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Tytoalba
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Jan 27 2017, 04:45 PM
Post #681
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- Happy Hornet
- Jan 27 2017, 09:16 AM
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- Jan 26 2017, 10:41 PM
- Tytoalba
- Jan 25 2017, 10:50 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
I remember all the claims Trump's detractors made and they were all wrong. Trump wouldn't put himself forward as a candidate for president. He did. Trump wouldn't surpass 15% support in the Republican primaries. He did. Trump wouldn't win the Republican primaries and become the Republican nominee for president. He did. Trump was finished after he said women should be punished for having an abortion. He wasn't. Trump was finished after he was secretly recorded saying that you can grab some women by the pussy. He wasn't. Trump was finished after multiple women came forward alleging sexual assault. He wasn't. Trump was finished after he attacked the parents of a fallen US soldier who had criticised him at the Democratic National Convention. He wasn't. Trump was finished after the presidential candidate debates against Hillary. He wasn't. Trump wouldn't win the US presidential election. He did. Trump wouldn't scrap TPP. He did. Trump wouldn't build the wall. He is.
Trump would release his tax returns - he didn't. Trump claimed he had a bigger audience than Obama at his inauguration - he didn't. Trump said the presidential election was rigged against him - it wasn't. Trump said he would ban all Muslims from entering the U.S.- he didn't. Trump is elected and is in the white house for the next 4 years may be 8 Just accept it as the base line.
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C-too
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Jan 27 2017, 04:49 PM
Post #682
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- Tytoalba
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- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 10:42 AM
As the Anti Trump lobby has been spectacularly wrong from the beginning, as Cymru so clearly points put, . . .
No, we've had the key parts 100% right C What we got wrong was not what he was but we gave the USA public too much credit.
As for demonstrations ,didn't We have a million demonstrating against going to war in Iraq. and how effective was that? Demonstrations for the most part are pointless. Just makes the demonstrators feel good about themselves if lawfully held. See how you try to avoid the reality by pointing to a totally unrelated incidence ?
The demonstrations against war are an entirely different debate to the demonstrations against Trump. One does not cancel out the other, each is a different debate in its own right. But you wish to avoid the implications of one by side tracking onto the other. Why would anyone do that ?
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Tytoalba
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Jan 27 2017, 04:53 PM
Post #683
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- Curious Cdn
- Jan 27 2017, 11:34 AM
- C-too
- Jan 27 2017, 08:28 AM
- Cymru
- Jan 26 2017, 10:41 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
----"There's nowt so queer as folk"----I remember that insane lunatic Adolf Hitler almost being directly elected to power by the German people.
... and if there had been the sort of "push back" against Adolph Hitler as you are witnessing now against Trump, tens of millions of people would not have suffered hideous deaths.This guy is so wrong on so many levels that one has a moral obligation to fight against him. Quixotes tilting at windmills. Would you like me to be your Sancho Panza?
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Rich
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Jan 27 2017, 04:56 PM
Post #684
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- Affa
- Jan 27 2017, 12:11 PM
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I am a Labour voter, but I will not vote left-wing labour just as I could vote for right-wing Conservative. Left-wing Labour is naïve, right-wing Conservatism is callous.
IMO the Stop the War Brigade are probably in the main nice people, but they are naïve dreamers who seem to either think they live in a nice world, or that they can make the world nice. That's why I christened them 'The Magic Wand Brigade'.
It starts somewhere, there has to be a starting place or change will never come. Corbyn and his followers are not tying to change the world so much. They are trying to change British politics and for the better of most Brits. They want the wealth gap closed, And end to greed. Who would argue against that? Well the wealthy will of course. The same wealthy that warn they will leave if - which is bloody ridiculous if think about it. Why would someone who has made a fortune here abandon adding to it because he's told he can't keep all of it. And if he is that stupid and does go, there will be many others ready to step in and replace the greedy bar-stewards. So, where is the incentive to make your life more comfortable by accumulating wealth if some jealous types want to have a share of it without having put the effort in to get that wealth......do you covet your neighbours bank account......of course not so why would you want some of someone else's fruits of their labour?
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Steve K
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Jan 27 2017, 04:59 PM
Post #685
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- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 04:37 PM
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- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 01:11 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Well clearly the "we" was the anti Trump lobby. Don't you read your own posts? - Quote:
-
As for demonstrations ,didn't We have a million demonstrating against going to war in Iraq. and how effective was that? Demonstrations for the most part are pointless. Just makes the demonstrators feel good about themselves if lawfully held.
