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What is Moyes smoking?
Topic Started: Jan 14 2014, 09:43 AM (1,108 Views)
cruyff_turn
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Vidal is just another example of a player that would probably bite off his own hand to play for Ferguson, but couldn't be arsed for Moyes.
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anelka_henry
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dream_team
Jan 14 2014, 12:08 PM
anelka_henry
Jan 14 2014, 09:58 AM
I think it's perfectly understandable! This is a guy who has failed to land most of his desired targets as such I think it will be best for him to try and move in before the real giants do.
That his main problem, his desired targets are ridiculous. I mean which coach is naive enough to think after barca sold one of their assets in Thiago, they would sell another one in fabregas for a mere £25m and then go into the season relying on 34 yr old Xavi and iniesta.
Why should Moyes base his decisions on assumptions? He isn't going to know Barca's financial position or objectives - he cannot hold back on his desires because he assumes Barca don't need the money or Barca need Fabregas more than the money. All he has to do is put the ball in Barca's court: it's up to them to deny or accept his offer based on whatever consideration they make.
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Gooner0893

Moyes is in the market haggling over transfer fees as if he is the coach of Everton, not United. Teams negotiate with you based on the club you represent. Teams expect Clubs like City, Chelsea, united, real, Barca etc to pay the premium fees for players. The poor guy has a lot to learn.
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cruyff_turn
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Gooner0893
Jan 14 2014, 06:25 PM
Moyes is in the market haggling over transfer fees as if he is the coach of Everton, not United. Teams negotiate with you based on the club you represent. Teams expect Clubs like City, Chelsea, united, real, Barca etc to pay the premium fees for players. The poor guy has a lot to learn.
Penny-pinching isn't Moyes' problem, it's profile.
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dream_team
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anelka_henry
Jan 14 2014, 05:48 PM
dream_team
Jan 14 2014, 12:08 PM
anelka_henry
Jan 14 2014, 09:58 AM
I think it's perfectly understandable! This is a guy who has failed to land most of his desired targets as such I think it will be best for him to try and move in before the real giants do.
That his main problem, his desired targets are ridiculous. I mean which coach is naive enough to think after barca sold one of their assets in Thiago, they would sell another one in fabregas for a mere £25m and then go into the season relying on 34 yr old Xavi and iniesta.
Why should Moyes base his decisions on assumptions? He isn't going to know Barca's financial position or objectives - he cannot hold back on his desires because he assumes Barca don't need the money or Barca need Fabregas more than the money. All he has to do is put the ball in Barca's court: it's up to them to deny or accept his offer based on whatever consideration they make.
Let get this straight Moyes knew before the start of the season thinks they are clearly in need of a midfielder, he knew the signing of a midfielder is very vital

I believe most coaches would have a rough Idea of their chances of landing a particular target especially if it a popular one like cesc unless they want to be a simpleton. These coaches would normally have about 1 or 2 backup plan if these signing isn't successful, and if their situation is similar to that of united where the midfield needs urgent attention, they'll have up to 3 or 4 back up players whom they would pursue ON TIME not 48 hrs before close of summer transfer window. In the case of Moyes he had 3 months of transfer window, Chased Cesc for like one and half months and few days before the end of transfer window he made a late bid for his only back up, that doesn't look wise to me.

