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| Labour Leadership Contest; merged thread | |
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| Topic Started: May 15 2015, 01:02 PM (2,208 Views) | |
| Tytoalba | May 15 2015, 01:02 PM Post #1 |
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Senior Member
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Chuka Umunna withdraws Labour leader bid, Who is left to lead them? The BBC has been attacking UKIP and Farrage for days, but at least they have a leader. Labour are in a state of uncertainty, and we do need a good opposition in the HOC, |
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| Affa | Aug 31 2015, 09:31 AM Post #1161 |
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Senior Member
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My daughter works for an entrepreneur, and in his own words, during and after the last crisis/recession, 'if it had not been for you we would have folded this time', she apparently worked hard to establish new outlets to replace some of those that had been lost ........ today the roster is twice what it was. They all owe her a lot. |
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| disgruntled porker | Aug 31 2015, 09:44 AM Post #1162 |
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Older than most people think I am.
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I imagine that the unskilled workers at the bottom of the pile also worked very hard to produce the goods to supply to these new outlets too. Or doesn't their part in it count at all? |
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| Tigger | Aug 31 2015, 11:40 AM Post #1163 |
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Senior Member
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Cameron employing a criminal who hacks the phones of dead schoolgirls? Blair parading with Gadaffi, Assad et al? Major cuddling up to ME despots and serial violators of human rights? Thatch? Take your pick on that one......... Best not to pretend you don't mean something when you do, it's a bit dishonest in my opinion.
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| Tigger | Aug 31 2015, 11:55 AM Post #1164 |
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Senior Member
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Really? Bravery? I've yet to meet a single business owner who did not do it it enrich himself, myself included, a few might develop a conscience when the money starts to flood in and you are able to meet all your own material needs, you then might even consider spreading some of that money around. Now if you run a business that needs skills other than those you might find Piotr has after he steps of the ferry at Hull you will be in a position of being totally reliant on those skilled people to keep the business viable and functioning on a day to day basis. It takes time to build any business and without quality staff the business will fold in very short order. I've found that businesses who treat their staff with the sort of barely disguised contempt you are exhibiting here tend to run into several problems regarding productivity, staff turnover and customer satisfaction. Continuity is vital for success. File under bog standard compo, minus the deprived childhood that sometimes it would seem removes humility...... Edited by Tigger, Aug 31 2015, 11:56 AM.
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| Pro Veritas | Aug 31 2015, 01:52 PM Post #1165 |
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Upstanding Member
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So it seems Corbyn is now a defender of Osama Bin Ladan...... ...except of course he isn't, and if you read what he actually said it is abundantly clear that he isn't. So here's the BBC article: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-34106214 Here are comments from two, supposedly, intelligent MPs:
And here is what Mr Corbyn actually said:
Now, my personal opinion is that the world is a lot better off with Mr Bin Laden out of it. But I would still rather, in principle, see countries try to uphold the principles of law and order. All The Best |
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| Phoenix One UK | Aug 31 2015, 01:57 PM Post #1166 |
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Labour have been “in denial” about threat from UKIP, says Dan Jarvis http://labourlist.org/2015/08/labour-have-been-in-denial-about-threat-from-ukip-says-dan-jarvis/ More than 40,000 union activists caught voting twice: Fears grow over validity of Labour's leader race Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3210801/40-000-union-activists-caught-voting-twice-Fears-grow-validity-Labour-s-leader-race.html#ixzz3kOuSjLsK Unquote:===================== The first link is to Labour's own site, the second is DM. I was so tempted to start a thread n both, but the hell with it. The GE is over, and Labour are in a mess. |
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| Phoenix One UK | Aug 31 2015, 02:12 PM Post #1167 |
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Regular Member
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'Labour MUST tackle Ukip head on if they want to win in 2020', warns Dan Jarvis http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/labour-must-tackle-ukip-head-6340034 Unquote:===================== The above headline comes from the Mirror, a Labour paper. Anyway, I will leave you all to it. |
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| Cymru | Sep 1 2015, 12:19 PM Post #1168 |
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Alt-Right
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Thank God we have the right-wing press to tell us what a disaster Jeremy Corbyn as PM would be http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/comment/thank-god-we-have-the-rightwing-press-to-tell-us-what-a-disaster-jeremy-corbyn-as-pm-would-be-10475557.html Steel nails it. The right-wing hysteria over Corbyn is reaching ludicrous levels. |
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| Steve K | Sep 1 2015, 01:09 PM Post #1169 |
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Once and future cynic
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Well that's written by Mark Steel whose dotty politics make Corbyn seem right wing in comparison "nails it" more like a heap of bollocks from a comedian |
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| Steve K | Sep 1 2015, 01:29 PM Post #1170 |
