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Corbyn, the media and the estalishment. Some observations.
Topic Started: Sep 15 2015, 08:50 PM (811 Views)
Tigger
Senior Member
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They can't quite get their heads round Corbyn yet can they? ;D

I was listening to R4 on the way home from work this evening and was highly amused at what I heard, a pack of reporters tuned up at the TUC conference in Brighton and amazingly there was no buffet laid on for them! No spin doctors handing out copies of the speech Corbyn was about to deliver and no briefing of any kind, the reporter said that he and his mates ended up somewhere outside the conference centre standing in an area where the wheelie bins were kept!  !bgrin!

It got better, they actually had to go in and see him speak, this particular reporter glossed over the content of the speech and criticised the fact that Corbyn had not bothered to seek them out and warned that without them he'd not get his message across, this BBC reporter also snottily claimed that by avoiding the media, as opposed to addressing those you represent first, was a huge error as the BBC, C4, Sky and ITV "were not like the Sun or Mail" the rest of the piece was barely disguised self pity, and to cap it all we had a repeat performance by Norman Smith on the six-o-clock news!

I'm enjoying this! ;D
Edited by Tigger, Sep 15 2015, 08:51 PM.
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skwirked
On Enforced Vacation
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Any real word about what went down though?

Good to encourage people to rely on better info srcs.
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Tigger
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skwirked
Sep 15 2015, 08:55 PM
Any real word about what went down though?

Good to encourage people to rely on better info srcs.
You have to check online to get a proper report of what actually went on in the conference, the mainstream media are a bit caught up in what they appear to have made a personality cult fixation!

And the latest horrifying news is that beardie did not sing the national anthem at the Battle of Britain commemorations thus disrespecting the royal family!  :o

Although as he later pointed out (except in tomorrows right wing newspapers of course) he was paying silent respect to those who fought and died in that conflict.
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Deleted User
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As an aside. I applaud Dennis Skinner for giving Emily Maitlis a mouthful and pointing out that she was acting more like a Murdoch hack than a BBC reporter .
I'd like to give her a mouthful too TBH.
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johnofgwent
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well has anyone actually heard Corbyn sing ?

I mean, for all anyone knows his singing voice might be banned by the UN as "cruel and unusual punishment"

And if Corbyn as leader means the press have to go and work for a living, instead of being spoon fed press releases witht heir caviar and bubbly, then I warm to the guy even more.

I am a little puzzled though.

If the media circus was indeed forced to stand outside by the wheelie bins, what the hell was providing the beeb with a live word by word account direct to their web pages ? Or were they merely retwatting a twatterfeed
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Deleted User
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The last person to mistreat the press in such a fashion was Prince Edward during 'It's a royal knockout'.
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Tigger
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They did get into the conference although apparently unrefreshed and without any preferential treatment, and Corbyn was once again to busy to engage in an interview.

And I predict tomorrows newspapers will be filled with reports about Tom Watson and Corbyn stealing free sandwiches intended for crippled war veterans!

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Cymru
Alt-Right
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politico-media_complex

Corbyn's refusal to play the game will see more negative press towards him.

The good thing is that all this negative press is nowhere near as effective today than it was 10 or 20 years ago. Indeed the young of today have an instinctive cynicism when it comes to the mainstream media and their agendas.
Edited by Cymru, Sep 15 2015, 10:38 PM.
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Tytoalba
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Tigger
Sep 15 2015, 09:14 PM
skwirked
Sep 15 2015, 08:55 PM
Any real word about what went down though?

Good to encourage people to rely on better info srcs.
You have to check online to get a proper report of what actually went on in the conference, the mainstream media are a bit caught up in what they appear to have made a personality cult fixation!

And the latest horrifying news is that beardie did not sing the national anthem at the Battle of Britain commemorations thus disrespecting the royal family!  :o

Although as he later pointed out (except in tomorrows right wing newspapers of course) he was paying silent respect to those who fought and died in that conflict.
I will take a bet that all the pilots in the Battle of Britain would sing the national Anthem with gusto. Not for thema respectful silence, one that could be and has been seen as totally disrespectful and just gesture politics.
I expect we will see a lot more 'gesture politics' in the future. Just not wearing a tie, in a situation where it would be expected and dress code is to be expected is not just gesture politics, it is just bad manners.
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Tytoalba
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Cymru
Sep 15 2015, 10:32 PM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politico-media_complex

Corbyn's refusal to play the game will see more negative press towards him.

