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What is Labour for?
Topic Started: Jan 30 2015, 08:21 AM (3,074 Views)
RJD
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Prudence and Thrift
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Quote:
 
Labour would not reverse billions of pounds of spending cuts to the police, hospitals, armed forces and local councils, Ed Balls has confirmed.
The savings include cutting £3.3billion from councils’ budgets, making £700million worth of cuts to the pay of members of the armed forces and shaving £400million off the NHS pay bill.


LINK

It has to be asked, what are Labour for if it is going to match the Tory budget programme? They now promise to stick to current Coalition plans so what are the offering? Maybe they think they can offer an experienced Management Team that can stimulate the economy and hold a tighter grip on State spending? Makes one want to laugh. Let's get real, without a programme of increases in State expenditure coupled with a programme of social engineering to make us fit their mould there is absolutely no point in Labour.
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papasmurf
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Nonsense
Feb 2 2015, 04:59 PM
For those of you, like me, who may have experienced health care in this country before the NHS was founded, would know the real cost of treatment\care from that period, but also, more crucially indeed, the NHS was not created to COUNTER THE LIFESTYLE CHOICES THAT CAUSE OBESITY,UNWANTED PREGNANCIES, DRUG ADDITION,SMOKING,ALCOHOL ADDICTION OR LIVER DISEASE & OF COURSE 'GAY' MALADIES.

These things above should be paid for 'PRIVATELY' NOT BY THE NHS.

Do you work for the Daily Mail? (Seriously, the DM had similar rant recently. ) It may surprise you given your ill informed rant that, there are factors involved in obesity, drug addiction, and alcoholism you are not aware of. A substantial number of people have those and other problems as a direct result of sexual and or physical abuse as children.
I would be interested to know what you think "Gay Maladies" are.
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Nonsense
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papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 05:08 PM
Nonsense
Feb 2 2015, 04:59 PM
For those of you, like me, who may have experienced health care in this country before the NHS was founded, would know the real cost of treatment\care from that period, but also, more crucially indeed, the NHS was not created to COUNTER THE LIFESTYLE CHOICES THAT CAUSE OBESITY,UNWANTED PREGNANCIES, DRUG ADDITION,SMOKING,ALCOHOL ADDICTION OR LIVER DISEASE & OF COURSE 'GAY' MALADIES.

These things above should be paid for 'PRIVATELY' NOT BY THE NHS.

Do you work for the Daily Mail? (Seriously, the DM had similar rant recently. ) It may surprise you given your ill informed rant that, there are factors involved in obesity, drug addiction, and alcoholism you are not aware of. A substantial number of people have those and other problems as a direct result of sexual and or physical abuse as children.
I would be interested to know what you think "Gay Maladies" are.
My point PS, is that those things mentioned, were never intended to be conditions that were treatable by the NHS, they are 'amenable' through other means within the government's power to address NOT the NHS.

It is NOT a 'rant', you will of course like to throw any insult that fits into the liberal, left-wing agenda that has put this country into it's current state, wouldn't you now?

Oh, by the way, I 'hate'(don't call me a 'bigot')'Right-wing' TORIES, just as much as the rest of them, in fact, I 'hate' them ALL without exception.

Oh, by the way, those 'gay' maladies are just that, things that 'gay' people think ought to be 'treated' by the NHS, any 'problem' with that, after all, it wasn't a 'problem' decades ago was it?
Edited by Nonsense, Feb 2 2015, 05:24 PM.
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Nonsense
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"It may surprise you given your ill informed rant that, there are factors involved in obesity, drug addiction, and alcoholism you are not aware of. A substantial number of people have those and other problems as a direct result of sexual and or physical abuse as children".

A typical left-wing false analysis of social\personal choices that people make, just IGNORE THE FACT THAT THEY ARE DOING WHAT THEY ARE DOING & BLAME 'SOMEONE' OR 'SOMETHING' ELSE.

I think that the name for it is 'BULLSHITE' & YOU are 'outed' for engaging in it.

