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| VS System 2PCG info released | |
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| Tweet Topic Started: May 27 2015, 12:20 AM (25,999 Views) | |
| plaid_warlock | Jul 2 2015, 03:13 PM Post #376 |
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I like the Storm MC though I was expecting something more from her second ability after she levels up. The way she gets XP is good though. I feel like the best MC's will be the ones whose method of gaining XP requires the least interaction with your opponent. Star Lord is a perfect example of this theory. There's nothing, so far, that can stop a player from recruiting characters so you'll be able to level him up quickly without any opposition from your opponent. Storm fits into that same model although she's slightly more difficult to level up than Star Lord. |
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| Speedy92286 | Jul 2 2015, 03:24 PM Post #377 |
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I would argue Storm's is easier with the right deck. If you get two blue locations and a wild, or two wild and one blue you level her up on the spot. However if you run a deck that uses supporting characters that also use different color resources (like colossus) but early game you will be level 2 faster than the rest. Starlord requires you to have a yellow or a wild card while in the right deck Storm can use blue, wild or whatever else another sc on your side has. As for her ability, flight is huge in this new format and is a cry to her old cards. I love it. |
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| x_chan | Jul 2 2015, 04:01 PM Post #378 |
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Facebook page delates all negative comments. So it's obviously happy land there. As for your comment on locations. I don't disagree that the new energy cards are a good addition to the new VS2 game. It gives new ways to strategy (even when they are a clear copy of other games), like create color based decks instead of team based decks. It could be interesting. Why I don't get is how can discard a "location" makes sense, or what the need of a resource row if nothing in it is going to be passive. I really doubt we will see ongoing plot twists or passive locations, or any other kind of resource row manipulation. They seem to focus on the board and your hand now, which is not necessarily a bad thing for this game. It's seems more accessible this way and addresses the second hand problem that seem a big issue for a lot of people. I would have been really happy if they had eliminated the resource row completelly and focused on the hand and board even more. It seems the game wants to do so by allowing to discard your locations from hand (I still don't get how that's flavourful), so why not enfasize it even farther and create energy cards instead? There are other ways to keep up with your resources (like giving hero points each round). They could have had a rule card/resource card similar to Netrunner's. Where you have the game phases described. Draw phase could be: - Draw 2 cards. - Discard one to get a hero point (only once per turn). Build phase: - Spend your hero points to recruit heroes (once used, you can't used them again util next turn). - Formation step. Combat phase: - Do any number of attacks. Recovery phase: - Recover all your heroes. I don't see how something like that wouldn't have been a better aproach, and could have made the game a lot more flavourful. The desitions are still there regarding when and how to use your energy, you have an option to not follow the curve if you draw everything you needed, and there's no additional row that overly complicated stuff for no reasons. |
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| BatHulk | Jul 2 2015, 04:05 PM Post #379 |
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It's also a tracking mechanism, 4 cards in your resource row, 4 points. And, who knows if later on, the number of cards in your resource row triggers something else (like in Vs 1.0). Plus, they decided to use it for Locations, which makes sense on where to place them if Locations are going to be a secondary resource system (although I still question why they chose to do that).
Just because you have a resource row doesn't take away from the focus of combat. Additionally, it gives you more space to put the "energy" locations so you won't need to discard from hand. I disagree it would make the game more solid. Wow does it (and as someone mentioned, so did Duel Masters).
This I can agree with. Until Mandel goes into the philosophy of it, I can only think of a few reasons to do this: 1. Introducing more randomness to allow a more level playing field 2. Applying a theme/color like they tried to do with Mutant traits While I think they could have used a different card type to make it more flavorful (like Trait Card), using Location was probably the easiest since that card type already exists, it makes sense to place them in the resource row and it has some connection with Vs 1.0 (although very distant). |
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| BatHulk | Jul 2 2015, 04:12 PM Post #380 |
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@x_chan: I'm with Plaid_Warlock. You keep comparing this to a digital card game but how do you propose keeping track of your resource points each turn? Dice? Counters? The point is it's easier to track with your "discarded" cards and some of those cards can actually have a use later. It also allows an area that you can expand for future use like non "basic" Locations that may have effects beyond triggering SuperPowers. What if they bring back Reservist? Doubtful but this leaves that possibility open. Or an effect that lets you swap out face down resources with cards in your hand. Or what if they bring back Ongoing PTs? For design space, a resource row makes sense, not sure why you are so against it because for a physical card game, it's functional. |
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| x_chan | Jul 2 2015, 04:31 PM Post #381 |
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I already mentioned how Netrunner do so. And that's a physical card game. You can use counters or hero tokens. You get one after discarding a card during the draw phase and can spend them to recruit heroes (as there's no threshold for locations or PT anymore, there's no need to keep track of your resources). Each turn you can get a new token to spend. It's not so hard to do and keeps up with the new game's flavour. The only reason we have locations in the first place is that they existed in the previous game. I'm sure if they created this new version from scratch we wouldn't have them at all, and instead we would have energy cards. So why keep the resource row that's just dead weight carried from the old game? You can use locations from there, but they have one time use only and can also be discarded from your hand (what? how can I discard a school to power up a guy?). It has little to no sense. And while I can see that the potential is there for future uses, I don't think they will do so. How they designed the locations functionallity creates a design limitation that's going to make passive locations difficult, as their are one time use only, either from your hand or row. One of the complains they tried to amend with this new system is that the resource row acted like a second hand. You had to keep track of what was faced down there and made matches too long. If they bring Reservist or other kind of resource manipulation back, the changes will make no sense at all and they will be back to square one. That's why I think it will never happen. The focus is now combat and that's why they called it main phase. So why not have only characters on your board. Let the hand be your power up devise alone. That would be a lot more dynamic and in flavour in the new game. |
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| Speedy92286 | Jul 2 2015, 04:33 PM Post #382 |
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The resource row right now is essentially like crystals in hearthstone; just a way to track the cards you can play. However you have to decide which card you want to sacrifice if you do not have a location. It is a better system than magic because you turn any card into a land so I like it already. If the game was digital the row would have been removed but since it is not, there is no better physical way to show your "resources" than seeing cards face down in a row. (Read your new post; i still stand by what i say because hero points seems more confusing than having a constant physical way to show exactly how many resources you have as opposed to tokens. Just my own view) Edited by Speedy92286, Jul 2 2015, 04:37 PM.