"He is a nasty, misogynistic, manipulating, rule breaking, lying, piece of scum that any right thinking person would be ashamed of supporting"
I support him in spite of your snide implications, and I am certainly not ashamed of doing so. He was democratically elected by the USA by the rules existing for many previous elections, and if he serves our country well and supports Brexit, I shall continue to do so and enjoy the ride.
Your support for telling lies, grabbing any woman you fancy by the pussy, coercing public officials into lying, illegal use of presidential power to benefit your own companies, defrauding in business, being a bigot and seeking to humiliate menstruating women and the disabled is noted And it won't wash off
I see you have succeeded in labeling me in your own mind.. Now you can continue to use it to attack me on personal level. Its against the board rules of course. No it is not. I can shred the message all I like and if you are the one giving the message then it's just tough if you see such as reflecting on the poster.
Perhaps you should not have set the tone by posting such as "Perhaps those demonising him are missing something as well, or perhaps they are just overblowing their speculations and personal fears, or perhaps it is their own unrealistic perfect world dreams being overtaken by events."
There are in essence three responses to accusations that Trump is a nasty piece of work
a) agree with the assessment b) deny the assessment and present arguments c) say you don't care if he's a nasty piece of work
You seem to be saying that (c) is a good place to be.
It isn't
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Tytoalba
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Jan 27 2017, 05:13 PM
Post #686
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- C-too
- Jan 27 2017, 04:49 PM
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- Jan 27 2017, 11:13 AM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
As for demonstrations ,didn't We have a million demonstrating against going to war in Iraq. and how effective was that? Demonstrations for the most part are pointless. Just makes the demonstrators feel good about themselves if lawfully held.
See how you try to avoid the reality by pointing to a totally unrelated incidence ? The demonstrations against war are an entirely different debate to the demonstrations against Trump. One does not cancel out the other, each is a different debate in its own right. But you wish to avoid the implications of one by side tracking onto the other. Why would anyone do that ? To try to get you to understand your own limitations. Our powers are miniscule compare to those with power and just verbally attacking them will gain you nothing. We may feel empowered by the social media but it is just a damp squib compared with the reality.
I say the only peaceful way forward is by the same democratic system that got your perceived enemies elected, and in the meantime, wait and see for there really is little or nothing else you can do about it. Do you really think that insulting and abusing others even when it is factual solves anything? Does shouting racial abuse at another across the internet or in the street solve anything and isnt it fundamentally illegalas well as immoral in itself?
For some strange reason I am reminded of this for so much seems to be obvious.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTszjoy6lPs
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Tytoalba
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Jan 27 2017, 05:16 PM
Post #687
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- Rich
- Jan 27 2017, 04:56 PM
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- C-too
- Jan 27 2017, 08:07 AM
I am a Labour voter, but I will not vote left-wing labour just as I could vote for right-wing Conservative. Left-wing Labour is naïve, right-wing Conservatism is callous.
IMO the Stop the War Brigade are probably in the main nice people, but they are naïve dreamers who seem to either think they live in a nice world, or that they can make the world nice. That's why I christened them 'The Magic Wand Brigade'.
It starts somewhere, there has to be a starting place or change will never come. Corbyn and his followers are not tying to change the world so much. They are trying to change British politics and for the better of most Brits. They want the wealth gap closed, And end to greed. Who would argue against that? Well the wealthy will of course. The same wealthy that warn they will leave if - which is bloody ridiculous if think about it. Why would someone who has made a fortune here abandon adding to it because he's told he can't keep all of it. And if he is that stupid and does go, there will be many others ready to step in and replace the greedy bar-stewards.
So, where is the incentive to make your life more comfortable by accumulating wealth if some jealous types want to have a share of it without having put the effort in to get that wealth......do you covet your neighbours bank account......of course not so why would you want some of someone else's fruits of their labour? I would think because they don't want to give up their own. It has to be someone else. Has that actress who was showing her loving concern for child refugees actually taken any into her own home?
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C-too
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Jan 27 2017, 05:23 PM
Post #688
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- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 05:13 PM
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- Jan 27 2017, 04:49 PM
- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 01:11 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
See how you try to avoid the reality by pointing to a totally unrelated incidence ? The demonstrations against war are an entirely different debate to the demonstrations against Trump. One does not cancel out the other, each is a different debate in its own right. But you wish to avoid the implications of one by side tracking onto the other. Why would anyone do that ?