Personal 'responsibility' or lack of them, are the 'CHOICE' of the individual alone.
'Abuse' of any kind by anyone against someone else, is a matter of the 'victim' reporting it asap, NOT decades later or resorting to habits mentioned in my post, which is just an 'excuse' or 'justification' for the excesses or indulging of 'vices' not commensurate with good health.
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papasmurf
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Nonsense
Feb 2 2015, 06:16 PM

'Abuse' of any kind by anyone against someone else, is a matter of the 'victim' reporting it asap,
They did in their thousands, at the time, and were ignored, and that is what led to the addiction and other problems.
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HIGHWAY
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papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 06:20 PM
Nonsense
Feb 2 2015, 06:16 PM

'Abuse' of any kind by anyone against someone else, is a matter of the 'victim' reporting it asap,
They did in their thousands, at the time, and were ignored, and that is what led to the addiction and other problems.
I hope your not saying that all drug takers are because of what happened to them as kids
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Affa
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the latest Halifax tv advert focuses on 'fairness', and gives a definition. not unlike mine earlier where it accuses other banks of ripping off customers.



Edited by Affa, Feb 2 2015, 07:22 PM.
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Rich
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" Loss of jobs, loss of income to the government, brain drain style of emigration, and so on."

But that is what is and has been happening for years now, leaving could not make it worse.
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Deleted User
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papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 05:08 PM
Nonsense
Feb 2 2015, 04:59 PM
For those of you, like me, who may have experienced health care in this country before the NHS was founded, would know the real cost of treatment\care from that period, but also, more crucially indeed, the NHS was not created to COUNTER THE LIFESTYLE CHOICES THAT CAUSE OBESITY,UNWANTED PREGNANCIES, DRUG ADDITION,SMOKING,ALCOHOL ADDICTION OR LIVER DISEASE & OF COURSE 'GAY' MALADIES.

These things above should be paid for 'PRIVATELY' NOT BY THE NHS.

Do you work for the Daily Mail? (Seriously, the DM had similar rant recently. ) It may surprise you given your ill informed rant that, there are factors involved in obesity, drug addiction, and alcoholism you are not aware of. A substantial number of people have those and other problems as a direct result of sexual and or physical abuse as children.
I would be interested to know what you think "Gay Maladies" are.


Whether or not you have a valid point you have highlighted the fatal flaw in Nonsense's idea.
Other peoples' idea of self inflicted injuries or maladies.
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papasmurf
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HIGHWAY
Feb 2 2015, 06:39 PM
I hope your not saying that all drug takers are because of what happened to them as kids
No, I am not, can't you read?
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jaguar
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papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 04:48 PM
Tytoalba
Feb 2 2015, 11:25 AM

I think that those on the left of politics have a greater problem in understanding the meaning of fairness.
It is the Conservatives who have no idea what fairness is.
Labour claim to be the defenders of the NHS, but they were happy in Government to hide figures showing the scandal of hundreds of deaths at Mid Staffs. Do you think that is fairness? Their failure to order an enquiry into the state of the Labour run Welsh NHS, once again shows they are only interested in WINNING rather than taking tough decisions for the long term good of the UK. Do you think that is fairness?

Now Andy Burnham, the man who refused to acknowledge there were any problems with the NHS now vows to save the NHS. !puke!

Do you really understand the meaning of fairness?
Edited by jaguar, Feb 2 2015, 07:45 PM.
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Lewis
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papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 05:08 PM
Nonsense
Feb 2 2015, 04:59 PM
For those of you, like me, who may have experienced health care in this country before the NHS was founded, would know the real cost of treatment\care from that period, but also, more crucially indeed, the NHS was not created to COUNTER THE LIFESTYLE CHOICES THAT CAUSE OBESITY,UNWANTED PREGNANCIES, DRUG ADDITION,SMOKING,ALCOHOL ADDICTION OR LIVER DISEASE & OF COURSE 'GAY' MALADIES.

These things above should be paid for 'PRIVATELY' NOT BY THE NHS.

Do you work for the Daily Mail? (Seriously, the DM had similar rant recently. ) It may surprise you given your ill informed rant that, there are factors involved in obesity, drug addiction, and alcoholism you are not aware of. A substantial number of people have those and other problems as a direct result of sexual and or physical abuse as children.
I would be interested to know what you think "Gay Maladies" are.
Some people are quick to condemn others without considering the reasons for their behaviour.

Should obese people be treated by the NHS? We can always condemn people for eating too much, being lazy. Some have a sluggish metabolism. There is evidence to suggest that a minority of people have a 'fat' gene whereby obesity tends to run in certain families. Here is a report that features in the NHS Choices website:

http://www.nhs.uk/news/2013/11November/Pages/Fat-gene-could-make-you-eat-more-move-less.aspx

With regard to unwanted pregnancies, these have been around since Adam and Eve were teenagers themselves. My first daughter wasn't planned exactly, we drank a bit too much one night when we were youngish and bingo, Eve Mk 2 came along. Any regrets - none. Now all I get when I drink too much is brewers droop. Oh to be young again!