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Once and future cynic
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For the education of Cymru and Mark Steel http://www.parliament.uk/edm/2003-04/1255
Supported by just Tony Banks, Jeremy Corbyn and some months later John McDonnell No it wasn't April Fools day but it was 3 fools that signed it. This will come back to haunt him if he ever makes PMQs |
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| Cymru | Sep 1 2015, 02:03 PM Post #1171 |
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Alt-Right
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Interesting the bit you missed out, rather puts a different context on what was being said, one which most people would probably agree with. |
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| marybrown | Sep 1 2015, 02:03 PM Post #1172 |
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What a tangled web we weave..when first we practice to deceive.. |
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| Steve K | Sep 1 2015, 02:34 PM Post #1173 |
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Once and future cynic
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No it's not, that's a false flag by you. It's arguably worse but certainly more verbose when you read the whole thing
it matters not a flying fig why he wanted us all to die, the fact is he's an unstable little nutjob that when peeved by MI5 about Pigeons decided he wanted us all to die. Or perhaps in your language "that humans represent the most obscene, perverted, cruel, uncivilised and lethal species ever to inhabit the planet and looks forward to the day when the inevitable asteroid slams into the earth and wipes them out" has a different meaning Corbyn = Nutter, end of. |
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| Cymru | Sep 1 2015, 04:47 PM Post #1174 |
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Alt-Right
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Well if you are going to bandy about allegations of false flags I'd say the false flag was all yours. But in all seriousness there's nothing particularly unusual in the deliberately passionate language used in that statement. The fact you give it an importance way beyond what it merits is likely exactly what those behind the statement intended when they used such language. Edited by Cymru, Sep 1 2015, 05:09 PM.
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| Tigger | Sep 1 2015, 07:24 PM Post #1175 |
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Senior Member
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It's going to be hilarious to watch a non establishment figure standing opposite Cameron in the Commons and pointing out all the stuff that former Labour leaders would not dare highlight, on account of their policies being virtually as corrupt and venal as the Tories! Can't wait, chaos and fun for sure, but will it wake up the comatose British public? |
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| Tigger | Sep 1 2015, 07:36 PM Post #1176 |
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Senior Member
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A good piece and far from being a bit of a joke as some on here seem to think, these is absolutely nothing wrong with the factual content of that article. I can only conclude that many British people have become so brainwashed, so insecure and so frightened of anything that tests their brazen hypocrisy their heads would explode if they had to think for themselves instead of pandering to the whims of our "leaders"........ |
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| Steve K | Sep 1 2015, 10:19 PM Post #1177 |
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Once and future cynic
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Perhaps you are missing the point. No one seriously believes Corbyn is deranged enough to really want the world to end. But he is monumentally stupid enough to sign a document that says such. Shouldn't be trusted to boil an egg let alone carry out a vital function of our constitution or even worse of government. |
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| Tigger | Sep 1 2015, 10:34 PM Post #1178 |
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Senior Member
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Well there is someone else I could mention who signed up a communications director despite the fact that there had been stories circulating since 2006 that this chap had been illegally tapping phones, he was also regularly publishing stories that could only have come from those covert sources. The employer of this bloke was re elected despite this and is apparently still boiling eggs on behalf of the nation......... |
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| Steve K | Sep 1 2015, 10:42 PM Post #1179 |
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Once and future cynic
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Ah but maybe he was being blackmailed by something Coulson had tapped off his phone Actually the record probably went more like this. CMD asked for him to be security cleared and the intelligence services came back and said "squeaky clean" and CMD didn't think these might be the same obsequious bozos who were prepared to tell Blair exactly what he wanted to hear too. But we digress. Corbyn is a nut for signing that please kill us all motion |
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| Rich | Sep 1 2015, 11:08 PM Post #1180 |
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Senior Member
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The thing is, what other world statesman like person would take him seriously....Gordon Brown was snubbed in the states, Mr Corbyn would not even be invited let alone given listening time. I have no problems with the Labour party choosing him as their leader because that will only show that the membership themselves have no good sense of judgement unless you look at it from the stance that he is the best of the bunch which only says the others must be even worse. What can one say?, the future of the labour party/movement is in the hands of it's members whom I think will be carping from the sidelines for the next 2 decades if Mr Corbyn wins. |
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| johnofgwent | Sep 1 2015, 11:09 PM Post #1181 |
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It .. It is GREEN !!