To try to get you to understand your own limitations. Our powers are miniscule compare to those with power and just verbally attacking them will gain you nothing. We may feel empowered by the social media but it is just a damp squib compared with the reality. I say the only peaceful way forward is by the same democratic system that got your perceived enemies elected, and in the meantime, wait and see for there really is little or nothing else you can do about it. Do you really think that insulting and abusing others even when it is factual solves anything? Does shouting racial abuse at another across the internet or in the street solve anything and isnt it fundamentally illegalas well as immoral in itself? It is not about what we can do, it is about facing up to the full reality of the situation. Turning a blind eye to relevant information, when it suits you to do so, totally lacks any trace of objectivity.
Only putting down what you want to record in your little black book is not reality.
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Steve K
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Jan 27 2017, 05:28 PM
Post #689
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- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 05:13 PM
Do you really think that insulting and abusing others even when it is factual solves anything? got rid of Thatcher
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Tytoalba
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Jan 27 2017, 05:48 PM
Post #690
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- C-too
- Jan 27 2017, 05:23 PM
- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 05:13 PM
- C-too
- Jan 27 2017, 04:49 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
To try to get you to understand your own limitations. Our powers are miniscule compare to those with power and just verbally attacking them will gain you nothing. We may feel empowered by the social media but it is just a damp squib compared with the reality. I say the only peaceful way forward is by the same democratic system that got your perceived enemies elected, and in the meantime, wait and see for there really is little or nothing else you can do about it. Do you really think that insulting and abusing others even when it is factual solves anything? Does shouting racial abuse at another across the internet or in the street solve anything and isnt it fundamentally illegalas well as immoral in itself?
It is not about what we can do, it is about facing up to the full reality of the situation. Turning a blind eye to relevant information, when it suits you to do so, totally lacks any trace of objectivity. Only putting down what you want to record in your little black book is not reality. Reality is the status quo, and what happens tomorrow and in the future just like the reality of 'yesterday' where Trump was elected, and we voted for Brexit. For us to know the reality we are obliged to wait and see. Anything else is just speculation as to what may happen or what should be done. Perhaps someone will step forward and tell us how they will change anything?
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marybrown
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Jan 27 2017, 05:58 PM
Post #691
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- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 05:48 PM
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- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 05:13 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
It is not about what we can do, it is about facing up to the full reality of the situation. Turning a blind eye to relevant information, when it suits you to do so, totally lacks any trace of objectivity. Only putting down what you want to record in your little black book is not reality.
Reality is the status quo, and what happens tomorrow and in the future just like the reality of 'yesterday' where Trump was elected, and we voted for Brexit. For us to know the reality we are obliged to wait and see. Anything else is just speculation as to what may happen or what should be done. Perhaps someone will step forward and tell us how they will change anything? I must admit I was a Farage believer..It seems that he has carved a new job out for himself..for someone who wanted to ''retire'' he seems to have taken on a new facet??
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Happy Hornet
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Jan 27 2017, 06:36 PM
Post #692
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- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 04:45 PM
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- Jan 26 2017, 10:41 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Trump would release his tax returns - he didn't. Trump claimed he had a bigger audience than Obama at his inauguration - he didn't. Trump said the presidential election was rigged against him - it wasn't. Trump said he would ban all Muslims from entering the U.S.- he didn't.
Trump is elected and is in the white house for the next 4 years may be 8 Just accept it as the base line. I'm to entitled to hold and express my opinion. Just accept it as the base line.
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Affa
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Jan 27 2017, 07:01 PM
Post #693
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- Rich
- Jan 27 2017, 04:56 PM
So, where is the incentive to make your life more comfortable by accumulating wealth
An incentive to go to work five days a week to earn mo more than the Welfare system determines you require to live respectfully .......... to never earn enough to be comfortable, always waiting for the next pay day. And this weak incentive is all so that the investor with more money than he needs gets the best return from the efforts that these five days a week employees make for their existence. The situation is this - the wealthy one gets richer, the other will never get rich.
Edited by Affa, Jan 27 2017, 07:02 PM.
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The Buccaneer
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Jan 27 2017, 07:05 PM
Post #694
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- Steve K
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As the Anti Trump lobby has been spectacularly wrong from the beginning, as Cymru so clearly points put, . . .
No, we've had the key parts 100% right He is a nasty, misogynistic, manipulating, rule breaking, lying, piece of scum that any right thinking person would be ashamed of supporting What we got wrong was not what he was but we gave the USA public too much credit.