The good thing is that all this negative press is nowhere near as effective today than it was 10 or 20 years ago. Indeed the young of today have an instinctive cynicism when it comes to the mainstream media and their agendas.
The young become older with time, and generally more experienced and better informed, especially when they become PAYE taxpayers on good salaries. Having responsibilities opens their eyes.
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Gand
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Tigger
Sep 15 2015, 09:14 PM
skwirked
Sep 15 2015, 08:55 PM
Any real word about what went down though?

Good to encourage people to rely on better info srcs.
You have to check online to get a proper report of what actually went on in the conference, the mainstream media are a bit caught up in what they appear to have made a personality cult fixation!

And the latest horrifying news is that beardie did not sing the national anthem at the Battle of Britain commemorations thus disrespecting the royal family!  :o

Although as he later pointed out (except in tomorrows right wing newspapers of course) he was paying silent respect to those who fought and died in that conflict.
And if he had sung “God save the Queen” they would probably have accused him of hypocrisy.

The Telegraph also pointed out that he had the top button of his shirt unfastened … unforgivable eh. Still so long as he keeps away from bacon sarnies he may be in with a chance at the next election.
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Pro Veritas
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As regards Corbyn not singing the God Save The Queen: http://i100.independent.co.uk/article/tory-mp-and-former-soldier-says-all-you-need-to-know-about-jeremy-corbyns-national-anthem-silence--WJKacOeELl?utm_source=indy&utm_medium=top5&utm_campaign=i100


And perhaps this is why people with a social and moral conscience are warming to Corbyn: http://i100.independent.co.uk/article/people-are-sharing-images-of-what-jeremy-corbyn-and-david-cameron-were-up-to-in-the-1980s--ZygEn9bkZUl

All The Best
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C-too
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Tytoalba
Sep 16 2015, 08:32 AM
Tigger
Sep 15 2015, 09:14 PM
skwirked
Sep 15 2015, 08:55 PM
Any real word about what went down though?

Good to encourage people to rely on better info srcs.
You have to check online to get a proper report of what actually went on in the conference, the mainstream media are a bit caught up in what they appear to have made a personality cult fixation!

And the latest horrifying news is that beardie did not sing the national anthem at the Battle of Britain commemorations thus disrespecting the royal family!  :o

Although as he later pointed out (except in tomorrows right wing newspapers of course) he was paying silent respect to those who fought and died in that conflict.
I will take a bet that all the pilots in the Battle of Britain would sing the national Anthem with gusto. Not for thema respectful silence, one that could be and has been seen as totally disrespectful and just gesture politics.
I expect we will see a lot more 'gesture politics' in the future. Just not wearing a tie, in a situation where it would be expected and dress code is to be expected is not just gesture politics, it is just bad manners.
It will however encourage more of the malcontents to vote for him.
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ACH1967
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If we didn't have such a stupid bloody national anthem that sucked up to the monarchy then this wouldn't be an issue (actually it isn't an issue).

Anyone who thinks not singing the national anthem is an insult is being a fool. If he doesn't agree with the monarchy then not singing god save the queen (i mean do all those who do sing it even believe in god?) is perfectly reasonable and nothing to do with disrespecting the dead.
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C-too
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Pro Veritas
Sep 16 2015, 09:51 AM
Many people from all political parties were apposed to 'Apartheid'. Does anyone know if Cameron was for or against it ?
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papasmurf
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C-too
Sep 16 2015, 10:58 AM
Many people from all political parties were apposed to 'Apartheid'. Does anyone know if Cameron was for or against it ?
A bit of a clue:-

http://www.progressonline.org.uk/2010/04/16/what-can-a-visit-to-south-africa-tell-us-about-cameron/

When David Cameron was 23 he went on a free trip to South Africa, funded by a lobbying group founded by a former member of the South African military intelligence to bust sanctions against South Africa, and organised by a member of the Monday Club. This doesn’t suggest that as a Thatcherite researcher in the Conservative Research Department in 1989 David Cameron was a supporter of apartheid, although some of his party’s MPs at the time were. Nor does it suggest that he agreed with his then-party leader Margaret Thatcher that Nelson Mandela was ‘a terrorist.’ Nor does it even suggest that Cameron supported his party’s opposition to sanctions against the apartheid government (although there is no evidence that he didn’t.) But it does suggest poor judgement, and at best ambivalence towards the situation in South Africa in the late 80s.