Oh having touched on the misuse of alcohol, there are the problems of alcoholism. Some people are also genetically inclined to favour alcohol or misuse drugs. I quote:

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=26119

Quote:
 
One version of the gene, GABRG3, was found statistically linked (associated) with alcoholism in the affected families.


Oh I suppose being gay is considered by the closed right wing mind, to be a disease. A lifestyle choice, rather than being the way some peoples brains are programmed from birth?

Oh I nearly forgot that right wingers are less intelligent than those on the left.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2095549/Right-wingers-intelligent-left-wingers-says-controversial-study--conservative-politics-lead-people-racist.html

I reckon that some of the writings by the rabid right wingers here, do add weight to this supposition!
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papasmurf
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Lewis
Feb 2 2015, 07:45 PM


I reckon that some of the writings by the rabid right wingers here, do add weight to this supposition!
I have been of the opinion for many years that people who express opinions that show them to be completely compassionless, should have visible identification, so that if they are in trouble and ask me for help, I can tell them to eff off and walk away.
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johnofgwent
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It .. It is GREEN !!
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ACH1967
Feb 2 2015, 11:53 AM
The Labour party appears to be there for exactly the same reasons the other parties are there, to protect the vested interests of those it believes will vote for it (most of the public sector).
You cannot blame them for this but you can disregard as flowery BS those who say that labour is interested in fairness. They may by default make the country fairer, but this is as a side effect to them looking out for their clients.
!tkq!

I have a document from no less than the paymaster generals chief lackey saying the taxpayers charter commitment to fairness does not mean two people in the same situation should pay tge same amount of tax ...

Sent to me from dawn primarolo the poll tax dodger, in 2001 when she had the paymasters job because the previous bloke had to give it up when mandelson made him an accessory to fraud
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Deleted User
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Lewis
Feb 2 2015, 07:45 PM
papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 05:08 PM
Nonsense
Feb 2 2015, 04:59 PM
For those of you, like me, who may have experienced health care in this country before the NHS was founded, would know the real cost of treatment\care from that period, but also, more crucially indeed, the NHS was not created to COUNTER THE LIFESTYLE CHOICES THAT CAUSE OBESITY,UNWANTED PREGNANCIES, DRUG ADDITION,SMOKING,ALCOHOL ADDICTION OR LIVER DISEASE & OF COURSE 'GAY' MALADIES.

These things above should be paid for 'PRIVATELY' NOT BY THE NHS.

Do you work for the Daily Mail? (Seriously, the DM had similar rant recently. ) It may surprise you given your ill informed rant that, there are factors involved in obesity, drug addiction, and alcoholism you are not aware of. A substantial number of people have those and other problems as a direct result of sexual and or physical abuse as children.
I would be interested to know what you think "Gay Maladies" are.
Some people are quick to condemn others without considering the reasons for their behaviour.

Should obese people be treated by the NHS? We can always condemn people for eating too much, being lazy. Some have a sluggish metabolism. There is evidence to suggest that a minority of people have a 'fat' gene whereby obesity tends to run in certain families. Here is a report that features in the NHS Choices website:

http://www.nhs.uk/news/2013/11November/Pages/Fat-gene-could-make-you-eat-more-move-less.aspx

With regard to unwanted pregnancies, these have been around since Adam and Eve were teenagers themselves. My first daughter wasn't planned exactly, we drank a bit too much one night when we were youngish and bingo, Eve Mk 2 came along. Any regrets - none. Now all I get when I drink too much is brewers droop. Oh to be young again!

Oh having touched on the misuse of alcohol, there are the problems of alcoholism. Some people are also genetically inclined to favour alcohol or misuse drugs. I quote:

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=26119

Quote:
 
One version of the gene, GABRG3, was found statistically linked (associated) with alcoholism in the affected families.


Oh I suppose being gay is considered by the closed right wing mind, to be a disease. A lifestyle choice, rather than being the way some peoples brains are programmed from birth?

Oh I nearly forgot that right wingers are less intelligent than those on the left.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2095549/Right-wingers-intelligent-left-wingers-says-controversial-study--conservative-politics-lead-people-racist.html

I reckon that some of the writings by the rabid right wingers here, do add weight to this supposition!


