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| Your Manifesto Priorities. | |
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| Topic Started: Jan 15 2015, 10:23 AM (648 Views) | |
| RJD | Jan 15 2015, 10:23 AM Post #1 |
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Prudence and Thrift
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For me 1). reduce the public spending deficit to zero asap. Certainly on or before 2020 as the promise for 2015 has been missed by a long mile. 2). significantly cut public spending as a share of GDP. Here ~40% of GDP should be the target. 3). to establish a timetable to substantially reduce the national debt as a share of GDP to 40% by running a surplus, in as far as that is possible, in each of every year until such is achieved. 2030 would be a good target. I would like to see it lower, but the consensus seems to be that 40% is the maximum acceptable for reasons of economic security. 4). By fiscal means rebalance the economy away from consumption towards greater exportable production, hence reducing and eliminating our trade deficit by exporting more of our products. As everything else flows from the above they are therefore my imperatives. What are yours? |
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| Steve K | Jan 15 2015, 06:16 PM Post #41 |
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Once and future cynic
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Yes but the false allegation that was made was that Osborne was cutting Total Public Spending to Victorian levels. He isn't, it's a risible allegation |
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| Nonsense | Jan 15 2015, 06:30 PM Post #42 |
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Regular Member
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Okay, we all have our own different views about this, even if we 'agree' about the goals. The only question's is, HOW do we do it & WHO will pay for it? Given George OSBORNE has stated that £35 BILLION per annum needs to be lopped off, here is my 'recipe', which would be the following; TAXATION The first one is a 'no-brainer', it's possible to do this one thing only, to do what OSBORNE is trying to trap the other leaders, who he believes have no 'answers', it's 'painless', it's 'fair', it's 'simple', it's 'obvious', there's is only one question to be asked of ALL political 'leaders' come the run-up to the election, what's your' EXCUSE' NOT TO DO IT. 1\ That is to REMOVE THE UNFAIR 'PENSION CONTRIBUTION RELIEF', THAT BENEFITS ONLY THE 'BETTER-OFF' & THE 'RICH' saving £35 BILLION per year. 2\ IMPOSE A 10% TAX ON 'BUY-TO-LET' LANDLORDS, WHO HAVE ENJOYED A £170BILLION+ ASSET VALUE INCREASE ON TAXPAYER FUNDED ASSET PURCHASES OF THESE RENTED PROPERTIES THROUGH THE HOUSING BENEFIT SYSTEM. 2a\ IN ADDITION TO THE ABOVE, THESE 'LANDLORDS' ENJOY 'YIELDS' FROM 4-20%,FUNDED BY THE TAXPAYERS. 3\ ABOLISH ALL TAX BREAKS ON THOSE EARNING\ PAYING THE TOP RATE OF TAX, INCLUDING 'TAX FREE PAY', AKA AS 'ALLOWANCES'. 3a\ ABOLISH THE 'BASIC RATE' FOR ALL TOP RATE TAXPAYERS,AS A 'ONE-OFF' RAISE THEIR STARTING RATE AT WHICH THEY BEGIN PAYING TAX. 4\ CHANGE THE VAT RATE ON UTILITY BILLS FROM 5% - 'ZERO' RATE, WHICH IS ANOTHER 'NO-BRAINER', AS THE GOV'T WOULD RECEIVE AN additional 15% IN VAT REVENUE (15% extra on the total VAT take from utility bills)BY DOING SO. STOP 'ALL' GOV'T 'CAPITAL SPENDING'(EXCEPT ON HEALTH),UNTIL THE FISCAL DEFICIT IS ELIMINATED. If just the top one is enough to do what OSBORNE says is required, you may ask, why do the 'other things', the answer is simple. A 'buffer' or 'reserve' is needed to fill any 'shortfall's', which will 'probably' not be required, but, which will enable the goal to be achieved much sooner. I could introduce much more by way of changes, but, I believe that the above are 'really' fair to ALL taxpayers. When the above is achieved, I would, on achieving a fiscal surplus, pay down the debt, upon which, when achieved, REDUCE THE TOP RATE OF TAX TO THAT OF 'BASIC RATE' . Further, the tax credit system related to in work payments is WRONG in principle, therefore, I would use some of the 'surplus' tax receipts to reduce this, by offsetting company taxes for employers that increase the pay rates to their employees, who would have their wage levels compared to a 'living wage index' set by the government each year & adjusted for inflation. The objective would be to eliminate tax credits, thus making employers pay a 'living wage' over a ten year period, eliminating this taxpayer support system.. 'Tax Breaks' are 'in-work' 'BENEFITS' for the 'BETTER-OFF & the RICH. We should abolish this 'wealth-fare' system for the 'better-off' & the RICH. As a society, we CANNOT AFFORD TWO TYPES OF 'WEALTH-WELFARE' SYSTEMS, ONE MUST GO, THE TAXPAYER FUNDED 'WEALTH-FARE' SYSTEM SHOULD GO. IMMIGRATION The pro-immigrant PC brigade say that if we curtail immigration to this country, other countries will reciprocate, that's completely fair & would be beneficial to the immigration\population picture in this country. I would STOP ALL 'COMMONWEALTH' right of entry to the UK. I would introduce a compulsory 'Fidelity Bond', that ALL employers of migrants would have to pay, amounting to £75,000 per employee(YES, make them pay the approximate 'real' cost of employing migrants to the country), which would cover 