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Gary Neville continues to criticise us
Topic Started: Aug 30 2015, 07:50 AM (468 Views)
billabog5
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Joe Bobs Fine Foods
Sep 11 2015, 01:41 PM
billabog5
Sep 11 2015, 01:39 PM
Joe Bobs Fine Foods
Sep 11 2015, 01:36 PM
SadlerTheKing
Sep 11 2015, 07:07 AM
supercollider7
Sep 3 2015, 09:01 AM
Gary Neville is starting to believe his own hype, saying Arsenal players are "soft" and chelsea players need to be "slapped around." Stick to analyzing games. I hate it when pundits try to act like psychologists or pretend they know better than the managers. Explain the game to us, no one wants to hear your subjective opinions.

We lack pace and power? Has he not seen Walcott, Welbeck, Ox play? The latter two are pretty explosive as well. Power and pace.

And if anything Wenger has sacrificed some of our attacking fluency by making room for Coquelin in the team, and we have been one of the best defences since. Michael Cox had a much better analysis of the situation in the team.

And Kamy, the leader on the pitch doesn't have to be the designated captain. You need more than one leader out there anyway. During games we have Cech, Mertesacker who are the captains. Arteta is almost a coach-player at this point and Wenger wants him to be the leader on the training ground and to help the younger players. He's a future manager, Arteta.
Actually you would be surprised at how many people DO want to hear Neville's opinion on these kind of things. That's why he is asked his opinion so often. You probably want to hear it too, but because he didn't kiss your managers ass the way you do, you've decided to pick and chose which opinions you want to hear. As for your rebuttal to what Neville said, you are living in a dream world where Wenger farts unicorns and rainbows. Your defense is that of a top 4 team, just like the rest of your squad. You are good. That's it. No ambition to win. This is proven year after year. Your ambition is to finish in the top 4 and make money. That's it. And that's the squad that is put out on the field each and every week. Neville is absolutely correct when he points out your flaws and that you keep repeating the same mistakes over and over again and only a "Wengerite" would refuse to see that...
As opposed to United, where player purchases in recent years equate to the GDP of medium sized nations, but nobody can figure out exactly WHAT is going on.
But you can at least see ambition at Utd joe. The methodology may need altering. but its a matter of when, not if, Utd climb back to the summit . With Arsenal its a case of just hanging on 7 hoping those above fall
Yes, Bill, eventually you'll spend so much money on players that a title will be inevitable.

You must be so proud.
Since when have my feelings & pride been relevant to Arsenals lack of ambition ?
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Joe Bobs Fine Foods
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billabog5
Sep 11 2015, 02:39 PM
Joe Bobs Fine Foods
Sep 11 2015, 01:41 PM
billabog5
Sep 11 2015, 01:39 PM
Joe Bobs Fine Foods
Sep 11 2015, 01:36 PM
SadlerTheKing
Sep 11 2015, 07:07 AM
supercollider7
Sep 3 2015, 09:01 AM
Gary Neville is starting to believe his own hype, saying Arsenal players are "soft" and chelsea players need to be "slapped around." Stick to analyzing games. I hate it when pundits try to act like psychologists or pretend they know better than the managers. Explain the game to us, no one wants to hear your subjective opinions.

We lack pace and power? Has he not seen Walcott, Welbeck, Ox play? The latter two are pretty explosive as well. Power and pace.

And if anything Wenger has sacrificed some of our attacking fluency by making room for Coquelin in the team, and we have been one of the best defences since. Michael Cox had a much better analysis of the situation in the team.