Indeed. Just as I said. In fact for every reason someone comes up with to reduce the range of NHS services others will come up with reasons to maintain or even increase it.
Problem is though, just how wide should' free' treatment be available?
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jaguar
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What is Labour for?

Ed Miliband on Sky News answering questions for young voters:

Q: "What experience do you have outside of politics?"
A: "Err... umm... I've done lots of things...err...I was an economics advisor at the Treasury". !jk! !jk!

Then we have Ed Balls, he also didn't know, when asked, what the structural deficit was, and this man wants to control our nations finances. !jk! !jk!

That explains the recession then...

Oh I nearly forgot, right wingers are less intelligent than those on the left.
Edited by jaguar, Feb 2 2015, 08:12 PM.
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HIGHWAY
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papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 07:44 PM
HIGHWAY
Feb 2 2015, 06:39 PM
I hope your not saying that all drug takers are because of what happened to them as kids
No, I am not, can't you read?
Yes,is there a % in your head that are drug takers because of what happened to them as kids then
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jaguar
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papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 06:20 PM
Nonsense
Feb 2 2015, 06:16 PM

'Abuse' of any kind by anyone against someone else, is a matter of the 'victim' reporting it asap,
They did in their thousands, at the time, and were ignored, and that is what led to the addiction and other problems.
Who ignored these drug takers? The reason I ask is because the majority of drug takers I come into contact with are into their twenties, which means Labour were in power when they were children.

Surely you are not suggesting Labour ignored these unfortunate people?
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C-too
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Tytoalba
Feb 2 2015, 11:25 AM
Malum Unus
Feb 2 2015, 10:51 AM
Steve K
Feb 2 2015, 10:20 AM
Affa
Feb 2 2015, 12:06 AM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
Not sure that is so, I suggest you are describing equality

It is fair as long as one does not gain more than than the other by deception, threat or monopoly.



By that definition our entire political system is unfair!



As to the OP however, what are any of the parties for?, do any of them actually stand for the country in its entirety?
If we go out or a meal together , or on holiday together, fairness Is each paying for their own bill.
If a richer one is present , no one expects them to pick up the bill for all, unless in a generous mood and volunteers to do so . The others cannot decide that he/she should pay, just because he has more.
Even if they have had a large bonus the others would not think it right that they should do so.

Some people are born less intelligent, or with physical deformities, , or are born into poverty elsewhere in the world, so quite obviously that is not equal or fair to all. Life cannot be fair.
Fairness is a concept that varies from person to person, and is not interpreted fairly at all, for self interest will always cloud judgements. One could claim that everyone should pay equally for their needs provided by the government, pay the same percentage of income tax, just as we do with VAT for the things we purchase.
I think that those on the left of politics have a greater problem in understanding the meaning of fairness. That generally means taking more than giving. The fact is that everyone's circumstances are different, and we need to be more objective in how we think.
Morality is a different issue.
Yes, it is clearly immoral for the richest to use their wealth in order to increase their personal wealth perhaps especially so during a period when so many are becoming poorer. The richest have almost doubled their share of the countries wealth since 2008.

The UK is financially divided into many different levels. In terms of wealth we have the 'Haves' the 'Have Not's' and the 'Have Plenty'. After watching a recording of the Super Rich- and Us, I have no doubt that it is time to introduce a wealth tax. A tax many other countries already have.
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C-too
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jaguar
Feb 2 2015, 08:27 PM
papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 06:20 PM
Nonsense
Feb 2 2015, 06:16 PM

'Abuse' of any kind by anyone against someone else, is a matter of the 'victim' reporting it asap,
They did in their thousands, at the time, and were ignored, and that is what led to the addiction and other problems.
Who ignored these drug takers? The reason I ask is because the majority of drug takers I come into contact with are into their twenties, which means Labour were in power when they were children.

Surely you are not suggesting Labour ignored these unfortunate people?
Those children would have been the children of the broken society, inherited by NL after 18 years of callous Conservatism.
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C-too
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jaguar
Feb 2 2015, 08:10 PM
What is Labour for?

Ed Miliband on Sky News answering questions for young voters:

Q: "What experience do you have outside of politics?"
A: "Err... umm... I've done lots of things...err...I was an economics advisor at the Treasury". !jk! !jk!

Then we have Ed Balls, he also didn't know, when asked, what the structural deficit was, and this man wants to control our nations finances. !jk! !jk!

That explains the recession then...