'displacement' of indigenous labour, health charges(no 'free' NHS treatment being available to them), repatriation charges, absconding of the employee would result in penury charges to the value of £100,000. Abolish ALL rights to a 'family life' for any immigrants. The above would bring into 'balance' the cost\benefits pro=rata, between immigrants & those departing these shores, backed up by annual recording of in-out traffic, to determine an agreed population level. The NHS The NHS was never set up to, or intended to offer 'treatment' to the lifestyles of the current generation, therefore the following treatment options to the 'lifestyle' patient groups would STOP. ALL 'Lifestyle' referrals for treatment would be ended, gross obesity(not overweight cases)Alcoholic, smoking related lung diseases, drug related cases, ALL non-normal sexual referrals would all cease to have any 'free' treatment options, an 'advice' option would be introduced to help these people change their lifestyles or they would have to pay for any 'treatment'. ALL A&E 'RTA' cases would be payment imposed, either directly to the patient or through his insurers on production of a verified & appropriate policy document. ALL 'cosmetic' treatments for other than 'congenital' cases would STOP. HOUSING I have elsewhere on the forum noted what is required to transform the housing market in this country . I 'recommend' these measures to the forum , if, as I hope, you find them 'fair', please copy & paste them to D,CA'MORON' for his 'edification', LOL. The BBC Either it is sold off or the following changes are required; License fee payers are the 'owners' of the BBC, therefore, the following should happen; Viewers(licensed) should have the right to more control over what type of, as well as content of programs, including involvement & making of programs. Interested groups of viewers should have funds available from the license fee to produce their own programs relating to any subject of general\specific interest to the 'indiginous' population. Many programs could be made of hobbies, crafts, studies, education, virtually everything except RELIGION. On political programs, the BBC should STOP 'choreographing' the programs, which is a form of controlled propaganda, therefore, no more 'BBC' 'Chairpersons' on such programs, instead, strict rules on questions & answers, which must be topic orientated, with no 'drift' allowed & Q & A's must be brief & time limited. The chairperson can use a switch to end any infringements of the rules. HOUSE OF LORDS Politicians want a continuation of the anarchic, patronising system, it needs no such thing, Therefore, I would ABOLISH the House of Lords, STOPPING ALL payments to the 'peers'. There is no need or requirement of 'another' House to run our faltering 'democracy', therefore it MUST & SHOULD GO. Like 'devolution', it's a device set up as a cop out from the 'democratic' process, in order to make available a 'second' life for these democratic failures. The ROYAL FAMILY This, like the House of Lords is an anachronism of a bygone undemocratic age, it MUST be ended or reformed. I therefore propose that ONLY the 'monarch' should be retained, that 'monarch's ' traditional continuation must be re-arranged with a more 'democratic' system. I propose that the 'heredity' principle to succession be abolished & replaced with an 'elective' system, in which everyone has a say. The duration of term of office would be determined in the course of setting up the alternative system. The 'Crown' property` & ALL assets that are available to the monarchy would cease to exist. A FULL & comprehensive inventory of 'royal' assets be taken & FULL 'Marginal' rates of tax be paid on them. This includes ALL 'residential', 'Land' assets, such as the 'Duchy of Cornwall' , held by 'Prince 'Charles. ALL rights to confer 'title's' by the monarch would be ended. A 'Capital' tax on ALL 'monarchial' assets would apply at a 'marginal' rate equal to the income tax available as recognition of the historical benefit of the position held by the monarch. ALL tax breaks enjoyed by ALL of that extended family to be ended. SOCIAL SECURITY It has become obvious that the system has become a hollow shell compared to pre- 2010. I propose further changes; No pupil, student or university graduate should be allowed to leave these places without a job to enter into. No young person should be 'entitled' to any 'benefits, until having been employed for 5 years of continuous employment. Everyone of the above shall be guaranteed a job by the state. Anyone leaving(for whatever reason)employment for the first five years shall not be 'entitled' to any benefits. Anyone claiming benefits MUST show 5 years of continuous employment in order to qualify for any benefit. Any benefits payable must be the adult equivalent & must be less than any adult in full employment. The state pension should be changed so that it meets the 'living wage' criteria. I propose that EMPLOYERS of immigrants become liable for ALL benefits currently payable by the state to such claimants (This is included in the 'Fidelity' Bond mentioned elsewhere in this article). I can add substantially to this draft 'manifesto', but needs must take precedence... I ALSO would like you to send them to Ed MILLIBAND & Ed BALLS(if he has any)to digest for their consideration. Edited by Nonsense, Jan 21 2015, 05:44 PM.
