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Rich
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Feb 6 2015, 11:41 PM
Post #41
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There are extremists in the so called Christian majority in this country, people who would never condemn homophobic attacks, people who would never condemn attacks on Mosques, Muslim owned shops and businesses, people who stay silent when Palestinian women and children are indiscriminately killed by Israel.
Then there are those who stay silent when abortion clinics are firebombed, the Catholic who smiles when a Protestant family are persecuted, the Protestant who laughs in the face of a Catholic beaten up simply because they are Catholic.
The American Christian fanatics who still refuse to accept racial equality, or the ones who think that non-believers should die, or that "fags should burn in hell", or that women should know their place.
You see fanatics and extremists are not limited or restricted to the Muslim faith, they are in all faiths, infact Christianity along with Islam are two of the most bigoted organisations in the world, there are extremists amongst our Muslim population, there probably always will be, but they are not the majority.
It appears I missed the bit where christian extremists in this country beheaded a couple of muslims and burnt a muslim alive.
The bastards who behead people and burn them alive aren't Muslims or members of any other religion. They have the pretence, but they are nothing more than scum whose only place is hell. They have no right to be called human or any other animal. They deserve not to exist and should be got rid of. And that is exactly why the greater world has asked and expects the muslim world in general to shout from the rooftops that these animals are nothing to do with them and make them socially unacceptable to everyone and that is the ONLY way that they will be gotten rid of.
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Tigger
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Feb 6 2015, 11:54 PM
Post #42
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- Tytoalba
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- Tytoalba
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I note, with horror, that the Muslim fundamentalist group has had their own wicker man , by enclosing a Jordanian pilot in a metal cage and burning him to death. I'm sure that we all felt a sense of pity for him , horror at what was done to him and with sympathy for his friends, but where are the protests and condemnations at what the perpetrators did to him on this board, or from our own Muslim clerics and leaders? Will I be condemned for raising the issue, or be accused of Islamaphobia for doing so ? Why the silence, and where are the protest from the silent peace loving majority of Muslims in Britain that we hear so much about? Is this the thing to come if not addressed properly, and is Obama right in saying full integration and a national identity the key to a peaceful future. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2913798/Religion-dare-not-speak... Was Enoch right http://www.riversofblood.uk/rivers_of_blood_enoch_powell.asp
Yet more senile ramblings. Here is another tip for you, if you want to see the wider picture try and find other sources of information other than a right wing piece of toilet paper like the Mail. How hard can that be?
Weekends do not seem to be a good time for you, for its then that you become the most offensive . Perhaps its then when you relax with a bottle or two and your true nature is revealed. I rarely touch alcohol as I've never been that keen on the taste and it beffudles the mind, yourself?
And I'm always happy to stomp all over bigotry and thinly disguised nationalism.
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Rich
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Feb 7 2015, 01:51 AM
Post #43
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- Tigger
- Feb 6 2015, 11:54 PM
- Tytoalba
- Feb 6 2015, 11:33 PM
- Tigger
- Feb 6 2015, 11:18 AM
- Tytoalba
- Feb 5 2015, 11:01 AM
I note, with horror, that the Muslim fundamentalist group has had their own wicker man , by enclosing a Jordanian pilot in a metal cage and burning him to death. I'm sure that we all felt a sense of pity for him , horror at what was done to him and with sympathy for his friends, but where are the protests and condemnations at what the perpetrators did to him on this board, or from our own Muslim clerics and leaders? Will I be condemned for raising the issue, or be accused of Islamaphobia for doing so ? Why the silence, and where are the protest from the silent peace loving majority of Muslims in Britain that we hear so much about? Is this the thing to come if not addressed properly, and is Obama right in saying full integration and a national identity the key to a peaceful future. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2913798/Religion-dare-not-speak... Was Enoch right http://www.riversofblood.uk/rivers_of_blood_enoch_powell.asp
Yet more senile ramblings. Here is another tip for you, if you want to see the wider picture try and find other sources of information other than a right wing piece of toilet paper like the Mail. How hard can that be?
Weekends do not seem to be a good time for you, for its then that you become the most offensive . Perhaps its then when you relax with a bottle or two and your true nature is revealed.
I rarely touch alcohol as I've never been that keen on the taste and it beffudles the mind, yourself? And I'm always happy to stomp all over bigotry and thinly disguised nationalism. Best turn your attentions to the Labour front bench then because their perfidity is certainly clouding their judgements with regard to policy and manifesto that will be conducive to the betterment of the taxpaying peoples of this country.
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krugerman
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Feb 7 2015, 02:21 PM
Post #44
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- Feb 6 2015, 11:41 PM
- Lewis
- Feb 6 2015, 07:21 PM
- ACH1967
- Feb 6 2015, 11:25 AM
- krugerman
- Feb 6 2015, 11:08 AM
There are extremists in the so called Christian majority in this country, people who would never condemn homophobic attacks, people who would never condemn attacks on Mosques, Muslim owned shops and businesses, people who stay silent when Palestinian women and children are indiscriminately killed by Israel.
Then there are those who stay silent when abortion clinics are firebombed, the Catholic who smiles when a Protestant family are persecuted, the Protestant who laughs in the face of a Catholic beaten up simply because they are Catholic.
The American Christian fanatics who still refuse to accept racial equality, or the ones who think that non-believers should die, or that "fags should burn in hell", or that women should know their place.
You see fanatics and extremists are not limited or restricted to the Muslim faith, they are in all faiths, infact Christianity along with Islam are two of the most bigoted organisations in the world, there are extremists amongst our Muslim population, there probably always will be, but they are not the majority.
It appears I missed the bit where christian extremists in this country beheaded a couple of muslims and burnt a muslim alive.
The bastards who behead people and burn them alive aren't Muslims or members of any other religion. They have the pretence, but they are nothing more than scum whose only place is hell. They have no right to be called human or any other animal. They deserve not to exist and should be got rid of.
And that is exactly why the greater world has asked and expects the muslim world in general to shout from the rooftops that these animals are nothing to do with them and make them socially unacceptable to everyone and that is the ONLY way that they will be gotten rid of. once again your post makes little sense, could you please explain why British Muslims need to make it clear to the rest of British society that they really do condemn what some extremists did in a foreign land far away in the middle east. ?