And Kamy, the leader on the pitch doesn't have to be the designated captain. You need more than one leader out there anyway. During games we have Cech, Mertesacker who are the captains. Arteta is almost a coach-player at this point and Wenger wants him to be the leader on the training ground and to help the younger players. He's a future manager, Arteta.
Actually you would be surprised at how many people DO want to hear Neville's opinion on these kind of things. That's why he is asked his opinion so often. You probably want to hear it too, but because he didn't kiss your managers ass the way you do, you've decided to pick and chose which opinions you want to hear. As for your rebuttal to what Neville said, you are living in a dream world where Wenger farts unicorns and rainbows. Your defense is that of a top 4 team, just like the rest of your squad. You are good. That's it. No ambition to win. This is proven year after year. Your ambition is to finish in the top 4 and make money. That's it. And that's the squad that is put out on the field each and every week. Neville is absolutely correct when he points out your flaws and that you keep repeating the same mistakes over and over again and only a "Wengerite" would refuse to see that...
As opposed to United, where player purchases in recent years equate to the GDP of medium sized nations, but nobody can figure out exactly WHAT is going on.
But you can at least see ambition at Utd joe. The methodology may need altering. but its a matter of when, not if, Utd climb back to the summit . With Arsenal its a case of just hanging on 7 hoping those above fall
Yes, Bill, eventually you'll spend so much money on players that a title will be inevitable.

You must be so proud.
Since when have my feelings & pride been relevant to Arsenals lack of ambition ?
Since when has Arsenal's ambition been relevant to you?
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jays712
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cruyff_turn
Sep 11 2015, 02:28 PM
jays712
Sep 11 2015, 09:51 AM
It does matter. Having fear of an opponent physically absolutely gives one team an edge over another. Think of all the times we played against Stoke under Pulis. A totally inferior opponent that would give us fits cuz we were getting knocked around and it would get into the players heads. How else do u explain dropping points to that shit team of Neaderthals? The build up to every match against them was all about them being physical with us and could we handle it. That's actually been the build up to many matches against many opponents we've played.

And stop bringing up Bayern and especially Barca and trying to compare those squads to us. There's no comparison to make. When u have one of the greatest players ever in Messi and a squad full of players that would be the best player on 99% of all other teams, u can play however the hell u want and think ur gonna win.

When was the last time Tony Pulis managed Stoke? The point that Trees is making is that Neville's criticism at the point seems pretty misguided. He's right.
Just making the point that a physically imposing player or team can intimidate and defeat a much more skilled player or team just through blunt force. Forgot how Drogba routinely made us his bitch by physically dominating our entire defense?

There is some more bite to our current team. I'm in agreement there. Is there a take charge, kick ass leader here? No.

I do think that Neville having to tangle with tough players like Viera, Adams, Dixon, etc in an Arsenal kit is clouding things a bit.
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cruyff_turn
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jays712
Sep 11 2015, 02:51 PM
cruyff_turn
Sep 11 2015, 02:28 PM
jays712
Sep 11 2015, 09:51 AM
It does matter. Having fear of an opponent physically absolutely gives one team an edge over another. Think of all the times we played against Stoke under Pulis. A totally inferior opponent that would give us fits cuz we were getting knocked around and it would get into the players heads. How else do u explain dropping points to that shit team of Neaderthals? The build up to every match against them was all about them being physical with us and could we handle it. That's actually been the build up to many matches against many opponents we've played.

And stop bringing up Bayern and especially Barca and trying to compare those squads to us. There's no comparison to make. When u have one of the greatest players ever in Messi and a squad full of players that would be the best player on 99% of all other teams, u can play however the hell u want and think ur gonna win.

When was the last time Tony Pulis managed Stoke? The point that Trees is making is that Neville's criticism at the point seems pretty misguided. He's right.
Just making the point that a physically imposing player or team can intimidate and defeat a much more skilled player or team just through blunt force. Forgot how Drogba routinely made us his bitch by physically dominating our entire defense?

There is some more bite to our current team. I'm in agreement there. Is there a take charge, kick ass leader here? No.

I do think that Neville having to tangle with tough players like Viera, Adams, Dixon, etc in an Arsenal kit is clouding things a bit.
I'm wondering who the "take charge, kick ass leader" of the last three EPL champions is.
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jays712
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cruyff_turn
Sep 11 2015, 03:00 PM
I'm wondering who the "take charge, kick ass leader" of the last three EPL champions is.
Terry, Yaya and Kompany, that ManU team still had Vidic, Rio, and Rooney. Not to mention SAF psyching out teams on the touch line.