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| krugerman | Jan 17 2015, 11:37 AM Post #43 |
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Regular Member
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(1) The present governments method of reducing the deficit is too heavily one sided towards budget cuts, there is another method of reducing the deficit by raising revenue, I would like to see the methodology shifted towards a mixture of budget reductions and raising revenue. By implementing new, fair and sensible tax laws such as a Mansion Tax, Land Tax, Bank Bonus Tax, it would ensure that essential public services could be spared from the harshest cuts, and it would create some additional revenue for investing in the NHS. (2) Abolish the bedroom tax, and replace it with measures that make it worthwhile for single people to live in one bedroom accommodation - but ONLY if one bedroom accommodation is available, no one should be penalized for living a large property if smaller properties are not available. (3) Abolish the Health & Social Care Act 2012, so that no profit making organisation can provide health care within the NHS, but there is no reason why a "marketplace" cannot exist between different hospitals, health services, trusts or even third sector providers. (4) Shift our foreign and defence policy more towards our own back yard, the UK is not a world power any more. (5) Work with Europe to put pressure on Israel into agreeing a two state solution (6) Follow the example of France and make all remaining overseas territories a part of the United Kingdom, residents of the Falkland Islands, Gibraltar and elsewhere to become full British citizens with a seat or seats in the House of Commons. (7) Terminate the lease of the British Indian Ocean Territory to the United States and allow the residents of Diego Garcia to return, from where they were illegally and forcibly removed. (8) Bring the entire rail network and all train operators back into state ownership, but leave in place the marketplace, each regional (state owned) company to be allowed to tender for other franchises. The revenue put into the treasury by rail operators to be used to invest in opening more stations, extending lines, creating new lines, branches and the reopening of disused stations and lines, thereby shifting the burden away from cars and roads. (9) some kind of measures to help the British pub industry It seems ludicrous that a well known supermarket can sell bottles of beer to a pub cheaper than the brewer of that beer could - put a stop to the pub companies from dictating where tenants can buy from - introduce a minimum alcohol unit price - introduce a "right to buy" law for pub tenants. That'll do for now |
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| Malum Unus | Jan 17 2015, 12:04 PM Post #44 |
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Hater of Political Correctness and Legalese
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But what if you take into account the current cost of living, rent, food, wages, ETC In relation to the amount of Public Spending?... While he may not be cutting Public Spending numerically to Victorian levels, he may still be effectively doing so. Edited by Malum Unus, Jan 17 2015, 12:04 PM.
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| papasmurf | Jan 17 2015, 12:07 PM Post #45 |
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Senior Member
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You do realise a small number of people would still be at an educational establishment until they reached retirement age. It is nearly impossible for the majority of people to be in five years continuous employment, and has been so for decades. So what are they supposed to do? Die? (This is a serious point by the way as non-one who proposes not paying any benefits to what would be many millions people seem to realise or care about the consequences of such policies. As for out of work benefits being less than 40 hours at the minimum wage, they already are, and have been for as very long time, with very few exceptions. |
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| Nonsense | Jan 17 2015, 12:25 PM Post #46 |
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Regular Member
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I think that you will find that Osborne was\is cutting, but that, like the saying goes, "there's no such thing as a 'free' lunch" , because the deficit is actually growing, as is the national debt, to the tune of £375 BILLION that the Coalition have indebted the people of this country with, who will finance that additional debt, ie, the 'poor'. When a government cuts benefits to those dependent on them(the 'deserving' & legitimate claimants only)there is a negative economic effect that the Tories with their ideological hatred of the poor, simply IGNORE in their calculations. If one thinks that the Tories are clear-headed about our situation, then reflect on CAMERON's comments that companies should pay wage increases to their employees due to falling oil prices. Does that idiot even know what he's talking about? Lower oil prices equals LOWER TAX REVENUES. Lower oil prices equals lower business cost. Lower oil prices equal lower INFLATION Lower oil prices equal lower INFLATION(Cost-of-Living) ONLY if those cost to the CONSUMER are passed back DIRECTLY to the CONSUMER-NOT to company employees through pay\wage increases, which will be reflected in higher prices when oil prices rise. CAMERON's comments will result in no benefit to consumers at all & companies will NOT pass on those cost savings to consumers. IT IS JUST PRE-ELECTION FANTASY ISLAND EMPTY RHETORIC STUFF FROM THE TORY CAMP. Edited by Nonsense, Jan 17 2015, 12:37 PM.