Your attitude is part of what the problem is, a deeply held suspicion of allMuslims based upon the actions of a very small minority of extremists, you are helping to propel the suspicion, and I rather suspect it has more to do with bigotry and intolerance as against anything else.
STATEMENT ISSUED BY THE MUSLIM COUNCIL OF BRITAIN
We also utterly reject attempts to hold all Muslims or the religion of Islam itself responsible for the actions of a handful of terrorists. The overwhelming majority of Muslims in France and in the whole of Europe and elsewhere have condemned these attacks. Nonetheless in attempts to tar the entire Muslim community with responsibility for these actions, public figures have called on Muslims to “apologise” for the actions of these killers and have revived the discourse about a “clash of civilisations” to explain these killings. Muslim communities have been singled out for vilification which has resulted in a rise in violent attacks on Mosques, Muslim communities and individuals including here in Britain. In the immediate aftermath, France witnessed grenades thrown at a Mosque and a Moroccan man was murdered. ’Kill all Muslims’ trended worldwide on twitter without an international outcry. Simultaneously Jewish people across Europe live in fear of further attacks. People of faith and none have a right to live in peace and harmony, free from fear, hatred and violence
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C-too
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Feb 7 2015, 04:03 PM
Post #45
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---- "People of faith and none have a right to live in peace and harmony, free from fear, hatred and violence". ----
I agree, but I would feel a lot better if another 5,000 Muslims had left the EU to fight against ISIS.
Islam does have a problem because everywhere Muslims migrate to it seems the Islamic nutters are either in amongst them or quickly follow them.
IMO the best people to deal with these extremists in their midst are the Muslims themselves.
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C-too
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Feb 7 2015, 04:05 PM
Post #46
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- Rich
- Feb 7 2015, 01:51 AM
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- Feb 6 2015, 11:54 PM
- Tytoalba
- Feb 6 2015, 11:33 PM
- Tigger
- Feb 6 2015, 11:18 AM
Weekends do not seem to be a good time for you, for its then that you become the most offensive . Perhaps its then when you relax with a bottle or two and your true nature is revealed.
I rarely touch alcohol as I've never been that keen on the taste and it beffudles the mind, yourself? And I'm always happy to stomp all over bigotry and thinly disguised nationalism.
Best turn your attentions to the Labour front bench then because their perfidity is certainly clouding their judgements with regard to policy and manifesto that will be conducive to the betterment of the taxpaying peoples of this country. Is that a bit like saying we'll sort the deficit out in five years ?
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krugerman
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Feb 8 2015, 12:19 PM
Post #47
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- C-too
- Feb 7 2015, 04:03 PM
---- "People of faith and none have a right to live in peace and harmony, free from fear, hatred and violence". ----
I agree, but I would feel a lot better if another 5,000 Muslims had left the EU to fight against ISIS.
Islam does have a problem because everywhere Muslims migrate to it seems the Islamic nutters are either in amongst them or quickly follow them.
IMO the best people to deal with these extremists in their midst are the Muslims themselves. There are "nutters" in all faiths, and all faiths are also full of hypocrite's, the best example by far is the moral preachings of a certain Christian sect known as "Roman Catholasism", which dictate s on such matters as homosexuality whilst at the same time covers up child sexual abuse on an industrial scale.
I do not subscribe to any faith or religion, but you know what, I would sooner have young Muslims go out and fight for some extreme bunch of terrorists as against a bunch of Catholic priests rape children, but in an ideal world I would prefer neither.
My point is that the failings of one faith and the actions of some of its adherents over another faith is in itself utterly hypocritical, and rather smells of bigotry.
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Tytoalba
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Feb 8 2015, 12:40 PM
Post #48
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- krugerman
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---- "People of faith and none have a right to live in peace and harmony, free from fear, hatred and violence". ----
I agree, but I would feel a lot better if another 5,000 Muslims had left the EU to fight against ISIS.
Islam does have a problem because everywhere Muslims migrate to it seems the Islamic nutters are either in amongst them or quickly follow them.
IMO the best people to deal with these extremists in their midst are the Muslims themselves.
There are "nutters" in all faiths, and all faiths are also full of hypocrite's, the best example by far is the moral preachings of a certain Christian sect known as "Roman Catholasism", which dictate s on such matters as homosexuality whilst at the same time covers up child sexual abuse on an industrial scale. I do not subscribe to any faith or religion, but you know what, I would sooner have young Muslims go out and fight for some extreme bunch of terrorists as against a bunch of Catholic priests rape children, but in an ideal world I would prefer neither. My point is that the failings of one faith and the actions of some of its adherents over another faith is in itself utterly hypocritical, and rather smells of bigotry. I think your defending the indefensible. Far better a straight condemnation without the excuse clauses. Unless we condemn such actions without reservations , no matter who by, or for what reason, then anything else will give them a lever of justification and right, and could suggest tacit support. Its not a matter of what others have done , it is what they have done, and are doing.
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marybrown
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Feb 8 2015, 12:57 PM
Post #49
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- Feb 7 2015, 04:03 PM
---- "People of faith and none have a right to live in peace and harmony, free from fear, hatred and violence". ----
I agree, but I would feel a lot better if another 5,000 Muslims had left the EU to fight against ISIS.
Islam does have a problem because everywhere Muslims migrate to it seems the Islamic nutters are either in amongst them or quickly follow them.
IMO the best people to deal with these extremists in their midst are the Muslims themselves.
There are "nutters" in all faiths, and all faiths are also full of hypocrite's, the best example by far is the moral preachings of a certain Christian sect known as "Roman Catholasism", which dictate s on such matters as homosexuality whilst at the same time covers up child sexual abuse on an industrial scale. I do not subscribe to any faith or religion, but you know what, I would sooner have young Muslims go out and fight for some extreme bunch of terrorists as against a bunch of Catholic priests rape children, but in an ideal world I would prefer neither. My point is that the failings of one faith and the actions of some of its adherents over another faith is in itself utterly hypocritical, and rather smells of bigotry.