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C-too
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papasmurf
Sep 16 2015, 11:02 AM
C-too
Sep 16 2015, 10:58 AM
Many people from all political parties were apposed to 'Apartheid'. Does anyone know if Cameron was for or against it ?
A bit of a clue:-

http://www.progressonline.org.uk/2010/04/16/what-can-a-visit-to-south-africa-tell-us-about-cameron/

When David Cameron was 23 he went on a free trip to South Africa, funded by a lobbying group founded by a former member of the South African military intelligence to bust sanctions against South Africa, and organised by a member of the Monday Club. This doesn’t suggest that as a Thatcherite researcher in the Conservative Research Department in 1989 David Cameron was a supporter of apartheid, although some of his party’s MPs at the time were. Nor does it suggest that he agreed with his then-party leader Margaret Thatcher that Nelson Mandela was ‘a terrorist.’ Nor does it even suggest that Cameron supported his party’s opposition to sanctions against the apartheid government (although there is no evidence that he didn’t.) But it does suggest poor judgement, and at best ambivalence towards the situation in South Africa in the late 80s.

Hmm, poor judgement. So we still don't actually know. Personally I would be a little surprised if he wasn't more pro than anti, but if he was against apartheid it would detract from that particular contrast between him and Corbyn.
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Tytoalba
Sep 16 2015, 08:36 AM
Cymru
Sep 15 2015, 10:32 PM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politico-media_complex

Corbyn's refusal to play the game will see more negative press towards him.

The good thing is that all this negative press is nowhere near as effective today than it was 10 or 20 years ago. Indeed the young of today have an instinctive cynicism when it comes to the mainstream media and their agendas.
The young become older with time, and generally more experienced and better informed, especially when they become PAYE taxpayers on good salaries. Having responsibilities opens their eyes.


On the contrary, they generally THINK they are better informed when they are not. They have an irritating habit of clinging to their prejudices and expecting the young to accept them. If the old are so well informed and wise then why is the world they pass onto the young so fecked up?
The problem with the oldies is that they have never lived up to their responsibilties and their eyes are set on to the kind of world that existed when they were young.
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Deleted User
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Corbyn believes in a republic. If he sang the national anthem ( God save our gracious queen) the the every people that get excited that he didnt sing it would be spouting that he was a hypocrite if he did.
Thats why they should be ignored...
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ACH1967
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gansao
Sep 16 2015, 12:06 PM
Tytoalba
Sep 16 2015, 08:36 AM
Cymru
Sep 15 2015, 10:32 PM
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politico-media_complex

Corbyn's refusal to play the game will see more negative press towards him.

The good thing is that all this negative press is nowhere near as effective today than it was 10 or 20 years ago. Indeed the young of today have an instinctive cynicism when it comes to the mainstream media and their agendas.
The young become older with time, and generally more experienced and better informed, especially when they become PAYE taxpayers on good salaries. Having responsibilities opens their eyes.


On the contrary, they generally THINK they are better informed when they are not. They have an irritating habit of clinging to their prejudices and expecting the young to accept them. If the old are so well informed and wise then why is the world they pass onto the young so fecked up?
The problem with the oldies is that they have never lived up to their responsibilties and their eyes are set on to the kind of world that existed when they were young.
That's a pretty broad generalisation though I agree that you were responding to another generalisation
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ACH1967
Sep 16 2015, 12:10 PM
gansao
Sep 16 2015, 12:06 PM
Tytoalba
Sep 16 2015, 08:36 AM


On the contrary, they generally THINK they are better informed when they are not. They have an irritating habit of clinging to their prejudices and expecting the young to accept them. If the old are so well informed and wise then why is the world they pass onto the young so fecked up?
The problem with the oldies is that they have never lived up to their responsibilties and their eyes are set on to the kind of world that existed when they were young.
That's a pretty broad generalisation though I agree that you were responding to another generalisation


I'm glad you noticed that... ;D
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marybrown
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Has Corbyn managed to speak yet..or was he sitting on someone's knee who had their hand up the back of his jacket?
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papasmurf
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marybrown
Sep 16 2015, 12:24 PM
Has Corbyn managed to speak yet..or was he sitting on someone's knee who had their hand up the back of his jacket?
You should have watched PMQs before you wrote that.
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Alberich
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I think that Corbyn hasn't yet realised the enormity of the task he has taken on. It is so easy to be a rebel back-bencher, free to snipe away at anything one doesn't much like, but one cannot be elected leader of a major political party, and continue on as though nothing has changed. It has! Now whether or not he sang to the National anthem is of no real import; but a more astute politician (especially one who presumably espouses to become Prime Minister) would have seen the banana skin at his feet, and made some pretence at singing along; even if he choked inwardly at the anachronistic words. And while few politicians really like having to pander to the media, it is an inescapable fact of political life that the Press can destroy you if they so choose. They have all the big guns. So Jeremy is going to have to learn that sticking to ones principles is fine, as far as it goes, but in the real world, it is advisable on occasion to bend with the wind. He must learn to be nice to the Press, for he will need friends from their ranks in the days ahead.