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| Nonsense | Jan 17 2015, 12:48 PM Post #47 |
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Regular Member
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[/quote]You do realise a small number of people would still be at an educational establishment until they reached retirement age. The question is, do you recognize that as an 'anomaly'? If so, it should be ended through time limited 'education'. Quote; "It is nearly impossible for the majority of people to be in five years continuous employment", Again, like so many other changes over the years, what is 'normal' has mutated into a new 'normality'. The question is, are these changes 'good' for society, or, just for companies. If so, to whom should serve whom?.. Should the people 'serve' business, or, should 'business' serve the people. Similar question, should the country(taxpayers) serve 'business, or, should 'business' serve the country? Answers to D CAMERON,CLEGG & MILLIBAND please. Consider the above & decide who should pay for the changes in work patterns, who is responsible for the unemployment & who should pay. Lastly, who is going to pay for the state benefits of the 5-6 million migrants, when the economy slides? Or, will the poor have their benefits cut again, in order to finance the benefits of the unemployed migrants,? Enough is enough, don't you think? Edited by Nonsense, Jan 17 2015, 12:48 PM.
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| Steve K | Jan 17 2015, 01:18 PM Post #48 |
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Once and future cynic
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IMHO best so far Krugerman, there are of course points I disagree with but it does look like a thought through position. So as I'm a serial gobby poster of opinions, my turn at a manifesto: The United Kingdom faces challenges we must address and has new opportunities we must seize. This is not a time for political dogma but for intelligent implementation of policies that will address both root causes and the symptoms of our problems. We will do what is good and has wide benefit and not what may be perfect for a small area of society Social Division We will only have a secure and fair society when we have firmly reversed the social divisions that have worsened over the last 50 years of dogma based short term policies. We must remove the scourge of unemployment and we must create worthwhile jobs. We will therefore: - raise the top rate of income tax to 50% for income above £1M, income above £50k will be taxed at 40% and no income tax or National Insurance will be payable on income below the NMW level of ~£14k - The rich must pay their fair share for the benefits they derive from society. We will uncap Council Tax to introduce an approximate 0.5% per year mansion tax and a similar level will apply for share and asset holdings in the UK over £1M per person. The use of trusts to avoid inheritance tax will be ended however a discount on inheritance tax liability on assets will be allowed of 1% for every year they have been declared for these wealth taxes. - We will encourage firms that are both profitable and employ properly rewarded UK workers and discourage those that are based on imports with only a few UK staff. - Employers will only pay National Insurance on salaries over £1M - Corporation Tax will be the lowest in Europe or 15% whichever is higher - To remove the anomaly where companies are tax incentivised to shed workers, the change in sum redundancy liability will form part of the taxable profits calculation. Company pension contributions and liability will be similarly exempt - it will not be illegal to employ someone at a wage of more than 50% of the NMW. To ensure this does not lead to exploitation, this will only apply if the employer has not declared redundancies in the previous 6 months and an employee's refusal to take or stay in a a job below NMW will not cause any DWP sanction - Value Added Tax will be increased and applicability of the lower rate widened to fund the above measures. Importers will pay for the jobs they have destroyed. - MPs salaries will be fixed to be a multiple of the average wage of the lowest 25% of the workforce including those on JSA . This will focus MPs on addressing the wealth divide Benefits - we will remove the spare room subsidy impacts where there is no practicable way the claimant could remove their need for the room - Child allowance will be abolished for any second child born after February 2016 - Any child where at birth there are less than two biological parents identified will have DNA samples taken and parents will be the first in line to fund the child's welfare Government Spending - if after 2018 there is a budget deficit of higher than 1% of GDP a General Election will be necessary and until one is then held all cabinet minister salaries will be zeroed Immigration We will reform the Nationality Acts so that from May 2015 nationality will only be given to those who have lived in the UK for 10 years with a UK parent or have been born to two UK parents Health - the NHS will stay as a state run institution providing free at point of delivery service to UK citizens and authorised residents where no person can be identified as being responsible for causing the need of health care. - we will maintain NHS budgets in real terms per citizen and will maintain a limit on some fringe treatments -we will encourage proper use of private funds by allowing privately run hospitals and the first £20,000 of private healthcare premiums will be eligible for tax relief - we will freeze all increase in tobacco taxes until a study is completed that shows the true net effect of smoking. We will abolish the ban on smoking in the workplace (incl pubs) where measures are in place to ensure any harmful gas levels are within limits we will agree with the BMA - behaving irresponsibly under the