Oh I nearly forgot, right wingers are less intelligent than those on the left.
At least you got your last comment right.
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HIGHWAY
Senior Member
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C-too
Feb 2 2015, 08:35 PM
jaguar
Feb 2 2015, 08:27 PM
papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 06:20 PM
Nonsense
Feb 2 2015, 06:16 PM

'Abuse' of any kind by anyone against someone else, is a matter of the 'victim' reporting it asap,
They did in their thousands, at the time, and were ignored, and that is what led to the addiction and other problems.
Who ignored these drug takers? The reason I ask is because the majority of drug takers I come into contact with are into their twenties, which means Labour were in power when they were children.

Surely you are not suggesting Labour ignored these unfortunate people?
Those children would have been the children of the broken society, inherited by NL after 18 years of callous Conservatism.
The majority of drug takers is because of a Tory government lol,,you been on the drink early tonight
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C-too
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ACH1967
Feb 2 2015, 11:53 AM
The Labour party appears to be there for exactly the same reasons the other parties are there, to protect the vested interests of those it believes will vote for it (most of the public sector).
You cannot blame them for this but you can disregard as flowery BS those who say that labour is interested in fairness. They may by default make the country fairer, but this is as a side effect to them looking out for their clients.
That's one interpretation. But as fairness increased under Labour and decreased under the Tories, then facts suggest you are mistaken.
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C-too
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HIGHWAY
Feb 2 2015, 08:37 PM
C-too
Feb 2 2015, 08:35 PM
jaguar
Feb 2 2015, 08:27 PM
papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 06:20 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
Who ignored these drug takers? The reason I ask is because the majority of drug takers I come into contact with are into their twenties, which means Labour were in power when they were children.

Surely you are not suggesting Labour ignored these unfortunate people?
Those children would have been the children of the broken society, inherited by NL after 18 years of callous Conservatism.
The majority of drug takers is because of a Tory government lol,,you been on the drink early tonight
Another ill-informed personal attack.
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HIGHWAY
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C-too
Feb 2 2015, 08:43 PM
HIGHWAY
Feb 2 2015, 08:37 PM
C-too
Feb 2 2015, 08:35 PM
jaguar
Feb 2 2015, 08:27 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
Those children would have been the children of the broken society, inherited by NL after 18 years of callous Conservatism.
The majority of drug takers is because of a Tory government lol,,you been on the drink early tonight
Another ill-informed personal attack.
Nearer the truth than the nonsense you have just spouted
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C-too
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HIGHWAY
Feb 2 2015, 08:44 PM
C-too
Feb 2 2015, 08:43 PM
HIGHWAY
Feb 2 2015, 08:37 PM
C-too
Feb 2 2015, 08:35 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
The majority of drug takers is because of a Tory government lol,,you been on the drink early tonight
Another ill-informed personal attack.
Nearer the truth than the nonsense you have just spouted
Another personal ill-informed attack.
Edited by C-too, Feb 2 2015, 08:49 PM.
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papasmurf
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jaguar
Feb 2 2015, 08:27 PM
The reason I ask is because the majority of drug takers I come into contact with are into their twenties,
Drug takers are not necessarily drug addicts.
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Deleted User
Deleted User

papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 09:02 PM
jaguar
Feb 2 2015, 08:27 PM
The reason I ask is because the majority of drug takers I come into contact with are into their twenties,
Drug takers are not necessarily drug addicts.


But all drug addicts are addicted to drugs .
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HIGHWAY
Senior Member
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C-too
Feb 2 2015, 08:49 PM
HIGHWAY
Feb 2 2015, 08:44 PM
C-too
Feb 2 2015, 08:43 PM
HIGHWAY
Feb 2 2015, 08:37 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
Another ill-informed personal attack.
Nearer the truth than the nonsense you have just spouted
Another personal ill-informed attack.
Echo echo
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C-too
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Honourable Member
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HIGHWAY
Feb 2 2015, 09:26 PM
C-too
Feb 2 2015, 08:49 PM
HIGHWAY
Feb 2 2015, 08:44 PM
C-too
Feb 2 2015, 08:43 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
Nearer the truth than the nonsense you have just spouted
Another personal ill-informed attack.
Echo echo
Still stuck with your childish ill-informed nonsense.
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HIGHWAY
Senior Member
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C-too
Feb 2 2015, 09:28 PM
HIGHWAY
Feb 2 2015, 09:26 PM
C-too
Feb 2 2015, 08:49 PM
HIGHWAY
Feb 2 2015, 08:44 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
Another personal ill-informed attack.
Echo echo
Still stuck with your childish ill-informed nonsense.
Says the man who claims he had letters after his name,who repeats the same sentence on here,
Is there a parrot near you
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Rich
Senior Member
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gansao
Feb 2 2015, 08:03 PM
Lewis
Feb 2 2015, 07:45 PM
papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 05:08 PM
Nonsense
Feb 2 2015, 04:59 PM
For those of you, like me, who may have experienced health care in this country before the NHS was founded, would know the real cost of treatment\care from that period, but also, more crucially indeed, the NHS was not created to COUNTER THE LIFESTYLE CHOICES THAT CAUSE OBESITY,UNWANTED PREGNANCIES, DRUG ADDITION,SMOKING,ALCOHOL ADDICTION OR LIVER DISEASE & OF COURSE 'GAY' MALADIES.