So you say, but you're only repeating a load of negative reports. Best to look at Trump's actions since he became the 45th Pres. Apart from the sort of lack of condemnation of the use of torture, though not outright support for it, much else has been along the lines of what he said he would do.
If only we had a government as decisive as the USA's getting, instead of our treacle like movement towards essential change, such as the NHS being replaced by a far more responsive system such as our near EU neighbours run.
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Rich
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Jan 27 2017, 07:06 PM
Post #695
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- Jan 27 2017, 04:59 PM
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- Jan 27 2017, 02:48 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep"He is a nasty, misogynistic, manipulating, rule breaking, lying, piece of scum that any right thinking person would be ashamed of supporting"
I see you have succeeded in labeling me in your own mind.. Now you can continue to use it to attack me on personal level. Its against the board rules of course.
No it is not. I can shred the message all I like and if you are the one giving the message then it's just tough if you see such as reflecting on the poster. Perhaps you should not have set the tone by posting such as "Perhaps those demonising him are missing something as well, or perhaps they are just overblowing their speculations and personal fears, or perhaps it is their own unrealistic perfect world dreams being overtaken by events."There are in essence three responses to accusations that Trump is a nasty piece of work a) agree with the assessment b) deny the assessment and present arguments c) say you don't care if he's a nasty piece of work You seem to be saying that (c) is a good place to be. It isn't But, once again, that is all a matter of opinion, yes, there is a lot to be said for balanced and considered opinions but just because they differ with anothers opinions does not make them any more or less important or relevant......it is just that, all a matter of opinion.
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The Buccaneer
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Jan 27 2017, 07:18 PM
Post #696
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- Curious Cdn
- Jan 27 2017, 11:34 AM
... and if there had been the sort of "push back" against Adolph Hitler as you are witnessing now against Trump, tens of millions of people would not have suffered hideous deaths.This guy is so wrong on so many levels that one has a moral obligation to fight against him.
Here we go again with the Godwin's, making silly and outrageous comparisons with Hitler, perhaps his supporters are fed up with the 'morality' of those patronising liberalistas who are making all the hideous noise against him.
Just let the guy get on with his job and save all the negative waves for if/when he fails ?
It gets really tedious listening to the banshee whines of the anti Trum, anti Brexit, doomsaying, sore loser, negative, depressing and 'holier than thou' know nothings infesting the media currently.
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The Buccaneer
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Jan 27 2017, 07:21 PM
Post #697
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- Affa
- Jan 27 2017, 12:11 PM
It starts somewhere, there has to be a starting place or change will never come. Corbyn and his followers are not tying to change the world so much. They are trying to change British politics and for the better of most Brits. They want the wealth gap closed, And end to greed.
Who would argue against that? Well the wealthy will of course. The same wealthy that warn they will leave if - which is bloody ridiculous if think about it. Why would someone who has made a fortune here abandon adding to it because he's told he can't keep all of it. And if he is that stupid and does go, there will be many others ready to step in and replace the greedy bar-stewards.
People like Corbyn are recidivist regressives because they only want to resurrect failed communist policies of yesteryear, he is a throwback dinosaur.
And, the wealth gap is actually CLOSING despite all the negative claims, according to recent reports.
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The Buccaneer
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Jan 27 2017, 07:27 PM
Post #698
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- Jan 27 2017, 11:13 AM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
We? Whose we? . . .
Well clearly the "we" was the anti Trump lobby. Don't you read your own posts? - Quote:
-
As for demonstrations ,didn't We have a million demonstrating against going to war in Iraq. and how effective was that? Demonstrations for the most part are pointless. Just makes the demonstrators feel good about themselves if lawfully held.
"He is a nasty, misogynistic, manipulating, rule breaking, lying, piece of scum that any right thinking person would be ashamed of supporting"
I support him in spite of your snide implications, and I am certainly not ashamed of doing so. He was democratically elected by the USA by the rules existing for many previous elections, and if he serves our country well and supports Brexit, I shall continue to do so and enjoy the ride.
Your support for telling lies, grabbing any woman you fancy by the pussy, coercing public officials into lying, illegal use of presidential power to benefit your own companies, defrauding in business, being a bigot and seeking to humiliate menstruating women and the disabled is noted And it won't wash off
'Bigotry' cuts two ways here, and it seems to me that you're even more guilty than Tyto, especially since you swallowed all the allegations against Trump, with no mention of the similar ones dogging Clinton.
