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Appointed to Corbyn's cabinet - without ever meeting
Topic Started: Sep 14 2015, 03:05 PM (662 Views)
skwirked
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http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-34245061

Why not?

Might get lucky and find a bright star. The others certainly are nothing special.
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papasmurf
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Any chance of expanding on a one sentence "news" item?
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Alberich
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Alberich
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Why not indeed? Most of the more capable, experienced Labour members won't serve under his leadership. The party is split down the middle, and whatever Labours problem is, Corbyn is NOT the answer!
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skwirked
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More capable of what, making soundbites and fooling idiots into believing their vacuous drivel?

Corbyn might well prove to be the answer, it's too early to make such rash judgements.
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Steve K
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skwirked
Sep 14 2015, 04:00 PM
More capable of what, making soundbites and fooling idiots into believing their vacuous drivel?

And you wonder why I posted about pissing on your teddy bear?

Idealism even naive idealism is admirable as long as it isn't accompanied by an arrogant wish to impose niche views on the majority against their will. Whether it be the Redwoods or Corbyn's of this world I despise such zealous fundamentalism.

The economy of the UK isn't just a means that makes some very rich, it is the means by which we keep child mortality low, life expectancy high, health good, millions from poverty and everyone wit a fair chance of advancing themselves through education.

I realise that to some all those good things have to be put at grave risk before the altar of spiteful jealousy that some get rich but you will find I will expose such for what it is.

Between Redwood's lack of care for the disadvantaged and Corbyn/McDonell's arrogance that would create many millions more in serious poverty there is a middle ground of inclusivity that I will defend.


Quote:
 

Corbyn might well prove to be the answer, it's too early to make such rash judgements.

And what if he isn't? How are you going to fix all the dead children because his wrecked economy couldn't afford proper healthcare?

Corbynistas run scared of any proper analysis of his ghost written economics but it is exactly that analysis that of any new policy that is needed. No sane person would drive a car at top speed that had never been tested in any way but hey ho some feel it's great to risk a country.

'Cuba without the sun'? No thanks
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Stephen
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It would appear that the right of the Labour Party is reverting to its communofascist roots,by insisting that the party is supreme over the people. Seems contradictory, I know, but how else does one explain the liking for ID cards and mass Stasi surveillance preferred by the right of the Labour Party? Whatever else you may say about Corbyn, he resolutely opposed all that garbage, which one reason why I support him.
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Stephen
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Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 04:33 PM
Between Redwood's lack of care for the disadvantaged and Corbyn/McDonell's arrogance that would create many millions more in serious poverty there is a middle ground of inclusivity that I will defend

Perhaps you can point me to the candidate in the election that stood for this admirable middle ground, for I would have voted for him or her had they presented themselves? Does this inclusivity include opposing the shabby treatment handed out to disabled people or opposing the unfair use of sanctions against benefit claimants? Does it involve any actual changofrom what happens now?
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Steve K
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Stephen
Sep 14 2015, 04:57 PM
Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 04:33 PM
Between Redwood's lack of care for the disadvantaged and Corbyn/McDonell's arrogance that would create many millions more in serious poverty there is a middle ground of inclusivity that I will defend

Perhaps you can point me to the candidate in the election that stood for this admirable middle ground, for I would have voted for him or her had they presented themselves? Does this inclusivity include opposing the shabby treatment handed out to disabled people or opposing the unfair use of sanctions against benefit claimants? Does it involve any actual changofrom what happens now?
Well all three not called Corbyn supported the recent Labour manifesto that addressed all those points you raise and clearly would be changes from what happens now. So take your pick

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skwirked
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Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 04:33 PM
skwirked
Sep 14 2015, 04:00 PM
More capable of what, making soundbites and fooling idiots into believing their vacuous drivel?

And you wonder why I posted about pissing on your teddy bear?

Idealism even naive idealism is admirable as long as it isn't accompanied by an arrogant wish to impose niche views on the majority against their will. Whether it be the Redwoods or Corbyn's of this world I despise such zealous fundamentalism.

The economy of the UK isn't just a means that makes some very rich, it is the means by which we keep child mortality low, life expectancy high, health good, millions from poverty and everyone wit a fair chance of advancing themselves through education.

I realise that to some all those good things have to be put at grave risk before the altar of spiteful jealousy that some get rich but you will find I will expose such for what it is.

Between Redwood's lack of care for the disadvantaged and Corbyn/McDonell's arrogance that would create many millions more in serious poverty there is a middle ground of inclusivity that I will defend.


Quote:
 

Corbyn might well prove to be the answer, it's too early to make such rash judgements.

And what if he isn't? How are you going to fix all the dead children because his wrecked economy couldn't afford proper healthcare?