These things above should be paid for 'PRIVATELY' NOT BY THE NHS.

Do you work for the Daily Mail? (Seriously, the DM had similar rant recently. ) It may surprise you given your ill informed rant that, there are factors involved in obesity, drug addiction, and alcoholism you are not aware of. A substantial number of people have those and other problems as a direct result of sexual and or physical abuse as children.
I would be interested to know what you think "Gay Maladies" are.
Some people are quick to condemn others without considering the reasons for their behaviour.

Should obese people be treated by the NHS? We can always condemn people for eating too much, being lazy. Some have a sluggish metabolism. There is evidence to suggest that a minority of people have a 'fat' gene whereby obesity tends to run in certain families. Here is a report that features in the NHS Choices website:

http://www.nhs.uk/news/2013/11November/Pages/Fat-gene-could-make-you-eat-more-move-less.aspx

With regard to unwanted pregnancies, these have been around since Adam and Eve were teenagers themselves. My first daughter wasn't planned exactly, we drank a bit too much one night when we were youngish and bingo, Eve Mk 2 came along. Any regrets - none. Now all I get when I drink too much is brewers droop. Oh to be young again!

Oh having touched on the misuse of alcohol, there are the problems of alcoholism. Some people are also genetically inclined to favour alcohol or misuse drugs. I quote:

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=26119

Quote:
 
One version of the gene, GABRG3, was found statistically linked (associated) with alcoholism in the affected families.


Oh I suppose being gay is considered by the closed right wing mind, to be a disease. A lifestyle choice, rather than being the way some peoples brains are programmed from birth?

Oh I nearly forgot that right wingers are less intelligent than those on the left.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2095549/Right-wingers-intelligent-left-wingers-says-controversial-study--conservative-politics-lead-people-racist.html

I reckon that some of the writings by the rabid right wingers here, do add weight to this supposition!


Indeed. Just as I said. In fact for every reason someone comes up with to reduce the range of NHS services others will come up with reasons to maintain or even increase it.
Problem is though, just how wide should' free' treatment be available?
I would say at this juncture that the government should be true and transparent with the public when it comes to subjects like tobacco, yes I am the first to agree that the consumption of tobacco is not good for ones health and it is not a natural substance that should be ingested.

Having said that, I smoke and I enjoy it although I now smoke an Epipe, the government should warn the taxpayers, especially the ones that do not smoke that if smoking were to be banned period, the loss to the treasury would be horrendous and would have to be substituted by other means and we all know what that means.

When those that exhort us to lead better and healthier lives actually practise what they preach then I will sit up and take notice and until they ban smoking in the private members clubs in the palace of Westminster then that is not likely to happen in my case, this also brings me to another thought, by virtue of the title of private members club, do those "honourable" peoples have to pay a yearly subscription to be a member or am I and you paying for their self gratification?
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Tigger
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Are the HoC puffers allowed to smoke if non smokers are in the same room?

My quick check unsurprisingly gave no clear answer.
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Lewis
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Rich
Feb 2 2015, 10:39 PM
gansao
Feb 2 2015, 08:03 PM
Lewis
Feb 2 2015, 07:45 PM
papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 05:08 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
Some people are quick to condemn others without considering the reasons for their behaviour.

Should obese people be treated by the NHS? We can always condemn people for eating too much, being lazy. Some have a sluggish metabolism. There is evidence to suggest that a minority of people have a 'fat' gene whereby obesity tends to run in certain families. Here is a report that features in the NHS Choices website:

http://www.nhs.uk/news/2013/11November/Pages/Fat-gene-could-make-you-eat-more-move-less.aspx

With regard to unwanted pregnancies, these have been around since Adam and Eve were teenagers themselves. My first daughter wasn't planned exactly, we drank a bit too much one night when we were youngish and bingo, Eve Mk 2 came along. Any regrets - none. Now all I get when I drink too much is brewers droop. Oh to be young again!