I think your defending the indefensible. Far better a straight condemnation without the excuse clauses. Unless we condemn such actions without reservations , no matter who by, or for what reason, then anything else will give them a lever of justification and right, and could suggest tacit support. Its not a matter of what others have done , it is what they have done, and are doing. I see Prince Charles is in Jordan kow-towing to the self appointed ''Royal'' family...
I don't remember any Muslim royalty coming to Britain to give their condolences to the family of be-headed aid worker Alan Henning..who was there to help them..
Did things only get serious because the latest victim was a Muslim??
A horrific death for sure...but no more horrific than having your head hacked off by a nutter with a penknife on video!
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Happy Hornet
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Feb 8 2015, 01:00 PM
Post #50
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- Feb 8 2015, 12:40 PM
- krugerman
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- C-too
- Feb 7 2015, 04:03 PM
---- "People of faith and none have a right to live in peace and harmony, free from fear, hatred and violence". ----
I agree, but I would feel a lot better if another 5,000 Muslims had left the EU to fight against ISIS.
Islam does have a problem because everywhere Muslims migrate to it seems the Islamic nutters are either in amongst them or quickly follow them.
IMO the best people to deal with these extremists in their midst are the Muslims themselves.
There are "nutters" in all faiths, and all faiths are also full of hypocrite's, the best example by far is the moral preachings of a certain Christian sect known as "Roman Catholasism", which dictate s on such matters as homosexuality whilst at the same time covers up child sexual abuse on an industrial scale. I do not subscribe to any faith or religion, but you know what, I would sooner have young Muslims go out and fight for some extreme bunch of terrorists as against a bunch of Catholic priests rape children, but in an ideal world I would prefer neither. My point is that the failings of one faith and the actions of some of its adherents over another faith is in itself utterly hypocritical, and rather smells of bigotry.
I think your defending the indefensible. Far better a straight condemnation without the excuse clauses. Unless we condemn such actions without reservations , no matter who by, or for what reason, then anything else will give them a lever of justification and right, and could suggest tacit support. Its not a matter of what others have done , it is what they have done, and are doing. You do realise that suspicion, fear and hostility towards muslims from non - muslims is EXACTLY what the Islamic extremist nut cases want?
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HIGHWAY
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Feb 8 2015, 02:05 PM
Post #51
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- Feb 8 2015, 12:57 PM
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- C-too
- Feb 7 2015, 04:03 PM
---- "People of faith and none have a right to live in peace and harmony, free from fear, hatred and violence". ----
I agree, but I would feel a lot better if another 5,000 Muslims had left the EU to fight against ISIS.
Islam does have a problem because everywhere Muslims migrate to it seems the Islamic nutters are either in amongst them or quickly follow them.
IMO the best people to deal with these extremists in their midst are the Muslims themselves.
There are "nutters" in all faiths, and all faiths are also full of hypocrite's, the best example by far is the moral preachings of a certain Christian sect known as "Roman Catholasism", which dictate s on such matters as homosexuality whilst at the same time covers up child sexual abuse on an industrial scale. I do not subscribe to any faith or religion, but you know what, I would sooner have young Muslims go out and fight for some extreme bunch of terrorists as against a bunch of Catholic priests rape children, but in an ideal world I would prefer neither. My point is that the failings of one faith and the actions of some of its adherents over another faith is in itself utterly hypocritical, and rather smells of bigotry.
I think your defending the indefensible. Far better a straight condemnation without the excuse clauses. Unless we condemn such actions without reservations , no matter who by, or for what reason, then anything else will give them a lever of justification and right, and could suggest tacit support. Its not a matter of what others have done , it is what they have done, and are doing.
I see Prince Charles is in Jordan kow-towing to the self appointed ''Royal'' family... I don't remember any Muslim royalty coming to Britain to give their condolences to the family of be-headed aid worker Alan Henning..who was there to help them.. Did things only get serious because the latest victim was a Muslim?? A horrific death for sure...but no more horrific than having your head hacked off by a nutter with a penknife on video! There's a shock
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krugerman
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Feb 8 2015, 02:18 PM
Post #52
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My whole point here is that British Muslims do not need to make statements or pass opinions about what terrorists do in a far away land, why do they ? and why should they ?
When a far right group in the United States firebombs an abortion clinic, should the Archbishop of Canterbury or The Queen condemn the actions, for fear of been supportive of such acts on Christian grounds. ?
The whole idea is a nonsense and based entirely upon suspicion and / or bigotry
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C-too
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Feb 8 2015, 02:47 PM
Post #53
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---- "People of faith and none have a right to live in peace and harmony, free from fear, hatred and violence". ----
I agree, but I would feel a lot better if another 5,000 Muslims had left the EU to fight against ISIS.
Islam does have a problem because everywhere Muslims migrate to it seems the Islamic nutters are either in amongst them or quickly follow them.
IMO the best people to deal with these extremists in their midst are the Muslims themselves.
There are "nutters" in all faiths, and all faiths are also full of hypocrite's, the best example by far is the moral preachings of a certain Christian sect known as "Roman Catholasism", which dictate s on such matters as homosexuality whilst at the same time covers up child sexual abuse on an industrial scale. I do not subscribe to any faith or religion, but you know what, I would sooner have young Muslims go out and fight for some extreme bunch of terrorists as against a bunch of Catholic priests rape children, but in an ideal world I would prefer neither. My point is that the failings of one faith and the actions of some of its adherents over another faith is in itself utterly hypocritical, and rather smells of bigotry. It is known as the Ummah;
Here is a daily prayer. "The simile of a single body conveys the feeling of the closeness of the Muslims to each other, such that each ones pain is shared by another since they are from the same body no matter their location, language or ethnicity". This suggests there is no disconnect between Muslims and their actions, or their non-actions as the case may be.
Any suggestion that because I feel some criticism of Muslims and a definite concern about ISIS, that I am in someway in favour the nastiness in Christianity makes no sense whatsoever. In my mind they are two different situations requiring two different debates.
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Heinrich
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Feb 14 2015, 02:46 PM
Post #54
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Enoch Powell was completely right when he warned about allowing so may immigrants flock into England from the former colonies. There are parts of England today that more resemble Muslim countries such as Pakistan than the country people knew when he made his speech and these people have not integrated.