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dream_team
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cruyff_turn
Jan 14 2014, 05:04 PM
Vidal is just another example of a player that would probably bite off his own hand to play for Ferguson, but couldn't be arsed for Moyes.
How did you come to that conclusion?
1) This is January, this is not summer
2) United are 7th now and look no where near a world beater (thanks to Moyes btw), they were not 7th under Fergie.
3) This isn't about Moyes reputation or pedigree, this is about
i) like 0893 said bidding the right amount, ESPN reports that Moyes is trying to use an injured player (Nani) as a bait for this deal.(a big LOL to that
ii)Biding at the right time, bid at the beginning of the season not summer, I can't remember the last time Fergie signed a big name in January was he sleeping in from June to August, when all his focus was on Cesc and Baines.
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dream_team
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cruyff_turn
Jan 14 2014, 06:33 PM
Gooner0893
Jan 14 2014, 06:25 PM
Moyes is in the market haggling over transfer fees as if he is the coach of Everton, not United. Teams negotiate with you based on the club you represent. Teams expect Clubs like City, Chelsea, united, real, Barca etc to pay the premium fees for players. The poor guy has a lot to learn.
Penny-pinching isn't Moyes' problem, it's profile.
it's not profile, what profile did mark hughes have to sign Tevez in 2009? or the likes of Kompany and Zabaleta in 2008? or Allegri to sign balotelli?
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cruyff_turn
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Piz, you got a hard-on for an argument or something? All I'm saying is these continentals probably don't even know Moyes, who was willing to splash out cash big-time for Anders Herrera or Cesc Fabregas. Hell, he even waited past the release clause to get Fellaini. He's not pinching pennies. The problem is no one wants to play for him. Your Citeh references are a bit out of place. Tevez is a lunatic with handlers and Kompany and Zabaleta weren't established stars, certainly not at the profile of a Vidal or Pogba. Anyways, Citeh had just been purchased at the time and were going big on P.R. with the "interesting project" idea and were throwing around absurd cash. Allegri won the Serie A three seasons ago, but besides that, that move was just about Balotelli going home. Moyes hasn't won anything in his career as a manager. You really don't think profile has anything to do with it?

FWIW, I'm speaking in hypotheticals, because I severely doubt the veracity (and the details) of that United-Juventus transfer story. United pisses Pogba away and then tries to throw big money at him? I doubt it.
Edited by cruyff_turn, Jan 14 2014, 07:13 PM.
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phatosas

Moyes attempt to sign Pogba and Chelsea's attempt to sign Matic are actually very similar. These are players that were previously at the club, given away and then having to pay big money to get them back. They would even solve a problem that both sides seem to have right now, having a presence in the center of the midfield. Anyway I think every player has a price and while it would be a bit more difficult to deal with Juve than Benfica, if United pay the right price Juve would sell at least one or both of those players. Juve are 8 points ahead on the table and are out of the Champions League. Selling a player for a high transfer fee is certainly not out of the question.
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anelka_henry
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dream_team
Jan 14 2014, 06:43 PM
anelka_henry
Jan 14 2014, 05:48 PM
dream_team
Jan 14 2014, 12:08 PM
anelka_henry
Jan 14 2014, 09:58 AM
I think it's perfectly understandable! This is a guy who has failed to land most of his desired targets as such I think it will be best for him to try and move in before the real giants do.
That his main problem, his desired targets are ridiculous. I mean which coach is naive enough to think after barca sold one of their assets in Thiago, they would sell another one in fabregas for a mere £25m and then go into the season relying on 34 yr old Xavi and iniesta.
Why should Moyes base his decisions on assumptions? He isn't going to know Barca's financial position or objectives - he cannot hold back on his desires because he assumes Barca don't need the money or Barca need Fabregas more than the money. All he has to do is put the ball in Barca's court: it's up to them to deny or accept his offer based on whatever consideration they make.
Let get this straight Moyes knew before the start of the season thinks they are clearly in need of a midfielder, he knew the signing of a midfielder is very vital

I believe most coaches would have a rough Idea of their chances of landing a particular target especially if it a popular one like cesc unless they want to be a simpleton. These coaches would normally have about 1 or 2 backup plan if these signing isn't successful, and if their situation is similar to that of united where the midfield needs urgent attention, they'll have up to 3 or 4 back up players whom they would pursue ON TIME not 48 hrs before close of summer transfer window. In the case of Moyes he had 3 months of transfer window, Chased Cesc for like one and half months and few days before the end of transfer window he made a late bid for his only back up, that doesn't look wise to me.

If you think 'most coaches have an idea of their chances' why then are you ridiculing Moyes for attempting, say, on Pogba this early? I don't want to sound like I'm spinning it but if you consider that Pogba was at United, who knows he might have something to prove by returning and Moyes could be banking on that. On the other hand, as Phato puts it "every player has a price" surely depending on how committed Moyes is a transfer is not out of this world as you alleges.

Right now, Moyes is shot on pedigree, Hughes wasn't an unknown quantity as Moyes is and to make matters worse United hasn't really delivered stellar performances. That means Moyes has to work harder in the transfer market if he's to land quality signings. The early bird syndrome applies here more than anywhere. His clout (or lack of) isn't helping and he needs to do more than stick to tradition. If he waits til everyone enters the market he relinguishes a 'competitive advantage'.
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