then head of the BoE agrees.

Maybe you might just be wrong? Perish the thought.


Edited by gee4444, Jan 4 2015, 11:25 PM.
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gee4444
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That Poland GDP constant prices (whatever the hell that's a measure of?) looks far too uniform to be genuine. Someone's been getting giddy with cutting and pasting me thinks.
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Rich
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gee4444
Jan 4 2015, 11:28 PM
That Poland GDP constant prices (whatever the hell that's a measure of?) looks far too uniform to be genuine. Someone's been getting giddy with cutting and pasting me thinks.


Well, Greece managed to gain entry easily enough into the wondrous EU dream, methinks the giddiness comes from Brussels, both Germany and France are guilty of breaking the GDP/debt ratio......so it would appear that anything goes as long as it suits their agenda.....what's good for the goose.......etc.
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Pro Veritas
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gee4444
Jan 3 2015, 11:56 PM
Seem's Kingy has decided to air his views:

http://www.thefreelibrary.com/Recession+'not+the+fault+of+Labour'+Ex-bank+boss+blow+to+PM.-a0395302193


Let's see Cammecrony and his ardent Tory boys debate their way out of this one.

King's just trying to cover his own ass.

His "no one could have prevented it" bollocks is just an attempt to hide serial and institutional incompetence at the BoE under his reign.

And even if he is correct that no one could have prevented it that doesn't mean we couldn't have been in a much better place to weather that storm; and our inability to weather that storm in a manner similar to Aus or Can for example is directly apportionable to Brown and King.

This is the "Please sir, everyone else did it too, so its not my fault I did it" defence; and it simply doesn't work.

People who assume the mantle of authority are supposed to buck the trend and and break free of the herd when that is what is required of them. If they fail to do so the fault is with them, not the herd.

All The Best
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RJD
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Affa
Jan 4 2015, 05:04 PM
RJD
Jan 4 2015, 03:58 PM
Affa
Jan 4 2015, 01:29 PM
Steve K
Jan 4 2015, 12:07 PM


Osborne (to an extent at the EU's strong suggestion) has brought in the real stress tests that have forced the banks to be far more responsible in not lending idiotically. He may be an odious self serving little git but surely he should get some credit for re-regulating the banks.


Does anybody seriously believe that had NL (Brown) attempted to tighten regulations on the City that there would not have been an outrage?
The whole economy rested on the UK FS being the world's major centre for banking .... an inherited position that no government of any colour could have jeopardised ..... imo.

Ah the old "what if" question.

It is best to read every word King has had to say ion this matter in order to obtain context. Nobody anywhere has claimed that NL was 100% culpable for the recession, so once again we find a Strawman. Basically their actions just exacerbated what was inevitable and made the UK the worst placed economy to accommodate the recession. Spin that any which way you like, but it will always end up the same. Look for justifications for the spending spree and if you are convinced we should have had one then you will find them. Call me old fashioned but I do not believe in purchasing what I cannot afford and when I can I ensure I get good value.




You seem somewhat confused here.
The global crisis that was in the banking sector is a different topic to the one you seem focussed on, i.e. the UK's inability to ride the storm and the consequential price of the Bail-out.
In essence it was the loss of revenue from that sector which precipitated the deficit, that and the added burden of debt interest repayments.
The bottom line is that Bank deregulation was at the root of the problem, an action that gave a once respectable profession the scope to become unscrupulous.
Every other sector continued tp perform and deliver as it had previously, damaged somewhat by the sudden lack of credit availability that the banks (again) were not able to give as a facility.



.
Not confused at all, the serial lefties continue to claim that the recent recession was nothing to do with NL decisions in Gov. when it clearly was. Nobody has claimed that that Gov. could have avoided the chilled winds, but it could have ameliorated them rather than exacerbated. As for the revenues, best look to what extent these were based on the Housing and Financial Services bubble and ask yourself "is it morally acceptable that a Gov. borrows money from future generations to finance current consumption"? That is why I say the depth of the last recession was sponsored by NL. To claim that NL had no choice is the lie expounded by liars.

Good to see that the Banking Sector is now more robust, that the Regulatory Authorities are testing this and intend to go further.



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RJD
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gee4444
Jan 4 2015, 11:23 PM
RJD: '...Nobody anywhere has claimed that NL was 100% culpable for the recession...'

You cannot be serious?

Evidence: PMQs July 2010 to the last one: '....The mess left by the last lot (NL)....' and many, many variants used to rebut any criticism of ConDem policies. Additionally it's plastered all over the news, in the papers and generally mentioned in any interview with a Tory MP.

NL's actions did not cause the crisis. The actions of the bankers did. NL and the Tories provided the necessary environment to make their actions all the more reckless and costly (for us). But the point is no country was able to avoid the crisis (even considering SteveK's opinion) and the then head of the BoE agrees.