By all means criticise his decisions/policies etc but why pander to the usual suspects ?
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The Buccaneer
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Jan 27 2017, 07:29 PM
Post #699
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- Affa
- Jan 27 2017, 07:01 PM
- Rich
- Jan 27 2017, 04:56 PM
So, where is the incentive to make your life more comfortable by accumulating wealth
An incentive to go to work five days a week to earn mo more than the Welfare system determines you require to live respectfully .......... to never earn enough to be comfortable, always waiting for the next pay day. And this weak incentive is all so that the investor with more money than he needs gets the best return from the efforts that these five days a week employees make for their existence. The situation is this - the wealthy one gets richer, the other will never get rich.
Did you read somewhere that life was fair ?
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Jessamy Bride
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Jan 27 2017, 07:34 PM
Post #700
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- Curious Cdn
- Jan 27 2017, 11:27 AM
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- Jan 27 2017, 10:42 AM
As the Anti Trump lobby has been spectacularly wrong from the beginning, as Cymru so clearly points put, . . .
No, we've had the key parts 100% right He is a nasty, misogynistic, manipulating, rule breaking, lying, piece of scum that any right thinking person would be ashamed of supporting What we got wrong was not what he was but we gave the USA public too much credit.
Yesterday he was DEMANDING respect from Mexico, after the Mexican President cancelled his meeting with Trump. He told them that he was going to wall them out, that they were going to come up with the $16 billion to do so and how can you negotiate with such ungrateful people who don't respect the USA? This is not Presidential behaviour. It does bring to mind all of the outrages and justices that Poland did to Germany, according to Hitler, who also DEMANDED that Poland respect the Third Reich. The NAFTA agreement has seen the US run a trade deficit of 60bn with Mexico for years. Whilst the agreement may have benefited the US economy over-all ...it has not been beneficial to the blue collar workers in the rust belt, who cannot compete with cheaper competition......(and who have voted trump in) I think he is just looking at the figures and wanting a better balance for the US
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The Buccaneer
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Jan 27 2017, 08:19 PM
Post #701
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- Jessamy Bride
- Jan 27 2017, 07:34 PM
The NAFTA agreement has seen the US run a trade deficit of 60bn with Mexico for years. Whilst the agreement may have benefited the US economy over-all ...it has not been beneficial to the blue collar workers in the rust belt, who cannot compete with cheaper competition......(and who have voted trump in) I think he is just looking at the figures and wanting a better balance for the US
Doubtless someone will be along soon to accuse you of bigotry, sigh !
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Steve K
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Jan 27 2017, 08:51 PM
Post #702
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- The Buccaneer
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- Jan 27 2017, 01:11 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Well clearly the "we" was the anti Trump lobby. Don't you read your own posts? - Quote:
-
As for demonstrations ,didn't We have a million demonstrating against going to war in Iraq. and how effective was that? Demonstrations for the most part are pointless. Just makes the demonstrators feel good about themselves if lawfully held.
"He is a nasty, misogynistic, manipulating, rule breaking, lying, piece of scum that any right thinking person would be ashamed of supporting"
I support him in spite of your snide implications, and I am certainly not ashamed of doing so. He was democratically elected by the USA by the rules existing for many previous elections, and if he serves our country well and supports Brexit, I shall continue to do so and enjoy the ride.
Your support for telling lies, grabbing any woman you fancy by the pussy, coercing public officials into lying, illegal use of presidential power to benefit your own companies, defrauding in business, being a bigot and seeking to humiliate menstruating women and the disabled is noted And it won't wash off
'Bigotry' cuts two ways here, and it seems to me that you're even more guilty than Tyto, especially since you swallowed all the allegations against Trump, with no mention of the similar ones dogging Clinton. By all means criticise his decisions/policies etc but why pander to the usual suspects ? But the ones against Clinton were of no substance. Most were fake news from project Trump
As for your idea that we should ignore everything Trump said and did before last Friday as if it is no indication of future behaviour then that is just bizarre
Would you say we should say returning Brit fighters for supposedISIS should have all their actions in Syria ignored as soon as they return to the UK? It's as logical
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Jessamy Bride
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Jan 27 2017, 08:54 PM
Post #703
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Its all a bit flouncy and borderline offensive......but the bottom line is that its just business. Its understandable people want a bit of pragmatism when they have been struggling to find jobs for far too long.