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billabog5
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Joe Bobs Fine Foods
Sep 11 2015, 02:41 PM
billabog5
Sep 11 2015, 02:39 PM
Joe Bobs Fine Foods
Sep 11 2015, 01:41 PM
billabog5
Sep 11 2015, 01:39 PM
Joe Bobs Fine Foods
Sep 11 2015, 01:36 PM
SadlerTheKing
Sep 11 2015, 07:07 AM
supercollider7
Sep 3 2015, 09:01 AM
Gary Neville is starting to believe his own hype, saying Arsenal players are "soft" and chelsea players need to be "slapped around." Stick to analyzing games. I hate it when pundits try to act like psychologists or pretend they know better than the managers. Explain the game to us, no one wants to hear your subjective opinions.

We lack pace and power? Has he not seen Walcott, Welbeck, Ox play? The latter two are pretty explosive as well. Power and pace.

And if anything Wenger has sacrificed some of our attacking fluency by making room for Coquelin in the team, and we have been one of the best defences since. Michael Cox had a much better analysis of the situation in the team.

And Kamy, the leader on the pitch doesn't have to be the designated captain. You need more than one leader out there anyway. During games we have Cech, Mertesacker who are the captains. Arteta is almost a coach-player at this point and Wenger wants him to be the leader on the training ground and to help the younger players. He's a future manager, Arteta.
Actually you would be surprised at how many people DO want to hear Neville's opinion on these kind of things. That's why he is asked his opinion so often. You probably want to hear it too, but because he didn't kiss your managers ass the way you do, you've decided to pick and chose which opinions you want to hear. As for your rebuttal to what Neville said, you are living in a dream world where Wenger farts unicorns and rainbows. Your defense is that of a top 4 team, just like the rest of your squad. You are good. That's it. No ambition to win. This is proven year after year. Your ambition is to finish in the top 4 and make money. That's it. And that's the squad that is put out on the field each and every week. Neville is absolutely correct when he points out your flaws and that you keep repeating the same mistakes over and over again and only a "Wengerite" would refuse to see that...
As opposed to United, where player purchases in recent years equate to the GDP of medium sized nations, but nobody can figure out exactly WHAT is going on.
But you can at least see ambition at Utd joe. The methodology may need altering. but its a matter of when, not if, Utd climb back to the summit . With Arsenal its a case of just hanging on 7 hoping those above fall
Yes, Bill, eventually you'll spend so much money on players that a title will be inevitable.

You must be so proud.
Since when have my feelings & pride been relevant to Arsenals lack of ambition ?
Since when has Arsenal's ambition been relevant to you?
Seeing as this discussion is about Arsenal & its failings & not about my pride then I would say the causes for Arsenal's failings are very relevant here

Over to you
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SadlerTheKing
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Joe Bobs Fine Foods
Sep 11 2015, 01:41 PM
billabog5
Sep 11 2015, 01:39 PM
Joe Bobs Fine Foods
Sep 11 2015, 01:36 PM
SadlerTheKing
Sep 11 2015, 07:07 AM
supercollider7
Sep 3 2015, 09:01 AM
Gary Neville is starting to believe his own hype, saying Arsenal players are "soft" and chelsea players need to be "slapped around." Stick to analyzing games. I hate it when pundits try to act like psychologists or pretend they know better than the managers. Explain the game to us, no one wants to hear your subjective opinions.

We lack pace and power? Has he not seen Walcott, Welbeck, Ox play? The latter two are pretty explosive as well. Power and pace.

And if anything Wenger has sacrificed some of our attacking fluency by making room for Coquelin in the team, and we have been one of the best defences since. Michael Cox had a much better analysis of the situation in the team.