influence of drink or drugs will be a criminal offence - parents that allow their children to run amok in pubs or other public places will be shot in front of said children * Crime - policing and prison space levels will be proportional to the level of crime - sentencing for repeat offences will be incrementally higher for each offence - carrying an illegal weapon or causing anyone to fear for their safety will attract a mandatory custodial sentence. - the release at half of sentence will be limited to only those prisoners who have had good behaviour for the preceding 3 years - the age of criminal responsibility will be lowered to 8 however sentencing will reflect a proper account of the child's needs and will rarely be custodial. Parents will be legally responsible for damage their children cause unless they can show they acted responsiblly Defence and Foreign Policy - we will break off diplomatic relations and implement sanctions again any belligerent nation that commits war crimes. For clarity this includes the State of Israel under its current government - we will maintain defence spending at current levels and focus it on defence of the UK and implementing UN Security Council resolutions - foreign aid will be strictly managed and cut to not exceed 150% of comparable nation levels. Countries with high levels of social division (eg India) will be incentivised to improve by the use of trade tariffs Europe We believe a UK future in a fair EU is better than one outside the EU but not to the exclusion of considering alternatives. The current EU and its plans must be reformed to once again be fair to the UK. - we will hold an In/Out referendum by the end of 2017 - we will veto all EU changes until we are allowed to implement effective measures to prevent large numbers of migrant workers taking jobs from equally able UK citizens. - we will veto free movement of labour from new EU countries that do not have a per capita GDP above 80% of the EU average - following the In/Out referendum we will veto all EU changes until it is reformed so that benefits are paid by the country of citizenship - we will veto any EU funds and bail outs for any EU nation that implements a predatory taxation policy to the detriment of the UK. For clarity this includes Irelands fuel, airport tax and company taxation policies. * only partly joking on this one Edited by Steve K, Jan 17 2015, 01:20 PM.
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| Steve K | Jan 17 2015, 01:21 PM Post #49 |
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Once and future cynic
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Maybe, maybe not. Dunno but doubt it. The post I was rebutting did not have that in it, it was talking about absolute levels of spending - we have to guess in real terms |
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| Affa | Jan 17 2015, 04:07 PM Post #50 |
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Senior Member
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| Affa | Jan 17 2015, 04:14 PM Post #51 |
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Senior Member
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Then you missed the point being made with that comment! A comment that indicated that the UK today is increasingly more like the Victorian period than in any period since. Most like, in terms of the Wealth gap, in terms unemployment, most like for job insecurity, and most like because of it turning into a service based society where the lower class are fodder for the wealthy, the businessman that can exploit his labourers and treat them as mere commodities ......... an age of despair. Scrooge. |
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| Nonsense | Jan 17 2015, 04:55 PM Post #52 |
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Regular Member
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| RJD | Jan 17 2015, 05:12 PM Post #53 |
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Prudence and Thrift
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Tig: 1. What use is high frequency trading, endless money churning for a fee and currency speculation, no I don't know either, all are anti social and destructive and add no value, something you continually bang on about. Must admit there are aspects of trade methods that are disturbing, but you do not indicate in what way they bring harm to our lives. A lot of such is a zero sum game with winners and losers, so I really do not see why such is so high up your agenda. Tig: 2. As you live under a Welsh rock and drink blue hemlock in copious quantities it may have escaped your attention that we spend approx £24bn a year on housing benefit, the bulk of it going to those who actually work, we have funding for lending, subsidies for house builders and help to buy among other things, all these things skew the market, got that now? You destroy your point by behaving in a juvenile manner. I therefore assume the rest of the sentence to be equally pathetic so will not waste my time. Tig: 3. Britain is not going to reconquer the World as a trading nation or join some English speaking only trading bloc we simply lack the clout, influence and sheer muscle to do so, participate in Europe and embrace it, it's not going away and much of it already outperforms us, time to bury the Empire and wake up to the fact it's the 21st century and not the 19th. Bit of a Straw-man as I do not recall anyone claiming such. Another wast of bandwidth. Tig: 4.Target areas we are already good at to start with, high precision and high tech manufacturing drug development and the luxury goods market are all areas that would benefit from useful tax breaks. So we are going to appoint Plumbers to pick the winners are we? That should give the lads studying for their MBAs a good laugh. 5. 6. It's pointless a relic of history, get rid of the Lords. 