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Well that's your opinion. I think you will find the law somewhat deviates from your ideal. For a start, meeting with IRA Members whether to discuss their grievances or not would be a bit of a problem seeing as they are a proscribed organisation. Meeting members of Sinn Fein may not have the same problem in SOME people's eyes ... but I think Corbyn and Livingstone's hob-nobbing was done at the height of the ban on Adams' voice being broadcast as part of Thatcher's policy f denying them the oxygen of publicity - for all the good that did. |
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| Heinrich | Sep 1 2015, 11:32 PM Post #1182 |
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Regular Guy
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By trying to get the convictions overturned on a charge of conspiracy to bomb the Israeli embassy in London of two people, Jeremy Corbyn is smeared again as somehow Antisemitic by The Jewish Chronicle. The court case was in 1996 and Corbyn believed it was a "miscarriage of justice". The Jewish Chronicle This newspaper is like a dog with a bone, one might say on a campaign to malign Jeremy Corbyn as an enemy of Jews. In 2002 Paul Foot (RIP), writing in The Guardian and given the lack of disclosure of evidence by MI5 which would have exonerated the pair, reasoned, "Surely these two young people should not have to rot any longer in jail. The plain fact is that someone else, with no connection to either prisoner, bombed the Israeli embassy. No European court or hearing under the Human Rights Act could possibly conclude that the trial of Samar and Jawad was fair. Both should be released at once on bail while their innocence is established." The Guardian Perhaps The Jewish Chronicle considers Paul Foot to have been an Antisemite too. Edited by Heinrich, Sep 1 2015, 11:37 PM.
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| RJD | Sep 2 2015, 08:43 AM Post #1183 |
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Prudence and Thrift
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Truth is that the claims of the Jewish community are not restricted to a single matter, but relate to a string of situations where they claim that Corbyn gave succour to the enemies of Israel. Heinrich stop being a Cherry Picker. I would not condemn Corbyn for such, for me his silly views on the People's QE are enough for me to believe he would be a danger to Joe Public. Clearly he is a loon. He even thinks that nationalising the Rail Carriers and Utilities would benefit Joe Public. Clearly he has learned little in his long life of doing not much other than sucking on the State's titties. The man is a joke. If elected it will be interesting to see how much authority he will command over Labour MPs. I suspect he will be a lame duck from Day One and doubt he would last more than a year. Still it will be interesting watching Labour move from being an electable Party to one that tears itself apart. I think that Labour will no longer be a Political Party as such wishes to gain power to implement it's preferred policies, but become a Debating Group determined to to expose it's massive differences in public. |
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| Heinrich | Sep 2 2015, 08:54 AM Post #1184 |
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Regular Guy
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I cannot be accused of cherry-picking since my post is in response to the campaign of The Jewish Chronicle to malign Jeremy Corbyn as Antisemitic. The article said nothing of his rejection of the British government to borrow billions in order to nationalize the debt of private banks and how this money could better have been used as quantitative easing for investment in industry, education, and infrastructure. |
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| RJD | Sep 2 2015, 08:59 AM Post #1185 |
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Prudence and Thrift
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You used a single example when the claims, by the Jewish Community not me, are legion. You lack balance. Your reference to the British Gov. is irrelevant. My interest here is to expose you as a serial bigot who cherry picks and never offers a balanced view. Tell us how the UK rates in accepting Asylum Seekers compared with all other EU countries over the last decade, say. Year by year will do. Tell us about the stance taken by other EU countries wrt to taking a share of these Economic Migrants? |
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| Heinrich | Sep 2 2015, 09:09 AM Post #1186 |
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Regular Guy
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The article in The Jewish Chronicle was about a single issue of Jeremy Corbyn's belief that the conviction for conspiracy of two people was a miscarriage of justice. It has happened before and proved to be so with people whom the MI5 and the police knew to be innocent but proceeded to stitch-up in a court of law. You went on to talk about quantitative easing proposed by Jeremy Corbyn and out of politeness I answered you to give a balanced opinion. The article I cited said nothing about exaggerated numbers of "economic migrants" among the refugee families seeking asylum in Europe. |
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| Tytoalba | Sep 2 2015, 09:33 AM Post #1187 |
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Senior Member
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Corbyn has voted against his party line, over 500 times, from a report I heard on a discussion programme. If he is elected to lead the party he is likely to get the same response from his fellow MPs to his proposals. He would hardly be in a position to complain about their principles when he will have set the precedence for them to follow. He may well be a good constancy MP, but he is not Cabinet material, or he would have been in the shadow cabinet already, and is certainly not a fit person to lead a united party party into an election. Quote. A rival camp supporter claims: “Jeremy can’t even pretend to claim he believes in party discipline. Even if he argues that he has a mandate from party members, it will be no greater than any mandate previous leaders have had when Jeremy was happy to rebel against them on every other vote. He will be absolutely stuffed when it comes to getting Labour MPs to toe the party line and obey the whips.” |