And Kamy, the leader on the pitch doesn't have to be the designated captain. You need more than one leader out there anyway. During games we have Cech, Mertesacker who are the captains. Arteta is almost a coach-player at this point and Wenger wants him to be the leader on the training ground and to help the younger players. He's a future manager, Arteta.
Actually you would be surprised at how many people DO want to hear Neville's opinion on these kind of things. That's why he is asked his opinion so often. You probably want to hear it too, but because he didn't kiss your managers ass the way you do, you've decided to pick and chose which opinions you want to hear. As for your rebuttal to what Neville said, you are living in a dream world where Wenger farts unicorns and rainbows. Your defense is that of a top 4 team, just like the rest of your squad. You are good. That's it. No ambition to win. This is proven year after year. Your ambition is to finish in the top 4 and make money. That's it. And that's the squad that is put out on the field each and every week. Neville is absolutely correct when he points out your flaws and that you keep repeating the same mistakes over and over again and only a "Wengerite" would refuse to see that...
As opposed to United, where player purchases in recent years equate to the GDP of medium sized nations, but nobody can figure out exactly WHAT is going on.
But you can at least see ambition at Utd joe. The methodology may need altering. but its a matter of when, not if, Utd climb back to the summit . With Arsenal its a case of just hanging on 7 hoping those above fall
Yes, Bill, eventually you'll spend so much money on players that a title will be inevitable.

You must be so proud.
It's money earned. If it's not put back into the club then it's in Glazer's pocket. What would you prefer? Actually, that's a silly question. You're a gooner and a wengerite. You think money earned is more important than silverware...I don't
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supercollider7
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SadlerTheKing
Sep 11 2015, 07:07 AM
supercollider7
Sep 3 2015, 09:01 AM
Gary Neville is starting to believe his own hype, saying Arsenal players are "soft" and chelsea players need to be "slapped around." Stick to analyzing games. I hate it when pundits try to act like psychologists or pretend they know better than the managers. Explain the game to us, no one wants to hear your subjective opinions.

We lack pace and power? Has he not seen Walcott, Welbeck, Ox play? The latter two are pretty explosive as well. Power and pace.

And if anything Wenger has sacrificed some of our attacking fluency by making room for Coquelin in the team, and we have been one of the best defences since. Michael Cox had a much better analysis of the situation in the team.

And Kamy, the leader on the pitch doesn't have to be the designated captain. You need more than one leader out there anyway. During games we have Cech, Mertesacker who are the captains. Arteta is almost a coach-player at this point and Wenger wants him to be the leader on the training ground and to help the younger players. He's a future manager, Arteta.
Actually you would be surprised at how many people DO want to hear Neville's opinion on these kind of things. That's why he is asked his opinion so often. You probably want to hear it too, but because he didn't kiss your managers ass the way you do, you've decided to pick and chose which opinions you want to hear. As for your rebuttal to what Neville said, you are living in a dream world where Wenger farts unicorns and rainbows. Your defense is that of a top 4 team, just like the rest of your squad. You are good. That's it. No ambition to win. This is proven year after year. Your ambition is to finish in the top 4 and make money. That's it. And that's the squad that is put out on the field each and every week. Neville is absolutely correct when he points out your flaws and that you keep repeating the same mistakes over and over again and only a "Wengerite" would refuse to see that...
I'm a fan of Gary Neville. I watch Monday Night Football religiously every week.

But I'd prefer it if these "analysts" stuck to analyzing the game and not trying to force their subjective opinion into the show.
He just sort of went on a rant that had nothing to do with anything on the Arsenal vs Liverpool game. And then I'm sure there's a better explanation to Chelsea's form than "the players need to be slapped around." Come on.


And I don't get comparing teams from now to 10 years ago. He was comparing Chelsea and Arsenal to their title winning teams in 04 and 05. Football has changed a lot in that time. His idea that Mourinho has come in and done basically the same thing he did in 2004-05 couldn't be further from the truth. It's a different setup and different way of playing.
In 2005 Mourinho actually said that Robben doesn't have to defend, he can stay high up because Makelele will cover for him. In 2014, he criticized Hazard for not defending well enough. That is just one example of how things have changed.

As for adding power and pace to the team, of course we'd love to have another Vieira or Gilberto or Petit type midfielder.
Wenger last year actually said that this team lacked a Vieira or Petit type player, who had great physical presence and technical ability.
The thing is, there's very few players like that out there, which is what made Vieira and Petit such a tremendous partnership. It's easy to find big and tall players, but to be a genius on the ball as well is a different matter.

