| Welcome to Uk Debate Mk 2, the UK's liveliest political and social debate site. You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are some features you can't use. If you join our community, you'll be able to access member-only sections, and use many member-only features such as customizing your profile, sending personal messages, and voting in polls. Registration is simple, fast, and completely free. Join our community! If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features: |
| Greece defies creditors over more cuts as economy shrinks unexpectedly | |
|---|---|
| Topic Started: Feb 15 2017, 09:51 AM (330 Views) | |
| Cymru | Feb 15 2017, 09:51 AM Post #1 |
|
Alt-Right
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/feb/14/greece-defies-creditors-over-more-cuts-as-economy-shrinks-unexpectedly Dear oh dear. Not happy with the humiliating terms they forced the Greek government to agree to in return for bailouts, international creditors are now demanding even more concessions above and beyond what the Greek government has agreed to in return for their concluding a compliance review. |
![]() |
|
| Tigger | Feb 15 2017, 10:40 AM Post #2 |
|
Senior Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Time to boot Greece out of the EU and Euro, it deserves it. A nation that thinks it can live off the backs of others. |
![]() |
|
| RoofGardener | Feb 15 2017, 12:19 PM Post #3 |
![]()
Lord of Plantpots
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
I find this bit worrying,
So... people are just borrowing money, and not paying it back, or paying their bills ? How long can THAT last for ? |
![]() |
|
| Malum Unus | Feb 15 2017, 01:07 PM Post #4 |
|
Hater of Political Correctness and Legalese
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
You know, I never thought to ask this before but... Is there a mechanism for booting a country out of the EU? |
![]() |
|
| Steve K | Feb 15 2017, 01:28 PM Post #5 |
|
Once and future cynic
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Yes, well they can be indefinitely suspended which is pretty much the same thing |
![]() |
|
| marybrown | Feb 15 2017, 01:32 PM Post #6 |
|
Senior Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Could be a good opportunity for Trump...dollar... |
![]() |
|
| Alberich | Feb 15 2017, 04:41 PM Post #7 |
|
Alberich
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
It's been on the cards for years. Greece should never have been admitted into the euro zone. Her economy was a basket case even then, but such was the drive to have an inclusive euro currency for all member states, the gauleiters turned a blind eye to that fact, and accepted the doctored evidence of financial probity that the Greeks cobbled together, with the help of compliant banks. But even now, I still think that the EU will find some way to keep Greece afloat...again....and again. At the moment, they need a large infusion of cash simply to enable them to repay previous handouts, which they must do in July this year. It is the economics of the mad-house. Funnily enough, if the Greeks DID leave, or were forced out, a devalued Drachma might be the way towards salvation. |
![]() |
|
| Affa | Feb 15 2017, 04:45 PM Post #8 |
|
Senior Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Being in the euro is not why Greece has ended up Bankrupt. Leaving the euro is not a way to save itself. |
![]() |
|
| RoofGardener | Feb 15 2017, 06:38 PM Post #9 |
![]()
Lord of Plantpots
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
I think Greece was admitted to the EEC for honourable reasons; they wanted to avoid catastrophic political instability following the rule of the Generals. And that pretty much worked. Unfortunately, everybody was so busy celebrating they forgot to pay their tax for the next 40 years. |
![]() |
|
| Alberich | Feb 15 2017, 07:14 PM Post #10 |
|
Alberich
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Probably. But being IN the euro meant that the traditional ways a nation combats an economic crisis ( a devaluation, or an adjustment of bank rates) was not open to them. They were hamstrung by the "one size fits all" euro; except that it doesn't, and it never can. And unless they DO leave the euro, then nothing is going to change much. There isn't much more slack for the Greeks to cut. It is a mess, and I don't see any way out for them. They are now welfare addicts. |
![]() |
|
| Tigger | Feb 15 2017, 09:20 PM Post #11 |
|
Senior Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Europhobes will be horrified at this statement, but then they probably don't realise that Greece has gone bankrupt many times, the big ones, not including common or garden defaults, were in 1834 (the Greek state as it is today only came into being in 1827!) 1893, 1932, 1945-51 and 1974. In every case they borrowed lots of money and then said we've spent it all! |
![]() |
|
| Tigger | Feb 15 2017, 09:20 PM Post #12 |
