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Colts exposed
Topic Started: Oct 26 2014, 09:33 PM (287 Views)
MrCCCs
Pro Bowl'er
Some much for a top 10 defense.

There were only two receivers we had to stop, Brown and Miller. We left Miller alone so many times it was sickening. We never did double Brown, or if we did we did it very very poorly.

Absolutely no pass rush. I was disappointed to see Arthur Jones in there more than Kerr. But maybe I didn't see Kerr in as many times as I thought. Werner was doubled, and we had nobody else.

Our o-line is coached to drop back a couple of steps and then balance on their heels to absorb the bull rush. That's the only reason why I could imagine we get pushed back in the pocket so much. It has got to be poor coaching. Or maybe I'm just trying to make myself feel better. Cherilus gets beat a lot this year by an outside speed rush.

We were without Walden right? And then Davis went down, and then we fell apart. Butler was rusty (but those were horrible PI call on him and Gordy that led to points for them when we still had a chance). I can't imagine a worse pass defense than what was displayed tonight.

Run defense was fine, fwiw.

The only way we win the game is if Luck is perfect, but he threw another pick six and several poor throws that killed drives. Before I get flamed, I'm not blaming the offense but with our defense DOA we had to have a perfect game and we just don't do that. Can't believe we scored 34 points and lost by 17.



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IronPony1965
Pro Bowl'er
Steelers played like it was a super bowl. I watch them a lot. I was afraid this might happen. Every year they have a couple of games where they just wake up and go off. I was hoping they would have gotten that out of the way against the Texans and even told a friend of mine about it who is a steelers fan who actually agreed it was bound to happen.
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Posted ImageBent20
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Rusty? He plays every week. How many excuses can one guy get?
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IronPony1965
Pro Bowl'er
I dont even know of any excuses ive ever read for Butler. I do know i prefer him in the Nickle instead of outside on receivers.

Butler plays lights out in the nickle.
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Posted ImageBent20
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I've noted this several times, but he's only lights out if he can jam the guy at the line. Down field and in space, he struggles to stay with guys and is very slow.
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IronPony1965
Pro Bowl'er
Ya, hes good in press coverage. Its his strength.

Hes a nickle corner for a reason. If he could do what you asked, he would be a starting outside corner. Hes an aggressive, route jumping press coverage corner.

And call me crazy, but i am 99.9% sure weve benefited way more from that than he has hurt us.
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Posted ImageBent20
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He's looked like crap quite a bit this season. Last year, many here went on and on about how much better Butler was than Vaughn. OK, let's see it.
Edited by Bent20, Oct 26 2014, 11:49 PM.
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IronPony1965
Pro Bowl'er
He IS better than Vaughn lol

Butler is the least of our problems honestly.
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Coltny
Pro Bowl'er
I'm still trying to figure out what happened, and I really can't. I would think that on a BAD DAY, a good team, like the Colts, would give up around 30 points to a good opponent. But 51?

To me, giving up 51 is a total team meltdown, and how can that be? How can a talented team show up for a game and completely meltdown to such an extent, especially when you play once per week. I can see a team being tired at the end of a long road trip or something like, in other sports, but not being able to compete once a week on a short road trip - very strange.

I don't know how long Luck can take the abuse that he suffered. These just weren't hits - they were shots. The Steelers were trying to take him out. If that were Manning, I don't think that he would have gotten up. Luck has got to be sore this week.

I agree with the poster who said that the Colts need more 5-7 yard routes like the Steelers used, but that seems to be Reggie Wayne territory now, and obviously he wasn't there. I liked the idea of using Whalen over the middle that we saw late in the game, that's something that should be revisited if the TE's can't seem to get open, or are needed to block.

But overall, I'm shocked that the defense was so noncompetitive.
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Posted ImageBent20
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IronPony1965
Oct 27 2014, 12:10 AM
He IS better than Vaughn lol

Butler is the least of our problems honestly.
Might not be our biggest problem, but not the least. He's decent as nickel corner, not reliable as a backup corner. If he has to stay with someone, he doesn't have the speed to get it done.
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errsay
Pro Bowl'er
Marcus Burley
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TheDodo
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Coltny
Oct 27 2014, 01:58 AM
I don't know how long Luck can take the abuse that he suffered. These just weren't hits - they were shots. The Steelers were trying to take him out. If that were Manning, I don't think that he would have gotten up.
When did Manning turn into a fragile porcelain doll? This is the guy who missed one snap in his whole career before the neck injury, and to my knowledge hasn't missed any snaps due to injury since.
Edited by TheDodo, Oct 27 2014, 09:28 AM.
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errsay
Pro Bowl'er
Reality and perception
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JediColt
Pro Bowl'er
TheDodo
Oct 27 2014, 09:19 AM
Coltny
Oct 27 2014, 01:58 AM
I don't know how long Luck can take the abuse that he suffered. These just weren't hits - they were shots. The Steelers were trying to take him out. If that were Manning, I don't think that he would have gotten up.
When did Manning turn into a fragile porcelain doll? This is the guy who missed one snap in his whole career before the neck injury, and to my knowledge hasn't missed any snaps due to injury since.
Not only is he a fragile porcelain doll, but he's also a massive a-hole. Lots of revelations about Manning on this board.
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AustinColtsFan79
Pro Bowl'er
It looked like Butler stayed in the slot after Davis went out and Gordy came in on the outside. Gordy seemed to get roasted all day. He just doesn't have the skills that Davis and Toler do and can't play out there. I think you are probably right errsay, we should have cut Gordy and kept the young pair in Burley and Purifoy.

It is a little unfair to be too hard on our secondary though. Our pass rush never got home, and in our scheme that's a death sentence. It's just impossible to stay with a good receiver for 6 or 7 seconds at a time.