8/9. Privatisation of the public utilities for example has been an embarrassing and shameful disaster, the idea was to free these from state control, many are now owned by foreign state controlled enterprises! We have also seen this last week how a private company reacts when it buggers up running a hospital, it just does a runner and it gets dumped back on the taxpayer, and this will doubtless become standard practice, time to put practicality over pathetic political dogma and dodgy private finance. I see no evidence that UK Utilities have not delivered anything other than good value to the UK consumer, maybe you have new private evidence that you can share. As for the recent privatised Hospital, just wait a little and you will learn how that was stitched up. 10.Young people are effectively disenfranchised with all the main parties pandering to the grey vote to a lesser or greater degree, fact, the majority of the elderly are unproductive and cost far more than they are worth in economic terms, and they still insist on spending their kids inheritance! My parents who lived and fought during the war had the noble concept that you left the country a slightly better place after you departed this Earth, you generation in particular threw that one out the nearest window, time to start thinking of other people instead of just yourself............. Ignorant generalisation. Most people for a very long time now have not been productive in the economic sense post retirement. As for kids inheritence best point your finger at Politicians. All said you offer a pathetic list of manifesto priorities, most seem to have been concocted when your belly was full of bile. I note your adopt the Euro at any time and any price was avoided for secondary comments. |
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| Tigger | Jan 17 2015, 05:20 PM Post #54 |
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Senior Member
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^ Entirely predictable and evasive one eyed drivel. not worthy of an even half intelligent reply! |
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| Steve K | Jan 17 2015, 08:37 PM Post #55 |
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Once and future cynic
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I missed no such thing, the post I am calling bollocks is this one:
You and others may wish to bring in other ways to compare Osborne with 1900 but I'm just saying that that ^ is rubbish. |
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| Affa | Jan 17 2015, 08:57 PM Post #56 |
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Senior Member
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The mention of the Victorian era and any comparison with that dystopian period, by RJD in this instance, has the purpose of saying 'things have been much worse' as if that is a justification for the return of 'Hard Times' 2014 style ........ it isn't, and as I mentioned the road to such ruin is the road we are on. |
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| Steve K | Jan 17 2015, 09:04 PM Post #57 |
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Once and future cynic
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I really don't think RJD any more than I did needs you to make up words to put in his mouth as to what you imagine his purpose was. Perhaps you should focus on what people actually say and not what you imagine they have said |
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| Affa | Jan 17 2015, 10:49 PM Post #58 |
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Senior Member
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What is the purpose of mentioning the Victorian period if it is not as a reference to the dystopia it was? I rather think you are caught with your pants down, and metaphorically speaking your reply is an attempt to cover your embarrassment with a small fig leaf. |
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| Steve K | Jan 17 2015, 10:56 PM Post #59 |
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Once and future cynic
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No Affa you have decided to make up a story, any story because you can't deal with what people actually posted "Then you missed the point being made with that comment!"
Edited by Steve K, Jan 17 2015, 10:57 PM.
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| johnofgwent | Jan 18 2015, 08:02 AM Post #60 |
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It .. It is GREEN !!
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Cur the recruitment of an entire army of ambulance chasers dedicated to inventing ways you will be found "responsible" for your own condition, leading eventually to this :- "Oh dear, you got yourself born with those genes, tut tut tut you should have had yourself aborted, pay up" |
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| Lewis | Jan 18 2015, 08:21 AM Post #61 |
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Senior Member
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Too true and it is obvious that the austerity measures that affect the poor more than those who caused the problems have clearly not worked. The so-called deficit is mostly a Tory fairy tale and borrowing by this incompetent government is higher than it was in the years leading up to the crisis, so much for that Tory lie then that Labour were profiligate with spending. http://www.ukpublicspending.co.uk/total_spending_chart Right whingers don't like factual evidence it appears. |
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| Gnikkk | Jan 18 2015, 08:32 AM Post #62 |
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Regular Member
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As population control is important to most problem issues in the country. I would say population control measures. This country runs like a 5 kid family living in a 3-bed house.