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Feb 14 2015, 02:54 PM
Post #55
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- Feb 8 2015, 12:19 PM
- C-too
- Feb 7 2015, 04:03 PM
---- "People of faith and none have a right to live in peace and harmony, free from fear, hatred and violence". ----
I agree, but I would feel a lot better if another 5,000 Muslims had left the EU to fight against ISIS.
Islam does have a problem because everywhere Muslims migrate to it seems the Islamic nutters are either in amongst them or quickly follow them.
IMO the best people to deal with these extremists in their midst are the Muslims themselves.
There are "nutters" in all faiths, and all faiths are also full of hypocrite's, the best example by far is the moral preachings of a certain Christian sect known as "Roman Catholasism", which dictate s on such matters as homosexuality whilst at the same time covers up child sexual abuse on an industrial scale. I do not subscribe to any faith or religion, but you know what, I would sooner have young Muslims go out and fight for some extreme bunch of terrorists as against a bunch of Catholic priests rape children, but in an ideal world I would prefer neither. My point is that the failings of one faith and the actions of some of its adherents over another faith is in itself utterly hypocritical, and rather smells of bigotry.
I think your defending the indefensible. Far better a straight condemnation without the excuse clauses. Unless we condemn such actions without reservations , no matter who by, or for what reason, then anything else will give them a lever of justification and right, and could suggest tacit support. Its not a matter of what others have done , it is what they have done, and are doing.
I see Prince Charles is in Jordan kow-towing to the self appointed ''Royal'' family... I don't remember any Muslim royalty coming to Britain to give their condolences to the family of be-headed aid worker Alan Henning..who was there to help them.. Did things only get serious because the latest victim was a Muslim?? A horrific death for sure...but no more horrific than having your head hacked off by a nutter with a penknife on video! I see Prince Charles also visited refugee camps whilst over there,no doubt you think that's wrong as well
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Feb 14 2015, 02:55 PM
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- Feb 14 2015, 02:46 PM
Enoch Powell was completely right when he warned about allowing so may immigrants flock into England from the former colonies. There are parts of England today that more resemble Muslim countries such as Pakistan than the country people knew when he made his speech and these people have not integrated. Immigration is the best thing that has ever happened to this country
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marybrown
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Feb 14 2015, 03:10 PM
Post #57
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Enoch Powell was completely right when he warned about allowing so may immigrants flock into England from the former colonies. There are parts of England today that more resemble Muslim countries such as Pakistan than the country people knew when he made his speech and these people have not integrated. Yes Heinrich..trouble is, if you say that you are automatically a bigot and a racist..
That is the PC's way of shutting you up..I gave up voting in Hudds as most the candidates were immigrants..once they were in..they worked for their own communities..and not for the good of all...
http://www.sadehlok.co.uk/
I wrote to these people to see if I they would consider housing me...
No chance...
Kirklees housing manager was African..lo and behold..the new houses were all consigned to black people..(mostly related to him!)..
The thicko's did eventually catch on...and he was under investigation..he did a runner..
The number of immigrant candidates is becoming alarming...
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marybrown
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Feb 14 2015, 03:24 PM
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Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
I think your defending the indefensible. Far better a straight condemnation without the excuse clauses. Unless we condemn such actions without reservations , no matter who by, or for what reason, then anything else will give them a lever of justification and right, and could suggest tacit support. Its not a matter of what others have done , it is what they have done, and are doing.
I see Prince Charles is in Jordan kow-towing to the self appointed ''Royal'' family... I don't remember any Muslim royalty coming to Britain to give their condolences to the family of be-headed aid worker Alan Henning..who was there to help them.. Did things only get serious because the latest victim was a Muslim?? A horrific death for sure...but no more horrific than having your head hacked off by a nutter with a penknife on video!
I see Prince Charles also visited refugee camps whilst over there,no doubt you think that's wrong as well http://www.voanews.com/content/syrian-refugees-complain-about-conditions-at-jordanian-camp/2518486.html
Obviously not Butlin's then?
Didn't his ascendants visit ''Bedlam'' and lunatic asylums as a source of amusement?
Mind you, a lot of the royal family were inmates..
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marybrown
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Feb 14 2015, 03:25 PM
Post #59
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Enoch Powell was completely right when he warned about allowing so may immigrants flock into England from the former colonies. There are parts of England today that more resemble Muslim countries such as Pakistan than the country people knew when he made his speech and these people have not integrated.
Immigration is the best thing that has ever happened to this country Well..certainly not for us..probably the ''best thing'' that's ever happened to the immigrants though!
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Feb 14 2015, 03:42 PM
Post #60
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- marybrown
- Feb 14 2015, 03:10 PM
- Heinrich
- Feb 14 2015, 02:46 PM
Enoch Powell was completely right when he warned about allowing so may immigrants flock into England from the former colonies. There are parts of England today that more resemble Muslim countries such as Pakistan than the country people knew when he made his speech and these people have not integrated.
Yes Heinrich..trouble is, if you say that you are automatically a bigot and a racist.. That is the PC's way of shutting you up..I gave up voting in Hudds as most the candidates were immigrants..once they were in..they worked for their own communities..and not for the good of all... http://www.sadehlok.co.uk/I wrote to these people to see if I they would consider housing me... No chance... Kirklees housing manager was African..lo and behold..the new houses were all consigned to black people..(mostly related to him!).. The thicko's did eventually catch on...and he was under investigation..he did a runner.. The number of immigrant candidates is becoming alarming... Had a look at your link,,not sure what your thinking when you post it We get all that tripe here as well,but it's you can't get a house/job because of the easy Europeans,but knowing housing officers I know it's not true
Edited by HIGHWAY, Feb 14 2015, 03:46 PM.
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marybrown
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Feb 14 2015, 03:48 PM
Post #61
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- HIGHWAY
- Feb 14 2015, 03:42 PM
- marybrown
- Feb 14 2015, 03:10 PM
- Heinrich
- Feb 14 2015, 02:46 PM
Enoch Powell was completely right when he warned about allowing so may immigrants flock into England from the former colonies. There are parts of England today that more resemble Muslim countries such as Pakistan than the country people knew when he made his speech and these people have not integrated.