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| Cymru | Sep 2 2015, 10:49 AM Post #1188 |
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Alt-Right
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Good. Fed up of the usual party toadies. |
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| Heinrich | Sep 2 2015, 11:29 AM Post #1189 |
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Regular Guy
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Yes indeed. One of the ways in which Parliament is dysfunctional is how the Cabinet impose their policies on backbenchers. It gives the impression that MPs are expected to be more loyal to the prime minister than to their constituents or their own conscience. |
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| RJD | Sep 2 2015, 11:55 AM Post #1190 |
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Prudence and Thrift
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Have you not noticed that such is universal and has been custom and practise for hundreds of years. Without such discipline there would be chaos and Gov. would grind to a halt. Grinding to a halt could be a good idea as it will stop politicians wasting Taxpayer's money. |
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| Steve K | Sep 2 2015, 11:59 AM Post #1191 |
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Once and future cynic
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The problem is the great British electorate who voted for First Past the Post Such makes it very rare for a candidate to get elected unless they take on the flag of an existing party. It's not unreasonable for such party to quid pro quo expect such MP to then be loyal to the party line The blame lies with the electorate, such is democracy
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| RJD | Sep 2 2015, 03:48 PM Post #1192 |
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Prudence and Thrift
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I do not see that lists of place-persons provided by Politicians and their Political Parties would be different. That could drive a wedge between MP and the Constituency. I think the fundamental problem is that there are far too many career Politicians who put, for obvious reasons, Party before principle. The fact that most of these, throughout the spectrum, have little or no real World, real job, experience does not help as this does not foster individual views based on own experience. Conviction Politicians are a near extinct species. |
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| Affa | Sep 2 2015, 06:40 PM Post #1193 |
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Senior Member
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He is also a signatory of the UAF ...... that blood thirsty anti democratic organisation that exists to prevent peaceful protest. |
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| papasmurf | Sep 2 2015, 06:47 PM Post #1194 |
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So is David Cameron. |
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| Affa | Sep 2 2015, 06:48 PM Post #1195 |
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Senior Member
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More Tory BS ...... G Brown was invited to address Congress, and it has been two (maybe three) recent Tory leaders that the US government have snubbed. Which makes you point invalid. |
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| Affa | Sep 2 2015, 06:48 PM Post #1196 |
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That's who I was referring to ......... |
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| Tigger | Sep 2 2015, 08:41 PM Post #1197 |
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Senior Member
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I think it's far more banal than that, Cameron thought he could get a Murdoch apparatchic on the staff and get some favourable headlines into the bargain. It'll be interesting to see in the newly reinstated ginger one goes after Cameron and his establishment chums after what she and Rupe were put through. Corbyn is but an amateur by comparison to what Cameron has got himself into here.......... |
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| Tigger | Sep 2 2015, 08:43 PM Post #1198 |
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Senior Member
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Jeffery Archer, Lord Hanningfield, the Jock bloke who beats up teenagers? |
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| Steve K | Sep 2 2015, 09:55 PM Post #1199 |
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Once and future cynic
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I agree. That's why AV would have worked, you still get a constituency MP but he/she could no longer sit back and be an arse knowing that wrapping themself in a Tory or Labour flag would guarantee their re-election. But the UK electorate wanted what it thought it wanted without thinking it through. Dumb |
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| RJD | Sep 3 2015, 09:07 AM Post #1200 |
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Prudence and Thrift
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I suppose the British Electorate are always dumb if they do not agree with one's opinions. I think they were dumb for voting in Blair and NL, I was proven to be correct, but that's democracy for you. We have to accept the will of the people even if we think them dumb. |
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