|
Senior Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
We have a winner! |
![]() |
|
| Cymru | Feb 16 2017, 08:00 AM Post #13 |
|
Alt-Right
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Here’s The Truth About Greece That Many Germans Won’t Like To Hear http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2015/07/01/greece-germany-bankruptcy-_n_7707620.html Despite Losing Tens Of Billions Of Euros, Germany Is Making A Profit Out Of The Greek Crisis http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2015/08/11/despite-losing-tens-of-billions-of-e-germany-is-making-a-profit-out-of-the-greek-crisis/#50cc67f82b4a Germany government gained from Greek crisis - IWH study http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-33845836 Highly recommend reading. |
![]() |
|
| Tigger | Feb 16 2017, 10:19 PM Post #14 |
|
Senior Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
OH MY GOD! ![]() What on earth is going on!!!!! A country puts money into another nation and not only expects to get it's money back one day as the economy grows but might want to turn a profit!!!! |
![]() |
|
| Pro Veritas | Feb 17 2017, 02:21 AM Post #15 |
|
Upstanding Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Well that's early half of all EU members then. Maybe if the EU kicked out all net-recipients the 2nd or 3rd largest net-contributor would not have voted to leave. All The Best |
![]() |
|
| Cymru | Feb 17 2017, 10:12 AM Post #16 |
|
Alt-Right
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Because turning a profit is more important than people having to give up their children because they can't afford to raise them. Good to see you have your priorities right. |
![]() |
|
| Steve K | Feb 17 2017, 11:34 AM Post #17 |
|
Once and future cynic
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Actually it's a case of Greek politicians having their Mercedes, rich Greeks avoiding paying tax and lazy Greeks that retired at 50 to keep their fat pensions seems more important to them The solution for Greece is simple: shut it with the whining and collectively live within your means |
![]() |
|
| Tigger | Feb 17 2017, 01:09 PM Post #18 |
|
Senior Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Sorry I've mislaid my violin, however most responsible parents would put their kids first instead of voting for easy credit and living off the backs of other nations, and it's not as if the Greeks are uneducated natives living in mud huts is it? |
![]() |
|
| ACH1967 | Feb 17 2017, 03:29 PM Post #19 |
|
Senior Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Yes that really works doesn't it because as I think you may have said many times in the UK selfish boomers continue to vote to feather their own beds whilst shafting the young (you would think none of them had children though it is more likely a case of "bad stuff will never happen to us" mindset). Then we have brexit. The idea that voters have access to complete and unbiased information with which to make informed voting decisions is a fantasy. Basically, and this is going to come as a massive surprise to you i am sure, the Greek people were lied to by their politicians and voted on that basis. Won't be the first time it happens wont be the last and as i rarely tire of pointing out it will be the weak and vulnerable of greek society who bear the brunt of the situation. As some one pointed out earlier the real criminals of the piece here are the greeks who fudge the euro entrance criteria and the Eurocrats whose job it was to check these fudged figures. |
![]() |
|
| Cymru | Feb 17 2017, 06:05 PM Post #20 |
|
Alt-Right
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
The EuroZone Profiteers http://www.corpwatch.org/article.php?id=15875
But, but... their lazy! |
![]() |
|
| Tigger | Feb 17 2017, 07:14 PM Post #21 |
|
Senior Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
The Greek people are not gullible victims here, lets get that out of the way first up, many Greeks will have lived through previous financial meltdowns that happened long before the nation hitched a ride with the EU, they are also rather good at not paying their taxes and of course borrowing money that they hope they won't have to pay back, in the past it was a shrug of the shoulders and vote in someone who will promise you what you'd like not what you need. They need to either grow up or sod off............ |
![]() |
|
| Tigger | Feb 17 2017, 07:18 PM Post #22 |
|
Senior Member
![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]() ![]()
|
Will you be retiring at 55 on a better pension than most in Western Europe? A pension you never really earned? How about taking out loans you have no intention of ever paying back? LAZY!
|
![]() |
|
| 1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous) | |
| « Previous Topic · Europe · Next Topic » |




![]](http://z5.ifrm.com/static/1/pip_r.png)





2:16 PM Jul 11