Oh having touched on the misuse of alcohol, there are the problems of alcoholism. Some people are also genetically inclined to favour alcohol or misuse drugs. I quote:

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=26119

Quote:
 
One version of the gene, GABRG3, was found statistically linked (associated) with alcoholism in the affected families.


Oh I suppose being gay is considered by the closed right wing mind, to be a disease. A lifestyle choice, rather than being the way some peoples brains are programmed from birth?

Oh I nearly forgot that right wingers are less intelligent than those on the left.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2095549/Right-wingers-intelligent-left-wingers-says-controversial-study--conservative-politics-lead-people-racist.html

I reckon that some of the writings by the rabid right wingers here, do add weight to this supposition!


Indeed. Just as I said. In fact for every reason someone comes up with to reduce the range of NHS services others will come up with reasons to maintain or even increase it.
Problem is though, just how wide should' free' treatment be available?
I would say at this juncture that the government should be true and transparent with the public when it comes to subjects like tobacco, yes I am the first to agree that the consumption of tobacco is not good for ones health and it is not a natural substance that should be ingested.

Having said that, I smoke and I enjoy it although I now smoke an Epipe, the government should warn the taxpayers, especially the ones that do not smoke that if smoking were to be banned period, the loss to the treasury would be horrendous and would have to be substituted by other means and we all know what that means.

When those that exhort us to lead better and healthier lives actually practise what they preach then I will sit up and take notice and until they ban smoking in the private members clubs in the palace of Westminster then that is not likely to happen in my case, this also brings me to another thought, by virtue of the title of private members club, do those "honourable" peoples have to pay a yearly subscription to be a member or am I and you paying for their self gratification?
Well there are some pubs where (illegally) you can have a smoke in, in darkest Cornwall. I include in this, one I frequent. I am a non smoker myself, but some enjoy their chuff and if they want to kill themselves, then it is down to them. They know the risks.
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papasmurf
Senior Member
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Lewis
Feb 2 2015, 11:42 PM
Well there are some pubs where (illegally) you can have a smoke in, in darkest Cornwall.
Is that one of those pubs where the regulars can order 6 pints with one hand?

Posted Image
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Tytoalba
Senior Member
[ *  *  *  * ]
Rich
Feb 2 2015, 10:39 PM
gansao
Feb 2 2015, 08:03 PM
Lewis
Feb 2 2015, 07:45 PM
papasmurf
Feb 2 2015, 05:08 PM

Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
Some people are quick to condemn others without considering the reasons for their behaviour.

Should obese people be treated by the NHS? We can always condemn people for eating too much, being lazy. Some have a sluggish metabolism. There is evidence to suggest that a minority of people have a 'fat' gene whereby obesity tends to run in certain families. Here is a report that features in the NHS Choices website:

http://www.nhs.uk/news/2013/11November/Pages/Fat-gene-could-make-you-eat-more-move-less.aspx

With regard to unwanted pregnancies, these have been around since Adam and Eve were teenagers themselves. My first daughter wasn't planned exactly, we drank a bit too much one night when we were youngish and bingo, Eve Mk 2 came along. Any regrets - none. Now all I get when I drink too much is brewers droop. Oh to be young again!

Oh having touched on the misuse of alcohol, there are the problems of alcoholism. Some people are also genetically inclined to favour alcohol or misuse drugs. I quote:

http://www.medicinenet.com/script/main/art.asp?articlekey=26119

Quote:
 
One version of the gene, GABRG3, was found statistically linked (associated) with alcoholism in the affected families.


Oh I suppose being gay is considered by the closed right wing mind, to be a disease. A lifestyle choice, rather than being the way some peoples brains are programmed from birth?

Oh I nearly forgot that right wingers are less intelligent than those on the left.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2095549/Right-wingers-intelligent-left-wingers-says-controversial-study--conservative-politics-lead-people-racist.html

I reckon that some of the writings by the rabid right wingers here, do add weight to this supposition!


Indeed. Just as I said. In fact for every reason someone comes up with to reduce the range of NHS services others will come up with reasons to maintain or even increase it.
Problem is though, just how wide should' free' treatment be available?
I would say at this juncture that the government should be true and transparent with the public when it comes to subjects like tobacco, yes I am the first to agree that the consumption of tobacco is not good for ones health and it is not a natural substance that should be ingested.