AS for PMQT, he did OK. He sounded confident, and it was not the disaster some had predicted. But reading out questions from the public has too much of the gimmick about it to be an effective tool. He must ask his own questions as leader of the opposition, if he is to make any impact on Cameron, who had no difficulty in batting away the questions he was asked.
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marybrown
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papasmurf
Sep 16 2015, 12:34 PM
marybrown
Sep 16 2015, 12:24 PM
Has Corbyn managed to speak yet..or was he sitting on someone's knee who had their hand up the back of his jacket?
You should have watched PMQs before you wrote that.
I watched a bit of it..then I got bored..did he have anything good to say??..Did he turn up?
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Deleted User
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A collectivist has become the leader of the Labour party, has managed to assemble a half decent shadow cabinet, made a pretty good stab at PMQs and retains a suprisingly good public reaction despite the attacks of the media.
I'd say he has had a fantastic start.
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marybrown
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gansao
Sep 16 2015, 12:59 PM
A collectivist has become the leader of the Labour party, has managed to assemble a half decent shadow cabinet, made a pretty good stab at PMQs and retains a suprisingly good public reaction despite the attacks of the media.
I'd say he has had a fantastic start.
He's 66 FFS..what can he do?

He's probably gone for a nap..

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skwirked
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gansao
Sep 16 2015, 12:59 PM
A collectivist has become the leader of the Labour party, has managed to assemble a half decent shadow cabinet, made a pretty good stab at PMQs and retains a suprisingly good public reaction despite the attacks of the media.
I'd say he has had a fantastic start.
I'll watch PMQs for once on your post.

As for age, most men in power are and were old white men. If anything, 66 is too young. :P
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marybrown
Sep 16 2015, 01:05 PM
gansao
Sep 16 2015, 12:59 PM
A collectivist has become the leader of the Labour party, has managed to assemble a half decent shadow cabinet, made a pretty good stab at PMQs and retains a suprisingly good public reaction despite the attacks of the media.
I'd say he has had a fantastic start.
He's 66 FFS..what can he do?

He's probably gone for a nap..



Well you cant refute the post so you create another stereotype to knock down..what next..cant trust anyone with a beard ?
The facts are that he is where he is... 66 or not.
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marybrown
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gansao
Sep 16 2015, 01:18 PM
marybrown
Sep 16 2015, 01:05 PM
gansao
Sep 16 2015, 12:59 PM
A collectivist has become the leader of the Labour party, has managed to assemble a half decent shadow cabinet, made a pretty good stab at PMQs and retains a suprisingly good public reaction despite the attacks of the media.
I'd say he has had a fantastic start.
He's 66 FFS..what can he do?

He's probably gone for a nap..



Well you cant refute the post so you create another stereotype to knock down..what next..cant trust anyone with a beard ?
The facts are that he is where he is... 66 or not.
We are no longer in the 1960's when elderly politicians can wander around smoking a pipe..

Things have changed...
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papasmurf
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Alberich
Sep 16 2015, 12:51 PM
But reading out questions from the public has too much of the gimmick about it to be an effective tool.
Those are questions from outside of the Westminster Bubble, they are not a gimmick.
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skwirked
Sep 16 2015, 01:15 PM
gansao
Sep 16 2015, 12:59 PM
A collectivist has become the leader of the Labour party, has managed to assemble a half decent shadow cabinet, made a pretty good stab at PMQs and retains a suprisingly good public reaction despite the attacks of the media.
I'd say he has had a fantastic start.
I'll watch PMQs for once on your post.

As for age, most men in power are and were old white men. If anything, 66 is too young. :P


PMQs was a pretty orderly affair and consisted of Corbyn reading out selected questions from the public.
Corbyn said he didnt want a circus and he didnt get one.
TBH I read about it and saw bits on the news. The only criticism was that it was boring and that Corbyn allowed Cameron to answer the questions without much challenge.
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marybrown
Sep 16 2015, 01:21 PM
gansao
Sep 16 2015, 01:18 PM
marybrown
Sep 16 2015, 01:05 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep


Well you cant refute the post so you create another stereotype to knock down..what next..cant trust anyone with a beard ?
The facts are that he is where he is... 66 or not.
We are no longer in the 1960's when elderly politicians can wander around smoking a pipe..