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Tigger
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Jan 27 2017, 10:12 PM
Post #704
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- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 05:16 PM
I would think because they don't want to give up their own. It has to be someone else. Has that actress who was showing her loving concern for child refugees actually taken any into her own home? The pop singer Madonna has just adopted another two black African children, they will be staying in her many homes.
What's that I hear you say? Only two? She's worth hundreds of millions!
No pleasing some is there?
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The Buccaneer
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Jan 27 2017, 10:51 PM
Post #705
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- Steve K
- Jan 27 2017, 08:51 PM
- The Buccaneer
- Jan 27 2017, 07:27 PM
- Steve K
- Jan 27 2017, 02:48 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
'Bigotry' cuts two ways here, and it seems to me that you're even more guilty than Tyto, especially since you swallowed all the allegations against Trump, with no mention of the similar ones dogging Clinton. By all means criticise his decisions/policies etc but why pander to the usual suspects ?
But the ones against Clinton were of no substance. Most were fake news from project Trump As for your idea that we should ignore everything Trump said and did before last Friday as if it is no indication of future behaviour then that is just bizarre Would you say we should say returning Brit fighters for supposedISIS should have all their actions in Syria ignored as soon as they return to the UK? It's as logical
You mean we're actually letting them back into the country ???
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The Buccaneer
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Jan 27 2017, 10:52 PM
Post #706
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- Tigger
- Jan 27 2017, 10:12 PM
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- Jan 27 2017, 05:16 PM
I would think because they don't want to give up their own. It has to be someone else. Has that actress who was showing her loving concern for child refugees actually taken any into her own home?
The pop singer Madonna has just adopted another two black African children, they will be staying in her many homes. What's that I hear you say? Only two? She's worth hundreds of millions! No pleasing some is there?
But when is Bob Geldoff, Pixie Balls cooper and other luvvies going to give houseroom to the claimed refugees they seem to have promised ?
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Rich
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Jan 27 2017, 11:00 PM
Post #707
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- The Buccaneer
- Jan 27 2017, 10:52 PM
- Tigger
- Jan 27 2017, 10:12 PM
- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 05:16 PM
I would think because they don't want to give up their own. It has to be someone else. Has that actress who was showing her loving concern for child refugees actually taken any into her own home?
The pop singer Madonna has just adopted another two black African children, they will be staying in her many homes. What's that I hear you say? Only two? She's worth hundreds of millions! No pleasing some is there?
But when is Bob Geldoff, Pixie Balls cooper and other luvvies going to give houseroom to the claimed refugees they seem to have promised ? Just have a listen to this very short clip, it is laughable and yet the man asking the questions is the same man who welcomed the first East European refugee here when he arrived at, I think it was Luton airport.
No wonder the public have lost faith.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/11929497/Minister-asked-seven-times-how-many-Syrian-refugees-have-arrived-in-Britain.h
Sorry team, the Telegraph will not let me show it....wasted post.
Edited by Rich, Jan 27 2017, 11:01 PM.
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The Buccaneer
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Jan 27 2017, 11:03 PM
Post #708
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incomplete or broken link Rich.
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Rich
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Jan 27 2017, 11:10 PM
Post #709
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- The Buccaneer
- Jan 27 2017, 11:03 PM
incomplete or broken link Rich. I'll try again Buccy.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/immigration/11929497/Minister-asked-seven-times-how-many-Syrian-refugees-have-arrived-in-Britain.html
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The Buccaneer
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Jan 27 2017, 11:21 PM
Post #710
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- Rich
- Jan 27 2017, 11:10 PM
That worked ta, but I'm not sure of the point you're making esp as the clip is dated Oct 2015. How does it relate to the 'Luvvies' saying they would give accommodation to 'refugees' ?
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Curious Cdn
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Jan 27 2017, 11:39 PM
Post #711
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- Jessamy Bride
- Jan 27 2017, 07:34 PM
- Curious Cdn
- Jan 27 2017, 11:27 AM
- Steve K
- Jan 27 2017, 11:13 AM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
Yesterday he was DEMANDING respect from Mexico, after the Mexican President cancelled his meeting with Trump. He told them that he was going to wall them out, that they were going to come up with the $16 billion to do so and how can you negotiate with such ungrateful people who don't respect the USA? This is not Presidential behaviour. It does bring to mind all of the outrages and justices that Poland did to Germany, according to Hitler, who also DEMANDED that Poland respect the Third Reich.