Yes Heinrich..trouble is, if you say that you are automatically a bigot and a racist.. That is the PC's way of shutting you up..I gave up voting in Hudds as most the candidates were immigrants..once they were in..they worked for their own communities..and not for the good of all... http://www.sadehlok.co.uk/I wrote to these people to see if I they would consider housing me... No chance... Kirklees housing manager was African..lo and behold..the new houses were all consigned to black people..(mostly related to him!).. The thicko's did eventually catch on...and he was under investigation..he did a runner.. The number of immigrant candidates is becoming alarming...
Had a look at your link,,not sure what your thinking when you post it What I was thinking and what is actually the truth is that you don't stand a snowball's chance in hell of getting a house/flat with this housing association unless you are an immigrant..
Doesn't the name ''Sadeh Lok'' give you a clue?..
Obviously they don't tell you as much..after all..that would be racist..wouldn't it??..
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HIGHWAY
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Feb 14 2015, 04:02 PM
Post #62
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- marybrown
- Feb 14 2015, 03:48 PM
- HIGHWAY
- Feb 14 2015, 03:42 PM
- marybrown
- Feb 14 2015, 03:10 PM
- Heinrich
- Feb 14 2015, 02:46 PM
Enoch Powell was completely right when he warned about allowing so may immigrants flock into England from the former colonies. There are parts of England today that more resemble Muslim countries such as Pakistan than the country people knew when he made his speech and these people have not integrated.
Yes Heinrich..trouble is, if you say that you are automatically a bigot and a racist.. That is the PC's way of shutting you up..I gave up voting in Hudds as most the candidates were immigrants..once they were in..they worked for their own communities..and not for the good of all... http://www.sadehlok.co.uk/I wrote to these people to see if I they would consider housing me... No chance... Kirklees housing manager was African..lo and behold..the new houses were all consigned to black people..(mostly related to him!).. The thicko's did eventually catch on...and he was under investigation..he did a runner.. The number of immigrant candidates is becoming alarming...
Had a look at your link,,not sure what your thinking when you post it
What I was thinking and what is actually the truth is that you don't stand a snowball's chance in hell of getting a house/flat with this housing association unless you are an immigrant.. Doesn't the name ''Sadeh Lok'' give you a clue?.. Obviously they don't tell you as much..after all..that would be racist..wouldn't it??.. Yet another urban myth,like the usual people spread lies up here
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marybrown
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Feb 14 2015, 04:03 PM
Post #63
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- HIGHWAY
- Feb 14 2015, 03:42 PM
- marybrown
- Feb 14 2015, 03:10 PM
- Heinrich
- Feb 14 2015, 02:46 PM
Enoch Powell was completely right when he warned about allowing so may immigrants flock into England from the former colonies. There are parts of England today that more resemble Muslim countries such as Pakistan than the country people knew when he made his speech and these people have not integrated.
Yes Heinrich..trouble is, if you say that you are automatically a bigot and a racist.. That is the PC's way of shutting you up..I gave up voting in Hudds as most the candidates were immigrants..once they were in..they worked for their own communities..and not for the good of all... http://www.sadehlok.co.uk/I wrote to these people to see if I they would consider housing me... No chance... Kirklees housing manager was African..lo and behold..the new houses were all consigned to black people..(mostly related to him!).. The thicko's did eventually catch on...and he was under investigation..he did a runner.. The number of immigrant candidates is becoming alarming...
Had a look at your link,,not sure what your thinking when you post it We get all that tripe here as well,but it's you can't get a house/job because of the easy Europeans,but knowing housing officers I know it's not true You know housing officers?
What!!...all of them?...
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HIGHWAY
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Feb 14 2015, 04:05 PM
Post #64
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- marybrown
- Feb 14 2015, 04:03 PM
- HIGHWAY
- Feb 14 2015, 03:42 PM
- marybrown
- Feb 14 2015, 03:10 PM
- Heinrich
- Feb 14 2015, 02:46 PM
Enoch Powell was completely right when he warned about allowing so may immigrants flock into England from the former colonies. There are parts of England today that more resemble Muslim countries such as Pakistan than the country people knew when he made his speech and these people have not integrated.
Yes Heinrich..trouble is, if you say that you are automatically a bigot and a racist.. That is the PC's way of shutting you up..I gave up voting in Hudds as most the candidates were immigrants..once they were in..they worked for their own communities..and not for the good of all... http://www.sadehlok.co.uk/I wrote to these people to see if I they would consider housing me... No chance... Kirklees housing manager was African..lo and behold..the new houses were all consigned to black people..(mostly related to him!).. The thicko's did eventually catch on...and he was under investigation..he did a runner.. The number of immigrant candidates is becoming alarming...
Had a look at your link,,not sure what your thinking when you post it We get all that tripe here as well,but it's you can't get a house/job because of the easy Europeans,but knowing housing officers I know it's not true
You know housing officers? What!!...all of them?... Did I say I knew all of them
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Tytoalba
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Feb 15 2015, 10:43 AM
Post #65
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- Happy Hornet
- Feb 8 2015, 01:00 PM
- Tytoalba
- Feb 8 2015, 12:40 PM
- krugerman
- Feb 8 2015, 12:19 PM
- C-too
- Feb 7 2015, 04:03 PM
---- "People of faith and none have a right to live in peace and harmony, free from fear, hatred and violence". ----
I agree, but I would feel a lot better if another 5,000 Muslims had left the EU to fight against ISIS.
Islam does have a problem because everywhere Muslims migrate to it seems the Islamic nutters are either in amongst them or quickly follow them.
IMO the best people to deal with these extremists in their midst are the Muslims themselves.
There are "nutters" in all faiths, and all faiths are also full of hypocrite's, the best example by far is the moral preachings of a certain Christian sect known as "Roman Catholasism", which dictate s on such matters as homosexuality whilst at the same time covers up child sexual abuse on an industrial scale. I do not subscribe to any faith or religion, but you know what, I would sooner have young Muslims go out and fight for some extreme bunch of terrorists as against a bunch of Catholic priests rape children, but in an ideal world I would prefer neither. My point is that the failings of one faith and the actions of some of its adherents over another faith is in itself utterly hypocritical, and rather smells of bigotry.