Edited by Gnikkk, Jan 18 2015, 08:33 AM.
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| Cymru | Jan 18 2015, 09:25 AM Post #63 |
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Alt-Right
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Population control Energy security Food security Water security |
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| Steve K | Jan 18 2015, 11:09 AM Post #64 |
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Once and future cynic
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No but if you go doing dangerous sports better get accident insurance, if you cause a car accident your insurer will be paying for the A&E treatment etc etc |
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| Affa | Jan 18 2015, 01:47 PM Post #65 |
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The NHS costs £bns to run. The Private Sector = Investors, profiteers, see that money and want a piece of it, want to run it for profit. Nowhere in this is there a desire to improve access to the service or the service itself, and if either are restricted in the urge for profit, so be it. The Public will still pay, still be the losers, and as the record shows, lose more. That we have ruling politicians, media commentators, and press reporters, that are abetting this transformation is an indictment of how rotten the elite have become. |
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| Nonsense | Jan 18 2015, 06:34 PM Post #66 |
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Exactly how are young people 'disenfranchised'? Are you referring to those under the legal voting age? Or, those who do not bother voting? I'm in my 70's, please tell me what 'pandering' I have been subjected to, as I must live on another planet. My pension's total less than the tax allowance (£10500) for someone of my age. I cannot get any 'tax credit' to increase my income. I pay Council Tax I get no reductions on my utility bills or any 'Cold weather payments)..Note: I worked ALL my life & qualify for a FULL state pension, which is lower than that on offer for someone who retires in 18 months time, who works just 35 years-NOT 50 years. I get no 'free' TV licence-a case of discrimination between one group of state pensioners & another group of age 75+. Q\Where are pensioners or other 'elderly' spending their kids inheritance? My late mother's sister pays £3,000 per week for 'care'(extortion) to a 'private' 'care' home, YES, it's her son's money that's paying for it, but, the majority are forced to pay the state the 'inheritance' money for 'care', which was once 'free' until the younger generations thought that it was 'normal' to live on the state the day that they left school, in addition to the 'holocaust' that the young generation caused by their 'liberal' behaviour in voting for New Labour's 'open-the-floodgates-to-immigrants' policy, that's let in SIX MILLION+ MIGRANTS. The 'elderly' are RETIRED, their 'pensions' are paid for by their 'OWN' contributions, in addition to which we paid for the massive increases in Child Benefits through our income taxes, brought up our own children, pay for things that our children cannot afford for their children that attract so many migrants to our shores. YES, We 'elderly thought that we were creating a better place for our descendants, but New Labour NEVER asked us if we wanted MASS UNCONTROLLED IMMIGRATION, BENEFITS FOR ALL, NO MATTER WHERE YOU LIVE,A MILLION 'PUBLIC SERVICE JOBS GOING TO THOSE 'MIGRANTS', WHO USE THAT EXPERIENCE TO FLEECE OUR COUNTRY. In all honesty, I think that you should think before posting such TRIPE. Have a 'good' day. |
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| papasmurf | Jan 18 2015, 06:39 PM Post #67 |
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All three main parties doing things to them not for them. |
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| Nonsense | Jan 18 2015, 06:39 PM Post #68 |
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LOL, you missed, 'Social Security'. |
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| Tigger | Jan 18 2015, 06:51 PM Post #69 |
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I have the Worlds smallest violin here would you like me to play a tune for you? Here is a list of things available to you when you were young but that are not available to today's young people, thanks in large part to politicians pandering to grey haired self centred elderly whingers.They will be in a FAR worse position than you in the coming decades. Free university education. Rent controls and affordable housing. Proper apprenticeships, again often with state help. Utility bills often bundled up, ie water rates as part of local corporation. ie cheaper. Pensions pots not subject the the ravages of the de regulated City. A reasonable level of job security and the chance to plan ahead. Need I go on? And do keep in mind that you and your ilk have been voting for easy credit, house price inflation and cheap imports for thirty years now, and because of this rank stupidity your lot have near bankrupted the nation and screwed up the prospects for those that will inherit your "legacy"! Edited by Tigger, Jan 18 2015, 06:54 PM.