Things have changed...


No we are in the 21st century where people live longer, age better and the concept of ageism is recognised and ageist assertions are frowned upon.
As you say ,things have changed
Also he doesnt smoke a pipe so why mention it? He does ride a push bike and probably eats well..he seems fit enough.
As said, you are simply finding a false premise to substantiate a false argument
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marybrown
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To be honest..Corbyn is going to have to deal with the circus..instead of imitating A Jedi knight..
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marybrown
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gansao
Sep 16 2015, 01:26 PM
marybrown
Sep 16 2015, 01:21 PM
gansao
Sep 16 2015, 01:18 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
We are no longer in the 1960's when elderly politicians can wander around smoking a pipe..

Things have changed...


No we are in the 21st century where people live longer, age better and the concept of ageism is recognised and ageist assertions are frowned upon.
As you say ,things have changed
Also he doesnt smoke a pipe so why mention it? He does ride a push bike and probably eats well..he seems fit enough.
As said, you are simply finding a false premise to substantiate a false argument
No..I'd love Corbyn to bash down the Tory barriers..not going to happen is it?

I do however, admire your enthusiasm..and your false hopes..
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skwirked
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gansao
Sep 16 2015, 01:23 PM
skwirked
Sep 16 2015, 01:15 PM
gansao
Sep 16 2015, 12:59 PM
A collectivist has become the leader of the Labour party, has managed to assemble a half decent shadow cabinet, made a pretty good stab at PMQs and retains a suprisingly good public reaction despite the attacks of the media.
I'd say he has had a fantastic start.
I'll watch PMQs for once on your post.

As for age, most men in power are and were old white men. If anything, 66 is too young. :P


PMQs was a pretty orderly affair and consisted of Corbyn reading out selected questions from the public.
Corbyn said he didnt want a circus and he didnt get one.
TBH I read about it and saw bits on the news. The only criticism was that it was boring and that Corbyn allowed Cameron to answer the questions without much challenge.
People still finding pedantic irrelevant reasons to attack him and will do whatever he does.

Love people watching it then giving up before he even comes on, holy mother.
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marybrown
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skwirked
Sep 16 2015, 01:36 PM
gansao
Sep 16 2015, 01:23 PM
skwirked
Sep 16 2015, 01:15 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep


PMQs was a pretty orderly affair and consisted of Corbyn reading out selected questions from the public.
Corbyn said he didnt want a circus and he didnt get one.
TBH I read about it and saw bits on the news. The only criticism was that it was boring and that Corbyn allowed Cameron to answer the questions without much challenge.
People still finding pedantic irrelevant reasons to attack him and will do whatever he does.

Love people watching it then giving up before he even comes on, holy mother.
He hasn't done anything..apart from hide.. and insult our Queen..
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marybrown
Sep 16 2015, 01:34 PM
gansao
Sep 16 2015, 01:26 PM
marybrown
Sep 16 2015, 01:21 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep


No we are in the 21st century where people live longer, age better and the concept of ageism is recognised and ageist assertions are frowned upon.
As you say ,things have changed
Also he doesnt smoke a pipe so why mention it? He does ride a push bike and probably eats well..he seems fit enough.
As said, you are simply finding a false premise to substantiate a false argument
No..I'd love Corbyn to bash down the Tory barriers..not going to happen is it?

I do however, admire your enthusiasm..and your false hopes..


Now you find a dead end in stereotyping Corbyn you express perceived limitations in his ability to succeed in an agenda that I never said he could....in an attempt to turn the argument against me.
What I DID say is basically... so far so good.
Personally I think that he will eventually be destroyed by his own MPs but I hope that he will change the political narrative in the UK for a while.
Dont worry, the politics of hate will return...
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marybrown
Sep 16 2015, 01:39 PM
skwirked
Sep 16 2015, 01:36 PM
gansao
Sep 16 2015, 01:23 PM

Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
People still finding pedantic irrelevant reasons to attack him and will do whatever he does.

Love people watching it then giving up before he even comes on, holy mother.
He hasn't done anything..apart from hide.. and insult our Queen..


When did he insult the Queen ?
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skwirked
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:facepalm:
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