I think your defending the indefensible. Far better a straight condemnation without the excuse clauses. Unless we condemn such actions without reservations , no matter who by, or for what reason, then anything else will give them a lever of justification and right, and could suggest tacit support. Its not a matter of what others have done , it is what they have done, and are doing.
You do realise that suspicion, fear and hostility towards muslims from non - muslims is EXACTLY what the Islamic extremist nut cases want? Your right. We mustn't say anything negative about them or their religion. no matter what they do or how they do it. They must achieve their ends without condemnation or criticism, until such time as we are all fully converted.
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HIGHWAY
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Feb 15 2015, 10:50 AM
Post #66
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- Tytoalba
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- Tytoalba
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- krugerman
- Feb 8 2015, 12:19 PM
Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
I think your defending the indefensible. Far better a straight condemnation without the excuse clauses. Unless we condemn such actions without reservations , no matter who by, or for what reason, then anything else will give them a lever of justification and right, and could suggest tacit support. Its not a matter of what others have done , it is what they have done, and are doing.
You do realise that suspicion, fear and hostility towards muslims from non - muslims is EXACTLY what the Islamic extremist nut cases want?
Your right. We mustn't say anything negative about them or their religion. no matter what they do or how they do it. They must achieve their ends without condemnation or criticism, until such time as we are all fully converted. Maybe you will convert,,,
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krugerman
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Feb 15 2015, 12:55 PM
Post #67
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Mr Enoch Powell's predictions of "rivers of blood" is a prediction that never came true, the speech made 47 years ago was an assertion by both Powell and those that supported his views that Britain was, and should remain a white only country.
The speech contained references to so called "concerns" raised by his constituents, like for example the man who wanted his sons to emigrate to another country because there were "too many black people in this country", and that in the constituents own words "before long, the blacks will hold the whip hand".
The speech could have been made by Oswald Moseley about Jews in 1936, or by Nick Griffin of the now almost defunct BNP, it could have been made by a leader of the Klu Clux Klan, and it could have been made by Adolf Hitler.
The fact that the speech was made by a supposedly intelligent man, and a prominent British politician made it astonishing, and it finished off Enoch Powell as a prominent cabinet minister and potential leader of the Conservative Party, he was from that point relegated to the back benches and to the backwater of Northern Ireland.
Making such a speech, branding perfectly decent people as been unacceptable and unwanted because of the colour of their skin, was outrageous, and today instead of our rivers foaming with blood (as Powell predicted), we totally accept our fellow citizens of Caribbean origin, we accept them as footballers, singers, news readers, politicians, gold medal winners, industrialists and also as the mate we go for a pint with down to the pub.
Perhaps Powell was the king of kings when it comes to bigots, or perhaps he was just misguided and shaped by how things were back in the day, but whichever way you look at it, one thing is certain - He was wrong
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C-too
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Feb 15 2015, 01:04 PM
Post #68
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- Tytoalba
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- Happy Hornet
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- Tytoalba
- Feb 8 2015, 12:40 PM
- krugerman
- Feb 8 2015, 12:19 PM
Quoting limited to 4 levels deep
I think your defending the indefensible. Far better a straight condemnation without the excuse clauses. Unless we condemn such actions without reservations , no matter who by, or for what reason, then anything else will give them a lever of justification and right, and could suggest tacit support. Its not a matter of what others have done , it is what they have done, and are doing.
You do realise that suspicion, fear and hostility towards muslims from non - muslims is EXACTLY what the Islamic extremist nut cases want?
Your right. We mustn't say anything negative about them or their religion. no matter what they do or how they do it. They must achieve their ends without condemnation or criticism, until such time as we are all fully converted. There does seem to be a desire from many quarters that non-Muslims should not express there doubts or concerns about Muslims or Muslim communities. We should just let things be, which appears to be the approach taken by some Muslims.
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Deleted User
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Feb 15 2015, 02:00 PM
Post #69
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- Tytoalba
- Feb 5 2015, 11:01 AM
I note, with horror, that the Muslim fundamentalist group has had their own wicker man , by enclosing a Jordanian pilot in a metal cage and burning him to death. I'm sure that we all felt a sense of pity for him , horror at what was done to him and with sympathy for his friends, but where are the protests and condemnations at what the perpetrators did to him on this board, or from our own Muslim clerics and leaders? Will I be condemned for raising the issue, or be accused of Islamaphobia for doing so ? Why the silence, and where are the protest from the silent peace loving majority of Muslims in Britain that we hear so much about? Is this the thing to come if not addressed properly, and is Obama right in saying full integration and a national identity the key to a peaceful future. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2913798/Religion-dare-not-speak... Was Enoch right http://www.riversofblood.uk/rivers_of_blood_enoch_powell.asp
Well it does appear that the Muslim assoc of Britain has condemned it. Apart from some swivel eyed Islamic fundamentalist loonies I dont see any Muslim organisations approving it. So what your problem is , is that muslims are not protesting enough to make you feel safe in your bed. I will remind you that the region where this is going on is an a huge area with a history of western backed vicious dictators. Its social structures have been dismantled by and with the approval of the West. If you and your cronies had been put through the misery that these people have been then you would be burning people or they would be burning you. WE in the West created these people. Grow up , stop wetting your knickers and stop blaming your local fecking newsagent/doctor/pound shop worker for people living in violent dystopias , in the main created by the West, killing each other.