Having said that, I smoke and I enjoy it although I now smoke an Epipe, the government should warn the taxpayers, especially the ones that do not smoke that if smoking were to be banned period, the loss to the treasury would be horrendous and would have to be substituted by other means and we all know what that means.

When those that exhort us to lead better and healthier lives actually practise what they preach then I will sit up and take notice and until they ban smoking in the private members clubs in the palace of Westminster then that is not likely to happen in my case, this also brings me to another thought, by virtue of the title of private members club, do those "honourable" peoples have to pay a yearly subscription to be a member or am I and you paying for their self gratification?
It matters not how strait the gate,
How charged with punishments the scroll.
I am the master of my fate:
I am the captain of my soul.
Invictus
In other words we are responsible to ourselves and own actions.
Being a diabetic my blood sugars are above normal. so it is up to me to eat and diet properly to get them down.
I cannot expect outside forces, like the GPs or NHS to do it for me. They give me the information I need , and guide me, even prescribe to me, but it is mostly down to me to do the right thing.
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ACH1967
Member Avatar
Senior Member
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C-too
Feb 2 2015, 08:42 PM
ACH1967
Feb 2 2015, 11:53 AM
The Labour party appears to be there for exactly the same reasons the other parties are there, to protect the vested interests of those it believes will vote for it (most of the public sector).
You cannot blame them for this but you can disregard as flowery BS those who say that labour is interested in fairness. They may by default make the country fairer, but this is as a side effect to them looking out for their clients.
That's one interpretation. But as fairness increased under Labour and decreased under the Tories, then facts suggest you are mistaken.
So lets see these facts about a subjective measure such as fairness.
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Lewis
Member Avatar
Senior Member
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papasmurf
Feb 3 2015, 09:14 AM
Lewis
Feb 2 2015, 11:42 PM
Well there are some pubs where (illegally) you can have a smoke in, in darkest Cornwall.
Is that one of those pubs where the regulars can order 6 pints with one hand?

Posted Image
Well I've learned something new here. A six string banjo, thought traditionally they had 4 or 5 strings. Well, well that's another string to your bow then!

As regards six pints, that's handy.

Regarding smoking, this landlord is canny he uses the function room for a 'private' lock in!
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Tigger
Senior Member
[ *  *  *  * ]
papasmurf
Feb 3 2015, 09:14 AM
Lewis
Feb 2 2015, 11:42 PM
Well there are some pubs where (illegally) you can have a smoke in, in darkest Cornwall.
Is that one of those pubs where the regulars can order 6 pints with one hand?

Posted Image
Is that for hitting a cows arse with?

;-)
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Tigger
Senior Member
[ *  *  *  * ]
RJD
Feb 2 2015, 04:29 PM

The Germans and French do not appear to be clamouring for the State to take full control of their Health Services. I wonder why?
Is it because the know their politicians would not hand it's financial control over to a load of sharp suited spivs located in the City Of London at the first opportunity?

Just a guess of course but worthy of consideration if you actually care about public services......
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C-too
Member Avatar
Honourable Member
[ *  *  *  * ]
ACH1967
Feb 3 2015, 12:18 PM
C-too
Feb 2 2015, 08:42 PM
ACH1967
Feb 2 2015, 11:53 AM
The Labour party appears to be there for exactly the same reasons the other parties are there, to protect the vested interests of those it believes will vote for it (most of the public sector).
You cannot blame them for this but you can disregard as flowery BS those who say that labour is interested in fairness. They may by default make the country fairer, but this is as a side effect to them looking out for their clients.
That's one interpretation. But as fairness increased under Labour and decreased under the Tories, then facts suggest you are mistaken.
So lets see these facts about a subjective measure such as fairness.
The rich got richer and the poor got poorer under the Tories.
The rich got richer quicker than the poor under NL, but at least the poor did get richer.
The number of people living in relative poverty increased under the Tories. (1979/1997).
1.6m people taken out of relative poverty by NL.
The introduction of the minimum wage.
Working Tax Credits. Increased Family Allowance. Winter fuel payments. Free bus passes. VAT on gas and electricity reduced to 5%.
A big reduction in waiting times for the NHS.
12 to 18 month waiting times for some operations dramatically reduced under NL.
17 years of high/mass unemployment under the Tories.
Less than 1m in 2006 under NL.


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