Corbynistas run scared of any proper analysis of his ghost written economics but it is exactly that analysis that of any new policy that is needed. No sane person would drive a car at top speed that had never been tested in any way but hey ho some feel it's great to risk a country.

'Cuba without the sun'? No thanks
Let's be clear, I have never voted for Labour and probably never will. My pov if anything is pretty much always total cynicism. Every now and then I see a glimmer of something optimistic but it's usually as dead as leaves soon after

That Corbyn has a few things going for him doesn't somehow mean I think he's going to do great things for the country (pointed this out 10 times now wtf).

You're still busy implying I have certain views I see.

A niche view by a minority? We'll see at the gen election. I have no desire for any country to have someone in charge that the maj dont want.

Cuba without the sun? Maybe.

Worse than the Tories?

I don't know and despite your posturing, neither do you.

You also keep calling him a BIGFATLIAR, what has he lied about?
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Steve K
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skwirked
Sep 14 2015, 05:21 PM
, ,You also keep calling him a BIGFATLIAR, what has he lied about?
And there you go again making up stories about me

Show where I called him a big fat liar or retract that


He did however lie about that economic policy being endorsed by Richard Murphy as if it was some sort of independent verification. It was written by Richard Murphy

He's been dishonest about all the promises he's made on welfare etc as they are unaffordable if you cripple the core of the mixed economy as he's planned to do.

He would reduce the rich:poor wealth ratio in the UK no doubt. By making millions more poor.
Edited by Steve K, Sep 14 2015, 05:43 PM.
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skwirked
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Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 05:40 PM
skwirked
Sep 14 2015, 05:21 PM
, ,You also keep calling him a BIGFATLIAR, what has he lied about?
And there you go again making up stories about me

Show where I called him a big fat liar or retract that


He did however lie about that economic policy being endorsed by Richard Murphy as if it was some sort of independent verification. It was written by Richard Murphy

He's been dishonest about all the promises he's made on welfare etc as they are unaffordable if you cripple the core of the mixed economy as he's planned to do.

He would reduce the rich:poor wealth ratio in the UK no doubt. By making millions more poor.
"So are you saying Corbyn was a big fat liar when he's made all those idiot statements in the past then? Or is he going to betray the platform he's stood on. Well he does have form for such doesn't he.

FWIW yes I revile Corbyn's dishonesty and his icing on the cake hypocrisy for trading as the supposed white knight honest candidate when he is anything but.

Corbyn has the dishonesty to promise what is manifestly not achievable and has the pure dishonesty to use that "the economist Richard Murphy endorses my economics" line which i showed earlier to be as dishonest a political trick as you will ever seen. He also has a track record of lying to his own party.
"

No point accusing me of making things ip because I strive to avoid that.

Well, I think claiming Murphy as indy verification was just intellectual laziness, not a massive lie.

I don't know about his aims being unachievable, he may be more moderate than you think. I think the people's QE if pushed too far might be a stupid idea..a lot of his policies aren't bad though.

I hope he shows himself to be a strong and reasonable leader of the opposition. If he can tone down some of his views a tad, he might stand a genuine chance of being elected.
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Steve K
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:facepalm: skwirked go and slowly read that "So are you saying Corbyn was a big fat liar when he's made all those idiot statements in the past then? Or is he going to betray the platform he's stood on. Well he does have form for such doesn't he"

and then when the penny drops about what it actually says, feel free to apologise
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C-too
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Stephen
Sep 14 2015, 04:49 PM
It would appear that the right of the Labour Party is reverting to its communofascist roots,by insisting that the party is supreme over the people. Seems contradictory, I know, but how else does one explain the liking for ID cards and mass Stasi surveillance preferred by the right of the Labour Party? Whatever else you may say about Corbyn, he resolutely opposed all that garbage, which one reason why I support him.
While I agree that the ID cards were over the top I think your description of the things you appose is far too extreme.

If Corbyn is against any moves that help to make the country safer then what would he do if the necessity became obvious ?
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skwirked
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Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 06:50 PM
:facepalm: skwirked go and slowly read that "So are you saying Corbyn was a big fat liar when he's made all those idiot statements in the past then? Or is he going to betray the platform he's stood on. Well he does have form for such doesn't he"

and then when the penny drops about what it actually says, feel free to apologise
It implies that you think he's a liar or completely disingenuous. And the other quotes? ;)
Edited by skwirked, Sep 14 2015, 07:01 PM.
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Steve K
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skwirked
Sep 14 2015, 07:00 PM
Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 06:50 PM
:facepalm: skwirked go and slowly read that "So are you saying Corbyn was a big fat liar when he's made all those idiot statements in the past then? Or is he going to betray the platform he's stood on. Well he does have form for such doesn't he"