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Tytoalba
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Feb 15 2015, 02:29 PM
Post #70
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- gansao
- Feb 15 2015, 02:00 PM
- Tytoalba
- Feb 5 2015, 11:01 AM
I note, with horror, that the Muslim fundamentalist group has had their own wicker man , by enclosing a Jordanian pilot in a metal cage and burning him to death. I'm sure that we all felt a sense of pity for him , horror at what was done to him and with sympathy for his friends, but where are the protests and condemnations at what the perpetrators did to him on this board, or from our own Muslim clerics and leaders? Will I be condemned for raising the issue, or be accused of Islamaphobia for doing so ? Why the silence, and where are the protest from the silent peace loving majority of Muslims in Britain that we hear so much about? Is this the thing to come if not addressed properly, and is Obama right in saying full integration and a national identity the key to a peaceful future. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2913798/Religion-dare-not-speak... Was Enoch right http://www.riversofblood.uk/rivers_of_blood_enoch_powell.asp
Well it does appear that the Muslim assoc of Britain has condemned it. Apart from some swivel eyed Islamic fundamentalist loonies I dont see any Muslim organisations approving it. So what your problem is , is that muslims are not protesting enough to make you feel safe in your bed. I will remind you that the region where this is going on is an a huge area with a history of western backed vicious dictators. Its social structures have been dismantled by and with the approval of the West. If you and your cronies had been put through the misery that these people have been then you would be burning people or they would be burning you. WE in the West created these people. Grow up , stop wetting your knickers and stop blaming your local fecking newsagent/doctor/pound shop worker for people living in violent dystopias , in the main created by the West, killing each other. For your information I was born and raised in Pakistan so I do know about the history and people Here is my Old School for your interest. There seems to be too many false assumptions made about posters or their thinking or intents, and objective discussions seems to be anathema to them. Always the implied personal attack or attempts to label or colour or demonise them . Views and opinions will differ, that is why we read and post Nothing said on here is world changing, and it will all sort itself out eventually and just become more of mans history. As the saying goes, a thousand years will pass in the blink of Buddha's eyes.
http://www.lawrencecollege.edu.pk Very good school BTW, with tolerant attitudes, producing many of Pakistan's best.
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Deleted User
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Feb 15 2015, 03:09 PM
Post #71
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- Tytoalba
- Feb 15 2015, 02:29 PM
- gansao
- Feb 15 2015, 02:00 PM
- Tytoalba
- Feb 5 2015, 11:01 AM
I note, with horror, that the Muslim fundamentalist group has had their own wicker man , by enclosing a Jordanian pilot in a metal cage and burning him to death. I'm sure that we all felt a sense of pity for him , horror at what was done to him and with sympathy for his friends, but where are the protests and condemnations at what the perpetrators did to him on this board, or from our own Muslim clerics and leaders? Will I be condemned for raising the issue, or be accused of Islamaphobia for doing so ? Why the silence, and where are the protest from the silent peace loving majority of Muslims in Britain that we hear so much about? Is this the thing to come if not addressed properly, and is Obama right in saying full integration and a national identity the key to a peaceful future. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2913798/Religion-dare-not-speak... Was Enoch right http://www.riversofblood.uk/rivers_of_blood_enoch_powell.asp
Well it does appear that the Muslim assoc of Britain has condemned it. Apart from some swivel eyed Islamic fundamentalist loonies I dont see any Muslim organisations approving it. So what your problem is , is that muslims are not protesting enough to make you feel safe in your bed. I will remind you that the region where this is going on is an a huge area with a history of western backed vicious dictators. Its social structures have been dismantled by and with the approval of the West. If you and your cronies had been put through the misery that these people have been then you would be burning people or they would be burning you. WE in the West created these people. Grow up , stop wetting your knickers and stop blaming your local fecking newsagent/doctor/pound shop worker for people living in violent dystopias , in the main created by the West, killing each other.
For your information I was born and raised in Pakistan so I do know about the history and people Here is my Old School for your interest. There seems to be too many false assumptions made about posters or their thinking or intents, and objective discussions seems to be anathema to them. Always the implied personal attack or attempts to label or colour or demonise them . Views and opinions will differ, that is why we read and post Nothing said on here is world changing, and it will all sort itself out eventually and just become more of mans history. As the saying goes, a thousand years will pass in the blink of Buddha's eyes. http://www.lawrencecollege.edu.pk Very good school BTW, with tolerant attitudes, producing many of Pakistan's best.
TBH it is not my concern where you went to school. I could not care less neither does it have any relevance to your OP. Your OP asks about the lack of public condemnation by Muslims in this country concerning one brutal killing of a Muslim by other Muslims in a Muslim killing field. You seem to be the one doing the demonising or trying to ' colour' whole sections of UK societies with your bigot brush. It appears they are not protesting enough for your liking. I can only assume that you either think they tacitally agree with the killing or do not care very much. Either way it seems to reflect an ignorance or bias rather than common sense. When your bigotry is challenged you post cod philosophy and somehow think that where you went to school is important to the debate. Jeez.......
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krugerman
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Feb 15 2015, 04:41 PM
Post #72
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Tytoalbar - I do not agree with the reasoning of your opening post on this thread, it has a slight whiff or air of anti Muslim sentiment about it, and from the opposite side of the coin can I suggest that many decent and law abiding Muslims will be tired of having to justify or prove their personal disapproval of extremists and terrorists, as though they are always under suspicion.
I assume that you yourself are not Muslim, (though I fully accept that this is really none of anyone's business on here, including me) and I accept that as with many places on earth, minorities are not always treated fairly or equally in Pakistan, infact they are sometimes treated harshly.
I had an argument recently with a friend who thought that it was ok for the Americans to torture inmates at Guantanamo Bay, because in his words "look what [they] do to us", and during that argument I quoted the words of one of the greatest ever leaders in history "An eye for an eye and soon the world will be blind".
At some point a start has to be made in repairing barriers of hate and suspicion, this has happened amongst the nations of Europe, its beginning to happen in Ireland, its working in South Africa and in the Balkans.
Are we all really going to simply accept that many Hindus will always hate Muslims, that Israeli's will always look upon Palestinians with suspicion, or that life must always be harsh for Christians in Pakistan and other places, or should we live in hope that it wont always be this way. ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jock_Tamson%27s_Bairns
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Tytoalba
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Feb 16 2015, 01:55 PM
Post #73
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- krugerman
- Feb 15 2015, 04:41 PM
Tytoalbar - I do not agree with the reasoning of your opening post on this thread, it has a slight whiff or air of anti Muslim sentiment about it, and from the opposite side of the coin can I suggest that many decent and law abiding Muslims will be tired of having to justify or prove their personal disapproval of extremists and terrorists, as though they are always under suspicion. I assume that you yourself are not Muslim, (though I fully accept that this is really none of anyone's business on here, including me) and I accept that as with many places on earth, minorities are not always treated fairly or equally in Pakistan, infact they are sometimes treated harshly. I had an argument recently with a friend who thought that it was ok for the Americans to torture inmates at Guantanamo Bay, because in his words "look what [they] do to us", and during that argument I quoted the words of one of the greatest ever leaders in history "An eye for an eye and soon the world will be blind". At some point a start has to be made in repairing barriers of hate and suspicion, this has happened amongst the nations of Europe, its beginning to happen in Ireland, its working in South Africa and in the Balkans. Are we all really going to simply accept that many Hindus will always hate Muslims, that Israeli's will always look upon Palestinians with suspicion, or that life must always be harsh for Christians in Pakistan and other places, or should we live in hope that it wont always be this way. ? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jock_Tamson%27s_Bairns Yesterday a number of Coptic Christians from Egypt were taken down to a beach and beheaded by Islamists Another report stated that over 250 captured prisoners of ISIS were stripped to their underwear, insulted and treated like sheep, and were marched into the desert and executed.