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| KardKrazy | Jul 2 2015, 05:06 PM Post #383 |
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Please don't tell me they are deleting any type of negative comment towards the game. That is such a joke if they are. Rants are fine to delete but sometimes the faults of a product need to be discussed in open so they can improve on it. Having nothing but "This is amazing." fanboys posting praise when there are obvious faults with the game does not help the game in the long haul. Makes giving legitimate feedback pointless. |
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| BatHulk | Jul 2 2015, 05:07 PM Post #384 |
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Speedy gets me. There is already enough non-card objects in play (wound counters, +1/+1 counters, -1/-1 counters)... adding dice or other counters makes it more messy. Physical cards acting as resource counters is highly visual, connects to Vs 1.0 and allows a secondary function of playing face-up cards. Taking away the resource row moves it even farther away from Vs 1.0 which I don't think they totally want to do. Seems like x_chan is in the minority here. You keep saying it makes little to no sense, but a few of us here have explained how much it does still add to the game. To help me add context to your opinion, how long have you been playing Vs? |
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| BatHulk | Jul 2 2015, 05:08 PM Post #385 |
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I highly agree with this. Dissenting opinions creates growth... as long as there are reasonable arguments behind each one. |
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| BatHulk | Jul 2 2015, 05:13 PM Post #386 |
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I missed Colossus' card:![]() So it looks like Locations also activate Supporting Character powers... boo. This makes packing Locations even more necessary. Ugh. |
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| Speedy92286 | Jul 2 2015, 05:44 PM Post #387 |
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Not necesarily. I doubt there will be many. Besides with all the ways x-men can draw cards I am sure you will get a ton anyway. You could also focus on one or two colors and wild cards which would only be 12 cards total. I think of them as plot twists at this point which change based on your mc and sc's. |
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| Speedy92286 | Jul 2 2015, 05:46 PM Post #388 |
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Agreed. I have seen some not so great comments but everything has been positive. If that is because of comment screening that makes me lose respect for the group. Eh, hopefully natural praise leaks through more once people play the game. |
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| x_chan | Jul 2 2015, 06:13 PM Post #389 |
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I understand that it makes it more messy. I'm not a fun of the counters. I don't get why they introduced the wound mechanics on the first place. But tracking resources it's pretty easy. It only happens once per round and it's used inmediatelly after. You got an extra one, now you have 3, spend those to recruit a 2 cost character and a 1 cost character. I can forget about them until next round. Having no resource row would also make other choices possible. Discarding a hero card from your hand to get a hero point would allow you to get a second use of that card in case there's some effects that manipulate your discard pile (which I'm sure there will be in time). Right now, everything you put in your resource row is a dead weight and it's meant to stay dead. Maybe we will see some way of resource manipulating in the future, but it seems really unlikelly at this point. And @BatHulk, I've been playing VS System since Avengers came out (you can see my join date here too). I don't understand what that has to do with anything. And can you explain me your definition of "how much it brings", because it's just a resource mechanism right now, compared to what it used to be. I would rather say "how little it brings". @KardKrazy. Yes, they are delating any negative feedback on their facebook page. I see it happen. Edited by x_chan, Jul 2 2015, 06:14 PM.
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| Christo | Jul 2 2015, 06:28 PM Post #390 |
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The Location issue has dulled a bit of my enthusiasm, but I suppose there's still room in design for it to be interesting. It's also possible that they won't all be generic - perhaps we'll get some Locations that have a one-shot effect as an option to giving power/energy/whatever. I do wonder which team/faction will have the ability to turn a Location back up... |
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