Maybe you might just be wrong? Perish the thought.


I think my claim is well proven. NL did leave mess behind, but that cannot be construed even by those with the most fertile imaginations to mean they engineered the crash. Those that seek to white-wash over the truth have done Labour more harm and Balls has alienated himself from Joe Public because of this. Biggest mistake Labour has made in recent years is allowing those two, Balls and Milliband, to take control of the Party, but maybe that is all they have.

I once thought the Tory rallying siren would be "don't let Labour ruin all your hard work", now I expect "don't let the SNP and Labour --- blah, blah, blah".



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Steve K
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gee4444
Jan 4 2015, 11:28 PM
That Poland GDP constant prices (whatever the hell that's a measure of?) looks far too uniform to be genuine. Someone's been getting giddy with cutting and pasting me thinks.
Yes of course Gee, it's all a conspiracy ;-)

!jk! !jk! !jk!


Go on have a click or two here (warning: you will find it embarassing to see your theories shredded)
http://www.tradingeconomics.com/poland/indicators

Or maybe you missed this chart from another thread

Posted Image


Who on earth would have such a failure as Mervyn King as a hero?
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Affa
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Steve K
Jan 4 2015, 10:33 PM
Affa
Jan 4 2015, 01:23 PM
Steve K
Jan 4 2015, 12:03 PM


King has much to ponder.

Oh and as for Oz, see if you can spot the massive impact the world recession had on their GDP

Of course the focus shifting to commodities and minerals/metals (China buying everything it could for eg), had nothing to do with Australia making a fortune???

You're missing the point. I was showing King to be sus because in the OP linked article he said

"I don't think it is easy to go back and say any one country on its own could have found their way through it."

Well it took me about 10 seconds to find one and I didn't have to even get to B in the alphabet. Mervyn King lost control and now he wants to fondly look back seemingly having lost the plot since.

As I said Mervyn needs a taxi to Specsavers - well either that or Bullshitters Anonymous

I rather view this stance of yours something like an examiner giving a F (fail) pass mark for a brilliant paper simply because it contained a couple of spelling mistakes.

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Affa
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Steve K
Jan 4 2015, 10:33 PM


Posted Image


Winter takes its toll every winter ........

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Steve K
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Affa
Jan 5 2015, 06:57 PM
I rather view this stance of yours something like an examiner giving a F (fail) pass mark for a brilliant paper simply because it contained a couple of spelling mistakes.

Not my fault if someone asks for the data is it to challenge a side point I made is it Affa? Clever try at deception by you though by omitting to mention that. Go on look back, my main point in post 2 was that "Mervyn King was a Feckwit who let the money supply go out of control on his watch. Of course he wants to blame anyone else but him for his part." Also my main point in posts 7 and 8.

Supported by the figures posted about how he let all that unsustainable consumer debt get taken on and did nothing despite the obvious impact on the money supply. Usual test: see if you can spot where the acceleration started?

Posted Image

Anyway it wasn't a spelling mistake was it. It was either a whopping lie or a reckless false statement made without even remotely checking first. Totally undermines his credibility
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Steve K
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How strange that those so keen to praise the clueless Mervyn King didn't rush to post today's news

It's Official, the BoE under King was clueless

Quote:
 
A month before the start of the financial crisis, the Bank of England was apparently unaware of the impending danger, new documents reveal.

In a unique insight into its workings, the Bank has published minutes of top-secret meetings of its governing body, the Court, between 2007 and 2009.

The minutes show that the Bank did identify liquidity as a "central concern" in July 2007.

However no action was taken as a result.


!jk! how lucky for Mervyn Clueless King that this came out on a good day to bury embarrassing news.
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Tigger
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Steve K
Jan 7 2015, 11:01 PM
How strange that those so keen to praise the clueless Mervyn King didn't rush to post today's news

It's Official, the BoE under King was clueless

Quote:
 
A month before the start of the financial crisis, the Bank of England was apparently unaware of the impending danger, new documents reveal.

In a unique insight into its workings, the Bank has published minutes of top-secret meetings of its governing body, the Court, between 2007 and 2009.

The minutes show that the Bank did identify liquidity as a "central concern" in July 2007.

However no action was taken as a result.


!jk! how lucky for Mervyn Clueless King that this came out on a good day to bury embarrassing news.
A bit like the more recent libor rigging where the US authorities repeatedly warned both the BoE and the FSA that fraudulent trading was going on in a place 3000 miles away from New York............

Useless twats.
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Affa
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It is an opinion - not a fact.
In any case, consistent with my belief that this crisis was no accident, I must of course determine that the BoE along with its counterparts in the US (and elsewhere) were complicit in taking no action ...... after all he attended several Bilderberg meetings - as has Mark Carney in recent years.

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