Welcome Guest [Log In] [Register]
We hope you enjoy your visit.


You're currently viewing our forum as a guest. This means you are limited to certain areas of the board and there are some features you can't use. If you join our community, you'll be able to access member-only sections, and use many member-only features such as customizing your profile, sending personal messages, and voting in polls. Registration is simple, fast, and completely free. Once you've registered and completed email validation, you'll need to reply to the thread in The Welcome mat before you gain full access to the site.


Join our community!


If you're already a member please log in to your account to access all of our features:

Username:   Password:
Add Reply
Proposition: Create new Age
Topic Started: Sep 20 2009, 04:52 AM (1,500 Views)
conel3
Member Avatar
Senior Member
[ *  *  *  * ]
I like MOR
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Shadowtrooper
Member Avatar
I Hate Rebel Scum!
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
I honestly can't believe what I am reading here. While I am always up for a new format to play with I don't believe these sets should be banned at all, well maybe MEV cause that set is in fact broken but I'm up for banning it from Modern, and perhaps even Silver not from Golden.

MOR - Yes MOR does allow for turn 4 kills, just like MVL and MTU. Should all sets that have Turn 4 decks be banned? Hell no. I don't get this opposition comment you made Dave, perhaps you can clear things up cause that Sinister Syndicate deck KK was talking about managed to get wins from Quick-Fate, and thats saying a lot.

Crisis - Are you guys seriously defending Ahmed and throwing stones at the Fate Artifacts? I can't believe you guys are saying that 3 pieces of equipment are far better than the card that single handedly gives more consistency to every deck it is incorporated into. Need a team-up? Ahmed to the rescue. Need a character? Ahmed to the rescue. Need a pump? Ahmed to the rescue. Need fate artifacts? Ahmed to the rescue. Seriously guys what are you thinking? Top it all off with 6/6 stats and range and that 3 drop is simply the best 3 drop that has ever been printed in Vs.

MHG - This set is in fact one of the most powerful sets out there, but this set shouldn't be banned. Most dangerous card this set has left is Quicksilver, and with the Fate Artifacts gone to Golden the rest is pretty much fair game, as Kree can't be used with Villains United unless you are playing once again Golden. What's there to fear here really?

So what does that say? Well Golden is broken Vs. broken. There is no other way to look at it and in a playing field where everything is broken no one really has an advantage. You want to play casual then do just that. There is no need to ban these sets to accomplish that. So the other guy whips out a broken deck and beats you, you have 2 options.

a) Whip out a broken set of your own and beat his sorry @$$
b) Go home and cry to your momma

You start banning a set or two and then the next set becomes the most powerful. What then? Ban that set also? You'll end up playing with the starter sets where Flying Kick will be such a busted card that it will also need to be banned, heck if it isn't banned already cause after all that card was in MOR.

In short - New format OK
Changing Golden - NO WAY

Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Piccolo-21
Member Avatar
Regular
[ *  *  * ]
Shadowtrooper,

Have you come up with any ideas on format ideas? I do agree that the Silver & Modern formats don't seem to fit anymore, which leaves us with Golden. But a variety from there would freshen things up. Any suggestions?
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Shadowtrooper
Member Avatar
I Hate Rebel Scum!
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
I like playing whatever comes to mind, I once told my friends to build insanity decks without any insanity cards and that was such a blast to play, lots of people have done that format by now. If you think no game of Insanity is ever the same this just adds an exclamation point. I also made up a format in which non-affiliated characters had the "Marvel" or "DC" affiliations. Cards like Mojo which referenced non-affiliated characters got to work of both of these affiliations. I did a thread over at TCG for people to name the formats they had created along the way just so others could get to play something new and interesting, or perhaps add their own twist. I can't find the thread right now I think it got deleted, but it would be nice to start a new one just to see what else people have created. I do recall a few that have been on that thread and from other threads:

Artifact Legends
Artifact Legends - no Fate Artifacts allowed
Location Legends
Location Legends - no Ahmed allowed
Ongoing plot twists only - no RS characters allowed.
Double endurance - everyone starts with 100 endurance
stack your deck - everyone stacked the top 10 cards of the deck
30 card insanity
double your deck - 120 cards per decks
2 cards max - only 2 cards of each allowed
common only
uncommon only
rare only
start with X amount of resources
switch a deck - make a crappy but playable deck an switch it with your opponents, then try to win
Team stamped cards only

I dunno people make up weird formats and some of them are up our alley, some don't. All you have to do is try them out and see what works for you.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
EvilDave
Member Avatar
Elite Member
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Well, forget Golden if you want, but EVERY age is stuck with MEV and the Galactus box set. That's a shame; those sets were poison pills that stifle creativity. Trying to open up Golden would be, in fact, a "nice bonus", I'd like as many sets as possible available.