Also, anyone questioning how valuable Davis is to our defense can go back and watch this tape. It reminded me of our offense last year the first couple of weeks after Reggie went down.
Edited by AustinColtsFan79, Oct 27 2014, 11:02 AM.
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Posted ImageBent20
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I don't think they'll play Butler outside unless they absolutely have to because they understand his weaknesses.
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Posted ImageBodey
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TheDodo
Oct 27 2014, 09:19 AM
Coltny
Oct 27 2014, 01:58 AM
I don't know how long Luck can take the abuse that he suffered. These just weren't hits - they were shots. The Steelers were trying to take him out. If that were Manning, I don't think that he would have gotten up.
When did Manning turn into a fragile porcelain doll? This is the guy who missed one snap in his whole career before the neck injury, and to my knowledge hasn't missed any snaps due to injury since.
I don't think Manning would have taken as many hits as Luck did yesterday. One major difference between Luck and Manning is Luck will hold the ball move around and try to make a play down the field while Manning faced with that kind of pressure would have used a lot more dump offs or hit the dirt voluntarily to avoid the big hit.

And for the record I don't view Manning's occasional hitting the deck as a fault. It is smart on his part, especially taking into account that he is no spring chicken and has a surgically repaired neck.
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Gary1888
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Manning also spent a lot of time pre-snap communicating with the offensive line on blocking schemes and calling out different defenders on different positions.
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Hawkeyecolt
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This defense has serious problems creating a pass rush without blitzing. If teams pick up what the Colts are doing in their blitz package, it looks a lot like yesterday's game. The difference is that in most games, the Colts got enough pressure for a quarter or two which allowed Luck and Co. to score enough.
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errsay
Pro Bowl'er
Most 3-4 teams blitz alot to create the desired pressure. They have to, obviously. I wondered when Mathis' absence would be evident, and yesterday was a prime example. Now it looks like Walden will be out for a bit. Not great news by any means. But Vontae should be back next week. Time for Werner, Newsome and Jones to step up.
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Coltny
Pro Bowl'er
TheDodo
Oct 27 2014, 09:19 AM
Coltny
Oct 27 2014, 01:58 AM
I don't know how long Luck can take the abuse that he suffered. These just weren't hits - they were shots. The Steelers were trying to take him out. If that were Manning, I don't think that he would have gotten up.
When did Manning turn into a fragile porcelain doll? This is the guy who missed one snap in his whole career before the neck injury, and to my knowledge hasn't missed any snaps due to injury since.
I am talking about about Manning vs Luck right now.

Yes, Manning has been a tough player throughout his career, I've NEVER said that he wasn't, but now at his age and his being post neck surgery, I'd be wincing pretty heavily seeing him take the shots that Luck takes (and took on Sunday). I wince watching Luck get hit, and he's a young stud built like a linebacker.

Common sense tells me that a player of Manning's age, with the mileage that he has on his body, is at a greater risk when taking such physical abuse, which is why, as already noted here, he gets rid of the ball so quickly so that he doesn't have to take a pounding.
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LACOLTSFAN
Pro Bowl'er
Coltny
Oct 28 2014, 12:02 AM


Yes, Manning has been a tough player throughout his career, I've NEVER said that he wasn't, but now at his age and his being post neck surgery, I'd be wincing pretty heavily seeing him take the shots that Luck takes (and took on Sunday). I wince watching Luck get hit, and he's a young stud built like a linebacker.

Common sense tells me that a player of Manning's age, with the mileage that he has on his body, is at a greater risk when taking such physical abuse, which is why, as already noted here, he gets rid of the ball so quickly so that he doesn't have to take a pounding.
I agree. Peyton is as tough as they come, but he is only human. A body in its 20's heals much better than a body in its late 30's.

I would hate to see anyone with a neck fusion take the hits Andrew has in the past 3 years.

One thing though: Peyton gets the ball out quicker than Andrew because his reads are so fast. He also does not throw the ball down the field as much as Andrew. So Peyton does not get hit as much.
Edited by LACOLTSFAN, Oct 28 2014, 12:35 AM.
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Weatherman
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Remember this?

http://articles.philly.com/2001-11-13/sports/25321757_1_ankle-ligament-peyton-manning-colts-linebacker-mike-peterson
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Coltny
Pro Bowl'er
Andrew Luck's competitiveness earns Steelers' respect


Check out article in ESPN.com NFL Colts section
Weatherman
Oct 28 2014, 06:30 PM
Yes, that was thirteen years ago before neck surgery, perhaps that's what caused his neck problems.

Hopefully, he will not get hit like that again.
Edited by Coltny, Oct 29 2014, 01:07 AM.
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Posted ImageBent20
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Is this the "respect" article you're referencing:

http://espn.go.com/blog/indianapolis-colts/post/_/id/8570/andrew-lucks-competitiveness-earns-respect-of-steelers?ex_cid=espnapi_public

Despite Manning's obvious toughness, many defenses didn't/don't like he and Brady because they think they are protected too much. It's a dumb argument, but I've heard it from Raven, Steeler and Bear fans over the years, as well as the players.
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Coltny
Pro Bowl'er
Bent20
Oct 29 2014, 11:49 AM
Is this the "respect" article you're referencing:

http://espn.go.com/blog/indianapolis-colts/post/_/id/8570/andrew-lucks-competitiveness-earns-respect-of-steelers?ex_cid=espnapi_public

Despite Manning's obvious toughness, many defenses didn't/don't like he and Brady because they think they are protected too much. It's a dumb argument, but I've heard it from Raven, Steeler and Bear fans over the years, as well as the players.
Yes, thanks for the link. :nod:
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