The suggestion that I am anti radical Muslims, and therefore islamaphobic is based on the presenting of the facts of the matter, and my concerns about them and their behaviour. if I am, so are all their enemies, for I think we have a lot to fear from the supporters of that religion, It could equally be claimed that the Egyptian government is Islamaphobic, for in retaliation they have bombed them from the air. Our own government wouldn't be spending so much time and money on trying to identify potential terrorists in Britain if the threat from them was not real. Who is radicalising them, and why do those who know them not identify them? I asked the question where are the objectors to the behaviour of the followers of Islam, where are those who will go to fight against them to supress their barbarity. Why are there so many prepared to go to fight for them, for they are not just a few extremists.
I do believe we have something to fear from them, and their longer term intents, and anyone who does not , based on all the available evidence, are deceiving themselves. IMO
What I want is the many good ones to stand up and be counted, for the good of their faith and the people of Britain and elsewhere.
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Happy Hornet
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Feb 16 2015, 02:29 PM
Post #74
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And Egypt responded with air strikes against ISIS targets although you neglected to mention this.
I don't condone ad-homs Ty, but if you keep telling only half the story people will inevitably start to question your motives.
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Tytoalba
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Feb 16 2015, 05:11 PM
Post #75
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- Happy Hornet
- Feb 16 2015, 02:29 PM
And Egypt responded with air strikes against ISIS targets although you neglected to mention this.
I don't condone ad-homs Ty, but if you keep telling only half the story people will inevitably start to question your motives. I did HH I said the Egyptian government bombed them from the air. My motives, like so many of the Jews I heard speak on the Jeremy Vine show this morning , was to live in peace without the threats that exist around us. To have unity of a nation, we should generally be unaware of the religious beliefs and practices of individuals, a truly secular society and one with a common purpose, where an individuals religious beliefs is of no consequence to the whole. The Jews today have to have their assembly buildings and homes constantly guarded for being Jews. Will we be attacked in the future , as in other countries for just being Christians and rejecting the faith of Islam?
Unfortunately human beings are by nature tribal, and I do not believe that a multicultural society will ever be at peace with itself. Its not just in Britain where the threats are coming from , but France and Belgium. In all theses instances the one common thread is Islam To hope that it will not continue, is just a wasted hope IMO, and to think it will not continue or even get worse is unreasonable. There are over 2.6 million Muslims in Britain millions, and there population is growing by birth rates alone, so they need to be actively positive in rooting out the potential terrorists among them.
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krugerman
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Feb 16 2015, 05:14 PM
Post #76
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Tytoalba - I am suspicious of the choosing of your words "beheaded by Islamists", so what is meant by "Islamists" ?
The Egyptian Coptic Christians were murdered by extremists, terrorists, cowards and murderers who claim that they are devout Muslims, they also claim to be doing the work of God or Allah, which is utterly ridiculous, and the vast majority of Muslims know that its ridiculous.
The Egyptian government has taken retaliatory action against ISIS for the murder of its Christian citizens, which in my opinion is a good thing, and tells the world that terror groups who target Egyptian citizens, regardless of their religion, will be punished.
For me personally, I am certainly not anti Muslim, and I am not anti any religion, but I am opposed to extremists, intolerance and those that use religion as an excuse to murder innocent people.
On the other hand I am not pro any religion either, I am an atheist who respects other people's beliefs, and I will defend always the right to freedom of religion.
If you choose to class all Muslims as been the same, based upon the actions of the extremists, then I think your a fool, perhaps all Catholics sexually assault young boys ?, perhaps all Irish Catholics are IRA terrorists, perhaps all Hindu's would like to see Pakistan wiped off the face of the planet ............... No, I dont think so
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Deleted User
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Feb 16 2015, 06:24 PM
Post #77
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- Tytoalba
- Feb 16 2015, 05:11 PM
- Happy Hornet
- Feb 16 2015, 02:29 PM
And Egypt responded with air strikes against ISIS targets although you neglected to mention this.
I don't condone ad-homs Ty, but if you keep telling only half the story people will inevitably start to question your motives.
I did HH I said the Egyptian government bombed them from the air. My motives, like so many of the Jews I heard speak on the Jeremy Vine show this morning , was to live in peace without the threats that exist around us. To have unity of a nation, we should generally be unaware of the religious beliefs and practices of individuals, a truly secular society and one with a common purpose, where an individuals religious beliefs is of no consequence to the whole. The Jews today have to have their assembly buildings and homes constantly guarded for being Jews. Will we be attacked in the future , as in other countries for just being Christians and rejecting the faith of Islam? Unfortunately human beings are by nature tribal, and I do not believe that a multicultural society will ever be at peace with itself. Its not just in Britain where the threats are coming from , but France and Belgium. In all theses instances the one common thread is Islam To hope that it will not continue, is just a wasted hope IMO, and to think it will not continue or even get worse is unreasonable. There are over 2.6 million Muslims in Britain millions, and there population is growing by birth rates alone, so they need to be actively positive in rooting out the potential terrorists among them.
Maybe the jews should be actively positive in reducing the oppression of the Palestinians. This may help to reduce the animosity between the muslims and the West. Maybe the secular and Christian Westerners should have been actively positive in reducing the amount of innocent muslims killed by the Western military ......that might have helped too. Your myopia mixed with tunnel vision would make you dangerous if you could produce a viable case for muslims being collectively responsible for their own enemies.
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