As to Ahmed, he's been great-but-not-dominat in every set he's been in. Fate Artifacts have ruled since the day they came into play; +4/+4 easily transfered up the chain. I'd go as far to say if Fate's Tower wasn't printed they wouldn't be "so bad"; but it is, and yes Ahmed/Ivy helps make them worse.

The point is, a reasonably open format that isn't dominated by the overly powerful effects. If you like the overly powerful effects, go for it; say nothing is banned... hell, bring back Overload and Dr. Light. I'm trying to free up some ages to make the game more interesting, and that is the goal of this thread.

Let me put this another way... do you feel if Modern/Silver had Galactus and MEV transferred out for another 2 sets it'd be better or worse? I'd say far better; but again I also don't think that basing things on the corporate structure of when they came out should matter as much anymore.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
kariggi
Member Avatar
Hero For Hire
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Ok 3 things...for now:

1) SoCal Qualifier #2
Location: Comic Cult I (Torrance)
Date: October 17, 2009
Format: Golden Age
Entry: $5-$10
Time: 2:00pm
Prizes: to be determined based off participation (most likely packs of some kind)

2) MCG realy helped the straight beats curve without tricks more than any other deck type. This is the deck type you yourself said was the most wanted to be played.

3) So this is G2 the equivalent of type 2 magic. I'd be happy just dropping MEV off the side of the boat but if MOR has to go with it, let's just try to keep collateral damage to a minimum.


...ok 4) For ages...all sets that include a super-man, all sets that contain a spider-man, the worst of all ages (IDK) MSM,DSM+ 2 more sets. Which are the worste 4 sets?
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Shadowtrooper
Member Avatar
I Hate Rebel Scum!
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
I do not think that MCG stifled creativity at all. Just because a vast majority of decks carried Pathetic and Omni doesn't mean anything. There have always been cards that see play in a great number of decks. Meltdown, Savage Beatdown, Mobilize, Enemy. I don't know about you but I don't start my deck building with 4 copies of PA and 3 Omni. I usually add them at the end and thats if they are added at all and it doesn't compromise my original build idea at all. Do I play the cards? Yes I do. Do I put them in every deck I build? NO. You can certainly be creative and find other ways to get through the problems you encounter without the use of these cards, after all we did so before they were used.

On the other hand, does it suck that MCG and MEV will be in all 3 main formats forever? Yes, as does it suck that MVL, DCL and MUN will also be part of them, and all other sets will never again be able to see the light of modern again. So what can we do? I recall a suggestion that was made a while back where you take all DC sets and put them in a hat, and do the same with the Marvel sets. Take two sets from each hand at random and there you go, and there you go thats Modern. Take two more from each hat and add them to the previous four and you have a new Silver. As always Golden will stay the same. You can either keep all subsets, collections or starters tied to their respective sets, or make them all available for all formats.

This will probably cause a little bit of trouble for the legacy content to see the light of play. Perhaps we can allow for the legacy content of affiliations in the current modern and silver ages to be played as if they were in the sets, sort of like a Bizarro Errata.

Another way to do this is to rotate the sets we already have. So we can change modern to rotate out MVL and add MOR. Then rotate out DCL and add DOR, and so forth and so on.

There are certainly other options we can explore before deciding to ban whole sets just for the sole purpose of changing the current formats.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Edawg
Member Avatar
Senior Member
[ *  *  *  * ]
Well, since this game is now just for the people who still enjoy playing it, why not just have people vote every 3 months on what is legal in the new Golden Fanboy Age? People can each vote for 4 sets to not be included, and the 4 sets with the most votes get axed for the next 3 months.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
bkwrds
Member Avatar
is a Gypsy Doom
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
I don't think that creating a format that leaves the more powerful sets out of the equation is such a bad idea. Some people like busted Golden or MOR or what have you. I understand and to an extent agree. I don't think that leaving those cards out of a new format means that it will be the only one that's played.

It would just be good to have a less broken format that was popular. I like old sets, and I'd like to use them competitively in a format. But I guarantee you that my deck won't be as broken as anyone else's, and I don't really think I'll enjoy losing in that format. 4x TNB and 4x TNNB? No thanks. Really, I'll pass.

Could we ever make a list of cards that were limited? For a free-for all Golden Age format? If there's only one TNB you can probably find a way to search out it easily and quickly. If there's only one Cosmic Radiation you can probably work your deck around recurring it. But it would add a lot of work and force lot of creativity to use the same 20-30 cards that are stronger than just about every other card, and the decks that can be run 4 of would gain an incremental advantage over all the Golden Age favourites.

Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Shadowtrooper
Member Avatar
I Hate Rebel Scum!
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
There is a really simple solution for that bkwrds play with casual decks and have fun. There is no need to band sets from a format if we can all agree to play "nice". We all know what the top decks in the format are so if you want a friendly game just say that when you play an opponent. I have asked people to play Golden and the first thing they ask is :"Friendly?" It really easy to do too.

Not everyone will want to play friendly and not everyone will want to play broken. So in order to find out what your opponent is into what simpler way than to ask?