The NAFTA agreement has seen the US run a trade deficit of 60bn with Mexico for years. Whilst the agreement may have benefited the US economy over-all ...it has not been beneficial to the blue collar workers in the rust belt, who cannot compete with cheaper competition......(and who have voted trump in) I think he is just looking at the figures and wanting a better balance for the US Tough. The US, Mexico and Canada all entered into that agreement legally. Mexico has "taken"nothing from the Americans (almost all of those rust belt jobs went to Asia, BTW).
So, what's going on? Trump wants to re-negotiate all American trade, as is his right, I suppose. He strengthens his negotiating position if he deals with countries one-on-one , rather than with big trading blocks. In every case, The US is the strong, muscular one with most of the cards and their potential trading "partners" are more like supplicants, begging for some trade. Trump needs to break up the EU, so that he can leverage Britain, France, Germany in their much weaker, individual form. A strong, united E U is at least as powerful as the US and a much tougher partner to deal with. Of course he likes Brexit! Divide and conquer!. You are playing straight into his plan. You are America's competitor in most things, btw and he probably doesn't give two hoots about whatever you think that you bring to the table. Shatter the EU. Shatter NAFTA and deal with Mexico and Canada, separately. Both countries have very different trade needs and already, a wedge has been driven between the Canadian and Mexican partners, as Canada is ready to throw Mexico under the bus to keep Sauron's eye off of us, too. TPP? Trump is already arranging talks with each of the smaller, weaker members.
Divide and conquer.
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Curious Cdn
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Jan 27 2017, 11:51 PM
Post #712
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- The Buccaneer
- Jan 27 2017, 11:21 PM
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- Jan 27 2017, 11:10 PM
That worked ta, but I'm not sure of the point you're making esp as the clip is dated Oct 2015. How does it relate to the 'Luvvies' saying they would give accommodation to 'refugees' ? I'm a descendant of four sets of refugees. They came to the New World a LONG time ago, mind you and they were all ridiculously white.Two of those four groups had to escape to stay alive and this is where they found peace and prosperity. Refugees are the foundation of English Canada and of parts of the United States, as well. Trump is turning off the tap from certain countries citing the "terrorist threat" that they pose, even though no terrorist attacks have originated from any of the "bad guy list" countries. The 9/11 hijackers, however came form Saudi Arabia, mostly, The united Arab Emirates, next plus one Egyptian, one Lebanese. The Saudis, the Emirates ... not on the list, nor is Chechnya from whence the Boston Marathon bombers came from.
The Americans are buying the bullshyte but it's all Orwellian propaganda. You want to make America safe? Take their half billion frikkin' guns away , stupid!
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Rich
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Jan 27 2017, 11:54 PM
Post #713
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- The Buccaneer
- Jan 27 2017, 11:21 PM
- Rich
- Jan 27 2017, 11:10 PM
That worked ta, but I'm not sure of the point you're making esp as the clip is dated Oct 2015. How does it relate to the 'Luvvies' saying they would give accommodation to 'refugees' ? The thing is, here we have a minister for immigration being questioned by a man who was only too eager to embrace the immigration of Eastern Europeans to the UK and has also been found to have flawed principles.
So how he can accuse the minister of being evasive is hypocritical to me and as I have said on many an occasion, successive governments have publicly stated that they do not know how many bods are in this country.
That to me raises the question of how can you budget for the future other than guessing.?
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Curious Cdn
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Jan 27 2017, 11:57 PM
Post #714
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- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 04:53 PM
- Curious Cdn
- Jan 27 2017, 11:34 AM
- C-too
- Jan 27 2017, 08:28 AM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep----"There's nowt so queer as folk"----
I remember that insane lunatic Adolf Hitler almost being directly elected to power by the German people.
... and if there had been the sort of "push back" against Adolph Hitler as you are witnessing now against Trump, tens of millions of people would not have suffered hideous deaths.This guy is so wrong on so many levels that one has a moral obligation to fight against him.
Quixotes tilting at windmills. Would you like me to be your Sancho Panza? I would rather you be thoughtful.
My guess is that you are looking at the "100 Day Presidency"
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Rich
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Jan 28 2017, 12:16 AM
Post #715
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- Curious Cdn
- Jan 27 2017, 11:57 PM
- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 04:53 PM
- Curious Cdn
- Jan 27 2017, 11:34 AM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep----"There's nowt so queer as folk"----
Quixotes tilting at windmills. Would you like me to be your Sancho Panza?