and then when the penny drops about what it actually says, feel free to apologise
It implies that you think he's a liar or completely disingenuous. And the other quotes? ;)
what's the point? You still haven't worked out that one and still failed to apologise for false accusation about me.
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Rich
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Stephen
Sep 14 2015, 04:49 PM
It would appear that the right of the Labour Party is reverting to its communofascist roots,by insisting that the party is supreme over the people. Seems contradictory, I know, but how else does one explain the liking for ID cards and mass Stasi surveillance preferred by the right of the Labour Party? Whatever else you may say about Corbyn, he resolutely opposed all that garbage, which one reason why I support him.
I will say straight away that I have no problem with every bonafide person in this country carrying an ID card, as long as it is granted authoratative status, it would make life so much easier for people when having to prove who they are when it comes to financial transactions and the like.
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skwirked
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Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 08:03 PM
skwirked
Sep 14 2015, 07:00 PM
Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 06:50 PM
:facepalm: skwirked go and slowly read that "So are you saying Corbyn was a big fat liar when he's made all those idiot statements in the past then? Or is he going to betray the platform he's stood on. Well he does have form for such doesn't he"

and then when the penny drops about what it actually says, feel free to apologise
It implies that you think he's a liar or completely disingenuous. And the other quotes? ;)
what's the point? You still haven't worked out that one and still failed to apologise for false accusation about me.
OK, in the interest of debate I apologize and retract my statement for saying that you implied that Corbyn was a big fat liar, when you actually said:

"Well he does have form for such"

I am in the wrong here clearly. :)
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Steve K
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Ta

If you look I actually said he had form for betraying his party. Which he does
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skwirked
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Ah, I took it that you meant both. No worries.

You did say he was specifically dishonest, hypocritical and that "he also has a track record of lying to his own party."

I asked you what he lied about without any malice. No need to feel that there's some kind of crusade going on, I'm not THAT fond of the guy.
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Steve K
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He campaigned on a party manifesto he then voted against
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Rich
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Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 09:51 PM
He campaigned on a party manifesto he then voted against
Perhaps the poor chap is just "misguided".... :facepalm:
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skwirked
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Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 09:51 PM
He campaigned on a party manifesto he then voted against
Maybe he saw sense?
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Rich
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skwirked
Sep 14 2015, 10:39 PM
Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 09:51 PM
He campaigned on a party manifesto he then voted against
Maybe he saw sense?
In which case he will be the first Labour politician to do so, all that remains to be done is for him to openly admit where Labour went wrong and promise that they will not do so again and empower that promise by advocating 100% behind the "power of recall"
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johnofgwent
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It .. It is GREEN !!
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Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 09:51 PM
He campaigned on a party manifesto he then voted against
Well hang on a minute, If you're asembling a gallows to dangle MP's who have done that, surely Clegg should go first, and I can't believe the HoC isn't filled to the roof with people who have done the same ...
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disgruntled porker
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Older than most people think I am.
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Rich
Sep 14 2015, 08:25 PM
Stephen
Sep 14 2015, 04:49 PM
It would appear that the right of the Labour Party is reverting to its communofascist roots,by insisting that the party is supreme over the people. Seems contradictory, I know, but how else does one explain the liking for ID cards and mass Stasi surveillance preferred by the right of the Labour Party? Whatever else you may say about Corbyn, he resolutely opposed all that garbage, which one reason why I support him.
I will say straight away that I have no problem with every bonafide person in this country carrying an ID card, as long as it is granted authoratative status, it would make life so much easier for people when having to prove who they are when it comes to financial transactions and the like.
I agree Rich. They can have cc tv on every lamppost too. I have nothing to hide or fear from them.
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skwirked
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Rich
Sep 15 2015, 12:01 AM
skwirked
Sep 14 2015, 10:39 PM
Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 09:51 PM
He campaigned on a party manifesto he then voted against
Maybe he saw sense?
In which case he will be the first Labour politician to do so, all that remains to be done is for him to openly admit where Labour went wrong and promise that they will not do so again and empower that promise by advocating 100% behind the "power of recall"
I agree that'd be an awesome step for democracy.

If all other MP's are bound by that it'd be fantastic.
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C-too
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Rich
Sep 15 2015, 12:01 AM
skwirked
Sep 14 2015, 10:39 PM
Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 09:51 PM
He campaigned on a party manifesto he then voted against
Maybe he saw sense?
In which case he will be the first Labour politician to do so, all that remains to be done is for him to openly admit where Labour went wrong and promise that they will not do so again and empower that promise by advocating 100% behind the "power of recall"
Are you suggesting that there has ever been a perfect or even near perfect government in the UK ?