I think you guys are really just exaggerating too much and trying to fix something that isn't really broken.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
bkwrds
Member Avatar
is a Gypsy Doom
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Trooper,

I agree with you about casual Golden and this doesn't pose any problem for me whatsoever. I know what it means and I know how to play it. It is relatively easy to get on the same level as somebody in Vs. That's a good thing. I have lots of decks that I play for fun -- they are not bad decks, but they are built with the intent on leaning on an interaction that may or may not be the best possible use of the cards I'm playing with.

However... it would be nice to have a format with more than 8 sets in it that doesn't require guarding against so many of the broken interactions that can occur with a 5000 card pool. It would be nice to have a format like that. Currently, in Golden Age, a "most powerful deck possible" is not a fun thing to build or play, and two decks with "most powerful" are not fun. Decks are either highly uninteractive or so dedicated to Rush that it's not as fun as I'd like it to be.

This is all my opinion, obviously, but this thread shows I'm not the only one to hold it.

A golden age without MOR/MEV and maybe a couple other key bans _could_ reward a best effort. Playing tier 1 Exiles does not - you may win, but you can easily lose the fun and comraderie.

It is not unusual for a card pool that size to be unbalanced. I would expect it to be. That does not mean that we can't attempt to balance it. Trial and error would be the best way to find that balance, I think.

Edited by bkwrds, Sep 22 2009, 04:51 AM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Ike E Bear
Member Avatar
Elite Member
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Quick point.

I used to play Anti-Green Lantern. It would be king of the rush decks without MOR and other faster rush decks. Without the threat of Doom, the only remaining threat is Total Anarchy and Bad Press could just be replaced with resource disruption.

Without Sentinels, what happens with Teen Titans?

I think the idea of one or more new Ages is worthwhile, but if we honestly want to balance formats then removing a few sets won't really do it. I think it'd have to be more targeted.

Edit - Furthermore, I agree with 'Troop that outside of tournaments, this really shouldn't be an issue. I play against my friends ... so there's only so much dickishness that I'm willing to inflict on them.
Edited by Ike E Bear, Sep 22 2009, 05:34 AM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Shadowtrooper
Member Avatar
I Hate Rebel Scum!
[ *  *  *  *  * ]
Ike E Bear
Sep 22 2009, 05:28 AM
Quick point.

I used to play Anti-Green Lantern. It would be king of the rush decks without MOR and other faster rush decks. Without the threat of Doom, the only remaining threat is Total Anarchy and Bad Press could just be replaced with resource disruption.

Without Sentinels, what happens with Teen Titans?

I think the idea of one or more new Ages is worthwhile, but if we honestly want to balance formats then removing a few sets won't really do it. I think it'd have to be more targeted.

Edit - Furthermore, I agree with 'Troop that outside of tournaments, this really shouldn't be an issue. I play against my friends ... so there's only so much dickishness that I'm willing to inflict on them.
See this is what I was saying. If you ban MOR and MEV where does that leave Titans, AGL, or Good Guys? Seriously if you want to play in a Golden Age format that has no broken decks play with your friends for fun, and if they dare bring out a broken deck then smack them upside the head. I honestly don't see what the big deal is.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
conykchameleon
Member Avatar
Senior Member
[ *  *  *  * ]
I'm with you bkwrds. I would like to see a competitive fomat that doesn't involve MEV and MCG. News flash: those cards are undeniably broken, and have no place in a competitive format. Here's what it is with MEV and MCG: Alright we're having a tournament. I want to win. So I play Exiles and I'm going to run either PA. Or maybe I feel like being creative and still trying to win, so I play X-Factor and to really spice things up, through Omni in there. Exciting.

Bottom line. We're not going to see any change in meta from new sets. So unless we want stagnant meta have two options (and if you do like having a stagnant meta, just say so):

1. Reorganize the card pool (what bkwrds and orignially EvilDave are suggesting.

2. Play with fan sets. (This topic, however is not about that)
Edited by conykchameleon, Sep 23 2009, 12:17 AM.
Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
Abyss
Member Avatar
Senior Member
[ *  *  *  * ]
It seems the problems people are having is with specific cards, not the sets themselves. Just because some MEV cards are broken doesn't mean the entire set is, for example.

And as mentioned, all removing sets is going to do is open up room for the next top tier deck to dominate.

If people are worried about it, I think it makes far more sense to 'softban' the broken cards, and not specific sets.

Offline Profile Quote Post Goto Top
 
1 user reading this topic (1 Guest and 0 Anonymous)
Go to Next Page
« Previous Topic · Vs. System Organised Play · Next Topic »
Add Reply

Marvel Comics Character Images, Character Names and Card Text Copyright 2009 Marvel Characters Ltd. and/or Upper Deck Entertainment, LLC. DC Comics Character Images, Character Names and Card Text Copyright 2009 DC Characters Ltd. and/or Upper Deck Entertainment, LLC.