I would rather you be thoughtful. My guess is that you are looking at the "100 Day Presidency" I have to say that after watching the press conference in full I can see nothing but good coming from this, I am very encouraged by the Presidents choice of words, the thing is, he IS willing to hold out the hand of friendship and co operation and it seems to me that the meeting in private seems to have been cordial to say the least.
IMO, the UK has nothing to fear from President Trump on first appearances and I would also add that our PM has certainly grown in stature during this meeting and will stand her in good stead in the House of Commons.
I am very optimistic for the future.
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Curious Cdn
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Jan 28 2017, 01:50 AM
Post #716
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- Rich
- Jan 28 2017, 12:16 AM
- Curious Cdn
- Jan 27 2017, 11:57 PM
- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 04:53 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep----"There's nowt so queer as folk"----
I would rather you be thoughtful. My guess is that you are looking at the "100 Day Presidency"
I have to say that after watching the press conference in full I can see nothing but good coming from this, I am very encouraged by the Presidents choice of words, the thing is, he IS willing to hold out the hand of friendship and co operation and it seems to me that the meeting in private seems to have been cordial to say the least. IMO, the UK has nothing to fear from President Trump on first appearances and I would also add that our PM has certainly grown in stature during this meeting and will stand her in good stead in the House of Commons. I am very optimistic for the future. You are not their trade partner.
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Affa
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Jan 28 2017, 01:55 AM
Post #717
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- The Buccaneer
- Jan 27 2017, 07:29 PM
- Affa
- Jan 27 2017, 07:01 PM
- Rich
- Jan 27 2017, 04:56 PM
So, where is the incentive to make your life more comfortable by accumulating wealth
An incentive to go to work five days a week to earn mo more than the Welfare system determines you require to live respectfully .......... to never earn enough to be comfortable, always waiting for the next pay day. And this weak incentive is all so that the investor with more money than he needs gets the best return from the efforts that these five days a week employees make for their existence. The situation is this - the wealthy one gets richer, the other will never get rich.
Did you read somewhere that life was fair ?
I've neither read nor believe that life is or should be fair, far from it. If you missed the point, as you frequently do regardless of who posts here, it was to answer the supposed acceptance that without 'incentives' (i.e, profits) investors wont invest. Yet mention paying workers a living wage (incentive) and suddenly none of it is affordable - insisting the economy would collapse. The opposite is the truth. Higher wages stimulates growth.
The economy is stagnating because consumerism is in decline due to folk having less disposable income. Back to the wealth gap ....... which is a chasm.
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C-too
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Jan 28 2017, 07:54 AM
Post #718
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- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 05:48 PM
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- Jan 27 2017, 05:23 PM
- Tytoalba
- Jan 27 2017, 05:13 PM
Quoting limited to 3 levels deep
It is not about what we can do, it is about facing up to the full reality of the situation. Turning a blind eye to relevant information, when it suits you to do so, totally lacks any trace of objectivity. Only putting down what you want to record in your little black book is not reality.
Reality is the status quo, and what happens tomorrow and in the future just like the reality of 'yesterday' where Trump was elected, and we voted for Brexit. For us to know the reality we are obliged to wait and see. Anything else is just speculation as to what may happen or what should be done. Perhaps someone will step forward and tell us how they will change anything? REALITY is the past and the present. We have knowledge of the past and we experience the present.
For us to know the FUTURE we will just have to wait and see.
Can you see how your words distorted reality ?
Just putting words together to suit an opinion lacks both insight and objectivity. Only seeing what we want to see would be dishonest.
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Lewis
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Jan 28 2017, 08:07 AM
Post #719
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- Tytoalba
- Jan 25 2017, 10:50 PM
- Lewis
- Jan 25 2017, 07:12 PM
Note that Donald Fart has today signed an 'executive order for the building of the Mexican Wall' and that Mexico is going to pay for it!
What delusions does this idiot have? There is a lesser chance of Mexico paying for it than seeing god!
But he is building the wall. Do you remember those that said it wouldn't happen? Saying that he will build that silly fucking wall and doing it in reality are two completely different things!
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Gnikkk
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Jan 28 2017, 08:25 AM
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Maybe someone has already said this but doesn't what Trump says ring true a lot of the time, do we not think the same? Do we care about terrorists rights? Wouldn't you like them to suffer badly, are they deserving of human rights given they would happily blow up your loved ones. Do we not build a wall/fence around immigrants wanting to enter our country through the tunnel? Once again democratic views are quashed because people wish to claim their values are better than the rest of us.
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