But there's more than one way of setting up a good team. Coquelin gives us that ball winning ability and if you've got Cazorla and Ramsey in there then he doesn't need to be a brilliant passer. But if we are missing something it is that kind of playmaking from deep that Arteta gave us, which makes including coquelin a tactical headache.

I would have preferred if Neville, Carragher, and Henry talked about that. Which is why I said I preferred Michael Cox's take on our problems right now because he actually hit the nail on the head.
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santry_gooner
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Fuck Gary Neville. And if you have anything left over fuck all people who start threads about him.
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SadlerTheKing
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supercollider7
Sep 14 2015, 09:03 AM
SadlerTheKing
Sep 11 2015, 07:07 AM
supercollider7
Sep 3 2015, 09:01 AM
Gary Neville is starting to believe his own hype, saying Arsenal players are "soft" and chelsea players need to be "slapped around." Stick to analyzing games. I hate it when pundits try to act like psychologists or pretend they know better than the managers. Explain the game to us, no one wants to hear your subjective opinions.

We lack pace and power? Has he not seen Walcott, Welbeck, Ox play? The latter two are pretty explosive as well. Power and pace.

And if anything Wenger has sacrificed some of our attacking fluency by making room for Coquelin in the team, and we have been one of the best defences since. Michael Cox had a much better analysis of the situation in the team.

And Kamy, the leader on the pitch doesn't have to be the designated captain. You need more than one leader out there anyway. During games we have Cech, Mertesacker who are the captains. Arteta is almost a coach-player at this point and Wenger wants him to be the leader on the training ground and to help the younger players. He's a future manager, Arteta.
Actually you would be surprised at how many people DO want to hear Neville's opinion on these kind of things. That's why he is asked his opinion so often. You probably want to hear it too, but because he didn't kiss your managers ass the way you do, you've decided to pick and chose which opinions you want to hear. As for your rebuttal to what Neville said, you are living in a dream world where Wenger farts unicorns and rainbows. Your defense is that of a top 4 team, just like the rest of your squad. You are good. That's it. No ambition to win. This is proven year after year. Your ambition is to finish in the top 4 and make money. That's it. And that's the squad that is put out on the field each and every week. Neville is absolutely correct when he points out your flaws and that you keep repeating the same mistakes over and over again and only a "Wengerite" would refuse to see that...
I'm a fan of Gary Neville. I watch Monday Night Football religiously every week.

But I'd prefer it if these "analysts" stuck to analyzing the game and not trying to force their subjective opinion into the show.
He just sort of went on a rant that had nothing to do with anything on the Arsenal vs Liverpool game. And then I'm sure there's a better explanation to Chelsea's form than "the players need to be slapped around." Come on.


And I don't get comparing teams from now to 10 years ago. He was comparing Chelsea and Arsenal to their title winning teams in 04 and 05. Football has changed a lot in that time. His idea that Mourinho has come in and done basically the same thing he did in 2004-05 couldn't be further from the truth. It's a different setup and different way of playing.
In 2005 Mourinho actually said that Robben doesn't have to defend, he can stay high up because Makelele will cover for him. In 2014, he criticized Hazard for not defending well enough. That is just one example of how things have changed.

As for adding power and pace to the team, of course we'd love to have another Vieira or Gilberto or Petit type midfielder.
Wenger last year actually said that this team lacked a Vieira or Petit type player, who had great physical presence and technical ability.
The thing is, there's very few players like that out there, which is what made Vieira and Petit such a tremendous partnership. It's easy to find big and tall players, but to be a genius on the ball as well is a different matter.

But there's more than one way of setting up a good team. Coquelin gives us that ball winning ability and if you've got Cazorla and Ramsey in there then he doesn't need to be a brilliant passer. But if we are missing something it is that kind of playmaking from deep that Arteta gave us, which makes including coquelin a tactical headache.

I would have preferred if Neville, Carragher, and Henry talked about that. Which is why I said I preferred Michael Cox's take on our problems right now because he actually hit the nail on the head.
You're right. This team is set to win and Neville is crazy. Next time he comes on I suggest you just change the channel just like the other 20 million people do whenever he decides to force his opinion on us
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