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| Nonsense | Jan 18 2015, 06:54 PM Post #70 |
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What makes you think that any of these will raise the 'Standard of Living' for the ordinary worker? Of course NOT, they are NOT meant to are they? You see, ANY 'TORY' measures of shrinking the state, will NOT make anyone 'better off', they will just use the proceeds to lower the national Debt, lower tax for the rich, AKA 'looking after number one' or 'look after our own kind first', NOT exactly a 'National' Party are they, the 'Tories'? There again, neither are New Labour & YES they are STILL 'New Labour', ALWAYS will be UNTIL they adopt 'Clause 4' again. |
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| Rich | Jan 18 2015, 07:10 PM Post #71 |
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Where Asians ans east Europeans are concerned I would suggest that you have underestimated the numbers, have you ever heard of "hotbedding" where shiftworking is concerned, say in taxi driving for instance? |
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| Rich | Jan 18 2015, 07:13 PM Post #72 |
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As I have whinged many times before, I would like to see any party/coalition coming to office to have their manifestos made legally binding, I do appreciate that other members think I am tilting at windmills, but if it were the case it would make the liars concentrate on telling truthfull aspirations and not just spouting soundbites. |
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| Nonsense | Jan 18 2015, 07:15 PM Post #73 |
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I shall leave the 'rank stupidity' where it belongs, in your court. I PAID for my apprenticeship, as did everyone else, there was no state 'apprenticeship' system, unless you know better? I left school on a Friday, went straight to my father's employer with my dad, then signed my indentures, started work on the Monday & I was paid just £2.50 per week. When I started at the School of Art twice a week, it was a good experience, a new School of Art was being opened at Hastings, where I met Harry H. Corbett,(Steptoe & Son) who was also a student there. University education was not universally available, it was virtually unobtainable, unless you attended Grammar School. Note; under the 11+ system, on entering secondary education, like the extermination camps under Hitler, pupils were either directed to 'Grammar' Schools(of which there was much corruption, by buying places from parents)or, one was directed through the 'vacation' route of post-war Secondary Education. Such university education was NOT 'free', it was paid for by taxpayers. Rent Controls are a necessity, as they are now, unless a system of taxation is used to reverse the current situation. 'Affordable' housing is a mere slogan, with no relevance at all, the same people who could not afford to buy then, are no different to those of today. Utility bills were cheaper for that reason, they were owned by the state(people)(Clause 4-get it?),why would they have changed it, apart from the criminal incompetence of politicians of all party's, the Tories, because they hate state ownership-meaning, no 'profits' to screw the people for' & Labour, because they couldn't even run a water tap. Many pensioners, in fact most of them either had a 'private' pension, often inadequate, plus a meagre state pension, back in those days, even such low pensions paid the rent, food, clothes, et'c , my abiding memory, is the generosity of my maternal grandparents, they were second to none, Brilliant in fact & anyone born during the war really appreciated their parents\grand parents. Of course times change, the country is filled with 'one-parent' families & the nation is not 'richer' for it, it is in one stinking mess, thanks to the younger generation of politicians that think of nothing but themselves. Job security or planning ahead. Look, your lot voted in the trash that put the country where it currently is, YOU get it OUT of the mess. Edited by Nonsense, Jan 18 2015, 07:48 PM.
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| Nonsense | Jan 18 2015, 07:19 PM Post #74 |
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There is some justification for that Rich, but then what would these workshy skivvying politicians do for the rest of the time, create more 'breaks-from-Westminster' like creating more school holidays? Yes, make it 'Legal' ,but with a punishment of 'death-by-hanging' for failure's. |
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| Rich | Jan 18 2015, 07:24 PM Post #75 |
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" but then what would these workshy skivvying politicians do for the rest of the time, " Probably concentrate their minds on their second jobs. Regards, Rich. Professional cynic.
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| Nonsense | Jan 18 2015, 07:30 PM Post #76 |
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I will go along with that PS. I agree totally, that many young people get a raw deal from government, it's all 'relative' though, they, even in the current situation, are 'relatively' rich in comparison to generations ago. I'm a great believer in hard-work & proper reward. I believe in the 'accumulation' method of acquiring 'wealth' NOT the 'speculative' method, it requires self-discipline to save whilst your peers are over-indulging themselves(just look at waistlines-compare them with the war years or up to the 1970's to see what has changed). I would NOT allow benefits for the young who do not work, but would do anything to help those who help themselves along in life, the 'young' that is. Unfortunately, for the Tories, such things are just slogans, with no substance behind them. Edited by Nonsense, Jan 18 2015, 07:31 PM.
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