For "the power of recall" to work you would need to have honest unbiased assessments of situations in the media and in the press in particular. IMO that is something you will never get.
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skwirked
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C-too
Sep 15 2015, 08:04 AM
Rich
Sep 15 2015, 12:01 AM
skwirked
Sep 14 2015, 10:39 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
In which case he will be the first Labour politician to do so, all that remains to be done is for him to openly admit where Labour went wrong and promise that they will not do so again and empower that promise by advocating 100% behind the "power of recall"
Are you suggesting that there has ever been a perfect or even near perfect government in the UK ?

For "the power of recall" to work you would need to have honest unbiased assessments of situations in the media and in the press in particular. IMO that is something you will never get.
Constituent referendums.

First I think it was a 1/3 of constituents must sign a petition calling for such.
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Steve K
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johnofgwent
Sep 15 2015, 06:32 AM
Steve K
Sep 14 2015, 09:51 PM
He campaigned on a party manifesto he then voted against
Well hang on a minute, If you're asembling a gallows to dangle MP's who have done that, surely Clegg should go first, and I can't believe the HoC isn't filled to the roof with people who have done the same ...
 ::)

No because Clegg's manifesto wasn't accepted by the electorate. That left it moribund and he negotiated the best deal he could to have key parts of it in the coalition agreement.

And you might want to compare Cleg's one issue with the staggering number of times Corbyn voted against the government he promised was the basis of his constituency campaign.

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marybrown
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Is there any chance that this man may ''assert'' himself at some point as being the new leader of the Labour party??
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C-too
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skwirked
Sep 15 2015, 08:25 AM
C-too
Sep 15 2015, 08:04 AM
Rich
Sep 15 2015, 12:01 AM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Are you suggesting that there has ever been a perfect or even near perfect government in the UK ?

For "the power of recall" to work you would need to have honest unbiased assessments of situations in the media and in the press in particular. IMO that is something you will never get.
Constituent referendums.

First I think it was a 1/3 of constituents must sign a petition calling for such.
Opinions are heavily influenced by the information they receive through the media and by the way the media choose to portray the information.

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skwirked
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Well, there's some counterweight ie new statesman, guardian, indy and err others I forget.

I'd trust constituents over politicians to regulate themselves through their unaccountable committees any day.
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skwirked
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marybrown
Sep 15 2015, 12:17 PM
Is there any chance that this man may ''assert'' himself at some point as being the new leader of the Labour party??
I just picture him having to fight t blair like the evil chicken in family guy.
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C-too
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skwirked
Sep 15 2015, 12:20 PM
Well, there's some counterweight ie new statesman, guardian, indy and err others I forget.

I'd trust constituents over politicians to regulate themselves through their unaccountable committees any day.
IMO all papers have a bias. In the past I've even heard disc jockeys and others on the radio making biased political comments.

All politicians have to depend on being elected and being re-elected. My preference would be to leave things as they are, although I understand many would like to see changes.
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marybrown
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I'm still waiting..Jeremy Corbyn..do something..anything would do... :facepalm:
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marybrown
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skwirked
Sep 15 2015, 12:23 PM
marybrown
Sep 15 2015, 12:17 PM
Is there any chance that this man may ''assert'' himself at some point as being the new leader of the Labour party??
I just picture him having to fight t blair like the evil chicken in family guy.
Yes..but he must make sure his Petunia's are OK first..

PS I love family guy...
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skwirked
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C-too
Sep 15 2015, 12:44 PM
skwirked
Sep 15 2015, 12:20 PM
Well, there's some counterweight ie new statesman, guardian, indy and err others I forget.

I'd trust constituents over politicians to regulate themselves through their unaccountable committees any day.
IMO all papers have a bias. In the past I've even heard disc jockeys and others on the radio making biased political comments.

All politicians have to depend on being elected and being re-elected. My preference would be to leave things as they are, although I understand many would like to see changes.
Yes we get it, go back to NL and don't rock the boat.

Thankfully the world moves on.

Anyone who doesn't adapt is liable to be eaten alive, yes it's unfair.

Hopefully something good will come out of the pretty extreme things going on politically.
Edited by skwirked, Sep 15 2015, 02:04 PM.
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marybrown
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Has feckin Jeremy Corbin done anything yet..if he has..please post me a link..
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papasmurf
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marybrown
Sep 15 2015, 02:09 PM
Has feckin Jeremy Corbin done anything yet..if he has..please post me a link..
Terrified the right wing press, there is no other reason for them to go completely overboard attacking him. The Tory propaganda video is ridiculous.

Edited by papasmurf, Sep 15 2015, 02:28 PM.
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marybrown
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papasmurf
Sep 15 2015, 02:25 PM
marybrown
Sep 15 2015, 02:09 PM
Has feckin Jeremy Corbin done anything yet..if he has..please post me a link..
Terrified the right wing press, there is no other reason for them to go completely overboard attacking him. The Tory propaganda video is ridiculous.

I would just like him to..talk..
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